47 replies to this topic

[Nitro]

we should do a raid for fun together if you like to try this out, because I am leaning towards rogue being the highest DPS class in the game. I haven't been outdps'd by any class since I began raiding

Sounds like fun. If you are up for it, we can get in a raid together and based on results, share our stats, cards, and gears. What say you? I am both Nitro here and in game.

[mysticalre]

Sounds like fun. If you are up for it, we can get in a raid together and based on results, share our stats, cards, and gears. What say you? I am both Nitro here and in game.

always up for it, will pm you or you pm me, whoever comes first (i'm EST timezone)

[ruusei]

I've always said rogues are slower but hit harder, sins are faster but deal less damage than rogues. (not a big one though)
Unstable doping at max helps you get your attack power up faster/ wasting less pots.
30% of attack power + 20% str/crit.
I love it then my agi buff procs and i use moonlight, its crit city.
Honestly sins are also fragile and require the hp pots neverless
using gangster for mobs and stuff is what i use and it cuts down on potion use a LOT
I really only use doping for the crit/agi most of the time, if im in a dungeon i use lower pots to keep my buff up

[Nitro]

With no actual DPS meter, not sure if Rogues really beat assassins in DPS at all.  Rogues generate both healing and DPS threat on the RO2 meter so using that to measure things is a bust.  Both are really good DPS, so I recommend going with the one that suits your style of play.  I think assassins out running anyone in combat is darn good, as well as being able to reduce all damage by 50% pretty often.

 

Anyway, if anyone want to test the theory in a raid I"m usually online around 5 PM server time.

Edited by Nitro, 02 July 2013 - 10:35 AM.

[Leinzan]

well, to make an easer comparison, Colo makes things standarized:

 

I usually max the Adrenaline Rush before the round starts, and when I do a jump on target with Dark Illusion it does a 1.2~1.7k crit damange as lvl 1 (when it doesnt bug doing normal damange)

 

And with maxed Adrenaline Rush and STR buff from Unstable Doping I do about 960 per double attack (480 each strike)

I've battled with sins in colo and they often do 520 damange on me with Shadow Assault, followed by double attacks of around 600 (300~330 per hit)

 

My Deadly Blow also does a 900~2300 damange from normal to crit on most targets, not sure if the STR buff was active but Adrenaline Rush sure was.

 

Any Assassin out there to compare this info with? please use Thief skills as reference the most as possible.

 

on another note, about my PvE current stats

My current gears:

- Desperate Appostle Dual Dagger

- Raid Victory Points Headgear

- RHD Top

- Raid Token Pants

- RHD Gloves

- RHD Shoes

- Colo Accesories

- Generic Cards

Current Moonlight Dance Max Critical Combo: 11k

Current Deadly Blows Critical Strikes: 2.5~3.2k

Current Double Attack Critical hits: 960~1400

Critical Hits occurrance: 25~45%

 

A Phen in SGD Hard mode (15.1k HP) lasts about 12~20 seconds, often use of Gangster Paradise, Moonlight Dance or Crecent Moon, most of the time only 2 of the 3 skills are used per enemy.

[RyeAkai]

I don't think I've ever done just 520 with a Shadow Assault on Colo, save misses, I always hit at least 725 or so (tanks), max 3xxx. My usual buffs are just my skills and a +25 atk/crit food (forgot the name).

 

 

I've been in raids and stuff with a lot of rogues, and while I can't say for sure who has better DPS, I do know for certain none has a clear advantage over the other one. Also, both are pretty damn good at DPS, that's for sure.

 

[7408130520121848977]

Okay i'm gonna make this clear.. Rogues are the best DPS in this game, PERIOD, no ifs no buts, Fact.... sins are like wizards garbo, you wont see not one Sin be in any type of raids over a rogue when the Noel race comes out. Now this shadow claw which gives sins 5% crit can be bought with union points to get 1% crit buff which is the same as 1/5 sin shadow claw. Go sin if you want to do Woe and colo and do well, go rogue if you want top dps in raids and be useful outside of pvp.

[4860130515113635440]

Okay i'm gonna make this clear.. Rogues are the best DPS in this game, PERIOD, no ifs no buts, Fact.... sins are like wizards garbo, you wont see not one Sin be in any type of raids over a rogue when the Noel race comes out. Now this shadow claw which gives sins 5% crit can be bought with union points to get 1% crit buff which is the same as 1/5 sin shadow claw. Go sin if you want to do Woe and colo and do well, go rogue if you want top dps in raids and be useful outside of pvp.

 

Wrong the best DPS in the game is a competent DPS no ifs ands or buts. Sins are garbage? You can evade nearly every attack with Sin's insane move speed, and if you can't Shadow Armour for 70% def. You can eat an AoE better than most tanks and with my gear its on a 30s CD. Sin is also far easier to play and as such don't need much input from the player to reach decent levels of dps. When it comes down to it if someone is looking for a dps they're going to ask the player not the class.

 

We have Wizards Sins and BST's in my raids because the players do their job fine and most of them are better than the majority of their dps sorc/rogues/knight,war,monk equivalents. Wizards Sins and BST's can easily hang with the best of them. Heck BeastMaster may be the best MT in the game, my guldie surprised the heck out of me with the saves he made.

[Velouce]

If anyone wants to get this topic out of the world, write me a PM if you are an assassin with complete Colo Set and STR runes, we can then go to Scarecrows and make a video to show which is the better DPS, if one of them is better...

[4860130515113635440]

If anyone wants to get this topic out of the world, write me a PM if you are an assassin with complete Colo Set and STR runes, we can then go to Scarecrows and make a video to show which is the better DPS, if one of them is better...

 

 

As a Sin I say that Rogue ARE better DPS, but they take more effort/gear/potions to get there. On respawn pop shadow armour, a master red, SF and PW and boom good as new, you have to rebuild doping and all that. Rogue are better but they require a better player to get them there, Sin gives you a ton of leway for not much sacrifice. If you need 1 more dps for your party and its between a Sin and Rogue equally geared that you don't know, Sin is the safer choice even though Rogue could be better. But don't get me wrong PVE under good condition Rogue are better, just not sure exactly how much.

Edited by 4860130515113635440, 07 July 2013 - 01:27 AM.

[Cthulhuzealot]

I have a Rogue with epic gear and it's damn expensive to keep your buff up all the time in RAIDS/RHD... I stopped playing my Rogue cause it's darn expensive. You don't need UD for PVE normal maps, but for Colo and Raids yeah. And keep in mind that if you die you'll lose the whole UD stack

[Leinzan]

Then dont die >=D!! (well its not like its under your control)

 

Sadly I went for chef when I picked my thief, originally was going to make a sin, but I liked the Double Dagger thing more, so I ended up as a Rogue, and since I got GP in lvl 3 and DP lvl 1 I stopped sitting to rest... its kinda crazy.

 

The thing is that now I really regret not being an alchemist on my Rogue, but guildies helps a ton, you just gets the mats to make a stack of pots which isnt so hard and use them wisely. 2 Master Red Pots and Im almost full on the adrenaline rush, just every 2:30 mins I use a pot lvl 3 or 2 to keep it up and when in full no problem at all, is like 5z a stack of 100 lvl 2 red pots, if its so annoying to get there to buy them just make a low lvl char and send it the money so it can send the pots back.

 

Colo is another story tho, pvp (or pseudo-pvp) is always spensive, but try to keep the rush of one pot per life, unless you get to the 5th round, so you can go all out!

[RORose]

Sin is good enough DPS to not deal with the hassle, just go rogue if you want a solid solo/pvp char this is where they shine without a doubt.

[SuccubusDeSade]

Doping vs shadow form? there are really REALLY 2 pages of posts about it?

EASY GUYS

Shadow Form = Ugly, no wait UGLY!

Doping.

[RORose]

Doping vs shadow form? there are really REALLY 2 pages of posts about it?

EASY GUYS

Shadow Form = Ugly, no wait UGLY!

Doping.

 

Funniest pic ever!!
 

[ZT0100]

Doping vs shadow form? there are really REALLY 2 pages of posts about it?

 

I know... It's simple. Shadow Form gives a solid 30% attack and speed. For Unstable Doping, critical hits do 2x the damage, so the 20% additional critical rate from Adrenaline Rush basically gives an additional 20% damage if you do the math ( that is if your hit doesn't crit in the first place.) So Adrenaline Rush gives an additional 20% damage with either the attack or critical boost, although the attack boost does more damage because it stacks with the base critical rate while the critical boost only makes criticals more often on-top of the already high base critical rate.. The overall damage boost with UD is 1.56 or 156%(1.20x1.30.) Shadow Form is just 130% overall.

 

Shadow Form

- 130% damage and 130% speed.

 

Unstable Doping

- 130% damage with a 20% chance of activating a buff for an additional 26% damage boost for a maximum of 156%.
 

[Dzonatan]

I think it is also worth to add the fact that rogues have (note quite sure so I would like to get confirmation) prolly highest burst they can achieve in the game:

 

Stealth > Dirty Plan to get 5 CP > Max Moonlight Dance.

 

That's an opening 220% atk power burst that can crit () into 440% atk power burst. A rogue with 2k AP suddenly makes a 8k blast. Pretty scary if you ask me.

 

That is ofcourse if you can get 5 CP through Dirty Plan while you are stealthed. Can anyone confirm this?

 

 

Edited by Dzonatan, 04 August 2013 - 06:55 AM.

[SephySama]

So does UD really out perform Shadow form? I mean both give +30% damage buff but does one skill have a particular advantage over another?

For newer players, I'd like to think that Assassins might be the better option since they don't have a cost in maintaining their buff (apart from style points), whilst rogues need to stack a few end game pots and keep gulping down level 1 pots to maintain effect.

Or am I missing something here?

 

been playing Sin from day one i will tell you facts

sin yes we get SF and shadow armor  yay we can tank we still need pots to keep us alive

rogue (hi dude i see you have high dps. LOOK HOW I STEAL THE BOSS FROM THE TANK)

 

sin = fun class good dps and i tank raid boss's

rogue = look i can self heal and poop all over your dps

facts

 

sin for the win

rogue to troll

 

[SparklingLimeade]

sin for the win

rogue to troll

 

So you're saying they haven't changed from RO despite losing divest? lol

[SephySama]

So you're saying they haven't changed from RO despite losing divest? lol

 

im saying my main char is a Assassin full Colo geared raid build

and the same build as a Rogue will will make the Assassin look like a pea shooter
 

i love Assassins but rogues do more dmg

 

we had a rogue in the guild that was low on the dmg meter and when he got his colo weapon he was making me look like chopped liver

[Leinzan]

 

sin for the win

rogue to troll

I would totally agree with this is Rogue still had the skill "full strip" .___.

[Chocs]

Divest would be completely OP in a gear based MMO...

[Vau]

On PvP:

 

Duels : SIns win Rogues, cuz it's a "no pot rule" when dueling. Long term battles rogue will win, always.

Colosseum: I've personally won every battle against rogues, maybe cuz they need to press more skills than we do, meanwhile we're full dpsing them until death.

 

On PVE: (bosses)

 

I've never saw a Rogue outdpsing me on my sin, possible reasons:

-Rogues need to waste lots of pots to keep their dopin' maxed.

-Personal build ( Rogue's need to put their skill points perfectly, if not, it will be a waste)

-Stats/cards/wep refining.

 

In conclusion:

Doping is way better in long battles against Assassins,but there's no long battles, neither on Colosseum or WoE as fact. Doping is better tho.