76 replies to this topic

[Cinquine]

I like the every two months idea. It's a nice in-between solution to renewals constantly changing every week.

I would also like to see Juperos.

Perhaps they could do more than one place at a time. So instead of just dragons for example maybe a couple different maps with equal benefits so that classes that maybe aren't very effective in map X are effective on map Y and aren't forced to play something else to get a party.

Edited by Cinquine, 24 September 2014 - 10:07 AM.

[Ralis]

[mod]Back on topic...[/mod]

 

I half share Xellie's views. I don't see much need for high-end TI events. I want to see more party play on maps outside of TIs. Where I DO want to see TIs are low-level maps like we had on Valkyrie such as Pecos, Alligators and Goats. Letting people meet and play with people early on in their RO career does wonders for the population, especially since I know how annoying starting out can be. Those of us that are established can level a character to level 80-90 in 30 minutes with the VIP 3x manual buff and a level 10 Sword Mercenary, but newer players don't have that luxury. Parties at Pecos, Alligators and Goats were some of my favorite memories playing Ragnarok.

[Xellie]

Ok now we have a bit of a clearer air may I actually put forward my suggestion without being jumped?

 

> Issues with rotational TIs

• They hurt soloists (the REAL casuals)
• They condense the population into one map messing with the economy (Classic is in a crazy bad spot atm economy wise)
• Class exclusion

> Issues with current levelling

• Thors or GTFO

> Solution?

 

Buff current maps:

• go back to some of the old Heim spawns (CTHO, Batholians), re-introduce some of the original unnerfed spawns (Juperos 1, remove dimiks, remove spawn timers, refix area spawns to each "zone" of the map).
• Add small perma-TIs to multiple maps, this way, a levelling spot can be picked on financial gain, classes available, being tired of X map.
• Adding TIs to various maps can introduce degrees of challenge, bio for those who wanna play hard, Icetitans for those who wanna dual log a strings and fwing forever.
• Some maps could be buffed for events, but alternatives are necessary

Taking the example of titans, assassins have 3 "good" places to level.

 

Magma 1 (sucks in comparision)

Juperos (is in a state of debuff)

Icetitans (have fun getting KSed and mob dropped all the time)

 

Alternatives are vital if the whole server is to be dumped on one map. I can't stress this enough, for some people, one map is their only option. For those who don't want to deal with the TI BS, other things MUST happen first.

 

Basically what I've been trying to say all along, but without the added frustration of being told my opinion doesn't matter.

Edited by Xellie, 24 September 2014 - 10:20 AM.

[Scuba]

I feel that we are ignoring the fact that TIs are hugely successful. That isn't just an accident. People flock to them because they are starved for something they do not get through standard gameplay. Logically, we can break down TI's into the elements of, community, efficiency, fun, and economy. Based on other popular elements of the game I would tend to believe players are attracted most to the element of community. WoE, BGs, and to a lesser degree ET are the most popular features of the game at this time. However we can address each element individually and focus on what about the game creates the deficiency that makes TI leveling so attractive relative to sologrind (duogrind).

 

Spoiler

Firstly we are talking about community. It is my estimation that most people that play MMO's are interested in interacting with other players. The elements of TI that appeal to these players are, a featured leveling area that attracts many people, opportunity to find a party without too much waiting, and the ability to learn from other players / play with people you otherwise wouldn't. Where do players develop community in this game? WoE is the biggest example I can think of. WoE only happens a couple times a week, 4 hours total. 4 hours is not nearly enough time to feel that the MMO has a good community opportunities. TIs provide an outlet for people starved of community to reach out to new people, even work with their WoE enemies.

 

Secondly there is the element of efficiency. RO is at extremes in terms of efficiency. There is either super efficient, or tedious grind. There is no middle ground. If the leveling method is not the best, its generally regarded as not worth doing. For example, would you do CTHO's when Thors was an option? It would be more efficient to spend $20 on KP and buy a thor's leech. The best leveling possible and the existing map diversity are like oil and water. RO might as well reduce its map availability by 75% because most people won't level on my mjolnir when they can get to 70+ in 30 minutes with a mercenary.

 

Third, is the element of fun. Now, fun can be highly variable from person to person, however I can offer a personal account of when I thought leveling in RO was fun. Back in 2006-07 I leveled a blacksmith in bathories from 70-99 using a guillotine for sp and a light epsilon for heals. Yes, it was boring, yes it was grindy, but it was fun because every single day I would see other people on that map leveling with me. Over time I began to recognize these people and became friends with them, starting up mag parties, or aspersio parties. I could message them if ogretooth decided to wreck my face. Since then the RO population has declined and map cultures like that no longer exist. Except for TIs. Over time, doing enough TIs, you will recognize people that you partied with before. And you will also find players you aspire to be as good as.  In some cases you might even be in the same party as your WoE nemesis.

 

Lastly is the economic factor. I will be short on this subject because I think it is ultimately irrelevant. The market may crash on certain goods but there will always be something else that is good money. Until the server reaches a point where raydric cards cost as much as pupa cards there will always be a good place to hunt outside of TI for money. I would strongly protest the implementation of TIs on Bio3 maps, or DG maps however. Rule of thumb: if an item is relevant and worth more than 50 mil, try not to tank its value. I think we can all agree though, morriganes helm and frozen hearts are not exactly relevant items that should cost a lot. And the misc item being overcharged is nothing compared to the bot problem. The economy could even be strengthened by TI's. People will need to gear new characters and people will be able to hunt rare items better on 99/70's than 87/43's.

 

TL;DR

To conclude, if there are to be no TI's, something needs to be done about fulfilling the player's needs. The deficiency in grind leveling in regards to a players connection to community, efficiency, fun, and economic gain is very large. If leveling was once again a social activity that was both fun and efficient, we wouldn't need TI's at all. However as it stands the community is clearly starving for more events like this. Key word, Events. TI's should not be implemented for long periods of time and they should only preceed the implementation of endgame content. Vets need to be encouraged to make new characters in preparation to endgame content, and beginners need to be able to participate in order to retain them. TIs need to be short lived, and infrequent to reduce burnout and players need something that will keep them playing once the event ends, otherwise population crash is inevitable. 

Edited by Scuba, 24 September 2014 - 04:48 PM.

[IcedCafeMocha]

A lot of people I've noticed since the 1.5x exp event have gone back to not leveling at all because the exp/ph ratio is worse for them (even when they solo or duo) it's not worth their time/effort. People whom are interested in leveling and i'm saying this as a rough guess & example wont stay at poring island if wolves are much better in exp unless they are "hunting" for specific items.

 

There's multiple level ranges on all of the places suggested and not all of those are "high-end" mobs and having maybe different spotlight & TI along side the current GH dungeon would help by making the population decide whether to go to x or y place. There's no condensing of people to any one map it's all preference then, like now ive seen multiple parties in the GH dungeon and multiple in ID3 ...it works. Again repeating what i said in the first post TIs dont have to be in constantly bi-monthly was my suggestion and doesn't seem too long to go with and then without a TI.

 

Not everyone has a guild to rely on for groups for places like ET/nameless/bios in fact i guarantee you NO NEW players will have any of those at their disposal unless they're returning players with friends and ... a guild to play with. Most of the TI groups i've seen are made up of people who group together from DIFFERENT guilds or non guilded players that end up JOINING guilds because they had a great time with the people they played with. 

 

If you wish to have maps altered to YOUR play style (this is generalizing and to no one in particular) make a thread and voice it there, i'm pretty sure the tiki tuesday thread is for suggestions also. Change for this server should be welcomed not beaten with a drama stick till it's dead and people are too anxious to post a suggestion without it being outright shunned or derailed. 

This thread was made on a suggestion from Tiki Tuesday... to HELP this server, if you read the first post (which changes frequently) it states that it is to continue what is already implemented in game but with varied places rotated and not constant unless the GMs felt that was a good idea.

 

 

[Xellie]

did you even read what I said?

[kschamp]

I don't think she did at all, senor xellie.

[IcedCafeMocha]

Updated front page, added more suggestions getting a lot of feedback from twitter and twitch followers   

 

<>

[Rythen]

Adding new high-level TIs will do nothing but benefit the users that are already established and can easily find parties.

 

This really isn't a difficult concept, the focus should be on lower-level areas where new players will be able to level and party up.

 

 

Abyss Lake 3 - Acidus and Ferus

Juperos 1 - Venatu (all)

Moscovia dungeon 03 - baba yaga

Rachel Sanctuary - Isilla & Vanberk

Ice Dungeon - Titans (current TI and count is fine)

Bio labs 2 - x/x/x/x mobs? (kill 50/100/150 of each?)

Nameless island (which level?) 

Turtle Island 2 - Permeter & solider                                 (ahhh the memories, reminds me of chalkboard and nails personally xD)

gl_prison1 - skel prisoners & injustice

CTHO - High orc xD

Magma 1 - Lava golem / Explosion / kaho

magma 2 - nightmare terror / diabolic

Umbala dun 02 - Wooden Golem

Geffenia -  (map dependant for mob amount)

Sphinx 5 - pasana / anubis

Ayo_Dun01 - Leaf cats & ghoul 

Ama_dun02 - Poison Toad & Firelock 

Beach_dun3 - Thara Frog & megalodon/hydras 

iz_dun04 - Strouf & merman 

alde_dun04 - Bathory

c_tower3 - Alarm

ein_dun02 - Obsidian & Teddy bear

odin_tem02 - skogul& frus / skeggiolds

orcsdun01 - orc zombie

orcsdun02 - zenorc / orc skel

tha_t02 - ancient mimic

tha_t03 - Deathword

 

So this is a nice list, let's go through and find the newbie-friendly ones out of it.

 

 

gl_prison1 - skel prisoners & injustice

CTHO - High orc xD

Beach_dun3 - Thara Frog & megalodon/hydras 

alde_dun04 - Bathory

c_tower3 - Alarm

orcsdun01 - orc zombie

orcsdun02 - zenorc / orc skel

 

A few of these are pretty dependent on party members and gear (GH Prison and Alarms aren't entirely newbie friendly, without some know-how), plus Prison would be best if Hunter Flys were gone, Bathories would be best without Jokers to deal with (have fun when someone turns it aggro and leaves), and Alarms have ridewords and mimics to deal with.

Edited by Rythen, 25 September 2014 - 12:38 PM.

[IcedCafeMocha]

Adding new high-level TIs will do nothing but benefit the users that are already established and can easily find parties.

 

This really isn't a difficult concept, the focus should be on lower-level areas where new players will be able to level and party up.

 

 

So this is a nice list, let's go through and find the newbie-friendly ones out of it.

 

 

A few of these are pretty dependent on party members and gear (GH Prison and Alarms aren't entirely newbie friendly, without some know-how), plus Prison would be best if Hunter Flys were gone, Bathories would be best without Jokers to deal with (have fun when someone turns it aggro and leaves), and Alarms have ridewords and mimics to deal with.

 

 

I'm still waiting on people with lower levels to pm/chat to me about TI maps that aren't happy with what is already available, You are more than welcome to suggest maps which would suit new players that isn't already buffed and TIs not available already on said maps as i believe ->>> http://irowiki.org/wiki/New_iRO_Quests  are all in the game still? 

 

Are TIs not supposed to be a lil dependant on parties? I know a few very under-geared people who were new and still managed to contribute to an ID3 group pretty well but i can see your point not everyone has gear, i know i'm limited to places I can go on some characters. 

[Exhale]

[AlmrOfAtlas]

 

Go home Zoidberg.

[IcedCafeMocha]

On topic i see lol... oh dear.

 

 

Edited OP

Edited by IcedCafeMocha, 29 September 2014 - 08:08 AM.

[Ralis]

Most new players don't use the forums. I didn't know the forums existed until I'd been playing for a week and needed help in the technical support section.

 

Only the item turnins are in, AFAIK. This is on Classic, remember?

[IcedCafeMocha]

Most new players don't use the forums. I didn't know the forums existed until I'd been playing for a week and needed help in the technical support section.

 

Only the item turnins are in, AFAIK. This is on Classic, remember?

 

 

I think the patcher could possibly do with a rehaul for classic to point new players here and to highlight patch notes and such, it took me a while to find my way here to see that it was useful and somewhat beneficial.   (i'm gonna throw this on TT thread as i think it might be relevant maybe ._.)

 

 

You can kill count and item turn in >_>;; 

 

 

 

i'm not stupid, honest.

Edited by IcedCafeMocha, 29 September 2014 - 11:09 AM.

[AlmrOfAtlas]

Bump for great justice. I'm not satisfied with this thread yet.

[IcedCafeMocha]

Thanks, it'd be nice to have GM response here. I'd asked about when the ti will change but apparently it takes a while to set up (i assume coding a kill count npc and map adjusting?) was answered in the muted TT.

[IcedCafeMocha]

Could this be stickied please to get more of a community input thing or put it in foundry i'd rather it not be buried when it's about something relevant to classic server atm ._.

[NorthenBeggar]

No. We already have too many pinned threads and this one has proven to cause feces storm.

[Kaymaru]

I like that idea about buffing all the maps and adding small perma-TIs as a means to buff them whilst running event TIs

It's the best of everything. I like options.

Edited by Kaymaru, 08 October 2014 - 04:04 PM.

[IcedCafeMocha]

No. We already have too many pinned threads and this one has proven to cause feces storm.

 

 

Provoked from what i was to understand.

 

I already suggested it could be moved to foundry as it's more of a suggestion and a project to improve the state of play on the classic server.

[Ralis]

The Foundry is for the CMs to post ideas they want to comment on. It's not my place to move threads there as I imagine they disabled posting in the section for a reason.

Edited by Ralis, 09 October 2014 - 04:30 PM.

[Cinquine]

In all honesty you'll get more traffic here than in foundry/suggestion section

Most ppl don't even know it exists :/ believe me. I've tried to bring it up in conversation before and people were like "wtf is that?"

[IcedCafeMocha]

Yeah, i've pretty much noticed there's 1 or 2 sections for the same use and it's somewhat a jumble of where is best to post anything for it to get seen for what it is :<

 

Thanks for the response Ralis, i wasn't sure whether they were just dead threads >.<

[Xellie]

they should go back to doing the TIs with the spotlights