Summoner Glitch - Page 2 - Dragon Saga Community Chat - WarpPortal Community Forums

Jump to content


Photo
- - - - -

Summoner Glitch


  • Please log in to reply
73 replies to this topic

#26 epifanes

epifanes

    I am New.

  • Members
  • 7 posts

Posted 25 March 2012 - 04:25 AM

Summoner's revenge is neither glitch nor bug - it does exactly what the description says (65% chance to reflect 40% damage at 5/5). The only difference between this and paladin's revenge is that minions are considered PvE monsters, which means they take and reflect PvE damage (pure HP value with close to no defense) even in PvP. While this sounds scary (and makes all mindlessly attacking people go rage because of insta-deaths), this can be countered quite easily in mass PvP.

Same as with paladin revenge, clerics are the best class to take care of revenging summoner, as almost none of their attacks/debuffs is reflecting damage. Freeze/frog the summoner and killing his minions with double shot spam seems to be the easiest way. Before the summoner can respawn golgon (main revenging tool), you have plenty of time to kill him with any attack then (240 secs cooldown). Ninja's dagger is another powerful skill that is not reflected and can be used etc etc.

I can't read developers' minds, but any revenge type of skill is the best counter to otherwise impossible-to-hit dodge/evade stackers, so maybe that's why they gave it to summoners in the first place. But as I said above, this skill doesn't have to be nerfed, because ways how to deal with it exist even with the current game mechanics. I'm playing lvl80 summoner on EU server and I can tell you that people there learned the above (and many other tricks) quite fast (we got the patch just this week), and I no longer get as many surprise kills as I used to in first days.
  • 1

#27 Jumpluffspore

Jumpluffspore

    Awarded #1 Troll

  • Members
  • 823 posts
  • Playing:Dragon Saga

Posted 25 March 2012 - 12:01 PM

Sorry no, revenge skills are just not necessary. The only effective counter you've presented was a priest, and in a "mass" pvp, all the summoner's team has to do is gank the priest and it's gg. The reflection of pve damage is absolute competitive trash.
  • 0

#28 StormHaven

StormHaven

    Ro2 Volunteer Class Rep

  • WarpPortal VM
  • 4695 posts
  • Playing:Dragon Saga
  • Server:Dekard

Posted 25 March 2012 - 12:16 PM

Sorry no, revenge skills are just not necessary. The only effective counter you've presented was a priest, and in a "mass" pvp, all the summoner's team has to do is gank the priest and it's gg. The reflection of pve damage is absolute competitive trash.


sentinel,Dragoons,ninja,destroyer, fighters, invokers, a skilled WM are all counters for it.
  • 1

#29 GrapefruitGod

GrapefruitGod

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Members
  • 1334 posts
  • LocationSurrounded by kneesocks
  • Playing:Dragon Saga
  • Server:decard

Posted 25 March 2012 - 12:20 PM

Whether there's a counter or not it's still a little ridiculous. I don't know if you noticed in my last post but I was basically saying that there's no summoners who know what they're doing.
Even so, if there's such a skill that can instantly kill off another player (with their own attack even) there better be some serious consequences to the skill. There are none with this one.
  • 6

#30 StormHaven

StormHaven

    Ro2 Volunteer Class Rep

  • WarpPortal VM
  • 4695 posts
  • Playing:Dragon Saga
  • Server:Dekard

Posted 25 March 2012 - 12:31 PM

Whether there's a counter or not it's still a little ridiculous. I don't know if you noticed in my last post but I was basically saying that there's no summoners who know what they're doing.
Even so, if there's such a skill that can instantly kill off another player (with their own attack even) there better be some serious consequences to the skill. There are none with this one.


there were none for pre twin-bug fix infinite kicking and there isn't one sniping, from the past 2 cases GG really doesn't care that skills can ohko people easily.

Edited by StormHaven, 25 March 2012 - 12:34 PM.

  • 1

#31 GrapefruitGod

GrapefruitGod

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Members
  • 1334 posts
  • LocationSurrounded by kneesocks
  • Playing:Dragon Saga
  • Server:decard

Posted 25 March 2012 - 01:17 PM

Twin damage was fixed. Sniping needs to crit to get big numbers. If I run to a person, use one skill and die. No matter how you look at it, it's stupid.
And that's the entire point. The only point actually. Can it be countered? sure. Does the developer care? not likely. But the fact remains that it's incredibly stupid.
  • 6

#32 Coolsam

Coolsam

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Members
  • 3710 posts
  • LocationLocation Location ;D
  • Playing:Dragon Saga
  • Server:revreS

Posted 25 March 2012 - 04:38 PM

Twin damage was fixed. Sniping needs to crit to get big numbers. If I run to a person, use one skill and die. No matter how you look at it, it's stupid.
And that's the entire point. The only point actually. Can it be countered? sure. Does the developer care? not likely. But the fact remains that it's incredibly stupid.


This I agree with.

Counter-able? Well depends on the summoner himself/herself. Some don't use familiars, others use only a Golgon and maybe another for help,

If there's no counter then the best are some checks. Where it can only depend on chance and skill at the time. Like it's been discussed some classes can get around this and there may be openings to where anyone can get the summoner.

Today in Battlesquare I saw a summoner making it to where he had nothing but a literal 6-10 group mob of summons surrounding him at all times. It was those weaker summons that you can mass-summon up. Summoners are now pretty much depending on it. Ok props that it ignores evade but seriously filling up every single summon slot so you have like 8-9 summons in a circle around you like a CIA horde around a President?

I believe the solution is to give summons hp/damage in a sort of pvp based thing. Like have thier hp lowered and other players deal damage like in pvp only. For this to be fair (since all summons have 0 defense virtually.) give them some pvp only defenses so we don't kill ourselves hitting upto several hundred's of thousands of damage. But instead at the most it probably takes down about half or a third of our hp.

Granted this isn't an easy one to do, not to mention probably has several flaws.

I like summoners at first, especially when it went from a 5-6 group of summons to mainly a Golgon and 1-2 others that give buffs and assist you. But the damage reflection will eventually have everyone making and rapid leveling summoners.

And the Developers lack of caring I may actually give ya that one. But atm I felt like they were rushed with summoner/fighter 4th jobs. And if they do care we won't see any changes till the next major patch where most new skills and skill changes take place.

Overall, it'll eventually have to be nerfed. But hey it's a class balance issue and we all know it takes half of forever for those to happen in MMO's (Not just Dragonica/Dragon Saga).
  • 1

#33 Kazu731

Kazu731

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Members
  • 3347 posts
  • LocationSky Garden
  • Playing:Dragon Saga
  • Server:Sky Garden

Posted 25 March 2012 - 05:08 PM

And the Developers lack of caring I may actually give ya that one. But atm I felt like they were rushed with summoner/fighter 4th jobs. And if they do care we won't see any changes till the next major patch where most new skills and skill changes take place.

This is a sad thing. I feel that they didn't get these skills out quickly enough. I can see what you mean, but I really hope that whatever they were doing, they don't consider these to be rushed in their development office.
  • 0

#34 Jumpluffspore

Jumpluffspore

    Awarded #1 Troll

  • Members
  • 823 posts
  • Playing:Dragon Saga

Posted 25 March 2012 - 05:09 PM

there were none for pre twin-bug fix infinite kicking and there isn't one sniping, from the past 2 cases GG really doesn't care that skills can ohko people easily.

PRE TWIN BUG MEANS FIXED NOW AS IN CHANGE AS IN WHAT WE WANT FOR THIS SKILL BECAUSE IT'S DUMB. SNIPING IF YOU GET CAUGHT BY IT AND NOTHING ELSE YOU DESERVED IT IF YOU WERE FROZEN/TRAPPED WELL YOU WERE SCREWED ANYWAYS
  • 1

#35 StormHaven

StormHaven

    Ro2 Volunteer Class Rep

  • WarpPortal VM
  • 4695 posts
  • Playing:Dragon Saga
  • Server:Dekard

Posted 25 March 2012 - 05:20 PM

PRE TWIN BUG MEANS FIXED NOW AS IN CHANGE AS IN WHAT WE WANT FOR THIS SKILL BECAUSE IT'S DUMB. SNIPING IF YOU GET CAUGHT BY IT AND NOTHING ELSE YOU DESERVED IT IF YOU WERE FROZEN/TRAPPED WELL YOU WERE SCREWED ANYWAYS

If you run in and straight away and attacks summons you deserve to die then.
  • 0

#36 Jumpluffspore

Jumpluffspore

    Awarded #1 Troll

  • Members
  • 823 posts
  • Playing:Dragon Saga

Posted 25 March 2012 - 05:22 PM

If you run in and straight away and attacks summons you deserve to die then.

I don't even have the words to explain how angry your inability to understand the problem here is making me. DAMAGE REFLECTION IS SOMETHING YOU DON'T EVEN HAVE TO PUSH A BUTTON FOR FFFFFFFFFFF JESUS CHRIST PRESS IT ONCE GG. THE SUMMONS GET IN THE WAY WHAT ABOUT LAUNCHING AOES LIKE HEAD SPIN. YOU MADE ME SO ANGRY YOU TRIGGERED MY MENSTRUAL CYCLE, NOW MY FLOOR'S COVERED IN PIECES OF MY UTERUS. ARE YOU HAPPY? HAPPY NOW STORM? WOULD YOU LIKE A PIECE OF MY TORN PLACENTA?

Edited by Jumpluffspore, 25 March 2012 - 05:23 PM.

  • 2

#37 StormHaven

StormHaven

    Ro2 Volunteer Class Rep

  • WarpPortal VM
  • 4695 posts
  • Playing:Dragon Saga
  • Server:Dekard

Posted 25 March 2012 - 05:37 PM

I don't even have the words to explain how angry your inability to understand the problem here is making me. DAMAGE REFLECTION IS SOMETHING YOU DON'T EVEN HAVE TO PUSH A BUTTON FOR FFFFFFFFFFF JESUS CHRIST PRESS IT ONCE GG. THE SUMMONS GET IN THE WAY WHAT ABOUT LAUNCHING AOES LIKE HEAD SPIN. YOU MADE ME SO ANGRY YOU TRIGGERED MY MENSTRUAL CYCLE, NOW MY FLOOR'S COVERED IN PIECES OF MY UTERUS. ARE YOU HAPPY? HAPPY NOW STORM? WOULD YOU LIKE A PIECE OF MY TORN PLACENTA?


you get angry easy. I already pointed out Overlords and HQs aren't counters to it aka things you don't use against summoners. All I'm reading from you at this point is "QQ my class can't beat summoners easy anymore, but other classes still can! unfair!"
  • 0

#38 GrapefruitGod

GrapefruitGod

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Members
  • 1334 posts
  • LocationSurrounded by kneesocks
  • Playing:Dragon Saga
  • Server:decard

Posted 25 March 2012 - 05:40 PM

He's not angry because of that. He's angry that you missed the point we've all been saying for the last page. I even went out of my way to italicize it for you.

Edited by GrapefruitGod, 25 March 2012 - 05:41 PM.

  • 2

#39 kenken12

kenken12

    I made it Off Topic

  • Members
  • 83 posts

Posted 25 March 2012 - 05:43 PM

Storm, it doesnt matter when you attack,... when summons die, the skill Cooldown is also done, so they can re-summon them again.. the mob that gives the revenge buff is Doomnamik, which is at lvl3, the skill Cooldown is 120s, and the duration of the mob is 8min..... tell me..,, if u fight him 1on1,... and with a time limit, and he barely moved,.. when will your opening attack be?

i cant believe you guys cant see an imbalance issue when u see one.....
  • 0

#40 GrapefruitGod

GrapefruitGod

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Members
  • 1334 posts
  • LocationSurrounded by kneesocks
  • Playing:Dragon Saga
  • Server:decard

Posted 25 March 2012 - 05:45 PM

Storm, it doesnt matter when you attack,... when summons die, the skill Cooldown is also done, so they can re-summon them again.. the mob that gives the revenge buff is Doomnamik, which is at lvl3, the skill Cooldown is 120s, and the duration of the mob is 8min..... tell me..,, if u fight him 1on1,... and with a time limit, and he barely moved,.. when will your opening attack be?

i cant believe you guys cant see an imbalance issue when u see one.....

I think Storm's the only one who can't see it.
  • 6

#41 Jumpluffspore

Jumpluffspore

    Awarded #1 Troll

  • Members
  • 823 posts
  • Playing:Dragon Saga

Posted 25 March 2012 - 05:46 PM

you get angry easy. I already pointed out Overlords and HQs aren't counters to it aka things you don't use against summoners. All I'm reading from you at this point is "QQ my class can't beat summoners easy anymore, but other classes still can! unfair!"

I'm upset because you're applying garbage strategies that you haven't tried yourself. Why give an outlet to something like idk: oh you can beat them if you dodge all the summons which dog them anyways and oh have I mentioned, can be CALLED DIRECTLY TO THE SUMMONER.
You can't just tote those solutions and pretend it isn't a problem. I'm upset because you seem to just completely glaze over this like it's okay and it's about to get very very personal if you don't see the point soon.
I'm just angry because my class can't beat it? Er, no it was an example. If someone can beat someone by sitting down after applying one skill, there is a problem. hopefully you don't miss this

Edited by Jumpluffspore, 25 March 2012 - 05:48 PM.

  • 4

#42 StormHaven

StormHaven

    Ro2 Volunteer Class Rep

  • WarpPortal VM
  • 4695 posts
  • Playing:Dragon Saga
  • Server:Dekard

Posted 25 March 2012 - 05:57 PM

1. I've never said it was balanced.
2. You're assuming I haven't tried out what I've said.
3. You only think in the box and not out of it.
4. If they summoner is gonna sit there surrounded by his minions, you always have the option of dash jumping around till he said to dash jump which leaves his open.
5. New skill comes out-> 2 classes have a hard to figuring out a way to beat it, " I refuse to think of unconventional methods to deal with it therefore it's OP"
  • 0

#43 xBayoo

xBayoo

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Members
  • 1411 posts
  • Playing:Nothing

Posted 25 March 2012 - 05:59 PM

Brain tumors -_-
  • 0

#44 GrapefruitGod

GrapefruitGod

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Members
  • 1334 posts
  • LocationSurrounded by kneesocks
  • Playing:Dragon Saga
  • Server:decard

Posted 25 March 2012 - 06:01 PM

If I facepalmed as hard as I wanted to I'd have a handful of occipital lobe. We've stressed out the point enough, in huge letters like in children's books too. I know a waste of time when I see one.
  • 1

#45 Jumpluffspore

Jumpluffspore

    Awarded #1 Troll

  • Members
  • 823 posts
  • Playing:Dragon Saga

Posted 25 March 2012 - 06:05 PM

1. I've never said it was balanced.
2. You're assuming I haven't tried out what I've said.
3. You only think in the box and not out of it.
4. If they summoner is gonna sit there surrounded by his minions, you always have the option of dash jumping around till he said to dash jump which leaves his open.
5. New skill comes out-> 2 classes have a hard to figuring out a way to beat it, " I refuse to think of unconventional methods to deal with it therefore it's OP"

#1, defending it like you think it is aren't you. #2 Proof as in pics/vids or bye #3 LORD JESUS DAS SUM LOL. DAS SUM LOL RIGHT DERE DAT IS SUM LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL THANK YOU FOR THE BEST LAUGH OF MY LIFE. 4. (this makes no sense)
5. Unconventional methods are kinda ruined by the fact that he has to push a button, get summon near, damage reflection
going to do this again.ENDBRINGER SAT AND A CERTAIN OVERLORD WITH GOOD QUALITY GEAR LOST. ENDBRINGER /SAT/ WHAT UNCONVENTIONAL METHODS DO YOU HAVE?
  • 0

#46 kenken12

kenken12

    I made it Off Topic

  • Members
  • 83 posts

Posted 25 March 2012 - 06:05 PM

hahaha,. agreed nilla,
  • 0

#47 StormHaven

StormHaven

    Ro2 Volunteer Class Rep

  • WarpPortal VM
  • 4695 posts
  • Playing:Dragon Saga
  • Server:Dekard

Posted 25 March 2012 - 06:06 PM

And i know people who give up to easy when i see it. I don't see any major QQs around mana burn anymore and it's still a 1 button win for summoners.
  • 0

#48 Jumpluffspore

Jumpluffspore

    Awarded #1 Troll

  • Members
  • 823 posts
  • Playing:Dragon Saga

Posted 25 March 2012 - 06:09 PM

And i know people who give up to easy when i see it. I don't see any major QQs around mana burn anymore and it's still a 1 button win for summoners.

I ENJOY THE TASTE OF LIMA BEANS HOW ABOUT YOU

Edited by Jumpluffspore, 25 March 2012 - 06:10 PM.

  • 0

#49 GrapefruitGod

GrapefruitGod

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Members
  • 1334 posts
  • LocationSurrounded by kneesocks
  • Playing:Dragon Saga
  • Server:decard

Posted 25 March 2012 - 06:10 PM

Quin, he wasnt even using the revenge skill when that happened. So imagine if he was lol.
  • 0

#50 Jumpluffspore

Jumpluffspore

    Awarded #1 Troll

  • Members
  • 823 posts
  • Playing:Dragon Saga

Posted 25 March 2012 - 06:11 PM

Quin, he wasnt even using the revenge skill when that happened. So imagine if he was lol.

... you've got to be freaking kidding me. this kind of renders the entire revenge skill moot then. It's unnecessary.
  • 0




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users