14 replies to this topic

[DestinyDeoxys]

Right now, in a Union War to get Union reward point, the only way is to get a kill as well as a proof of extermination. In other words, without some sort of high damage output, it is very unlikely to get yourself some proofs. Classes such as cleric, knight, scout are in disadvantage when it comes to getting proofs but we have extra points given to clerics which in my opinion should be changed as well, this encourages leech and afk as a cleric instead of participating in a Union War. Instead of getting proofs by killing enemy, players should stick to what their job intended for. And this is a way to counter afk and promote actions in Union War.

Cleric - (15 extra points removed) For every 100,000 hit points healed = 1 proof
Knight - For every 15,000 hit points counter attack through shield reflect = 1 proof
Scout/Dual Wield Raider - For every 5 stealthed/camouflaged/cloaked enemy revealed with second sight = 1 proof
Katar Raider - For every 50,000 hit points damage inflicted during cloaking = 1 proof
Artisan - For every 10 enemy put into sleep mode = 1 proof
Bourgeois - For every 5 stealthed/camouflaged/cloaked enemy revealed with third eye = 1 proof
Champion - too overpower ATM go home and get proof XD
Mage - For every 5 opponent anti-magic shell succeed = 1 proof (LOL I'M JOKING DON'T -1 ME SO EARLY)
hm ... just give them 2 proof instead of 1 lol since they are so hard to play in UW

/end thread


Edit: Mage - For every 3 consecutive kills without dying = 1 proof (Buy 3 get 1 free)

Edited by DestinyDeoxys, 18 August 2011 - 09:26 AM.

[Dusk1PS]

I like the idea. It isn't perfect but it's a good template to work with.

Rewarding actions done vs rewarding killing ability.

[DestinyDeoxys]

Rewarding actions done vs rewarding killing ability.

Besides that reason, I'm making this thread mostly for knights/dual raiders/clerics/scout, to get proofs on these classes, you have to be using DPS build which is really not what these classes are intended for, rewarding killing ability is really dumb and boring.

[Dusk1PS]

Besides that reason, I'm making this thread mostly for knights/dual raiders/clerics/scout, to get proofs on these classes, you have to be using DPS build which is really not what these classes are intended for, rewarding killing ability is really dumb and boring.

Yeah, I know what you mean. You basically got to find the weak noobs and pick them off as those classes to get proofs really.

Maybe you can make it both, killing ability + your idea of an alternative way to get proofs?

[DoubleRose]

waste of GM's time, not sure if they are using it effectively as it is.

[Phish]

Looks great! This is a simple feature that could give more classes a 'purpose' in union war. Of course people would still gain proofs through kills, but not every class is meant to be a killing machine. The current cleric bonus is kind of flawed now, because yes it encourages leeching, and also discourages fighting. On losing wars the cleric won't get any points, even if they worked hard to support people during it.


The only thing I am a little iffy on is the reward for scout/bourgious. For Bourgs maybe have, every 10 grenades throw = 1 proof. If every class has an alternative for points, Champs should have one too (class balancing is a separate category), maybe the same as what the Mage alternative is.



The cleric heals should only count if the ally is already injured (not just repeatedly spamming heals on afk people on spawn for points).


And for those thinking that this can be exploited; it's not any more so than someone farming their own characters for proofs now.

waste of GM's time, not sure if they are using it effectively as it is.

Not like they are already wasting our time. They are planning on making Union war changes, and this would be beneficial to have it implemented.

Edited by Phish, 07 July 2011 - 02:09 PM.

[ThunderBug]

not gonna -1 it but i dont like the idea :/

[DoubleRose]

how will the system ever be able to differentiate between dual/katar raiders?

[Phish]

Then it should just be the dual alternative of dodging for both.

[Kaizy]

It could just check which weapon they have equipped?

There are games much more complex than Rose and have these types of features. It's not like it's impossible. The devs might have to actually learn how to program to do it though.

This is one of the better ideas I've seen for UW changes.

[Zayin]

I like the general idea, but I have no opinion on the exact reward amounts. This would be particularly great for clerics since they aren't supposed to be fighters.

Edited by Zayin, 07 July 2011 - 03:34 PM.

[HellGuardian]

The list seem like all rely on debuff skill to get point but most are horrible in percentage even if you use it constantly, the success of it landing the hit is very low.

If just using the skill without requiring to land the hit, there would be many exploit on that.

For example, dual raider for dodge, use mirror rush in crowd spam pots and run back out, rinse and repeat would easily get tons of points.

The idea can act as a template as someone mention earlier but there is so much possibility to be exploit just by glancing at it.

[DestinyDeoxys]

Hey there! With the new game arena system finally running on live servers, I would like to continue this thread and make some changes, so ignore everything from the 1st post because Union war doesn't exist anymore.

I feel like getting high points in Crystal defender only happens when the duration of the war is long. And let's forget about the duration of war, as many of you and bendersmom know the points gained from healing inflicted compare to the points gained from killing/damage inflicted is not balanced. Many clerics feel like being a healer is rewarded less than a killer.

So I'm looking forward to a more fair and precise points reward system instead of just healing inflicted / damage inflicted / kill counts, something like the following should be done.

In a crystal defender match:

- points are rewarded based on healing inflicted to death count ratio and should not be based on pure total healing inflicted.
Reason: promote competitive gameplay, tired to see high INT but low def clerics die over and over, spam healing the crystal but not helping the team. Inflicting high amount of heals while keeping a low death count is vital to the victory of the team.

- points are rewarded based on kill count to death count ratio and should not be based on pure total damage inflicted or pure total kill count.
Reason: promote competitive gameplay, if it is based on pure total damage inflicted, then it will not be fair to class without AOE. And if it is based on pure total kill count, then it will not be fair to class with less offensive power such as knights, scouts. Getting high amount of kills while keeping a low death count is vital to the victory of the team.

- points are rewarded based on shield reflected hit count to total damage received ratio, the shield reflect damages are displayed in announcement box, so I think it will be possible to check the total shield reflected hit count. Notice that it is hit count not the actual reflected damage.
Reason: similar to clerics for being supportive role, knights are meant for tanking not a killing machine, so they need to be rewarded for being defensive, getting high counts of melee hit while receiving least amount of damage is the most efficient way to help the team.

- in a crystal defender match, there are 3 crystals (sunrise/sunset/dusk), each crystal worth 5 points for the team, so the attacker and defender are fighting for these 15 points. If the match end with 1 crystal destroyed 2 crystal left, then attacker gets 5 points for their team and defender gets 10 points for their team.
Reason: currently there is no reward for winning or losing a crystal defender match besides the one from daily quest, and we don't want to give too much points due to leechers, but I guess everyone know by now leeching will not get you anywhere but making your team lose.

- keep everything else game arena already has, like kill within crystal proximity stuff
Reason: prevent spawn killing


Daily quest:
- 30 points are rewarded for achieving at least 3.0 kill to death ratio (in 1 match not cumulative)
- 30 points are rewarded for killing 30 enemies (cumulative)
- 30 points are rewarded for killing more than 10 enemies (in 1 match not cumulative)
- 30 points are rewarded for total damage received > 1,000,000 (cumulative, for new players who has just joined game arena)
- 30 points are rewarded for joining crystal defender match 3 times
- 30 points are rewarded for total healing inflicted > 1,500,000 (cumulative)
- 30 points are rewarded for revealing 30 hidden enemies (camouflage/stealthed/cloaked)
- 30 points are rewarded for getting 3 consecutive kills (you know it, 3 kills with no deaths in-between)

Note: I was gonna put one up for reviving, but I guess not because I don't recommend revive on the battlefield which gets the team in trouble further due to the time it takes to re-buff and you lose further teammates. Also, there is nothing I can do for mages and dual sword raiders, because it is the flaw of the class itself not the game arena point reward system.

[jerremy]

Agreed on everything. Yup, that's all I had to say on this.

[Phish]

I think the kill to death ratio for a quest is a good idea, because it is optional and you get rewarded for living. I don't think the kill to death ratio is a good idea for the main point distribution because it penalizes you for dieing; which can make people give up when they start losing, but you already know that.

The other ideas look good, shield reflect 'hits' favor knights doing their job but bourgs will also gain points for it.


For new quest we could have 3 difficulties for each (most) types. Novice, Intermediate, Expert.

For example one type would be kill X number of enemies in one war.

Novice: Kill 5
Intermediate: Kill 10
Expert: Kill 20

Another Type would be Heal x amount of hp to your allies in one war:


Novice: 300k
Intermediate: 600k
Expert: 1m


Kill to Death ratio:


Novice: 3/1 kills to death
Intermediate:6/1 kills to death
Expert: 10/1 kills to death


You would only be able to pick up 1 quest of a certain type (can't grab novice, intermediate and expert all at once). I don't think it should have a time limit but the quest should reset after a war if you didn't meet the requirements to complete it.