381 replies to this topic

[Adamage]

Just a note, if you have a class designed around BURST "Double Damage + JT or VS" and each of the bursts can do anywhere from 50-80% of the health pool, the game is no longer fun.

 

Seriously, I made a sorc, and when you just have to get a positive kill point to death ratio, its quite easy when any crit  can get me a kill. I felt dirty when I, (a sorc with no colo gear) came up to a priest with 10.3 k hp, and literally 2 shot them. This is not skill, this is just bad design. If you step it up a notch and learn how to heal yourself and not just sit still and tunnel, winning a colo comes down to RNG. Who gets the most crits or who secures the most kills.

[Gluttannie]

This doesnt work for me cuz i lag in Colo (probably laptop isnt the best thing to game on). Also if they run too far .... ur bound to be chasing them with interrupted cast times lol. By the time u get to them someone's probably killed them or maybe they've gotten to u XD

 

Cold Bolt gives a -40% movement speed effect on your targets, meaning you can always catch up to them unless they use guardian or something. If you know your target is going to run away instead of confronting you, always drop a CB before they have the chance. Its cast is fast enough so that 90% of the time it comes off. Plus, you get the chance of a Wind Emblem proc.

 

Also...Frost Driver is even simpler than that. Start casting, keep your hands off your mouse, and you'll be guaranteed to finish your casting while they become sitting ducks. This works even with tedious graphics lag, but only if you don't manually control your character's camera. But, of course, it all comes down to choosing the right targets.

 

I've never had the problem of my targets running out of reach while I'm on my sorc. Sorcs have enough counters for that. The biggest problem I face is that I get focused; but being a class that does insane burst damage, it would be stupid of others to not target sorcs.

[rasterfahndung]

Your complaining about sorcs let me guess your a sin or a ranger XD

 

hehe, i dont know why rangers should complain about sorcs, i kill them as fast as they kill me. thats what i think is balancing.

based on that its just a matter of how u play and use your skills and how u made ur build.

 

after some colos i found out my targets and its like: wizard, ranger, rogue, sorc, knight, warrior (in that order)

i usually dont try on priest and bm cause they take way too long to kill them and are a pain in the a** when they chase u afterwards^^

monks are quite rare and do pretty much dmg so i dont like fighting them as well and what i dont like most about all is assassins.

always sneaking to u from behind and then ur taped on the ground forever until ur dead XD

 

in fact i dont look out for their gear. i dont care if they wear colo or not, cause i realized that doesnt make much of a change for me.

although i still dont have full colo and not even colo waepon i do quite the same damage as full colo rangers, thanks to my build.

and as long as i dont fail with my playing im doing quite good in colo XP

 

sadly i was 2nd in last round not long ago and a swordie won the colo. still dunno how he did that but i guess swordies are just OP.... XD

[ktbanh]

There's a huge reason why everyone is saying Sorcerers are overpowered.

 

They:

 

A) 1-3 Shot people, with balanced attributes in Colosseum

 

Outside Colosseum, they can one shot most anyone with a Critical, even without they still do a min of 2-3k damage.

 

Even A fully geared Wizard can down me when I have no 40% reduction for 10 seconds up even if i stay defensive, all it takes is a stun and it will chew past my regeneration from high heal and rev. All this comes from raw nuking power, because the game is centered around gear stats, most stats are the same.

 

Unlike Ragnarok 1, where you can have a specifically vit-base priest that can at least tank insane damage but obviously lack offensive. (At least when I use to play RO1 when it was month to month payment)

 

So in comparison, you have most everyone with PVP gear (excluding cash items and cheats e.g. extra health) come in around 6-7k hp. 7k hp for priests with buff, 6~ for those without, but obviously those with VIP and massive cash items with rune slots will cheat out of it so we won't consider it.

 

So once again, lets recap, for those that have PVP gear, everyone ends up around 6-7k HP with no cash item and self-buff excluding tanks.

 

All it comes down to now is how much damage can you dish out, and how much can you negate, e.g. if you can negate the damage taken through heal.

 

As a consensus its tough to survive a combo from sorcerers, even if you do survive, they can wait, rinse and repeat.

 

In the amount of time, you'd have to wait through stun before you can react and heal yourself.

 

 

------

 

The core reason why they're OP is because stats are all the same, so it comes down to damage.

 

Sorcerers have the highest damage burst and they have the strongest single quick heal along with regeneration and not have to spec heal.

 

They can swap between offensive and defensive (while getting healed when spamming defensive heal seal) without any slow-down. e.g. like a priest using sacrament to increase heal by 10%, he/she would have to wait 3-4 seconds due to gimpy animation.

 

When you cap out around 7-8k hp outside Colosseum, sorcerers can do even more damage than they do in Colosseum due to stat balancing.

 

They have more crit, more damage, more raw power.

 

Don't even get me started on those who have +7 or higher weapons, the Crit amount is insane, even without crit, the base damage is at the very least enough to chisel down 30-50% hp.

 

This is why people consider them OP.

 

Its like trying to fight a guy with a machine gun using a knife from distance with no cover. e.g. (casting through walls from tab-target) lol.

[Chizzmaks]

There's a huge reason why everyone is saying Sorcerers are overpowered.

 

They:

 

A) 1-3 Shot people, with balanced attributes in Colosseum

 

Outside Colosseum, they can one shot most anyone with a Critical, even without they still do a min of 2-3k damage.

 

Even A fully geared Wizard can down me when I have no 40% reduction for 10 seconds up even if i stay defensive, all it takes is a stun and it will chew past my regeneration from high heal and rev. All this comes from raw nuking power, because the game is centered around gear stats, most stats are the same.

 

Unlike Ragnarok 1, where you can have a specifically vit-base priest that can at least tank insane damage but obviously lack offensive. (At least when I use to play RO1 when it was month to month payment)

 

So in comparison, you have most everyone with PVP gear (excluding cash items and cheats e.g. extra health) come in around 6-7k hp. 7k hp for priests with buff, 6~ for those without, but obviously those with VIP and massive cash items with rune slots will cheat out of it so we won't consider it.

 

So once again, lets recap, for those that have PVP gear, everyone ends up around 6-7k HP with no cash item and self-buff excluding tanks.

 

All it comes down to now is how much damage can you dish out, and how much can you negate, e.g. if you can negate the damage taken through heal.

 

As a consensus its tough to survive a combo from sorcerers, even if you do survive, they can wait, rinse and repeat.

 

In the amount of time, you'd have to wait through stun before you can react and heal yourself.

 

 

------

 

The core reason why they're OP is because stats are all the same, so it comes down to damage.

 

Sorcerers have the highest damage burst and they have the strongest single quick heal along with regeneration and not have to spec heal.

 

They can swap between offensive and defensive (while getting healed when spamming defensive heal seal) without any slow-down. e.g. like a priest using sacrament to increase heal by 10%, he/she would have to wait 3-4 seconds due to gimpy animation.

 

When you cap out around 7-8k hp outside Colosseum, sorcerers can do even more damage than they do in Colosseum due to stat balancing.

 

They have more crit, more damage, more raw power.

 

Don't even get me started on those who have +7 or higher weapons, the Crit amount is insane, even without crit, the base damage is at the very least enough to chisel down 30-50% hp.

 

This is why people consider them OP.

 

Its like trying to fight a guy with a machine gun using a knife from distance with no cover. e.g. (casting through walls from tab-target) lol.

lmfao you made my day ^_^

[Chizzmaks]

There's a huge reason why everyone is saying Sorcerers are overpowered.

 

They:

 

A) 1-3 Shot people, with balanced attributes in Colosseum

 

Outside Colosseum, they can one shot most anyone with a Critical, even without they still do a min of 2-3k damage.

 

Even A fully geared Wizard can down me when I have no 40% reduction for 10 seconds up even if i stay defensive, all it takes is a stun and it will chew past my regeneration from high heal and rev. All this comes from raw nuking power, because the game is centered around gear stats, most stats are the same.

 

Unlike Ragnarok 1, where you can have a specifically vit-base priest that can at least tank insane damage but obviously lack offensive. (At least when I use to play RO1 when it was month to month payment)

 

So in comparison, you have most everyone with PVP gear (excluding cash items and cheats e.g. extra health) come in around 6-7k hp. 7k hp for priests with buff, 6~ for those without, but obviously those with VIP and massive cash items with rune slots will cheat out of it so we won't consider it.

 

So once again, lets recap, for those that have PVP gear, everyone ends up around 6-7k HP with no cash item and self-buff excluding tanks.

 

All it comes down to now is how much damage can you dish out, and how much can you negate, e.g. if you can negate the damage taken through heal.

 

As a consensus its tough to survive a combo from sorcerers, even if you do survive, they can wait, rinse and repeat.

 

In the amount of time, you'd have to wait through stun before you can react and heal yourself.

 

 

------

 

The core reason why they're OP is because stats are all the same, so it comes down to damage.

 

Sorcerers have the highest damage burst and they have the strongest single quick heal along with regeneration and not have to spec heal.

 

They can swap between offensive and defensive (while getting healed when spamming defensive heal seal) without any slow-down. e.g. like a priest using sacrament to increase heal by 10%, he/she would have to wait 3-4 seconds due to gimpy animation.

 

When you cap out around 7-8k hp outside Colosseum, sorcerers can do even more damage than they do in Colosseum due to stat balancing.

 

They have more crit, more damage, more raw power.

 

Don't even get me started on those who have +7 or higher weapons, the Crit amount is insane, even without crit, the base damage is at the very least enough to chisel down 30-50% hp.

 

This is why people consider them OP.

 

Its like trying to fight a guy with a machine gun using a knife from distance with no cover. e.g. (casting through walls from tab-target) lol.

 

lmfao you made my day its so funny ^_^

 

Edited by 5323130618183626000, 17 July 2013 - 10:23 PM.

[rasterfahndung]

They can swap between offensive and defensive (while getting healed when spamming defensive heal seal) without any slow-down. e.g. like a priest using sacrament to increase heal by 10%, he/she would have to wait 3-4 seconds due to gimpy animation.

well wether they deal dmg or they heal themselves. when they deal dmg its time to deal dmg, when they heal up its time to deal dmg, when they heal with lor or deluge and meanwhile deal dmg its time to deal dmg.
some try to do both at the same time (healing while attacking), but i havent seen one surviving that yet, at least not in colo in front of my bow with 2 falcons on their ass XP
indeed pretty OP^^

so the core question is: how much dps can u do? and thats a matter of skill (playing skill / knowledge)

[NiaAdha]

well, it's GM's classes. they wont nerf it.

we wont hold for 4 sec with a sorc and a ranger. hands down, ranger is the fastest killer.

[NiaAdha]

I truly wish that this was the case.  In PvP, Rangers are OP in both PvP ad PvE and Priests are OP in PvP.  They need to be nerfed is anything.  Sorcs are not OP.  It is one of the balanced characters compared to Priests and Rangers.

 

come again dude?

 

we only crit around 3300+ with ray of genesis. the best we can do is kill steal. it needs a long casting time. not to mention we're slow. we can never kill in 1 or 2 hit, or less than 4 seconds for that matter.

 

we dont have sorcs 7k++ crit or rangers 2k++ every hit and you wanna talk nerf with us?

 

go in front of a mirror dude. i find it funny if a ranger or a sorc whines. sorcs are the one that should be nerfed. if we have some buff to double our ray of genesis to 7k++, then u're allowed to talk about nerfing priest. pfft-

[Pooksie]

I agree, Rangers are OP but still doesnt match a Sorc simply because you burst so fast, and those heals really get you through tough situations.
Whereas as a Ranger you just die. 

[Gluttannie]

Not to mention a sorc can continuously cast/heal inside Deluge, while a priest has to choose between either staying in sanc or to cancel and use another spell (even potting would cancel Sanc).

That's why you don't see Sanc come off very often in colo but there are always Deluges near round end.

It also boggles me that they decided to give one skill (Varetyr Spear) insane burst damage and the ability to stun, and a cool down that is on par with a lot of the other "stun/knock down only" skills.

[Zechrem]

The inbalance lies where pve crosses into pvp. That is why most pvp centered games that use a "versus player" skill modifiers and mechanics to balance pvp. Yes there is a lot of luck involved and there will always be inherent rock vs paper vs scissors mechanics to classes, but when you consider skill rotation / cooldowns / skill effects there is a heavy inbalance towards some classes.

 

The reasons priests seem op is because (in colo):

1. Sometimes no one botheres targeting them allowing them to dot / RoG last few hp to rack up kills.

2. Healing is continuous and discourages priests being targeted, add pots and you are in a losing battle of attrition (unless you interrupt their coloceo / assumption with a stun and you happen to crit your attacks ALOT.... well unless your a sorc then its just 2 lucky crits to freedom).

 

Sorc really are op though... (argument of getting jumped on by multiple classes applies to everyone)

1. cold bolt slow is always available and procs instant cast spells at chance

2. frost diver immobilizes for 6 seconds (and now with update they get even more free pot shots) with the cooldown being so low that you could cast it again BEFORE it even runs out (even if you say well the 2nd one is only a 3 second freeze that essentially 9 seconds of sitting there)

3. Instant cast ranged stun skill with high crit modifier that can be used on an active double dmg buff or frozen target.

- Basically gives you the ability to lock down an opponent if they start anywhere past 7meter range as you have 9 seconds of freeze, a few seconds of slow and 3 seconds of stun on a class that can rotate its skills in 15 seconds. Add animation delay and you basically have a one sided fight unless you miss (which applies to both sides on missing).

 

Rangers have a steady stream of dmg and fast movement, one on one they truly have the best potential for pvp. Their fast attacks and movements allow them to pump dmg and with a high lvl of poison arrow they can essential pick off targets (especially when the cd of the skill is so ridiculously low). With the new trap / freeze mechanic they can get free hits on any class for 6 seconds since traps do not miss and can easily be placed on top of people.

In terms of one vs one on melees they shouldn't ever lose given enough room exists in the area to maneuver (when you add a fight with potions this is becomes more obvious).

 

Add the fact of the horrendous in game position lag and u see a heavy inbalance set between classes when you compare players of equal skill.

Edited by Zechrem, 18 July 2013 - 08:14 AM.

[loneknives]

Vote buff melee class, Beastmaster, Warrior, Monk, Knight to balance the game ~_^

[rasterfahndung]

to make a long story short: OP for me means unbeatable and thats just not true...

[Tofumaro]

This belongs here.

 

 

<3 the OP Sorc.

[elvenne]

OP is not unbeatable, OP means overpowered (=too strong, unbalanced)

[rasterfahndung]

OP is not unbeatable, OP means overpowered (=too strong, unbalanced)

i know the correct words, and usually too strong leads to be unbeatable or not suvivable, thats what i meant

[NiaAdha]

as for what has been discussed, OP means when you can kill in 4 seconds or 2-3 hits. even suckier when 1 hit deals with 80% of hp cap. (7k hit to 8000++ hp cap.)

[2204130521212213647]

Sorcerer OP? No. Next.

Edited by 2204130521212213647, 18 July 2013 - 02:56 PM.

[Adamage]

Sorcerer OP? No. Next.

 

Sorc Player.

 

 

If you played on a sorc, and seriously think killing someone in 2-3 attacks is not overpowered, you are probably the same kid that used cheat codes to beat every game and bragged about it the next day.

[rasterfahndung]

as for what has been discussed, OP means when you can kill in 4 seconds or 2-3 hits. even suckier when 1 hit deals with 80% of hp cap. (7k hit to 8000++ hp cap.)

i dont know what sorcerers hit u, those who hit me for now needed at least 6 or 7 hits to kill me... pretty much time to do sth against them as far as my pc and game allow me to act XD

Edited by rasterfahndung, 18 July 2013 - 07:07 PM.

[coded]

What if they had AOEs like in RO rather than heal? or both + a link from pally O_O

Edited by coded, 18 July 2013 - 07:32 PM.

[Rafnex]

try fighting a GOOD sorc in WoE map with only your 5k-7k HP (non tank class)

 

and tell me your story

 

 

Edited by Rafnex, 18 July 2013 - 08:51 PM.

[5391130503175245443]

Vote buff melee class, Beastmaster, Warrior, Monk, Knight to balance the game ~_^

I agree to vote on melee def buff or range buff!

 

BTW, Monks need a serious buff, though.  What kind of a martial artist hits and move so slow???  The only way to do somewhat decent in colo is to go tanking...wait....no one wants a dps monk in a party either, huh?  So monk players are pretty much out choices?

Edited by 5391130503175245443, 18 July 2013 - 09:02 PM.

[2204130521212213647]

Sorc Player.

 

 

If you played on a sorc, and seriously think killing someone in 2-3 attacks is not overpowered, you are probably the same kid that used cheat codes to beat every game and bragged about it the next day.

 

Try playing with sorcerer first.

 

You can  kill people with 2-3 skills, but only if you're lucky and crit on varet and jt. (considering you froze the target or have that lucky wind seal buff)

 

If the target parries, or it misses, or any defense skill is used, you end up defenseless.

Edited by 2204130521212213647, 18 July 2013 - 11:07 PM.