39 replies to this topic

[Trickster]

I started playing Dragonica a month or two before the transfer and I was playing a lvl 39 trickster. I decided to switch over to the warrior class for phase 1 beta and I got to lvl 21 and chose the knight class. Now im unsure of whether to choose knight or gladiator when phase 2 comes around. I want big damage and strong PvE. PvP doesnt bother me so much but ide like it to be an option at the least.

~ Should I choose Gladiator or Knight when the game reopens? Gimme some reasons why.

~ Solved http://image-storage...115005515005000
or http://image-storage...115005114115000 <<< (add 1 more to stinger)

Edited by Trickster, 23 October 2010 - 01:23 PM.

[ApeKing]

I started playing Dragonica a month or two before the transfer and I was playing a lvl 39 trickster. I decided to switch over to the warrior class for phase 1 beta and I got to lvl 21 and chose the knight class. Now im unsure of whether to choose knight or gladiator when phase 2 comes around. I want big damage and strong PvE. PvP doesnt bother me so much but ide like it to be an option at the least.

~Should I choose Gladiator or Knight when the game reopens? Gimme some reasons why.

~If you think a completely different class is a better option then please direct me towards that suggested class.

Myrm wont be good PvE wise till 50+ (51 actuality) and even then its a stretch (yeah I know they have absurd attack, but they have awful CD). Paladins were given and enormous boost, and are more than competent in PvE now (maybe even better)

[Trickster]

Myrm wont be good PvE wise till 50+ (51 actuality) and even then its a stretch (yeah I know they have absurd attack, but they have awful CD). Paladins were given and enormous boost, and are more than competent in PvE now (maybe even better)

i think what made me question knights in the first place was the uselessness of the defense buffs. On top of that, pallys have like 3 useful attacks and it was hard finding a shield during beta for some reason. There was a video of some myrmidon and pally fighting and it took like 5 seconds for the myrmidon to win in pvp when he got the grab on the pally but the pally locked onto the myrm and was bashing away for like 5 minutes (roughly the same level i believe). im just concerned with how much of a beating I can take and how quickly i can kill mobs.

[EmoCutt]

Lol just make both

[ApeKing]

i think what made me question knights in the first place was the uselessness of the defense buffs. On top of that, pallys have like 3 useful attacks and it was hard finding a shield during beta for some reason. There was a video of some myrmidon and pally fighting and it took like 5 seconds for the myrmidon to win in pvp when he got the grab on the pally but the pally locked onto the myrm and was bashing away for like 5 minutes (roughly the same level i believe). im just concerned with how much of a beating I can take and how quickly i can kill mobs.

Paladins dont actually need those buffs as they have absurd HP and defense already. You will survive much longer as a paladin. When did you play one btw? Pre Paris patch? Because they were given a HUGE attack and and multiple skill buffs. I'd say they have nearly as much attack now, as Myrms did before the patch.

[iKnowMyABCs]

Is OP mocking the God (paladins)?

[Djbio]

I prefer paladin as the defense is pretty much good and if you're funded u can craft your weapon for decent damage... I had a lvl 50 pala in SEA... And yeah it's true they truly suck in PvE after lvl 40, they r horribly outclassed by every1 in PvE, You'll find yourself being the bait not the disher ... For well in PvP, You're fairly good against every class except mages or xtremely funded ninjas... (unless you r a super pro) I don't know bout after lvl 60.

[iKnowMyABCs]

I prefer paladin as the defense is pretty much good and if you're funded u can craft your weapon for decent damage... I had a lvl 50 pala in SEA... And yeah it's true they truly suck in PvE after lvl 40, they r horribly outclassed by every1 in PvE, You'll find yourself being the bait not the disher ... For well in PvP, You're fairly good against every class except mages or xtremely funded ninjas... (unless you r a super pro) I don't know bout after lvl 60.

??

[ApeKing]

I prefer paladin as the defense is pretty much good and if you're funded u can craft your weapon for decent damage... I had a lvl 50 pala in SEA... And yeah it's true they truly suck in PvE after lvl 40, they r horribly outclassed by every1 in PvE, You'll find yourself being the bait not the disher ... For well in PvP, You're fairly good against every class except mages or xtremely funded ninjas... (unless you r a super pro) I don't know bout after lvl 60.

When was the last time you played? Because they are High Tier PvE now.

[Trickster]

ive never actually gotten to a 3rd job in any class. dead close in trickster before the transfer though. I was set on pally but the big fking sword was so intimidating. I think ill stick with pally then, but for sure theyre a better choice?? if u could, post a build for me. I have a general idea of what i need, but just so i dont put too many points in hammers or something.

[iKnowMyABCs]

ive never actually gotten to a 3rd job in any class. dead close in trickster before the transfer though. I was set on pally but the big fking sword was so intimidating. I think ill stick with pally then, but for sure theyre a better choice?? if u could, post a build for me. I have a general idea of what i need, but just so i dont put too many points in hammers or something.

http://forums.warppo...din-compendium/

[Djbio]

When was the last time you played? Because they are High Tier PvE now.

2 months ago before I had to quit... They changed? o.o

[Trickster]

http://forums.warpportal.com/index.php?/topic/6233-guteks-paladin-compendium/

thats the guide i was following(roughly) in phase 1 lol. k thanks for the post dude!

[ApeKing]

ive never actually gotten to a 3rd job in any class. dead close in trickster before the transfer though. I was set on pally but the big fking sword was so intimidating. I think ill stick with pally then, but for sure theyre a better choice?? if u could, post a build for me. I have a general idea of what i need, but just so i dont put too many points in hammers or something.

http://image-storage.co.uk/nicco/dsim/?0_75_0_11500111001351555000000111125150001500515510000

This will get you through PvE no problem.

[Trickster]

http://image-storage.co.uk/nicco/dsim/?0_75_0_11500111001351555000000111125150001500515510000

This will get you through PvE no problem.

ty! appreciate it.

[DirtyClaw]

I want big damage and strong PvE. PvP doesnt bother me so much but ide like it to be an option at the least.

That describes a Myrmidon. They're completely viable in PvE pre 51 postpatch.

Paladins aren't high tier in PvE, just mid tier. Dragoons however, are high tier. Myrmidons/Destroyers(Overlords) still beat them though.

[ApeKing]

That describes a Myrmidon. They're completely viable in PvE pre 51 postpatch.

Paladins aren't high tier in PvE, just mid tier. Dragoons however, are high tier. Myrmidons/Destroyers(Overlords) still beat them though.

I was referring to endgame. And if they beat them it is just barely. Yes they do have significantly higher attack, but they also have longer CD. A Dragoon spamming Spear Jab> Cross Cut > Rolling Ground > Spin it Bear! will have a constant stream of high damage, where as a Overlord will have to wait for that Ten second CD on Gust and Wyvern Blade.

When it comes ot RAW POWER, yes a Overlord wins. But when it comes to DPS, Dragoons are now the masters.

[DirtyClaw]

You were using the 3rd job names, so... assumed it wasn't 4th job.

Sure, if you're just attacking an infinite HP monster with low def then the Dragoon might win. If it had high def, the Overlord will win. However, PvE isn't dps, it's more burst damage. Even in Hero mode Van Cliff with the ~140 monsters, you still have short breaks between each group of mob. Overlords can just wrestler and move on to the next group => wyvern and stormblade if needed => gust slash then bro or deathbound and stormblade => deathstinger, or wyvern and combo again since your CD would most likely be over by now. The monsters there also have rather high defense too.


I've already compared endgame; +8 Superior Lightning Oak on both Dragoon and Destroyer(Overlord). I(Destroyer) definitely cleared mobs in PvE faster.

IF you want to compare at Arkah F6, the Myrm/Destroyer clears faster too, with 1 wyvern killing the whole spawn. Same with wrestler, or deathbound => stormblade. Also broom jab has pitiful width, so all you can really rely on for messy mobs is crosscut => bear => stormblade.

Edited by DirtyClaw, 19 October 2010 - 10:06 PM.

[Kimimaro]

You were using the 3rd job names, so... assumed it wasn't 4th job.

Sure, if you're just attacking an infinite HP monster with low def then the Dragoon might win. If it had high def, the Overlord will win. However, PvE isn't dps, it's more burst damage. Even in Hero mode Van Cliff with the ~140 monsters, you still have short breaks between each group of mob. Overlords can just wrestler and move on to the next group => wyvern and stormblade if needed => gust slash then bro or deathbound and stormblade => deathstinger, or wyvern and combo again since your CD would most likely be over by now. The monsters there also have rather high defense too.


I've already compared endgame; +8 Superior Lightning Oak on both Dragoon and Destroyer(Overlord). I(Destroyer) definitely cleared mobs in PvE faster.

IF you want to compare at Arkah F6, the Myrm/Destroyer clears faster too, with 1 wyvern killing the whole spawn. Same with wrestler, or deathbound => stormblade. Also broom jab has pitiful width, so all you can really rely on for messy mobs is crosscut => bear => stormblade.

I have to agree with dirty.

Usually you don't just sit there and wait for the cool down and it's not like Wyvern and SB are the only skills Myrmidons/Overlords have.

[ApeKing]

WALL OF BORING TECHNICAL CRAP INCOMING




All skills listed are maximum possible damage (excluding level 10 skills). This means the damage you see is the total damage if all hits connect (to the bet of my Knowledge)

FOR REFERENCE


Dragoon

Spear Jab
450% + 1300 5sCD (3 sCD with Time Reverse)

Spin it Bear!
650% 5sCD (3sCD with Time Reverse)

Cross Cut
1020% + 1600 (3sCD with Time Reverse)

Rolling Ground
1755% 6sCD (4sCD with Time Reverse)

Acending Dragon
1700% 15sCD (12sCD with Time Reverse)

Dragon Dive
2240% 15sCD (12sCD with Time Reverse)



THE FOLLOWING ARE COMPARISONS BETWEEN OVERLORD AND DRAGOON SKILLS


Wyvern
650% + 5500 10sCD
Possible Dragoon Skills
Spear Jab x2: 800% + 2600
Spin it bear! x2: 1300%
Cross Cut x2: 2040% + 3200
Rolling Ground x2: 3510 (ALMOST. It comes to two 12 seconds)

IF TIME REVRSE IS USED
Rolling Ground x2: 3510
Any 3 Cobinations of teh examples given under Wvyern Blade (except Rolling Ground). You do that math on that one. But it ends up being a whole damn LOT.

Gust Slash
780% + 1860 10sCD
See Wyvern

Raising Storm
2800% + 7200 30sCD (it hits 8 times Max I think and good luck gettign that many hits on a moving target)
Yipe. Add an extra attack to any of the above combos.
Acending Dragon x2: 3400%
Dragon Dive x2: 4480%
If Time Reverse is on you have time ot add any of the main 4 skills (inlcluding Rolling Ground)

Death Stinger
240% 15sCD (I dont know how many times Death Stinger hits)
3 of Any of the Main attacks. 4 if Time reverse is Active.

Incoming Bear!
150% + 400 4sCD
Meh too low to bother with

Im Gone Bear!
640% + 664 5sCD
Same.



Now, some of this is obviously situational. An Overlord is not gonna derp around while he waits for his CD if he doesn't have to (unless he is forced too, which sometimes happens). But OVERALL a Dragoon has much higher damage potential. An Overlord may win (if barely) in a dungeon, but when it comes to bosses, the Dragoon wins by sheer quantity in her attacks. Yes Overlords have higher potential raw attack than Dragoons (or anyone else for that matter). But its not THAT much higher. I have seen Dragoons with higher attack than Overlords on IAH. And even ones who didn't could very well out-damage any of them. When you have skill that does FIVE TIMES as much damage in the CD it takes form the other classes best skill...?

I hope someone reads this I spent a lot of time on it (too much to prove a point but ask anyone who knows me, when I know I am right about something I am determined)

[Trickster]

ya sorry if the title and names were confusing. but people are more likely to take paladin and myrmidon seriously as opposed to dragoon and overlord or knight and gladiator. ude get a bunch of lvl 5s telling u which is better when they clearly dont know. both 4th jobs are great obviously, im just concerned with getting to 40 this time around and having made the right decision to make it to 60.

[Yurai]

WALL OF BORING TECHNICAL CRAP INCOMING




All skills listed are maximum possible damage (excluding level 10 skills). This means the damage you see is the total damage if all hits connect (to the bet of my Knowledge)

FOR REFERENCE


Dragoon

Spear Jab
450% + 1300 5sCD (3 sCD with Time Reverse)

Spin it Bear!
650% 5sCD (3sCD with Time Reverse)

Cross Cut
1020% + 1600 (3sCD with Time Reverse)

Rolling Ground
1755% 6sCD (4sCD with Time Reverse)

Acending Dragon
1700% 15sCD (12sCD with Time Reverse)

Dragon Dive
2240% 15sCD (12sCD with Time Reverse)



THE FOLLOWING ARE COMPARISONS BETWEEN OVERLORD AND DRAGOON SKILLS


Wyvern
650% + 5500 10sCD
Possible Dragoon Skills
Spear Jab x2: 800% + 2600
Spin it bear! x2: 1300%
Cross Cut x2: 2040% + 3200
Rolling Ground x2: 3510 (ALMOST. It comes to two 12 seconds)

IF TIME REVRSE IS USED
Rolling Ground x2: 3510
Any 3 Cobinations of teh examples given under Wvyern Blade (except Rolling Ground). You do that math on that one. But it ends up being a whole damn LOT.

Gust Slash
780% + 1860 10sCD
See Wyvern

Raising Storm
2800% + 7200 30sCD (it hits 8 times Max I think and good luck gettign that many hits on a moving target)
Yipe. Add an extra attack to any of the above combos.
Acending Dragon x2: 3400%
Dragon Dive x2: 4480%
If Time Reverse is on you have time ot add any of the main 4 skills (inlcluding Rolling Ground)

Death Stinger
240% 15sCD (I dont know how many times Death Stinger hits)
3 of Any of the Main attacks. 4 if Time reverse is Active.

Incoming Bear!
150% + 400 4sCD
Meh too low to bother with

Im Gone Bear!
640% + 664 5sCD
Same.



Now, some of this is obviously situational. An Overlord is not gonna derp around while he waits for his CD if he doesn't have to (unless he is forced too, which sometimes happens). But OVERALL a Dragoon has much higher damage potential. An Overlord may win (if barely) in a dungeon, but when it comes to bosses, the Dragoon wins by sheer quantity in her attacks. Yes Overlords have higher potential raw attack than Dragoons (or anyone else for that matter). But its not THAT much higher. I have seen Dragoons with higher attack than Overlords on IAH. And even ones who didn't could very well out-damage any of them. When you have skill that does FIVE TIMES as much damage in the CD it takes form the other classes best skill...?

I hope someone reads this I spent a lot of time on it (too much to prove a point but ask anyone who knows me, when I know I am right about something I am determined)

1. Bosses such as Paris, you won't be just sitting in one spot spamming skills unless you want to die. Myrms are much more useful in this aspect as they can deal high amounts of burst damage while her revenge or other attacking skills aren't being used.
2. Against mobs with high defense, the myrm wins by far, due to raw attack power and high +damage on their skills.

Against bosses that are just sitting there waiting for you to attack, the wrestler is more viable in that the boss that is sitting there is usually up against a wall, such as bone dragon, and produces much higher dps than the paladin will be able to output.

End game PvE favors the myrm much more than the paladin. It seems that bosses are starting to become less based on sitting there and spamming, anyway, since they now do high amounts of damage.

[DirtyClaw]

WALL OF BORING TECHNICAL CRAP INCOMING

Now, some of this is obviously situational. An Overlord is not gonna derp around while he waits for his CD if he doesn't have to (unless he is forced too, which sometimes happens). But OVERALL a Dragoon has much higher damage potential. An Overlord may win (if barely) in a dungeon, but when it comes to bosses, the Dragoon wins by sheer quantity in her attacks. Yes Overlords have higher potential raw attack than Dragoons (or anyone else for that matter). But its not THAT much higher. I have seen Dragoons with higher attack than Overlords on IAH. And even ones who didn't could very well out-damage any of them. When you have skill that does FIVE TIMES as much damage in the CD it takes form the other classes best skill...?

I hope someone reads this I spent a lot of time on it (too much to prove a point but ask anyone who knows me, when I know I am right about something I am determined)

Well obviously if we compare the two, we will be comparing with the same type of weapon and refinement. That means, the Dragoon will NOT have a higher attack than Overlords. In your wall of boring technical crap, you did not factor in the difference between the atk stat of the Dragoon and the Overlord. You also did not factor in the fact that many endgame monsters/bosses have high defense, making high attack alot more viable. A good example in THQ was bone dragon. Myrmidons could damage it while having a lower enchant weapon than most other classes. I'd also like to see an endgame boss that lets you sit there and constantly skill it until it dies. The only thing that comes to mind is bone dragon, however you'd need extremely good armor/alot of pots to just stand there and tank every hit to have the maximum DPS.

So uh, you're right in theory, but if you actually apply it to the game... no.

[ApeKing]

And you are kinda forgetting the point that a Dragoon can tank nearly anything since they have the highest defense and HP in the game. SO yeah other than Paris they can kinda just sit there and spam skills. But whatever.

I'll concede for now. I plan on getting my Myrm to and Overlord and making a Dragoon.

[EmoCutt]

I'll concede for now. I plan on getting my Myrm to and Overlord and making a Dragoon.

i too am making an overlord, than trying Dragoon :p