18 replies to this topic

[gangga]

These are stats which i'm going for,
since balance stats is needed for woe with decent gears.

str 92
agi 81
vit 95
int 93
dex 72
luk 31

With Dragon breath as main skill
I'll ditch HS since i'm planning on using IB+SB for woe.
Or should i stick to HS with this stats?*^{assuming that i only use glorious spear since no vellum spear on holds}

is it good??

Edited by gangga, 03 February 2013 - 07:35 PM.

[Peerless]

Well,inb4 people start telling you to go full Dragon Breath's Build with no str. or agi.,which most will tell you anyway...


Thing is,this is what exactly will happen if you ask a lot of RKs ingame,with a few good ones telling you to have alot of agi anyway(Masq Resistance mainly),but no str. and the reason for that is,most people think the only thing that hurts from a rk in war anyway,is DB.They would tell you to forego HS and go with your former route or to not get any str. at all.For that,I say to each his own.DB could do more or less damage then HS depending on the other person's gear,especially if you count fire armor(their gear) or Urs Set(your gear).


You have pretty good strength for the rune skill,Crushing Strike and for spamming Storm Blast.HS is good with both of those weapons mentioned above,depending on refine level.Most people will argue that HS sucks in war,especially without a +12 fully enchanted Urs Set.I consider HS like any other skill actually.It isn't meant to oneshot,but to deal damage.With Woe Sets,its damage is a little neglegible,depending on what class/gear your opponent has.From my experience though,I have oneshotted alot of baddies in war though with that skill and have also dealed decent damage to people who aren't bad,some pre-merge,some after.Your choice in the end if you wanna choose that skill though..


The rest of your stats though look pretty well,considering your choosing the versatile route over DB monkey.You have enough agi to hit 190+ aspd in war,depending on buffs and a good loss in animation delay for DB.Your vit is at the perfect point for a balance build.Int is looking smexy for more DB damage. Dex is good.Luck is good as well.

Edited by Peerless, 03 February 2013 - 02:25 PM.

[KamiKali]

^ Disagreed.
HS wont' do , unless your only targets in woe are baddies as what ^ said, something I wouldn't be proud of killing. You shouldn't be 1v1ing on an RK. SB only if you're demounted or CC'd.

STR is great for a DB RK, AGI is great as well. but 92 Str is too much, and you need to aim for 180+aspd, not gonna specify the exact amount. You should get at least 110 vit for your dragon breath to start tickling. Don't need much dex if you're going to use RWC pendants. No need for luck at all. It's a completely useless stat.
I'm not going to give you a specific build, but the two main things to consider is DPS with Dragon Breath and Masq Resistance.

Edited by KamiKali, 03 February 2013 - 02:34 PM.

[Peerless]

^ Disagreed.
HS wont' do , unless your only targets in woe are baddies as what ^ said, something I wouldn't be proud of killing. You shouldn't be 1v1ing on an RK. SB only if you're demounted or CC'd.

STR is great for a DB RK, AGI is great as well. but 92 Str is too much, and you need to aim for 180+aspd, not gonna specify the exact amount. You should get at least 110 vit for your dragon breath to start tickling. Don't need much dex if you're going to use RWC pendants. No need for luck at all. It's a completely useless stat.
I'm not going to give you a specific build, but the two main things to consider is DPS with Dragon Breath and Masq Resistance.

As you know Kali,there were alot of baddies back on ygg and there are still alot of baddies even on chaos server,after merge.HS isn't a skill I use in war anymore because I rarely find myself using that skill now,especially after merge.I'm usually in precast or running through a castle with strings,whenever I woed,spamming DB.When I did use HS,it was when I didn't have strings around,when I was alone due to some of my party being wiped(also no strings),or when I knew I would have a better chance of killing an enemy with Hundred Spears(in correlation with my guildie's attacks),when faced with one tanky class like a SC or something.I also knew that without strings,my DB could be outpotted,especially if the opponent was wearing a fire armor,but with HS and DB,I could at least string both attacks,one after the other,adding more damage.About his strength,hes got a little more than what I would have gotten,but depending on his gears,92 strength is good enough.If he had +12 Glorious/Vellum Spear or higher,I could see him lowering his strength just a little to say 85~90 or even lower.I would want to have enough strength where I would be able to oneshot most classes with CS,having the appropiate gears.Contrary to popular belief,DB isn't almighty.There are alot of ways to counter it,just like other skills.But you'd want to have CS for a tanky SC/RG or something,thats not being affected by anything else,including DB.

With 81 agi,180+ aspd will be gotten pretty easily depending on buffs and other skills like 2H quicken.You also don't need 110 vit for your DB to start "tickling".Also,all of the opponent's damage he's taking won't all be coming from you.It will be coming from your guildies as well.With good strings and gear/buffs,you won't have to invest so much stat points into vit,especially since your going balance build.No,its not bad to get 110 vit,but you don't have to get it.And yeah,you don't need much dex as well.Also,Luk is not a completely useless skill.You can have some of that for a little howl resistance and it also adds to other stats.Once again,since you will be going for a balance build OP,a little luck is always good to have.

Honestly,I would be telling you to focus on DBing as your main form of attack in war,to be most helpful to your guild,but since you want a certain build to focus on,I'm giving you advice for that instead.Also,its not bad to have a versatile build at all,especially considering DB can be countered,in a lot of ways.

Edited by Peerless, 03 February 2013 - 03:05 PM.

[Baturiano]

HS is a sell skill, because when you DB your opponent will switch to fire armor, if you feel like DB isnt denting him equip your spear and convert it with water (CS/HS) would work whichever you choose.

[KamiKali]

As an RK using runes, you shouldn't be worried about howl at all. CS damage is more dependent on weapon upgrade and your current buffs. Not too much on str plus you have runes for str/atk buffs anyway. Sacrificing vit for str is . . . If you read the OP, se is saying he wants to focus on DB. So I don't know why you're mentioning anything about Ur's set and HS, unless you read his post wrong.

An RK with 110 Vit is very versatile and a lot more useful than a 95 Vit one. As for aspd 2H quicken only works if you're using a 2-handed weapon. We're talking about WoE here.
DBing with 50-60k Hp with your 95 vit will produce at max 10k~13k damage. Good luck killing anyone with that esp if they equip fire armor. You're not running around alone with a single stringer or anything like that. You should be as a group with your team and doing y'know team stuff. Other people can and should be water or w/e endowing.

RK's role is to act as a crowd control.

Edited by KamiKali, 03 February 2013 - 03:27 PM.

[Peerless]

As an RK using runes, you shouldn't be worried about howl at all. CS damage is more dependent on weapon upgrade and your current buffs. Not too much on str plus you have runes for str/atk buffs anyway. Sacrificing vit for str is . . . If you read the OP, se is saying he wants to focus on DB. So I don't know why you're mentioning anything about Ur's set and HS, unless you read his post wrong.

An RK with 110 Vit is very versatile and a lot more useful than a 95 Vit one. As for aspd 2H quicken only works if you're using a 2-handed weapon. We're talking about WoE here.
DBing with 50-60k Hp with your 95 vit will produce at max 10k~13k damage. Good luck killing anyone with that esp if they equip fire armor. You're not running around alone with a single stringer or anything like that. You should be as a group with your team and doing y'know team stuff. Other people can and should be water or w/e endowing.

RK's role is to act as a crowd control.

RKs using runes.....Nosiege Rune,which cancels Howling status has a 2 min Cooldown and can only be casted once for said effect before the CD.Not everyone will have an AB around them the exact moment that get howled spammed by multiple of even one gen.You should actually be worried about howl alot,unless you have a tanky AB(not dying) in your party who knows what they are doing or even on screen with you when you get howled.I find that common alot in most of the smaller guilds after merge,with barely any ABs around to spam lauda when you get howled,but I'm quite sure you rarely have that problem in your guild.Yeah,CS is more dependent on weapon upgrade,but having strength adds more damage to CS,by alot.Runes only stack with that attack.

In his OP,he is also asking about his stats for a balance build first,before asking about DB.Also,it seems you are reading his post wrong lol."Or should i stick to HS with this stats?"He's asking about HS.

Hmm 95 or 110 vit.I personally have 100 vit.The damage is almost negligible,especially since DB damage depends on current hp/max hp.SP counts for more if anything,when dealing with DB,unless you have a tao gunka,which completely overshadows that.Wasting too many stat points on one stat,unless build specified.....2H Quicken-He said he wants a balance build,which can require wielding a vellum katz at some point,hence the agi and aspd mentioning.We're talking about woe here,but RKs are still hella tanky even with 2H swords.And don't tell me your team has never been wiped/been wiped and both guilds had few people left standing and your rks had no strings and by then everyone left standing from opposing guild should have already swapped to fire armor,blah,blah,blah...

Edited by Peerless, 03 February 2013 - 04:01 PM.

[KamiKali]

Vit difference damage is not negligible. I can build an RK with 180k+ HP with 120 vit while a 95 vit RK won't hit nearly half that much, do you know how much HP 120 vit vs 95 vit will add with full gears? SP is nice and allows constant damage, but HP allows you to tank a -_-load more. I'm talking about Agi/aspd for dragon breath, not for vellum katz. Please don't deterring from the original context.

He never said balanced build in terms of skill usage. He mentioned stats - which he's thinking of switching to SB + IB as a backup skill after DB as opposed to HS, a single target and having to chase after the opponent. HS also has a horrendous cool down. As I mentioned before, a WoE RK is about DPS and Masq resistance, focusing on those would give you a balanced stat build. If you want to be any good at RK that's what you'd concentrate on. Not put stats here and there which are complete negligible in the long run, in WoE, WoEing as a team.

[CeruleanGamer]

If you're an RK and you're using other skills other than runes, IB, or Dragon Breath, you need to uninstall the game for being bad.

Edited by CeruleanGamer, 03 February 2013 - 04:56 PM.

[gangga]

I don't think IB + SB will be superior in terms of crowd control,
But at least you can deal AoE if you're masqed,
Even if you're moving on a large group,
RKs are SCs first target to dismount,

Edited by gangga, 03 February 2013 - 06:29 PM.

[Kydon]

IB + SB wont do any decent of dmg to well geared ppl unless u got full gods a really good kvm and full buffs. HS is "OK" in terms of dmg with ur's set + vellum and many many other buffs but there are some things to consider about it 1) its single target 2) u do 1 every 3sec 3) requires ur's set.

Also if u are masqed your dmg will be even less cause spears do 75% to med without your dragon. In the situation u described HS vs IB doesnt matter cause u are pretty much up anyway and your best option is to bwing and go get your dragon back but there are moments that u have to keep fighting to the end, like on top of the emp. in that case IB+SB is probably better using kvm or even a status mailbreaker.

In any other case DB on magic strings > HS, IB, SB

... now about that conversation above about vit. yes having more vit gives more dmg but not enough make to make DB "not tickling? lol". i would like Kali to tell us a number of the HP someone would gain on RK if he had 120vit instead of 95vit (without a tao, just good HP/SP gear)

Edited by Kydon, 03 February 2013 - 08:57 PM.

[Peerless]

Vit difference damage is not negligible. I can build an RK with 180k+ HP with 120 vit while a 95 vit RK won't hit nearly half that much, do you know how much HP 120 vit vs 95 vit will add with full gears? SP is nice and allows constant damage, but HP allows you to tank a -_-load more. I'm talking about Agi/aspd for dragon breath, not for vellum katz. Please don't deterring from the original context.

He never said balanced build in terms of skill usage. He mentioned stats - which he's thinking of switching to SB + IB as a backup skill after DB as opposed to HS, a single target and having to chase after the opponent. HS also has a horrendous cool down. As I mentioned before, a WoE RK is about DPS and Masq resistance, focusing on those would give you a balanced stat build. If you want to be any good at RK that's what you'd concentrate on. Not put stats here and there which are complete negligible in the long run, in WoE, WoEing as a team.

Hmm ok,where should I start...

Vit difference is negligible if the RK has like 100 vit as opposed to 120 vit.Those 20 extra points won't give your DB damage a significant increase.The points are better off going into int or agi for masq resistance,instead of having them being wasted on vit.Like I said though,its up to the rk's preference.I'd rather not put 120 vit for any stat on a rk,when I know i can deal awesome damage with only 100 vit,good int,and strings,AB buffs,foods,etc.Also btw,when I had 95 vit,sitting in precast,with BC,Song of Lutie,and my own personal buffs,I had well over 180k HP.At one point,I was telling my guildies to view my HP in party list,because it was so fricking awesome.That was my old build though and with my current one,I have even more hp/sp.A RK with 75k hp and only like 2k sp would be doing crappy damage compared to a rk with 65k hp and 5k sp.Also,what allows you to tank more,if anything,are your current gears and whether you can pop pots/ygg seeds fast enough,as opposed to having alot of HP.HP just adds to it.

The guy said he those are the stats he was going for since he wanted a decent balance build for woe with good gear.Agi helps with alot of things including 190+ aspd for vellum katz when your up against a tanky RG or something.You aren't gonna kill any good RG with DB,especially if hes tanking half of your guild.There are only two good options for you,unless you move like A2S raiding castles, and that is to Crush Strike the RG or Vellum Katz him.Its good to be able to switch to different weaps and skills to deal sufficient amount of damage against an opponent.

Also,I'm not telling him to go HS/DB build in war.I'm just saying its good to weigh options.IB sucks in war first of all.Just gonna get that out there.HS would actually do more damage,but you would have to swap to Urs Set and whatnot to increase its damage.No,I'm not recommending for him to get HS,since its up to him,but I am saying it would possibly be a better option than IB.Personally,I don't use HS in war anymore or IB for that matter.The only thing IB has on HS is the aoe factor.The guy wants a balanced build though,so that he can perform versatile acts.Sure you can recommend for him to just get DB and have stats specified just for that,but I'm just giving him info on what he asked for.

Edited by Peerless, 03 February 2013 - 11:05 PM.

[gangga]

but there are moments that u have to keep fighting to the end, like on top of the emp.

This~!
This is why i want to switch to IB + SB,
But still i'm doubting on getting IB,
with woe reduction IB will hit for like 9k-ish.

[Kydon]

HS or IB... the never ending question to all RKs. The answer to it is "It doesnt matter" just get the skill u like more.

[Peerless]

HS or IB... the never ending question to all RKs. The answer to it is "It doesnt matter" just get the skill u like more.

^This

[HayrohsLegacy]

Almost got the same balance stat build for RK, main skills IB/SB/DB and I dont have HS ever since the dmg is bad vs WOE set users and you are not having good redux on the armor set.

IB/SB mode:


DB gears mode (can reach 4k+ SP):
+12 Carat Maestro Turkey Hat
+9 Ares WOE Plate/Brynhild
Variants
2x 250 SP Ur's Seals
MailBreaker 200 SP
Fatasm BFG
Umbala Spirit
Strange Nyd Garb
Incubus Pet > but well, its hard to keep one always alive.
^ gets hardcore DB DPS dmg with a good Strings+Lutie Maestro and Battle Chant RG.

ASPD mode (190~193 is possible with Runes/ASPD item/other class buffs/gears):
+9 Immune HBP
Vellum Katzbalger
2x Gloriuous Rings or 2x Bakonawa Tattoos
Pegasus Wings

Edit: I stopped playing my 150/50 RK coz I'm lazy farming rune stuffs unless somebody donates.

Edited by HayrohsLegacy, 05 February 2013 - 12:31 PM.

[Peerless]

Almost got the same balance stat build for RK, main skills IB/SB/DB and I dont have HS ever since the dmg is bad vs WOE set users and you are not having good redux on the armor set.

IB/SB mode:


DB gears mode (can reach 4k+ SP):
+12 Carat Maestro Turkey Hat
+9 Ares WOE Plate/Brynhild
Variants
2x 250 SP Ur's Seals
MailBreaker 200 SP
Fatasm BFG
Umbala Spirit
Strange Nyd Garb
Incubus Pet > but well, its hard to keep one always alive.
^ gets hardcore DB DPS dmg with a good Strings+Lutie Maestro and Battle Chant RG.

ASPD mode (190~193 is possible with Runes/ASPD item/other class buffs/gears):
+9 Immune HBP
Vellum Katzbalger
2x Gloriuous Rings or 2x Bakonawa Tattoos
Pegasus Wings

Edit: I stopped playing my 150/50 RK coz I'm lazy farming rune stuffs unless somebody donates.

Yess,was looking for something like this for a pretty good example of what balance is like.

And yeah,those rune mats...

[gangga]

Thank you for the SS Hayroh,
Yeah farming the rune items is a pain in the ass

[Baturiano]

Rune items? The TI's are a good source of them.

I like to have my backups because quite frankly, if you're an RK you are the main targets of chasers, when you get dismounted and you have no str you are worthless unless you have a backup of HS/IB/CS with str stats. Sure it wouldnt do much damage as DB but you have to try, I know some RK's who go full DB when they enter the castle they get dismounted -> Bwing rinse and repeat.