36 replies to this topic

[SuperGlue]

I'm around level 24 right now nearing that time of the game.

I've always wanted to become a Monk. Primarily because they are underused/appreciated-ish (or at least I was getting that vibe) and understand that they are mainly Tanks.

But will I ever get chosen for parties later in the game or will I always be left fighting out spots in favor of cookie cutter classes?

I was thinking something along the lines of str/int/vit - 35/35/rest

Any insight is greatly appreciated!

IGN is Bascojin (yes, that typo was on purpose, I never did like the original spelling)

[Chocs]

Monks are..... one of the best main tanks in Raid.

If tanking is what you're going for, I don't think you'll have a problem--

[Reppu]

Viable tanks? Most definitely.

Viable DPS compared to who? Rogues/Assassins? No group buffs is VERY painful here. No natural agility is as well. Warriors/Knights (Yes, Knights)? No group buffs, and Monks have to toggle off their major survivability power to not lose their Attack.

As well, Monk weapons have lower attack to compensate for their dual-attack granting stats. It... doesn't add up as much as you'd like (Although it's a boon for their Parry!). All in all? Amazing tanks, DPS sort of falls off due to scaling.

Monk DPS probably needs a little tweaking, or perhaps a DPS 3rd.

[rzevidz007]

Monks are actually a little costy to build, main reason is because the source of your attack power came from two stats, which are STR and INT.
Now you'll probably think. Oh, Monks' gear have STR and INT in it! Despite of its weapon low attack power, we can catch up with other class thanks to the stats from Monks' gear! Sadly, no. Even Monks have both STR and INT in their gear, those two stats alone are more or less equal to one stat in other class' gear. (For example, Rogue's armor gives 50 str, Monk's armor gives 25 str and 25 int), which is actually our LOSS here.

Now, how do we actually make up from that loss? Cards. Indeed. A lot of cards gives massive amount of STR, INT and possibly AGI, but like I said before, those cards are FRIGGIN expensive. With that said, building a DPS Monk is indeed costy.

Edited by rzevidz007, 12 May 2013 - 07:20 AM.

[NiaAdha]

Monks are actually a little costy to build, main reason is because the source of your attack power came from two stats, which are STR and INT.
Now you'll probably think. Oh, Monks' gear have STR and INT in it! Despite of its weapon low attack power, we can catch up with other class thanks to the stats from Monks' gear! Sadly, no. Even Monks have both STR and INT in their gear, those two stats alone are more or less equal to one stat in other class' gear. (For example, Rogue's armor gives 50 str, Monk's armor gives 25 str and 25 int), which is actually our LOSS here.

Now, how do we actually make up from that loss? Cards. Indeed. A lot of cards gives massive amount of STR, INT and possibly AGI, but like I said before, those cards are FRIGGIN expensive. With that said, building a DPS Monk is indeed costy.

I'm a priest, so this is my pov.

I'm currently pairing up with a monk. I love pairing with a monk more than a knight. reason is, they aggro too much; even better than knight. their vitality is massive, which makes up for the lower defense rate that they have compared to a knight. in term of dps + tank combo, monk is a better tank (for me), especially in end game (lv50+). stat might seem like a loss, truth is, their skills always multiple several times. not a rogue-like dps, but decent.

one downside is that they might have too little mana for the class. -.-

[Tastey]

I'm a priest, so this is my pov.

I'm currently pairing up with a monk. I love pairing with a monk more than a knight. reason is, they aggro too much; even better than knight. their vitality is massive, which makes up for the lower defense rate that they have compared to a knight. in term of dps + tank combo, monk is a better tank (for me), especially in end game (lv50+). stat might seem like a loss, truth is, their skills always multiple several times. not a rogue-like dps, but decent.

one downside is that they might have too little mana for the class. -.-

The Mana cost of their skills arnt that high so it does not really make any diffrence in Boss fights i mostly use up heal potions. Maybe 1 Mana Pot at least.

[Chocs]

Monks are actually a little costy to build, main reason is because the source of your attack power came from two stats, which are STR and INT.
Now you'll probably think. Oh, Monks' gear have STR and INT in it! Despite of its weapon low attack power, we can catch up with other class thanks to the stats from Monks' gear! Sadly, no. Even Monks have both STR and INT in their gear, those two stats alone are more or less equal to one stat in other class' gear. (For example, Rogue's armor gives 50 str, Monk's armor gives 25 str and 25 int), which is actually our LOSS here.

Now, how do we actually make up from that loss? Cards. Indeed. A lot of cards gives massive amount of STR, INT and possibly AGI, but like I said before, those cards are FRIGGIN expensive. With that said, building a DPS Monk is indeed costy.

Why would you lose in Attack Power for using STR/INT?

For Monks, both parameters increase AP by 2. In fact, by going in equal STR/INT your attack in pure base stats will be higher than any other class. Consider this:

Monk: 41/41 STR/INT -- 164 AP
Rogue: 51 STR (capped) -- 102 AP

This should be true for Parrying values too.

As for the low weapon AP, you're forgetting that Monks have a faster passive attack (1.4s) than all the other tank classes (2.5s, 2.6s, 3.0s), which kinda makes up for it.

The only DPS that is costly are Rogues. Monks should be costly to maintain, but from spending on pots and repairs, nothing to do with their stats and cards. If you're using cards to justify expense, then every class is expensive--

[Riyk]

Why would you lose in Attack Power for using STR/INT?

For Monks, both parameters increase AP by 2. In fact, by going in equal STR/INT your attack in pure base stats will be higher than any other class. Consider this:

Monk: 41/41 STR/INT -- 164 AP
Rogue: 51 STR (capped) -- 102 AP

This should be true for Parrying values too.

As for the low weapon AP, you're forgetting that Monks have a faster passive attack (1.4s) than all the other tank classes (2.5s, 2.6s, 3.0s), which kinda makes up for it.

The only DPS that is costly are Rogues. Monks should be costly to maintain, but from spending on pots and repairs, nothing to do with their stats and cards. If you're using cards to justify expense, then every class is expensive--

You, sir or madame, have reaffirmed my decision to be a Monk in Ragnarok Online 2.

A dozen internet cookies for you!

[Reppu]

I mean, showing the fact Monks get more AP due to STR and INT is nice and all, but you kind of left out the fact their weapons have much lower Attack Values ( you MENTIONED IT, but it is a VERY large difference), and their steroid is pitiful compared to Rogues/Rangers. As in really, really, REALLY pitiful.

The faster attack speed is sort of shrug when your attack value is that low. It equalizes at best, but the Auto Attack is just one aspect. Their abilities are what are key.

Edited by Reppu, 13 May 2013 - 04:58 AM.

[crazyjimmeh]

I mean, showing the fact Monks get more AP due to STR and INT is nice and all, but you kind of left out the fact their weapons have much lower Attack Values ( you MENTIONED IT, but it is a VERY large difference), and their steroid is pitiful compared to Rogues/Rangers. As in really, really, REALLY pitiful.

The faster attack speed is sort of shrug when your attack value is that low. It equalizes at best, but the Auto Attack is just one aspect. Their abilities are what are key.

I dont get why that is much of a problem, Att Pow = DPS, if you playing monk as dps and hoping to be the highest dps'er you picked the wrong class, imo Monks are Tank firstly and DPS secondary, higher Att Pow isnt all that usful for a class aimed at tanking, u can argue that it will increase threat but most of your threat is coming off your Tank Buff and any additional threat from lightning crush, adding more att pow isnt gunna increase your threat count massively.

Also as its been said they general att speed is alot faster which you be surprised how that effects dps/threat more than extra att power.

IMO i finding monk one of the strongest tanks in the game, maybe only problem being slightly more squishy than other tanking classes, mainly due to the cloth armour, but generating threat i never have a problem, in fact i can easily out threat a knight with aura armor without using any taunt just dps'in the mobs.

[Reppu]

I'm simply eliminating the illusion Monks would be taken (outside of friendship/pity) as DPS. In fact, Monks being touted as one of the Higher DPS tanks is False. If anything, it is Knights and Beastmasters who obtain this title (They don't have penalties to ATK, unless I am mistaken re; Bears). But, this is a factor at the High End.

All said, Monks are great tanks. It's just a shame they have a massive shortcoming as a tank (AOE).

Edited by Reppu, 13 May 2013 - 05:56 AM.

[Chocs]

I did say "kinda makes up for it", but I wasn't trying to argue they can be good DPS at all. Outside the double Guillotine burst, and Ki/Fury Explosion duration it's very hard --

Being arguably the best at 1v1 tanking is their inherent advantage AND disadvantage - At least -currently-

Was just pointing out that dividing STR/INT is not a justification to call them "costly".

Monks are actually a little costy to build, main reason is because the source of your attack power came from two stats, which are STR and INT...

...(For example, Rogue's armor gives 50 str, Monk's armor gives 25 str and 25 int), which is actually our LOSS here.

Now, how do we actually make up from that loss? Cards. Indeed. A lot of cards gives massive amount of STR, INT and possibly AGI, but like I said before, those cards are FRIGGIN expensive. With that said, building a DPS Monk is indeed costy.

Reading this post again, however, I'm beginning to understand what the argument was regarding cards. There are indeed cards that give ~15/~15 STR/INT but -none- with a flat 30 STR (or even above 20 STR yet). So even though it's Monk's potential win in pure stats, they would still need to earn these cards to par with the others' weapon damage?

This is still not just the Monk's problem though. Everyone needs good cards...

Weapon attack is only a small part of your total Physical Attack and is not increased by party buffs (you should benefit from both Battle Order and Dragonology). How about Throw Spirit Sphere and its 10% damage increase for monks on the target? Maybe with Fury+TSS you can get 40% damage modifier for a short moment, which is more than the usual 30% other DPS class have.

Edited by Chocs, 13 May 2013 - 12:32 PM.

[JustGabe]

The Mana cost of their skills arnt that high so it does not really make any diffrence in Boss fights i mostly use up heal potions. Maybe 1 Mana Pot at least.

I totally get what she means thou, from a single dungeon run I usually run out of SP 2-3 times (I once completely ran out of SP during a boss fight and felt like a real tanking meat! ) but it's easily overcame with a couple of SP foods or 4-5 blue potions with no problem.

[Tastey]

I totally get what she means thou, from a single dungeon run I usually run out of SP 2-3 times (I once completely ran out of SP during a boss fight and felt like a real tanking meat! ) but it's easily overcame with a couple of SP foods or 4-5 blue potions with no problem.

lm kinda imagine that u guys waste ur SP. o.o ok some times i use food though, but losing your whole SP? U are fighting nostop with all trashmobs or smth?

[Reppu]

Pausing is inefficient. RUSH THROUGH.

[rzevidz007]

Why would you lose in Attack Power for using STR/INT?

For Monks, both parameters increase AP by 2. In fact, by going in equal STR/INT your attack in pure base stats will be higher than any other class. Consider this:

Monk: 41/41 STR/INT -- 164 AP
Rogue: 51 STR (capped) -- 102 AP

This should be true for Parrying values too.

As for the low weapon AP, you're forgetting that Monks have a faster passive attack (1.4s) than all the other tank classes (2.5s, 2.6s, 3.0s), which kinda makes up for it.

The only DPS that is costly are Rogues. Monks should be costly to maintain, but from spending on pots and repairs, nothing to do with their stats and cards. If you're using cards to justify expense, then every class is expensive--

The only real deal from 41/41 STR INT is the Parry which is useful for tanking. Attack Power alone won't be enough to determine one's DPS. You forgot to mention Critical (as it become a need for every DPS class end-game). Sure you can maximize your Monk's truest potential by having STR INT AGI cards, but as I said before, it is costy to build it.

I still disagree. Having STR and INT for our stats is still the greatest loss for Monks. I believe the reason behind my statement is because there is no AGI in our gears in the first place. Not to mention, both STR and INT, BOTH STR AND INT are used for your Attack Power ALONE and your gears' STR and INT combined equals to one main stats from other class' gears. Two stats for one damn thing? Damn straight, Gravity. All in all, building a DPS Monk is possible, but hard.

You also forgot to mention that Swordman class both branches have a DoT: Head Crush which is more or less equivalent to one normal attack + the original normal attack.

If it is card sets you were talking about, then yes. All classes need those to actually enhance their DPS, because card sets can give you bonus stats as if there is one more slot for a card. If you count a card alone, Monks will still be costly because they are dependant on multiple stats, which are STR INT VIT and AGI if you're going for DPS. Now, search for the card which has those 4 cards focused. Can't find it? Because only Normal+ cards hold such potential.

All in all, for newbies out there that are still hesitating on a playing a Monk..: Don't be.Monk is a very strong tank class, if not, the strongest tank in RO2 + DPS is strong, potentially stronger than other tank classes. You should not go wrong on this class.

Edited by rzevidz007, 14 May 2013 - 09:52 AM.

[Reppu]

I do not believe the "DPS is strong for a tank" statement is valid, if only because of Stone Skin. Yes, I'll call it Stone Skin.

-10% Attack Power adds up, which is exactly why Warrior DPS falls so much in their Tank role at 50. At the very least, Monk has one of the few Tank Damage Steroids that doesn't hinder them, but I'm pretty confident Beastmasters win as DPS tanks, since they don't get any penalties to their damage when Grizzled.

But, it's likely irrelevant.

[Raidius]

so "monk dps" will get rejected till get some change on the class?always liked monks (made like 8 on ro1) but i hate tanking, if as dps is that bad probably gonna stop lvling mine then

[Reppu]

There's literally nothing a Monk DPS offers that isn't provided by a larger margin from Rogues, Rangers, Assassins, or Sorcerers. And all three of those provide some form of desired Team Buff as well.

Monk DPS would be a pity/friend slot.

[Ryouichi]

Hmmm. Why do I feel the opposite about monk? Yes, they can get attack from both STR and INT, except people fail to realize that Monk's weapon has the LOWEST attack in the game. Can't even top 400 attack in end game. That and Monk get 0 agi from their gear kind of sucks.

As for being best defense, I don't know where this rumor came from. Even with 250% defense bonus, Monk on Apostle only gets 1568 defense. Meanwhile a Knight with the same gear gets 1853 defense. Unless math doesn't matter in this game, I can't find the justification. On a side note, Monk does have the highest parry.

Edited by Ryouichi, 14 May 2013 - 12:09 PM.

[Reppu]

False, Warrior does. Defender scaling.

Really, all Monk has going for it is Style and Burst Damage. That's really it.

Edited by Reppu, 14 May 2013 - 12:23 PM.

[Raidius]

i checked at 30ish lvl, sword+shield for knight gives more str(besides som agi) than the monk get str+int from knuckles, so less from stats and less atk power too. kinda disheartening that class you love most suck the way you want to play it.

armor for knight/warrior gives 130 str+some agi from abaddon set, while monk gives 60 str/60int,assassin/rogue 114 str/49agi(think i made my point there)

so yeah weapons+stats from gear gives less than other classes, dunno how much does the "white hits" for monk dps, but doubt is much

[Ryouichi]

False, Warrior does. Defender scaling.

Really, all Monk has going for it is Style and Burst Damage. That's really it.

Sorry, but this has been compared. Full INT/STR Monk has higher parry than Warrior with full STR and Defender. Both with Apostle set.

[Reppu]

Ahhh, Monks can break the cap, then? Interesting. Or are we just pointing out Monks hit the cap sooner?

Either way, it's irrelevant. A cap is a cap, unless Monks break it. And even then, Parry isn't as good as Dodge.

[JustGabe]

lm kinda imagine that u guys waste ur SP. o.o ok some times i use food though, but losing your whole SP? U are fighting nostop with all trashmobs or smth?

Actually yeah, in dungeons it's kind of normal to me to start running out of SP due to the non-stop killing

Either way, it's irrelevant. A cap is a cap, unless Monks break it. And even then, Parry isn't as good as Dodge.

Yeah, but in order to get a good Dodge rate (or Crit rate) you have to sacrifice a lot of Atk Pwr

Edited by JustGabe, 14 May 2013 - 06:00 PM.