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Decreasing Mall and F2P Gap Proposals


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#1 XRosebloodX

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 12:35 PM

Purpose: To decrease the gap between mall and free players while not devaluing mall players or decreasing money spent. This will be partially be achieved by revamping the base stats of items and the reinforcement system.

 

Currently, at end game, +0 players are at best 17-25% efficiency compared to full +30 players. The proposed system will decrease the gap to 50% percent of full +30 mall players.

 

The proposed system also includes:

  • +30 players retaining current stats

  • mall amounts needed not decreasing

  • encouraging reinforcement to certain stages with bonuses

 

Proposals:

Note:All reinforcement additions except percentages rounded to hundredths. Percentages rounded to thousandths.

 

For items without ranged stat rolls:

 

New base stats of item = Current +30 stats of item/2

New addition per reinforcement =  New base stats of item/30 

 

Examples:

Base defense = (+30 defense/2)

Defense per reinforcement = (+30 defense/60) 

Base stats (con int mnd str dex) = (+30 stats/2)

Stats per reinforcement = (+30 stats/60) 

Spoiler

 

For items with ranged stat rolls:

 

     New Min Roll = + 30 Current Minimum Roll/2
      New Max Roll = New Min + Range of Current Max to Min Rolls      (Range difference stays the same.)
      Addition per + = New Min Base / 30

 

Example:

Spoiler

Changed From:
Spoiler

For players at +0 to +9, players will be able to compete at a 50 – 72% efficiency compared to heavy spenders (not including enchants).

 

Proposition # 1 Regarding Jewels
Note: 
% bonus applied to the dmg, the cad, scad, scc, pcc, but NOT the actual targeted stat (Ex: No bonus on CON from NM CON jewels)

For each jewel at reinforcement levels 10, 20, and 30, rewards to item base stats would include:
 

Q7PjSMU.jpg

 

These are bonuses to each jewel at that current reinforcement stage. THESE DO NOT include enchantments IN the item. ONLY effecting the stats of the jewel itself.

 

Option 2 for this proposition

The % bonus only turns on when the ENTIRE set is at the required reinforcement stage. Each jewel gets this % bonus onto its OWN stats EXCLUDING enchants ofc. Encouraging people to spread their reinforcement instead of focusing solely on jewels that give the most benefit. This however would require this formula for people using split sets

(Bonus for Grade Set/8)*Quantity of set items + (Bonus for 2nd Grade Set/8)*Quantity of 2nd set items

 

Proposition #2 Regarding Jewels

If % bonus to jewels is not possible. The concept behind this, is rewarding the player for getting the entire set to a specific reinforcement level. +10 is easily accomplished during a 70% forge for a free player, requires very limited amount of foc points, and offers a substantial bonus to getting full set to a specific reinforcement.

 

CbpVOSa.jpg

 

 

As you can see, the difference between +30 set and +10 set is not overly excessive, yet it still provides incentive for players to aim for full +30 gear.

 

Additional Note for players who are using mixed Grade sets:

If you are currently using 4 parts Carus +30 and 4 parts rare +30, the bonus would work as followed

(150/8)*4 + (125/8)*4 = Scad/Pcad

(5%/8)*4 + (4%/8)*4 = Scc/Pcc

(200/8)*4 + (175/8)*4 = Damage

Formula is

(Bonus for Grade Set/8)*Quantity of set items + (Bonus for 2nd Grade Set/8)*Quantity of 2nd set items

 

Proposition # 1 Regarding Armors

Currently they difference between Plate, Chain, Leather, and Cloth armor is, very minimal. The only difference is the defense they provide.

 

Plate Armors:

 

Reinforcement

lEu2WSL.jpg

     

 

Work in Progress

 

 

 

 

Yes, Helium, we realize that reworking all those stats on items along with reinf will be a huge thing. But the gap between f2p and mall players is too large.

 

Also, this project has been worked on by multiple people. Mostly one mad scientist, a representative/HR person, an angel who deserves a bucket of mint and caramel ice cream, and a couple handfuls of older mall and free players. All help is appreciated! 


Edited by XRosebloodX, 06 January 2015 - 10:41 AM.

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#2 Kazara

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 12:51 PM

Easier way :
Each reinforcement on ANY item will give the following bonusss :

Each +1 = +1 cad scad attribute etc...and 5% def/eva/accuracy of the item base stats.

Get rid of detoration rate and break rate, put a permanent 60% forge.

Now, the difference between a +10 or +30 won t be high, and players won t be able to get thousands of cad/scad.

No?

Also reduce reinforcement prices.
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#3 Apollonia93

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 12:54 PM

Easier way :
Each reinforcement on ANY item will give the following bonusss :

Each +1 = +1 cad scad attribute etc...and 5% def/eva/accuracy of the item base stats.

Get rid of detoration rate and break rate, put a permanent 60% forge.

Now, the difference between a +10 or +30 won t be high, and players won t be able to get thousands of cad/scad.

No?

Also reduce reinforcement prices.

absolutely not

 

First, you just proposed screwing over every single player that has malled their toon.

Second, you proposed changing the actual system of reinforcement which is impossible to do

Third, if your goal is to remove high scad and cad then your goal is to make every player unkillable. Also no.

Fourth, why reduce the prices.

 

The goal is NOT, i repeat NOT to remove mallwhores or reduce the pricing or change the success rates.

The goal is to minimize the difference between +30 and free players, WITHOUT changing the stats of current +30 items


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#4 XRosebloodX

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 01:00 PM

 

The way to fix things is usually and most efficiently done when focusing on the very beginning of problems. In this case, the base stats of items and how much is added. Just lessening bonuses overall and adding things mainly for pvp is not well thought out. 


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#5 jebac098

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 01:01 PM

Omfg why are you cry so much about free players pll tell me.
Ok im not a free player np but whit this xmas evet i make 6 pice of gear +30 only whit foc and i know a lot off ppl lets say free player that would be +10 gear i was able to kill them in 2 hot but now no way they are almost full +30 and you telling as that forge 70% its not good?that is the best thing that can heppen to free player go to facking foc feed them make ypu countribution max,have all bags full of cards and that's it..

BTW my english sux sry
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#6 Apollonia93

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 01:03 PM

Omfg why are you cry so much about free players pll tell me.
Ok im not a free player np but whit this xmas evet i make 6 pice of gear +30 only whit foc and i know a lot off ppl lets say free player that would be +10 gear i was able to kill them in 2 hot but now no way they are almost full +30 and you telling as that forge 70% its not good?that is the best thing that can heppen to free player go to facking foc feed them make ypu countribution max,have all bags full of cards and that's it..

BTW my english sux sry

christmas is a once in a year time, which means all players during the rest of the year do NOT have this opportunity and are stuck being WAY sub-par compared to other players.

This heavily discourages new players.

As does your brilliant feeding. Most people dont like being worthless and feeding in foc and union just to get points to work on gear.


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#7 Kazara

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 01:04 PM

absolutely not

First, you just proposed screwing over every single player that has malled their toon.
Second, you proposed changing the actual system of reinforcement which is impossible to do
Third, if your goal is to remove high scad and cad then your goal is to make every player unkillable. Also no.
Fourth, why reduce the prices.

The goal is NOT, i repeat NOT to remove mallwhores or reduce the pricing or change the success rates.
The goal is to minimize the difference between +30 and free players, WITHOUT changing the stats of current +30 items


Yes, they will have lower scad/cad but also lower hp/def/ resistance like in S1,with my system.
With the current system skill damage worth nothing, while in s1 it was a big part of the dmg. The +30 players will have higher bonuses so where is the problem? Also get rid of break rate and detoration rate is impossible?lol
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#8 Apollonia93

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 01:06 PM

Yes, they will have lower scad/cad but also lower hp/def/ resistance like in S1,with my system.
With the current system skill damage worth nothing, while in s1 it was a big part of the dmg. The +30 players will have higher bonuses so where is the problem? Also get rid of break rate and detoration rate is impossible?lol

Absolutely impossible.

 

Once again, your suggestion is forcing all players who have already finished their toons, to completely redo their gear. That is completely unreasonable.

 

Once again, the point is to keep +30 people with finished gear the way they are, or increase them a little, and at the same time bring up NON heavy mallers up to a point where they dont get 2 shot.


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#9 VanillaNinja

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 01:31 PM

Absolutely impossible.

 

Once again, your suggestion is forcing all players who have already finished their toons, to completely redo their gear. That is completely unreasonable.

 

Once again, the point is to keep +30 people with finished gear the way they are, or increase them a little, and at the same time bring up NON heavy mallers up to a point where they dont get 2 shot.

its easy to balance -_-, simple add new gear that has better stats 0+ than previous at 30+ and make them max 15+


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#10 Unbound

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 01:33 PM

instanced = nope :P

 

Gravity = Kill it with fire


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#11 VanillaNinja

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 01:35 PM

Gravity = Kill it with fire

well im not playing anymore, i dont even know why im still onn forums xD


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#12 Apollonia93

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 01:38 PM

its easy to balance -_-, simple add new gear that has better stats 0+ than previous at 30+ and make them max 15+

no, cannot change from +30 to +15, that is not balance that is messing up the reinforcement system they have in place.

 

stop thinking about trying to change the reinforcement % or the way reinforcement process works.

 

also you cannot introduce new gear that OP at +0 because once again you mess up all the older players.

 

The goal, is to minimize the difference between +30 and +0 players, NOT change the income the company gets from people malling


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#13 VanillaNinja

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 01:48 PM

no, cannot change from +30 to +15, that is not balance that is messing up the reinforcement system they have in place.

 

stop thinking about trying to change the reinforcement % or the way reinforcement process works.

 

also you cannot introduce new gear that OP at +0 because once again you mess up all the older players.

 

The goal, is to minimize the difference between +30 and +0 players, NOT change the income the company gets from people malling

they could find something else to make $$ if their IQ was higher than sack of potatoes


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#14 Kazara

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 01:51 PM

Why you think devs will look on this topic?
They ll ignore it like others...
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#15 Apollonia93

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 01:52 PM

Why you think devs will look on this topic?
They ll ignore it like others...

well, im trying to propose a suggestion which would be beneficial and yet not alter current malling paterns


Edited by Apollonia93, 05 January 2015 - 02:12 PM.

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#16 Kazara

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 02:33 PM

You know the games with highest income are totally f2p?
This game with only cosmetic in item mall and fixed, would have thousands of players.
Just watch the new server f2p on ru server, it has a lot of players, is near full while others are empty.
But our devs are stupid, they don't know anything about the game, they still stuck with that old -_-ty p2w system to get incomes..
While some other -_-ty game with less potential than requiem, gets millions of income, updates, etc...
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#17 explicid17

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 02:48 PM

80% frogee


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#18 BloodyHalo

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 02:58 PM

I think +0 characters are much less than 1/4 effective than +30 ones.


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#19 Apollonia93

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 03:02 PM

I think +0 characters are much less than 1/4 effective than +30 ones.

yes and no, stat wise about 1/4. defense wise, 1/5 to 1/6. i tried to be optimistic. and just pointing out that there is a huge gap that can be relatively easily fixed


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#20 BloodyHalo

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 03:09 PM

Oh I as talking about roseblood Fos, and I meant more in pvp because there you can see the real diff, in raids you're right there isnt as big or noticeable difference.  My fault should've specified  better.


Edited by BloodyHalo, 05 January 2015 - 03:10 PM.

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#21 Apollonia93

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 03:24 PM

Oh I as talking about roseblood Fos, and I meant more in pvp because there you can see the real diff, in raids you're right there isnt as big or noticeable difference.  My fault should've specified  better.

we worked on it together lol, that was my math and yeah i was off.

atm im not trying to be TOO detailed and exact, spent plenty of time on this and dont want to spend more until i know helium has seen this and at the very least tosses a comment


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#22 Mythdra

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 04:26 PM

this is requiem, no such thing as "free" end debate.
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#23 BloodyHalo

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 04:30 PM

we worked on it together lol, that was my math and yeah i was off.

atm im not trying to be TOO detailed and exact, spent plenty of time on this and dont want to spend more until i know helium has seen this and at the very least tosses a comment

 

Yah I wouldn't, like blowing smoke to the wind.


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#24 Helium

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 06:36 PM

Purpose: To decrease the gap between mall and free players while not devaluing mall players or decreasing money spent. This will be partially be achieved by revamping the base stats of items and the reinforcement system.

 

Currently, at end game, +0 players are at best 17-25% efficiency compared to full +30 players. The proposed system will decrease the gap to 50% percent of full +30 mall players.

 

The proposed system also includes:

  • +30 players retaining current stats

  • mall amounts needed not decreasing

  • encouraging reinforcement to certain stages with bonuses

 

Proposals:

 

For items without ranged stat rolls:

New base stats of item = +30 stats of item/2

New addition per reinforcement =  +30 stats of item/60

 

Examples:

Base defense = (+30 defense/2)

Defense per reinforcement = (+30 defense/60) rounded to nearest .5

Base stats (con int mnd str dex) = (+30 stats/2)

Stats per reinforcement = (+30 stats/60) rounded to nearest .5

 

For items with ranged stat rolls:

New range maximum for item = +30 Best Possible Stats of Item/2
New range minimum for item = +30 Worst Possible Stats of Item/2  
New addition per reinforcement = (+30 Best Possible Stats) + (+30 Worst Possible Stats)/120
 

For players at +0 to +9, players will be able to compete at a 50 – 72% efficiency compared to heavy spenders (not including enchants).

 

Proposition # 1 Regarding Jewels
Note: 
% bonus applied to the dmg, the cad, scad, scc, pcc, but NOT the actual targeted stat (Ex: No bonus on CON from NM CON jewels)

For each jewel at reinforcement levels 10, 20, and 30, rewards to item base stats would include:
 

Q7PjSMU.jpg

 

These are bonuses to each jewel at that current reinforcement stage. THESE DO NOT include enchantments IN the item. ONLY effecting the stats of the jewel itself.

 

Option 2 for this proposition

The % bonus only turns on when the ENTIRE set is at the required reinforcement stage. Each jewel gets this % bonus onto its OWN stats EXCLUDING enchants ofc. Encouraging people to spread their reinforcement instead of focusing solely on jewels that give the most benefit. This however would require this formula for people using split sets

(Bonus for Grade Set/8)*Quantity of set items + (Bonus for 2nd Grade Set/8)*Quantity of 2nd set items

 

Proposition #2 Regarding Jewels

If % bonus to jewels is not possible. The concept behind this, is rewarding the player for getting the entire set to a specific reinforcement level. +10 is easily accomplished during a 70% forge for a free player, requires very limited amount of foc points, and offers a substantial bonus to getting full set to a specific reinforcement.

 

CbpVOSa.jpg

 

 

As you can see, the difference between +30 set and +10 set is not overly excessive, yet it still provides incentive for players to aim for full +30 gear.

 

Additional Note for players who are using mixed Grade sets:

If you are currently using 4 parts Carus +30 and 4 parts rare +30, the bonus would work as followed

(150/8)*4 + (125/8)*4 = Scad/Pcad

(5%/8)*4 + (4%/8)*4 = Scc/Pcc

(200/8)*4 + (175/8)*4 = Damage

Formula is

(Bonus for Grade Set/8)*Quantity of set items + (Bonus for 2nd Grade Set/8)*Quantity of 2nd set items

 

Proposition # 1 Regarding Armors

Currently they difference between Plate, Chain, Leather, and Cloth armor is, very minimal. The only difference is the defense they provide.

 

Plate Armors:

 

Reinforcement

lEu2WSL.jpg

     

 

Work in Progress

 

 

 

 

Yes, Helium, we realize that reworking all those stats on items along with reinf will be a huge thing. But the gap between f2p and mall players is too large.

 

 

Bottom line agreed but still reading...


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#25 Helium

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 06:53 PM

Trying to imagine this in practice...

 

 

 

Proposals:

 

For items without ranged stat rolls:

New base stats of item = +30 stats of item/2

New addition per reinforcement =  +30 stats of item/60

 

Examples:

Base defense = (+30 defense/2)

Defense per reinforcement = (+30 defense/60) rounded to nearest .5

Base stats (con int mnd str dex) = (+30 stats/2)

Stats per reinforcement = (+30 stats/60) rounded to nearest .5

 

For items with ranged stat rolls:

New range maximum for item = +30 Best Possible Stats of Item/2
New range minimum for item = +30 Worst Possible Stats of Item/2  
New addition per reinforcement = (+30 Best Possible Stats) + (+30 Worst Possible Stats)/120
 

For players at +0 to +9, players will be able to compete at a 50 – 72% efficiency compared to heavy spenders (not including enchants).

 

 


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