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Planned Axe Lord Non-Mado Mechanic


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#1 KhelbenVasq

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 01:39 PM

I am asking for those with a critical eye to critique this planned build, This will be my No Mado Armor Mechanic and will not be my Crafter this one is my goof around and Solo (small party / guild) the world Build.
 
Do note before hand I am very much a miser and Most likely will not be using Mammonite, HSCR, or Maximum Over-thrust.  Even though I do have they are skills I can cut them to the Bare min if there is something passive in the Mado Tree that works with out the Mado. (don't think there is but I been wrong before).   Yes I know at Higher levels I will be Fly-winging (creamy card) a lot to avoid mass mobs with the restrictions I placed on myself but then, I do Plan to Grind as much as is absolutely Necessary, going to try to use Quests for my main source of XP. Now as for Gears I have not Been Planning those as of yet, I got some Ideas mainly staying with a Mace or a 1 hand Axe for shield use.
 
Khelben Lv 150, Job 50 Mechanic
 
Just Solo Skills and Zerk pot Not counting Armor and Weapon adjustments
 
Stats                   Job Bonus
Str             99      +      6
Agi           120     +      3       
Vit              25     +      7         
Int              25     +      5          
Dex          120     +      3      
Luk            40     +      5         
 
Status Information
Atk           242     +      0
Def              0     +     27
Matk          46     ~     66
Mdef            0     +     30
Hit            293
Flee         273     +     5
Critical       14
Aspd        187
 
LeftOver  Stat Points 1
 
 
First Aid                       LV 1 (Quest Skill)
Play Dead                    LV 1 (Quest Skill)
Enlarge Weight Limit    Lv 10
Discount                      Lv 10
Overcharge                 Lv 8
Vending                       Lv1
Pushcart                      Lv 10
Identify                         Lv 1
Mammonite                  Lv 10
Mass Bulk Buy              Lv 2 (Quest Skill)
Cart Revolution            Lv 1 (Quest Skill)
Change Cart                Lv 1 (Quest Skill)
Loud Exclamation         Lv 1 (Quest Skill)
Iron Tempering             Lv 3
Steel Tempering           Lv 3
Enchanted Stone Craft Lv 1
Research Oridecon       Lv 1
Hilt Binding                    Lv 1
Finding Ore                   Lv 1
Weaponry Research     Lv 10
Repair Weapon             Lv 1
Skin Tempering             Lv 5
Hammer Fall                  Lv 5
Adrenaline Rush           Lv 5
Weapon Perfection       Lv 5
Over Thrust                  Lv 5
Maximize Power           Lv 5
Melt Down                   Lv 10
Cart Boost                   Lv 1
Full Adrenaline Rush  Lv 1 (Soul Linked)
Cart Termination         Lv 10
Maximum Over Thrust Lv 5
Unfair Trick                 Lv 1 (Quest Skill)
Greed                         Lv 1 (Quest Skill)
Axe Training               Lv 10
Research Fire / Earth Lv 5
Axe Boomerang          Lv 5
Power Swing               Lv 5
Axe Tornado               Lv 5
FAW - Silver Sniper    Lv 5
FAW - Magic Decoy    Lv 5
FAW - Removal          Lv 1
 
 
Total 1st job skill point used: 49/49 Left: 0 Over: 0
Total 2nd job skill point used: 69/69 Left: 0 Over: 0
Total 3rd job skill point used: 49/49 Left: 0 Over: 0
 
 
So how far off base am I looking at here?

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#2 spikexp

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 03:14 PM

i can only give advice for stat, and as every class does, getting 120 isn't really worth the points except that you would max out ONE potential that the class have.

also, that kind of vit won't get you anywhere to grind on higher level. you'll be sitting and winging a lot, hence, more time grinding.

for dex, it's also WAY too high, tbh, as you may hit most of the monsters in RO with 90 dex, ofc with some restrictions of high-flee monsters such as eremes guile.

you also have 1 stat point left. i guess you used RMS calc? try using one from irowiki's database.

btw, have you tried leveling post 99 before?
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#3 KhelbenVasq

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 03:43 PM

Honestly this will be the first official time to lv past 99,  where I learned the basics of RO had ahem fudged tables to go to 160, so I know about the exponential curve with the points past 99,  I realized with the plan that mass grinding would be problematic at best because of limiting the zenny outflow skills.  The dex and Agi is to get as close to max aspd as possible, yes with a one hand axe /mace that limits my weapon selection but the addition of the shield and most likely a shield card will make him less of a glass cannon.

 

 The hit and the flee were also big considerations due to a few select armors and cards geared to the mobs on the map and I could shift the balance to my favor.  Unless they have never miss skills the mobs would have a difficult time cornering me with as much as they would miss.  This is also why i will not be using my cart as a weapon as much, to hold the shift it around gears for the maps as I travel.

 

The idea is to put off the main quest trees (the main arcs and the standalone ones) until I get to the grindy part of the game taking advantage of the sliding xp on many of the quests.  That would off set the grind factor some.

 

I will give the irowiki one a try see how close to this build I can get and see where it needs compensation.

 

I am not aiming at the fast game so the sit and wait will happen a lot with me, I don't mind that so much.  Although I thought the wiggle thing was only for Super Novices as one of their hidden skills like their boosts at level and their ability to cheat death...

 

Emmes guile was one of the mobs that honestly inspired this build, him and howard ets  I found with conventional builds those two were a pain to deal with, I had to find a way over their mad builds.  More so since closer to end game for me those two will become main targets for me.

 

But I will take your advise on the irocalc, I will edit the build with the result.

 

Khelben

 


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#4 kasshin

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 03:53 PM

To be blunt, you'll need to rethink your whole plan. AGI ctrl click builds are only for the beginning levels for less funded players. In fact you should go with an aoe build as soon as you can afford to. You'll definitely only be aoeing for leveling as a third class and you'll never ctrl click monsters one at a time. Flee is useless in general because multiple monsters attacking you creates a flee penalty that reduces flee to nothing. AGI is also very expensive over 100 and even with 120 agi you won't ever have enough flee.

Non mado mechs should also always opt to get a mado at least for the leveling phase. Axe tornado is not strong enough for leveling past ~120.
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#5 sb120495

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 04:37 PM

Stick to conventional builds to level to 150 and then reset because frankly,with that build,you won't be going anywhere past the mid TI unless you leech off parties.You can kill monsters one at a time(maybe) but you'd still be gaining experience very slow.


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#6 GwenevereXOXO

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 05:05 PM

lol i applaud your endusiasm toward grinding via crtl.click to 150. its not impossible but youll need tons of battle.manuals.

also to.help.with your idea of 1v1 lvling, u dont.need so muh dex, keep it at 80~90 is enough. agi also should stay at 110 tops. migh as well add all those left over points into vit and luck for some crit. vit should be at least 90 for all classes. the rest into.luk for crit.

when youre done lvling to 150 try out assassins. with enchant poisons they can solo 1v1 to 150 much quicker.
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#7 GwenevereXOXO

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 05:07 PM

but while youre at it get axe tornado. use it once and i garantee u will want to stop cntrl clicking.
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#8 KhelbenVasq

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 05:09 PM

spike thank you for that simulator it has a vs monster calc, I can tailor even nicer.

 

As for TI I doubt I will even be touching it after Rebirth.

 

I am aware of the Long Road as I stated before I plan on being very very creamy....

 

gwenevere thank you much Spike gave me something big to look at so I can tailor to specific mobs there are a couple mobs I figure if I taylor to the rest would fall in line easy.

 


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#9 AlmrOfAtlas

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 05:12 PM

Even as a 150 Mechanic, if you're not going Mado then HSCR is STILL your best DPS skill, and Max Power Thrust is STILL your best self-buff, and you'll be beyond hilariously pathetic without using them. My avoiding these skills, which are the staple of Battlesmiths everywhere, you're bastardising your Axe Mech build (which is supposed to be a continuation of the Battlesmith playstyle).

 

Axemerang is underpowered, Axenado is VERY underpowered, and Powah Swing has a very long cooldown. FAWs are cute but are rather sucky in practice, except in PvP where they can knock your foes out of cast and generally annoy them. They all have terrible SP drain. Relying on these skills alone will cost you more in EXP and pots than you'll make back. They're supposed to be situational benefits, not primary levelers.

 

Now then. Your VIT's too low. As an axenado mobber you'll require VIT to survive, and VIT contributes to axenado's damage additively.

 

Your DEX is much much too high for the points cost associated with getting it there, even with the boost to Power Swing damage.

 

AGI is also a bit high, even if want to ctrl+click things. Your aspd buffs will stem from gears and consumables, not AGI alone, so drop it to around 100 or even just 90 for the HBP buff. In fact, you should consider HBP for all your stats. Note that it requires a +9 refine and minimum base 90 to a stat for the bonus to be applied. If you want to dodge things, remember that Smith classes have naturally low flee mods, so it's not like AGI does much for it anyway.

 

Your chosen INT will have you popping strawberries like there's no tomorrow. Be wary of spamming skills.

 

Finally, quests won't get you very far AT ALL in terms of 100+ leveling. AoE mobbing is the only optimal form of leveling there is post-120 or so, unless you're an MVPer (which Axe Mechs are, but only with HSCR and MPThrust).


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#10 KhelbenVasq

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 05:13 PM

axe tornado is nice but it has too much cool down to be viable to my taste, remember I am not much of a hscr guy as is ... ;) mind this build will have it.


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#11 KhelbenVasq

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 05:24 PM

:gg:

 

New ways of thinking comes with new players, I already got the best input so far from the first reply it will work wonders that may not have been seen here before.

 

but thank you for the concern I am a very slow build type player as is.  I mean like 45/40 merchant since my first post slow and been begging :Emo_14: my guild master :ani_wow:  for max tax :ani_money:  :exlamation:  to slow me down some more.

 

o.0

 

khelben

 

lets see 02 Apr 2014 first post, 12 days I been doing what 3.75 levels a day and that is just way to fast for my taste.

 

 


Edited by KhelbenVasq, 14 April 2014 - 05:27 PM.

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#12 AlmrOfAtlas

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 05:29 PM

:gg:

 

New ways of thinking comes with new players.

 

We've been here long enough to know what works and what doesn't. Innovative players have come and gone. Anything nonstandard is called that for a reason, and is just building for giggles.

 

As the caveman said, if the idea is so good, why aren't the apes already doing it?

 

 

lets see 02 Apr 2014 first post, 12 days I been doing what 3.75 levels a day and that is just way to fast for my taste.

 

Why aren't you playing Classic? Smiths are still quite excellent there (I main one), and the leveling is slow as balls. I got 16% of Lv95 in half an hour with VIP, a BMX3 active, and a Lv10 Fencer tailing me while soloing in Clock Tower Underground 4 just a while ago, and we consider that fast.


Edited by AlmrOfAtlas, 14 April 2014 - 05:38 PM.

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#13 KhelbenVasq

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 05:52 PM

Ok time for the monkey-math here.

 

Game + Time = fun

 

Power leveling = less Time

 

Beaten path with walk though sites = less Game (while I may recommend it for others I tend to avoid the walk though sites until I am so frustrated that I can not figure it out that I have to get a single spoiler or two, been that way since the Atari 2600 days with the game adventure. Same with Zork to this day I have not had to use anything that did not come in the box with the game when it comes to infocom games.)

 

Take time out of the Equation you lessen the fun of it,

Take the Game out of the Equation you lessen the fun.

 

If I could I would ratchet the difficulty of a game up anyway I can I do, with the exception of Hard Core one life to live mode that is "I want to be the guy" tough.  A simulator tool is acceptable to me when it comes to this type of game for reason of once it is done it is done there are no second chances to get it right on the build, (yes I know about the skill reset npcs but I think they never should have been added.) So is an item / monster database so I can plan my hunts.  But other then that I had to learn the hard way already that the job change npcs were relocated to Islude and you can not even trigger the become a merchant quest in Alberta anymore. The npc complains that they don't do that anymore. Was a shock for me.

 

 


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#14 KhelbenVasq

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 05:56 PM

Quote:
 

Why aren't you playing Classic? Smiths are still quite excellent there (I main one), and the leveling is slow as balls. I got 16% of Lv95 in half an hour with VIP, a BMX3 active, and a Lv10 Fencer tailing me while soloing in Clock Tower Underground 4 just a while ago, and we consider that fast.

 

Answer:

 

I wanted to play with the new toys eventually (second toon is going to be geared for pure MADO).  Why build two different characters on two different worlds to do what I could do in One world.  

 

Khelben


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#15 BrrrIshCold

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 05:59 PM

I regretted getting the FAWs. Theyre useless. The materials to create them are heavy as well. Expect short leveling trips if you utilize them. I havent used them in a while but i believe they only stay out for 30 seconds to a minute which made it very expensive too. For sure you need more VIT or else you will die to a mob of three (8000hp at level 101 taking 800 damage ia not fun). Dont rely on agi for flee. Only get 90 for attack speed, less depending on gear.
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#16 KhelbenVasq

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 06:07 PM

Now that is good info in the last few posts about the faw,  it is appearing they would only be worth half a lick in a woe situation in a tight choke point as part of an ambush....  Hmm the suicide mechs could comeback and start laying faw down as  a tactic.

 

Now the question would be does faw work in the Mech anti field?

 

 


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#17 spikexp

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 08:47 PM

as for irowiki calc matter, i never suggested anything beyond stat calc. most gear, buff, moreover, the monster calc, is broken.

i will give you a hint on ctrl-click leveling.
Spoiler


i hope you can cover your hitting method, time to think about survivability.
Spoiler


i haven't been in game for too long to try those myself since i don't have the budget, but that's all i know by asking out people's gear i don't know yet.


again, you may ask things you can't consult from the wiki.
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#18 kasshin

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 09:52 PM

New ways of thinking comes with new players, I already got the best input so far from the first reply it will work wonders that may not have been seen here before.

 

Wrong... new ways of (effective) thinking comes from old experienced players who already understand the game. Sorry but it's the truth. Blacksmith / Mech originates from a merchant class so really you should not play this class if you aren't going to spend any money at all on leveling.

 

Don't think of Mado as a "build". Think of it as a "leveling tool" to get you to where you want your character to be at 150.

 

Ctrl-click leveling isn't slow to 150. It's impossible. Your build will be so flawed and weak that all the little EXP you gain from monsters will all be lost quicker than you gain it when you die.
 


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#19 GwenevereXOXO

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 11:17 PM

aha i see where u are going with this. the original poster wants to ramp up the difficulty of the game. he has no interest in fast leveling and has no interest in partying for ti as well.

heres a couple of ways to ramp up difficult even more for your grind fest:

join or create your own guild and tax yourself max
do not carry any healing items and rely on sitting only
do not wear a shield, as a matter of fact dun wear any armor.
dun use warps, walk to where u want to go
dun use skills. it semms ure already doing that
dun use flywings or butterfly wings

that sgould be a super challenge. might take.u 2~3 years to reach 150. lol really long game time.
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#20 Hikusaak

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 12:52 AM

You will obviously have my respect if you actually reach 150/50 by auto-attacking monster 1 by 1 and without use of TI.

Finally someone who have such courage and ambition other than this *cough* eccentric *cough* and *cough* proud *cough* Kagerou on the server :ani_slur:


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#21 GraydroZ

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 02:43 AM

Honestly this will be the first official time to lv past 99

Although I have never played Mech, It is really painful just to think that someone has to ctrl+click to level 150 :omg:Please take a look at the accumulated base exp required to reach level 150 from level 99. That is around 1,500 million base exp from level 99 to level 150 as compared to 48 million base exp from level 1 to 99 (trans).

 

... , unless you're an MVPer (which Axe Mechs are, but only with HSCR and MPThrust).

 

I have never played Mech so may I ask how good are these skills in practice compared to let's say Vanishing point for example?


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#22 seaechiowai

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 02:49 AM

FAWs are garbage.


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#23 spikexp

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 03:08 AM

Ctrl-click leveling isn't slow to 150. It's impossible. Your build will be so flawed and weak that all the little EXP you gain from monsters will all be lost quicker than you gain it when you die.


i can't believe axe tornado is actually THIS bad. i thought it would still be possible. slow, but not impossible.
 

that sgould be a super challenge. might take.u 2~3 years to reach 150. lol really long game time.


and i heard the game update itself got 2 years behind schedule.
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#24 Wurzel

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 07:47 AM

 My mechanic right now is 121 and is a pure axe build as well. Everyone keeps telling me go mado and etc, but really man, is fun.  If you have the fund, pop a bm and solo TI with HSCR, that's what I've been doing. I've done 2 groups only, once for mid-TI and one for low-TI when I was a BS still. 

 I use either Fish in Mouth or 2 Snowier cards (Ice Cream) for healing, so I can use either my RWH or my Vanagard to be a little cheaper, but still extremely expensive to level, just to give a heads up.

 You'll be surprised on how far you can go on Axe alone man. Yesterday I was on ET and I got up to Osiris, solo. Unfortunately I had to leave, but could've made a lot further for sure.

 My SS's come all messed up, so I can't post it, but if you wanna talk in game, hit me up.

 Theo Bell is my Mechanic's name. Or my main, Gorus.


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#25 Wurzel

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 07:49 AM

Wrong... new ways of (effective) thinking comes from old experienced players who already understand the game. Sorry but it's the truth. Blacksmith / Mech originates from a merchant class so really you should not play this class if you aren't going to spend any money at all on leveling.

 

Don't think of Mado as a "build". Think of it as a "leveling tool" to get you to where you want your character to be at 150.

 

Ctrl-click leveling isn't slow to 150. It's impossible. Your build will be so flawed and weak that all the little EXP you gain from monsters will all be lost quicker than you gain it when you die.
 

 Sorry to break down, but I did a lot of leveling on my FS AB with Ress 4 in Nameless Isle man. Is slow, but is far, far from impossible. Mado is a build, has it's own skill tree. He's not wrong for wanting to try something new for him. My SC leveled up to 143 solo, on ctrl+click as well. I didn't level any further because it got boring for me, but could've easily made to 150, would just take time.


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