175 replies to this topic

[WinterStorm2]

Has there been any official word why there were so many accounts banned? Player speculation seems to have concluded that players who were inadvertantly involved in the chain of bought zeny were banned along with the buyers and sellers but from my own account activity that doesn't make sense unless the AH was involved too. And if I can't trust the AH, how can I possibly make any purchases in game? It makes me reluctant to put more money into the game knowing I could be banned for no good reason until they can be bothered investigating. Tonydinh's comment yesterday about being asked where he got his zeny and then, satisfied with his reply, wasn't given a ban shows they shot first and asked questions later.

The only thing I can think of that would look suspicious with zero investigation on my account was using a level 1 character to purchase VIP packages which I sold and used to buy crafted epics which I mailed to my main. I also mailed most of the zeny I made whilst getting to 50 to my level 1 because to save on travel costs, that's my auctioneer. The only conclusion I can draw is that an algorithm was run to list characters with too much zeny for their level and/or amounts of zeny obtained too quickly for the algorithm to deem regular. Even a tiny amount of investigation BEFORE banning me would have shown I hadn't been involved in zeny purchasing. The epics I bought were listed at market value (as far as I could tell. For what they were the prices seemed reasonable to me. It wasn't like I was dropping thousands on a a green) and I've yet to do a player to player trade involving zeny. Also, all the zeny I moved was within my own account apart from the AH purchases.

Please can there be an official statement on whether processes have been put in place to prevent this happening again. The only good thing about it was how quickly the bans were reversed.

tl;dr I need a reason to again trust this game with my money.

[Ledise]

It's because of RMT related stuffs. Some are real culprits and some are just victims.

[FallingGrace]

I think WP wanted to do something to deal a serious blow to the RMT'rs.

Honestly being perceived as the "Ban happy company out to jack up every single RMT account" is actually a welcome change to the usual "we'll get around to it eventually" motto most F2P game companies take.


Anyways enjoy the VIP day (I wish I got banned for 4 hours and got free items too ).

[Coulrophobia]

tl;dr I couldn't log in to a video game for about 8 hours and then had it reversed, now I have lost all faith in a group of people that were obviously trying to do the right thing and am completely unable to look past my own selfishness to see that this was a good thing for the 34,000+ other players.

[WinterStorm2]

I haven't had a chance to play so didn't know they were trying to make recompense. That's a good sign.
It's not that they were trying to do a good thing I object to, nor the quick reversal of the incorrect ones. It's the lack of communication and obvious lack of prior investigation.

I applaud the intentions behind this but zeny selling is a problem that's plagued every MMO since their inception and to my knowledge it's never been beaten. That doesn't mean no attempts should be made. Kudos for trying but I had no idea how long it would be. I had no idea why it was happening, whether I'd been hacked, whether my CC details were compromised and I should be contacting my bank asap, etc. And now that it's over I'd like to know if this will be a regular thing and what I need to do to avoid it, if I even can.

I was hoping for constructive responses but I guess with all the posts people made about people who were banned must have bought zeny and deserved it, I should have expected Caulrophobia's response.

Edited by WinterStorm2, 12 June 2013 - 07:29 PM.

[Benttincan]

tl;dr I couldn't log in to a video game for about 8 hours and then had it reversed, now I have lost all faith in a group of people that were obviously trying to do the right thing and am completely unable to look past my own selfishness to see that this was a good thing for the 34,000+ other players.

Bravo on your rather lackluster flaming. I would pick apart your tenuous response, but somehow I feel that my fingers have better things to fing.

I haven't had a chance to play so didn't know they were trying to make recompense. That's a good sign.
It's not that they were trying to do a good thing I object to, nor the quick reversal of the incorrect ones. It's the lack of communication and obvious lack of prior investigation.

I applaud the intentions behind this but zeny selling is a problem that's plagued every MMO since their inception and to my knowledge it's never been beaten. That doesn't mean no attempts should be made. Kudos for trying but I had no idea how long it would be. I had no idea why it was happening, whether I'd been hacked, whether my CC details were compromised and I should be contacting my bank asap, etc. And now that it's over I'd like to know if this will be a regular thing and what I need to do to avoid it, if I even can.

I was hoping for more constructive responses but I guess with all the posts people made about people who were banned must have bought zeny and deserved it, I should have expected Caulrophobia's response.

Your loss of trust in the company after this incident isn't selfish or absurd, despite what some might claim. It's perfectly reasonable and to be expected, especially given WP's extremely poor handling of the entire situation; most notably the lack of communication afterwards. Due to said lack of communication many people were left wondering the exact same things you were: was this official, was WP hacked, was I hacked, is my information safe, so on and so forth.

[Sylvius]

I'm pretty active in trade chat, so I was like "wtf" when they asked for a specific moment

[Rebirth]

And then they banned my level 1 mule with 7k zeny. Filed ticket they tell me to explain myself because i had a record that indicated I've been exploiting zennies?

What even

[Varunax]

And then they banned my level 1 mule with 7k zeny. Filed ticket they tell me to explain myself because i had a record that indicated I've been exploiting zennies?

What even

I could've sworn you posted in another thread and said your cousin was on your account. I don't know why your stories change so much!

[Skize]

Lol, don't listen to the people that are saying you should always trust a gaming company. Those people are either very ignorant or have yet to play MMO's for a very long time. Also, I love how people are treating these bannings as if WP were the only ones to ever do it. Those are the people you KNOW haven't been playing MMO's for a long time. When it comes to mass bannings, gaming companies usually do a terrible job at it. There will be actual bannings and a good amount of people banned for no reason.

Anyway, never trust gaming companies. To do so is at your own risk. It's like trusting some random person that comes up to you and says that he'll give you a winning lottery ticket for $50.

[Rebirth]

I could've sworn you posted in another thread and said your cousin was on your account. I don't know why your stories change so much!

This was a separate case. This is my 2nd account to be falsely banned. Really, 7k zeny on a level 1 constitutes a ban?
I swear, they're 101% hating on me right now.

Edited by Rebirth, 12 June 2013 - 08:13 PM.

[JyuGrace]

This was a separate case. This is my 2nd account to be falsely banned. Really, 7k zeny on a level 1 constitutes a ban?
I swear, they're 101% hating on me right now.

why did you have 7k zeny on a level 1 in the first place?

[Sera]

To act as a mule/bank/trade character? Why not? o.o

[Jonss]

To act as a mule/bank/trade character? Why not? o.o

yeah.... im amazed that people are asking why someone would do that LOL

hi guys im stupid and my name is jyugrace

[Coulrophobia]

Bravo on your rather lackluster flaming. I would pick apart your tenuous response, but somehow I feel that my fingers have better things to fing.

If you think that was flaming, you must be new to the internet. Welcome.

One too many "I have lost faith" posts for today, sorry. Something bad happened for a very short period of time, was quickly rectified and was dealt with appropriately. No need to go Chicken-Little. The problem seems extreme when browsing the forums because no one is going to post "I bought zeny from a website and got banned, now I feel stupid." Nor are any gold sellers going to create accounts and say "Bravo, WP, you caught us."

But if we're to believe the GM's, they banned over 500 accounts. I'm not going to count, but I did read the entire thread and I would put a high estimate of complaints around 75. That's still an 85% success rate, which is better than I would honestly expect.

So instead of incessantly complaining why not applaud the company for taking action, admitting they made some mistakes and rectifying those mistakes in a timely manner? I see this as a good thing for the game and community as a whole, despite causing what boils down to a slight inconvenience for a small minority. I also only see a bunch of "me, me, me" coming from the complainers and identifying that as selfishness is not uncalled-for.

Skize: Nowhere did I say to "always trust game companies." I'm just saying this is not a reason to distrust this particular game company. I find it humorous that you claim the people "treating these bannings as if WP were the only ones to ever do it" are new to games, yet it is the people complaining about "losing faith" who act as if this is totally unprecedented, shocking, unfathomable and worthy of jumping ship completely.

[Rebirth]

To act as a mule/bank/trade character? Why not? o.o

exactly.

And this is exactly why I don't know why i got banned,

[SuperGlue]

Don't see why you'd need another account as a mule unless you were using it as a fail safe for something.

[WinterStorm2]

Don't see why you'd need another account as a mule unless you were using it as a fail safe for something.

May save on travel costs though I haven't done the math on mail vs travel. Also, for convenience, it's usually quicker to switch chars at a mailbox to a char near AH then switch back to main than travel even using BWs.

[Rebirth]

Don't see why you'd need another account as a mule unless you were using it as a fail safe for something.

Or in case I got hacked. Why do people keep money in their banks? It's not like the interest rate is high or anything. It's because it's handy, you don't have to bring your money everywhere, and can use it anytime. Also, it's easier to rob a person than it is a bank. Think about it analogously: You have a geared character and a low leveled character. Which character would hackers want to hack?

And does it matter if I have a mule or not? I don't remember having a mule = false bans. I was banned for "Zeny exploit" even though I don't even know what that is. If I really had an exploit, wouldn't my main character be banned? Also if I had an exploit, you can be sure I'd have a hell lot more than 7k Zeny.

And yes, it's more useful to have a mule stationed in Alberta or Prontera than having my character go back to check the auction everytime. I don't get how a level 1 would be ivolved with a zeny exploit. It's not like I could exploit conceal scrolls or anything. Jesus WarpPortal, get your shi.t together.

Edited by Rebirth, 12 June 2013 - 09:43 PM.

[Suweeka]

exactly.

And this is exactly why I don't know why i got banned,

Not sure about how warp portal thinks of it, but my guess is...

-drum roll-

Ban evasion.

[Coulrophobia]

And yes, it's more useful to have a mule stationed in Alberta or Prontera than having my character go back to check the auction everytime. I don't get how a level 1 would be ivolved with a zeny exploit. It's not like I could exploit conceal scrolls or anything. Jesus WarpPortal, get your shi.t together

An alt on your same account could serve the same purpose.

And you really don't see why someone would want to create a different account to receive their RMT zeny? I'm sure this was very common, even multiple new accounts trading it back and forth in an attempt to make it more difficult on any GM's who might try to trace such transactions. Not that this would really hinder any investigation, but people think this makes them clever somehow.

I'm not saying this is what happened with you, but to assume there is absolutely no way anyone could ever use a lv1 character on a fresh account to abuse zeny/RMT is just plain silly.

[Rebirth]

Not sure about how warp portal thinks of it, but my guess is...

-drum roll-

Ban evasion.

No, after banning my false ban they said I was allowed to make another account.

An alt on your same account could serve the same purpose.

And you really don't see why someone would want to create a different account to receive their RMT zeny? I'm sure this was very common, even multiple new accounts trading it back and forth in an attempt to make it more difficult on any GM's who might try to trace such transactions. Not that this would really hinder any investigation, but people think this makes them clever somehow.

I'm not saying this is what happened with you, but to assume there is absolutely no way anyone could ever use a lv1 character on a fresh account to abuse zeny/RMT is just plain silly.

No harm done. They said I had a "Zeny Exploit"
on a level 1 character.

The funniest thing they said was they had "records". If they had record then I wouldn't be banned in the first place because i did not exploit zennies (if they were referring to the conceal scroll thing).

I know for a fact I transferred around... 6.9k from one account to another, but that money was made from selling stuff and emrchanting.

If they had their bullshi.t records, they would be able to see all the money sent from 1 account to another came from the SAME i.P ADDRESS.



Yes great Idea guys, let's ban a level 1 mule when he has alts that can "exploit" WAY MORE ZENNIES. There goes my faith for you guys WP
GG RIP Warpportal

Edited by Rebirth, 12 June 2013 - 09:48 PM.

[Suweeka]

No, after banning my false ban they said I was allowed to make another account.

-shrug-

Then perhaps this:

(i) Related Accounts. If Gravity terminates an Account, Gravity may terminate any other Accounts that share the same member name, phone number, email address, postal address, Internet Protocol address, or credit card number with the terminated Account.

Considering [and assuming] that character was affiliated with the previous account you had that was banned, I wouldn't doubt they'd target that account as well.

[Rebirth]

-shrug-

Then perhaps this:

(i) Related Accounts. If Gravity terminates an Account, Gravity may terminate any other Accounts that share the same member name, phone number, email address, postal address, Internet Protocol address, or credit card number with the terminated Account.

Considering [and assuming] that character was affiliated with the previous account you had that was banned, I wouldn't doubt they'd target that account as well.

And yet all my other alts aren't banned. Warpportal is full of fluffy bunnies.

Especially when they said they had "records". Umm, if they had records, they would've seen that all the transferring was done by the same IP address,

Please watch your language <3

Edited by VolunteerMod11, 13 June 2013 - 07:30 AM.

[Suweeka]

And yet all my other alts aren't banned. Warpportal is full of shi.t.

Especially when they said they had "records". Umm, if they had records, they would've seen that all the transferring was done by the same IP address,

Hm, have you logged on to those other alts?

I mean who knows? Sooner or later those might get hammered as well.


Or it could be concerning the "records", assuming that 7k zeny was transferred to that mule from your main/alts/etc., it could be that part of that 7k was acquired through illegitimate means, and as such, the 'infected' alt had to be put down as well.

Edited by Suweeka, 12 June 2013 - 10:05 PM.