110 replies to this topic

[Xellie]

As some of you may know from reading around the forums or talking to other players, there's been a "little bit" of a cheating problem on the servers.

 

But what really counts as cheating and what should we do about it?

 

Report, of course.

 

On saturday I encountered one of the worse cheats in the game. It is always the same guild that encourages the use of this cheat, videos (if posted by myself get removed, but not if posted by others) and forum posts in the open prove this.

 

Its not really fair for those of us who don't have the contacts for those sorts of clients but I digress, the point is that the GM team ask for evidence of such things and then do things that cannot be disclosed to the person reporting for "privacy reasons."

 

The result is that we end up playing against the same cheaters using the same cheats for months.

 

Normally I wouldn't complain, but I'd like to compare the amount of effort they put into various cheats.

 

I uploaded a video, unlisted of a certain player using nodelay. I shared this video with one friend located in Texas whom I know did not share it. The only other way to obtain the link to this video is through a ticket.

 

My video has been viewed from three locations.

the UK (myself), Texas (my friend) and the Philippines (????). Aside of the fact that I know of nobody who lives in the Philippines and that my video is unlisted and that alone is weird - not a single view of my video comes from California.

The ticket has since been closed. I have waited a week for views to show. Nope.

 

 

 

Now lets talk about what they really deal with.

 

19/08/2014 - My recaller is issued a 2 day ban for emblem swapping.

 

This is a video of the emblem and swap in question (at the end).

 

So what happened? Obviously the emblem didn't really play out much in the overall scheme of that WoE, but we argued it because we had previously reported 2 other guilds

- 1 for changing emblem to harrass us

- 1 for copying emblems during WoE.

 

Nothing happened to either.

 

Still we took the warning and now I set different emblems to my various recallers before WoE.  We haven't emblem swapped since.

 

Why do we use mutliple guilds? This is why

 

 

 

But so where was I? Oh right, so a few weeks later I've reported this ndl sniper and my ticket is closed and my video is unviewed. (with a mysterious view from the Philippines )

 

But this happened this week

 

 

And we didn't even do anything!

 

the tl;dr is -

 

 

 

Oh and I just feel like I need to add this:

 

Emblems have no outcome on the results

 

(feel free to report my ninja for actually doing something illegal to give the enemy team an advantage!)

Edited by Xellie, 20 September 2014 - 07:53 AM.

[AlmrOfAtlas]

CSO outsourcing fail. We now know their dirty secret.

 

On topic ndl is god damn annoying to fight against. It's not a matter of skill anymore if the other player is bypassing frame delay and is able to get 3 skills off as you're still in recovery from 1. I've personally reported several users of that damnable hack from my time in PvP (mostly on Renewal) and I'd say 8/10 of them are still actively playing the game ON the character I reported.

 

It's not hard to spot if you know what to look for. Get your -_- together.

[Necrohealiac]

GM offshore from phillipines?

[hoikarnage]

I never understood the no-emblem swapping rule to begin with. I used to woe with no emblem at all and apparently now that's against the rules.

 

Sure it might confuse people but who the hell cares, it's called strategy.

 

[Xellie]

It's my fault for wrecking people with a gtb stalker early on in the classic server.

 

it was never illegal on old Chaos, perhaps people just weren't such babies.

 

edit: I should have noticed it sooner, I'll give 50m to anyone who can pinpoint the nodelay champion in the final video in the OP

Edited by Xellie, 20 September 2014 - 08:35 AM.

[kschamp]

It's my fault for wrecking people with a gtb stalker early on in the classic server.

 

it was never illegal on old Chaos, perhaps people just weren't such babies.

 

edit: I should have noticed it sooner, I'll give 50m to anyone who can pinpoint the nodelay champion in the final video in the OP

Xellie cn pls help. I need to test something with full reduc woe sin x w/o gr dr

[Xellie]

idk how 2 w/o gr dr

[AlmrOfAtlas]

Xellie cn pls help. I need to test something with full reduc woe sin x w/o gr dr

 

[Trance3D2Y]

It's quite possible that WarpPortal's Customer Service is outsourced here in the Philippines. Business process outsourcing industry is quite popular here. And if ever that's true, that a GM/employee is also a player in real life, isn't that conflict of interest and possible reason for expulsion?

[Facekiller]

the No Emblem in WoE thing is stupid... first off you dont need to even be in a guild to WoE (you only need to be in approved guild to attack emperium)... so if a bunch of guildless people want to join the fun of killing people during woe and causing a shakeup for the WoE guilds they can be banned?.... also if a person isnt using the same emblem as you are why not just kill them? emblems should be the LAST thing anybody cares about in WoE

[iROLee]

You would make a point if guildless people could be recalled / break an emperium.

Edited by MP5SD2, 20 September 2014 - 09:00 AM.

[amarande]

*edit* nevermind

 

Edited by amarande, 20 September 2014 - 09:17 AM.

[Tofu]

I never understood the no-emblem swapping rule to begin with. I used to woe with no emblem at all and apparently now that's against the rules.

Sure it might confuse people but who the hell cares, it's called strategy.

There's a certain guild in renewal right now that would emblem swap every minute or so.

Immediately after a guild change emblems, the first time you see any member from that guild, and the following 10 seconds, you will see NO EMBLEM above their head. After those 10 seconds are up, and you've successfully loaded the new emblem, the person would have to move offscreen in order to actually see the emblem above their head.

That guild would do this, while sending in their recaller first, snapping at the speed of light. The lack of an emblem made it next to impossible to see.

After a few minutes of this, the single guild would have 3 or 4 different emblems on their members, all on the same screen.

Even if you don't think it's "cheating", at the very least it kills the spirit of what WoE is supposed to be about.

[Gn1ydnu]

Cheating in general, but ndly specifically is pathetic. Just make a proper build and you can achieve *almost* the same spam rate. Builds that strive off of ndly are generally more tanky due to not having to invest points into decreasing after cast delay or can wear more defensive gears (valk shield > thorny for example) well dealing more dps. All of these factors add up to giving a huge advantage to that player.


Side note: I will never have an emblem again.

Edited by Gn1ydnu, 20 September 2014 - 09:42 AM.

[Cinquine]

I didn't think the outsourcing thing would be a surprise. I remember seeing something on Facebook about Philippine employees for RO2 (at least I think, memory is a little foggy. I'll try to find it and link it).

[Xellie]

There's a certain guild in renewal right now that would emblem swap every minute or so.

Immediately after a guild change emblems, the first time you see any member from that guild, and the following 10 seconds, you will see NO EMBLEM above their head. After those 10 seconds are up, and you've successfully loaded the new emblem, the person would have to move offscreen in order to actually see the emblem above their head.

That guild would do this, while sending in their recaller first, snapping at the speed of light. The lack of an emblem made it next to impossible to see.

After a few minutes of this, the single guild would have 3 or 4 different emblems on their members, all on the same screen.

Even if you don't think it's "cheating", at the very least it kills the spirit of what WoE is supposed to be about.

 

Ummm that sounds like nonsense. If they changed it with you on screen then it wouldn't "turn blank", it would stay as the old emblem. At least that is the case on Classic. The people you're talking about would have to either change it outside the room that you're in (or offscreen) at which it would be forced to load anyway? There would be no blank time.

The only way what you are saying is possible, is if they load a blank emblem first, then swap.

 

I would also question how the recaller is switching so efficiently and moving so fast.

 

Spoiler

Let me teach you about the temp_emb folder. You grab a program to make a batch of copies of a guilds current emblem. (the files are like guildid_emblemnumber.tmp) and you increase the number on the end with each copy.

 

Set the temp_emb folder to read only

 

and you won't see their changes for the number of copies you made. Enjoy.

[Memoir]

I still don't get why people cheat. If they are smart enough to figure out how to cheat then why aren't they smart enough to figure out how to play without cheating? But damn that person just ruined the reputation of everyone from the Philippines.

Edited by Memoir, 20 September 2014 - 12:19 PM.

[littlechiyo]

Because ndl is legal no one has been banned for it on renewal why would they care about it on classic 

[Tofu]

Ummm that sounds like nonsense. If they changed it with you on screen then it wouldn't "turn blank", it would stay as the old emblem. At least that is the case on Classic. The people you're talking about would have to either change it outside the room that you're in (or offscreen) at which it would be forced to load anyway? There would be no blank time.

The only way what you are saying is possible, is if they load a blank emblem first, then swap.

 

I would also question how the recaller is switching so efficiently and moving so fast.

 

Spoiler

Let me teach you about the temp_emb folder. You grab a program to make a batch of copies of a guilds current emblem. (the files are like guildid_emblemnumber.tmp) and you increase the number on the end with each copy.

 

Set the temp_emb folder to read only

 

and you won't see their changes for the number of copies you made. Enjoy.

 

It doesn't "turn blank" like you say.

 

They have some emblem X. They change the emblem to Y. The recaller zooms through the castle FIRST. He shows up on everyone's screen first. The client requires time to display the new emblem Y. During this time, the recaller has no emblem. Once people behind him start showing up, they now have emblem Y. The recaller still has no emblem, until he leaves and reenters everyone's screen.

 

On renewal clients, if you change an emblem, it does not show up as the previous emblem. If that's how it works on classic, then emblem swapping on classic =/= emblem swapping on renewal. Blank emblems have always been against the rules, but emblem swapping wasn't until this recaller started doing this. They got off with a slap on the wrist, afterward they stopped doing it.

[Xellie]

Yeah it's not like that on classic, I'm pretty sure!

[Xellie]

What a surprise, that same nodelay POS was playing today.

 

I think I might start nodelaying, it;s clearly not illegal.

[AlmrOfAtlas]

What a surprise, that same nodelay POS was playing today.

 

I think I might start nodelaying, it;s clearly not illegal.

 

But then you'd be going against your cute new loading screen!

[celestience]

This is messed up. Very true. So do GMs even care or do they chuck tickets/reports which are flagged with "ndl" into the bin, since it's proven by xellie that no authorities viewed the video. Is it really classified on who is getting banned, or gms really don't care about banning these people? In that case, please just issue a statement saying so, at least we can start using ndl as well so at least we're on the same level.

 

To refresh sweet memories:

 

http://forums.warppo...renewal-server/

 

http://forums.warppo...n-breath-skill/

 

There's a certain guild in renewal right now that would emblem swap every minute or so.

Immediately after a guild change emblems, the first time you see any member from that guild, and the following 10 seconds, you will see NO EMBLEM above their head. After those 10 seconds are up, and you've successfully loaded the new emblem, the person would have to move offscreen in order to actually see the emblem above their head.

That guild would do this, while sending in their recaller first, snapping at the speed of light. The lack of an emblem made it next to impossible to see.

After a few minutes of this, the single guild would have 3 or 4 different emblems on their members, all on the same screen.

Even if you don't think it's "cheating", at the very least it kills the spirit of what WoE is supposed to be about.

 

http://forums.warppo...-the-wrist-now/

 

Pretty sure this ndl-get-caught-and-not-get-banned "kills the spirit of what WoE is supposed to be about", way more than what guild emblems even do. Maybe you need to worry more about the doings of your guild if you're really concerned about killing the spirit of woe.

 

Edited by celestience, 20 September 2014 - 06:51 PM.

[KiyokoHasami]

It's all about the money. That's why these people are still around.

[Kailash]

http://forums.warppo...-the-wrist-now/

 

Pretty sure this ndl-get-caught-and-not-get-banned "kills the spirit of what WoE is supposed to be about", way more than what guild emblems even do. Maybe you need to worry more about the doings of your guild if you're really concerned about killing the spirit of woe.

Not commenting on whether the cheats happen in WoE or not cause I haven't played Renewal in a while, but the RK in USRC doesn't look like he's nodelaying. The only time his animation is incomplete is when he's taking damage during the 20 second window at around 2:30. For the rest of the video, his animation is complete. His hand goes up, all the way down and then he bends over slightly. If he was no-delaying, his hand would stop somewhere midway. Also, nodelay isn't something you can switch on and off while playing (unless something's changed), so if his animations were complete for the majority for the match, chances are he wasn't using NDL.

 

Unless I'm completely wrong and something's changed, that doesn't look like NDL at all.