11 replies to this topic

[Jonss]

I have a warrior friend and we arent sure which would be which

thanks!

[Elysion]

Well, in this situation, knight is better at single target agro than warrior, who is better at aoe agro than knight. So it would probably naturally fall into place that knight would mt and warrior would offtank just due to their skills.

If we are talking a raid situation then it would be different, you would just assign them jobs based on their gear/prefferences/experience and they woud simply ensure they do those roles.

[Jonss]

Well, in this situation, knight is better at single target agro than warrior, who is better at aoe agro than knight. So it would probably naturally fall into place that knight would mt and warrior would offtank just due to their skills.

If we are talking a raid situation then it would be different, you would just assign them jobs based on their gear/prefferences/experience and they woud simply ensure they do those roles.

Thanks

lets say it was a raid and they both have never done the raid before and had exactly same gear

which would u assign them to?

[Jonss]

also wondering why knights are better for single target?

[SonicTMP]

Because a knights grand cross is very weak compaired to a Warrior's brandish. Leap is also handy for jumping to a pack and then Brandish while the knight would have to charge and stun 1 or sheild boom and hope they are close enough together for the splash to hit.

[Jonss]

Because a knights grand cross is very weak compaired to a Warrior's brandish. Leap is also handy for jumping to a pack and then Brandish while the knight would have to charge and stun 1 or sheild boom and hope they are close enough together for the splash to hit.

you cant stun bosses i thought

so you are saying because knights AoE isnt as good that makes them better single target tanks? wat



"knight is better at single target agro than warrior"

[Chocs]

you cant stun bosses i thought

so you are saying because knights AoE isnt as good that makes them better single target tanks? wat

Battle Leap and Shield Charge are used for movement in this case. Battle Leap allows you to stun a group of adds which is beneficial for an offtank. We're saying that a Warrior's AoE is better than a Knight's, so Warriors are better at dealing with those adds; we're playing by strengths, not weaknesses.

Knight's defence is higher and more sustainable than a Warrior's so it's the Knight that will be the one to soak up damage more steadily.

Warrior can move freely using any of their skills so they're better at doing the various roles an offtank is required to do. Knights are more restricted in that regard.


Knight = Sustainability
Warrior = Mobility/Versatility

Edited by Chocs, 07 June 2013 - 05:45 PM.

[Elysion]

you cant stun bosses i thought

so you are saying because knights AoE isnt as good that makes them better single target tanks? wat



"knight is better at single target agro than warrior"

Knights do more single target damage than warriors(due to aura mastery and not having a 10% damage debuff when tanking), and less aoe damage. This means if you had a knight and a warrior tank both doing the same exact thing (using single target skills on the boss, aoeing when adds), the knight would automatically have more agro on the boss, and the warrior would automatically have more agro on the adds.

This is why i said in a group situation it would just sort of naturally happen that the knight would probably have agro on the boss, and the warrior would probably have agro on the adds.

Works the same way with monks, all while leveling monks tend to naturally steal agro from other tanks single target due to higher damage output. This falls off eventually because monks dont get agi gear. If monks ever get agi gear they may become the preffered main tank class anyway, despite warriors technical superiority, knights and monks are both durable enough to tank anything. I can see the meta changing to monk main and knight as off/support as the 'best' setup, due to monks superior defensive cooldowns (protection ki and a cooldown reducer)

Its kind of funny. when you are totaly new to the game you consider knights as naturally the best tank. Then you learn about warriors advantage, and your opinion changes, but then you get experience in the game, realize that knights are still fine, and grow to appreciate their extra support capability and the elegence of how well their single target skill setup synergyses. Ive played a warrior and single targeting with them is just boring, knight feels more like a rogue, and being a rogue is fun.

Edited by Elysion, 08 June 2013 - 02:36 AM.

[Jonss]

thanks for that good explanation

its weird how warrior has more block and knight uses a shield

hopefully 3rd jobs give knight some pretty darn good tanking skills because it seems like they should be more of the tanking class for SMs

[kingarthur6687]

Works the same way with monks, all while leveling monks tend to naturally steal agro from other tanks single target due to higher damage output. This falls off eventually because monks dont get agi gear. If monks ever get agi gear they may become the preffered main tank class anyway, despite warriors technical superiority, knights and monks are both durable enough to tank anything. I can see the meta changing to monk main and knight as off/support as the 'best' setup, due to monks superior defensive cooldowns (protection ki and a cooldown reducer)

I'll admit, reading endgame talk regarding Warriors makes me doubt whether I'l ultimately have any use/purpose or even be wanted in a party come crunch time with RHD and raids.

[sephiroso]

I'll admit, reading endgame talk regarding Warriors makes me doubt whether I'l ultimately have any use/purpose or even be wanted in a party come crunch time with RHD and raids.

knights will always be more desirable than a warrior tank to the general public. the only ones who would actively refuse a knight tank over a warrior tank are the elite/top end guilds who care about achieving top efficiency.

reason why to the general public knights will be more desirable is shield fortress. takes a big strain of healers and can and will save dps' lives if you notice they started backing off to slow or healers got a little behind on heals and a big aoe is coming up.

when it comes down to it, yes warrior has more avoidance stats than a knight(parry/dodge) but its not like that'll spell the difference of life and death between a knight tanking and warrior tanking same boss. which is why knight will always be more desirable to the general public. until your raid group gets good enough that you don't have to babysit them with shield fortress, knight > warrior.

[Timmmt]

I'll admit, reading endgame talk regarding Warriors makes me doubt whether I'l ultimately have any use/purpose or even be wanted in a party come crunch time with RHD and raids.

Warriors can main-tank any boss in the game, even AOD Hard bosses. Their parry really benefits them against bosses that do 10k+. When you take half damage 70% of the time on these bosses, it really makes it that much easier.

Really, choosing between a Knight and Warrior to MT will come down to which player has the better gear. You just have to know your role depending on your party composition.

If you need inspriation, here are some random clips of my Warrior main-tanking and off-tanking various bosses on the SEA servers:

RatMaster Hard as Main-Tank
RatMaster Hard as Off-Tank
Giantworm Normal as Main-Tank
Giantworm Normal as Off-Tank