249 replies to this topic

[Feuer]

Its been too many chances made ... This shows the game was not built for quite along term. It chances every time people complaining about it . Im speechless ... Seems so unprofessional making changes on the game so often .... I prefer the team made the new maps or something

 

Lol? You should see the list of complaints Blizzard gets when they add / change / remove something. Talk about "sweet marry christ tap dancing backwards naked through a corn field while playing zippiddy doo-dah on the bagpipes". Yea, it's that crazy. 

[pdfisher]

Lol? You should see the list of complaints Blizzard gets when they add / change / remove something. Talk about "sweet marry christ tap dancing backwards naked through a corn field while playing zippiddy doo-dah on the bagpipes". Yea, it's that crazy. 

 

This. ROFLMAO!

[Feuer]

Fisher you need to update your sig lol, those DC issues are so last year

[jerremy]

Ok, so I know you don't like changing things around too often, so I don't expect much to happen as of yet, but I'm just going to leave this here for future consideration.

 

Cannon bourgs:

 

Spoiler

This class, while not particularly underpowered, isn't very sought after cause it doesn't offer much to group play aside from AoE damage. And when it comes down to that, it even loses out to other AoE classes like the champion (which it should, as a ranged class should be doing less overall damage than a melee), the dual raider (unless it doesn't AoE often) and the mage (also understable, given most classes have lower magic than physical defense). One of the most prominent reasons why they're not very desirable as ranged AoE's is because their casting times are so horribly slow that some other classes out there could do three skills by the time the cannon bourg is done with one. But because it only has damage to offer right now, it really isn't a very viable class in most PvP situations. Especially so since it is incredibly weak in 1v1 situations. I would say slightly improve the skill powers across the board, but we already have enough damage only classes *ahem* raider *cough*.

 

So let's take a look at the debuffs that this class offers. First off we have a 5%+50 AoE mspd down on cannon blast. Why movement speed? Sure moblity is important, but the amount of movement speed downs that the game has is high enough as it is. Not to mention this movement speed down loses out to that of the champions/mages/dual raiders. And if cha isn't high enough it also loses to the scout. In other words, it doesn't really have much of a point to have this movement speed down, and it really provides nothing to the team at all.

 

Next up we have a single target 5%+100 def down on loaded barrel. All in all it's not bad, but it really isn't that great and massively loses out to the defense down of the champions and dual raiders.

We also have a 5%+30 AoE def down, but about this one the same can be said as the single target version, but even worse.

 

The only really useful effects are the cannon stun burst (which is unreliable at 30%, but as an AoE this is tolerable) and the burn (which is short and in the end is only damage, which we're not looking for here).

 

So here's a few possible suggestions:

 

1)Overall increase of skill powers by 10%. A slight increase in damage to make up for the fact that it doesn't really have much to offer other than damage, and focus on that so that it does actually offer enough damage to be viable, without making the class overpowering.

 

2)Increasing the critical damage passive in the bourg tree to 25%, to end up with 95% rather than 90%. A similar suggestion to the first, also making the class more based on damage and damage alone.

 

3)Change the debuff effects on the two mentioned AoE's. Movement speed and defense downs are already offered by two or more classes, so the cannon bourg should be given another status down which is slightly less prevalent to make them have something else to offer rather than just straight out damage. So here's what I propose:

 

Cannon blast: Remove the movement speed down effect. In return, add a 10%+6*skill level attack power down. The attack power down status is only offered by the champion, so having an attack power down effect can be useful. Note that it loses to the ap down effect of berserker's cry, but berserker's in return has no damage and can only be cast at melee range, which is why cannon blasts attack power down effect is weaker.

 

Schrapnel burst: First of, this effect is far too weak for the duration and cooldown of this skill. If you want to keep this a defense down, it needs a good boost. But as I mentioned before, strong defense downs are already offered by both the champion and the dual raider (of which the dual raider especially outclasses the cannon bourgs by miles). Rather than keeping it a defense down, why not make it a crit down? A crit down would be quite a lot more useful in group situations than a weak defense down which gets bested by a random no charm champ's berserker's cry. Replace the defense down with a 5%+25 critical down. This would be helpful to make not only yourself but also allies crit more often against their targets. The only classes which currently offer crit down are the raider and the axe champ, but both are only single target. An AoE crit down would fit the cannon bourg class as an AoE supportive damage dealer.

 

Bow scouts:

 

Spoiler

All in all, this class is pretty balanced. Can do some good damage with their mixed barrage of normal attacks and skills, and can do some impressive damage if they land crits. The scout tree, however, is incredibly linear. While there are a decent enough amount of available skills, most are kind of.. useless.

First of, we have aimed shot, double arrow and triple arrow. Double arrow and triple arrow have a somewhat OK amount of skill power, but the skill just takes so strenuously long to cast that they're not worth it. Aimed shot takes even longer to cast and has even less damage, this skill is by far the most useless thing I've ever seen. As aimed shot and double arrow are hawker skills, we'll leave those aside, but the triple arrow skill needs some love. If at all possible, increase the casting speed, or make it so that the three arrows are shot all at once, not one after another. It's mainly this that causes it to take so long to cast.

 

Another thing I would like to point out is the impact arrow skill. This skill is impressive for its massive skill power ratio, and with it comes a long cooldown (slightly too long in my opinion, but still fine). However, I don't really understand the point of the PvP impact arrow skill. Stuns are nice and all, but with a 30% success chance it's merely a gamble and not worth it, given its long cooldown. Either increase the stun chance to 40%, but this leaves another problem. With how fast paced combat is, stuns are incredibly overpowering and I'd rather not see so many stuns in the game. 

It seems impact arrow always forces a crit, hence its long cooldown and casting time. I'll still say that 30% is too low of a gamble to be worth investing in though, up it to 40% please.

Also, the casting time is as strenuously long as aimed shot/double arrow/triple arrow. Is the skill power/forced crit really worth a casting time of four times as long as skills like phoenix arrow?

 

Next up, we have fire, ice, wind and poison arrow. While they cast relatively fast, the skill power is so low that you can do just as much or even more by using auto attacks. I'm not sure what you're planning to do with the elemental system, but with how low the skill powers are, and how unreliable the system seems, it doesn't seem like anyone would want to use them, even when it is in place. The poison arrow skill has that poison effect, but in fact no one really wants to use it. The reason being, the burn effect of phoenix arrow by far trumps the poison, especially with how fast paced combat is people will choose a short term high damage DoT over a slow but long one. Not to mention cause of the ability to recast, in 20 seconds one can fire three phoenix arrows, and have a higher accumulated DoT than the poison did. So no one really wants to use this skill either, as DoT's can't override eachother. Here's a few suggestion that may make these skills more desirable:

 

1) The first possibility would be to increase the base skill power on all four of them by 20%. This would put them at 140% skill power, which still isn't the greatest, but it makes them slightly more reliable and more useful.

 

2) Move fire, ice and wind arrow to the scout tree, increase their skill power by 40%. This would put them at 160% skill power and is an alternate suggestion similar to the first one. A lot more reliable than 120%, but I'm not sure how it pays out. But it's one of the possibilities.

 

3) Leave the fire, ice and wind arrow as they are, boost poison arrow to 140% skill power. However, add a new skill, namely the following:

 

Elemental mana arrow

Skill power: 100%+10%*SkillLvl +200+10*SkillLvl.

Magic targeted skill. Element: Sorcery

Cooldown: 8 seconds. Cast cost: 25% of max MP.

Skill requirements: Fire arrow (5), Ice arrow (5), Wind arrow (5), Poison arrow (5).

 

This would be the ultimate elemental skill for the scout, combining the four elements you know to create a substance similar to pure mana. The thing that defines this skill is that is a fast casting (same animation as the other element arrows) magic attack. Magic attacks can be incredibly devastating depending on the target, and could mean quite a lot. As such, this skill has a drawback, which is its incredible mana cost. If you aren't careful and use this skill too often, you may find yourself in MP troubles. I'm not sure how it would play out in real combat, as this is purely theorethical, and as such some things may need to be altered.

 

I'm aware you probably have your own plans already, but perhaps you could take these suggestions into account for future implementation.

 

Edited by jerremy, 31 March 2014 - 07:10 AM.

[pdfisher]

Cannon blast: Remove the movement speed down effect. In return, add a 10%+6*skill level attack power down. The attack power down status is only offered by the champion, so having an attack power down effect can be useful. Note that it loses to the ap down effect of berserker's cry, but berserker's in return has no damage and can only be cast at melee range, which is why cannon blasts attack power down effect is weaker.

 

I really don't want to lose my mspd down. I use my bourg for doing SoD a lot, and many times, there is no champ in the group. So my mspd down, is the only one there. This comes in mighty handy for that judge dude.

[Leonis]

i just want to know how many games did both attacker and defender got FS clerics..just curious, since all of the games i have played don't have a cleric on one side

I mentioned this before, there's no way to truly identify a full support cleric without a large amount of checks, so we don't track it. But Clerics, as a class, are one of the more frequent classes to appear on average in a game on either team side.

 

is there manual patch for this update?? my client can't patch it then suddenly closing it..

Check that you don't have an anti-virus program interfering with the patch client.

 

Iam not sure if iam in the right topic for this . but what happend to scout skills?
I see grey skills in scout list for scout? Is this still a bug or something?

 

That's an mistake and will be corrected next patch.

 

I just noticed that I can't cast my PVP Mana Burn on the Crystal (CD)

 

The "PvP" has a "player only" listing, which makes the Crystal an invalid target. We will consider the idea of changing this in the future, but for now that's why it wont' work on the Crystal.

 

 

jerremy, those are some great ideas We'll keep them in on hand and in consideration when we're doing more to the other classes for the next round of class enhancements.

[jerremy]

I really don't want to lose my mspd down. I use my bourg for doing SoD a lot, and many times, there is no champ in the group. So my mspd down, is the only one there. This comes in mighty handy for that judge dude.

If it's for kiting around, you also have launcher smash which is 80% mspd down. Although I guess with the limitations melee and short duration, that the longer duration AoE one might be useful, although weaker in effect.

But alright, if you insist on wanting the mspd down, why not leave it there, and add the attack power down I suggested on another AoE, like Fire in the hole.

[Phish]

As Jeremy said the secondary status effects on launcher skills are really minor (I'm referring to the status effects influenced by charm). On defense down status effects this is partially an issue with all classes overall but the bourgeois really stand out.

 

Because defense scales so slowly and at high level the defense value for players and monsters gets to be a high number overall. Most of the time being the highest stat value-wise sans hp and mp sometimes. 

 

Look at Shrapnel burst: 5%  + 30 defense down. Even if you go with a crazy charm build (say 450 con 450 charm) thats only going to equate to 5% + 210ish defense down. Practically nothing when enemies have over 4k defense, (often times much higher depending on the class). And the difference between lowering their defense by 100 with a charm build won't even do anything. 

 

Launcher Bourgeois shouldn't have powerful debuffs, but something a little stronger wouldn't hurt. Though I do feel most secondary effects on defense down skills are too low.

 

[jerremy]

The only skill that really stands out as a powerful defense down in my opinion is the PvP circle break with 10%+200. All the other ones are kind of meh. Maybe champs def down is somewhat relevant cause of its 15% base, but the cha scaling part is rather obsolete. (I think it was 50? Not sure but that's still not to the point where it actually makes a grand difference even if you get a lot of cha, for which you have to sacrifice quite a lot in return)

Edited by jerremy, 27 March 2014 - 01:53 PM.

[Nifa]

Just checking, was it intentional to give us the 24hour skill and unique skill resets but not the 24hour stat reset?

[MidnightSmurf]

I mentioned this before, there's no way to truly identify a full support cleric without a large amount of checks, so we don't track it. But Clerics, as a class, are one of the more frequent classes to appear on average in a game on either team side.

 

What about the raiders? When I've played they have been a minimum of 4 in my team up to 8 at most. But that's my games, what about the overall?

[Nifa]

All we get are completely stealthed teams now...usually you'll see 4-7 raiders, a bow scout here and there, maybe a champ or two or bc or (*gasp*) a knight, and then if you are really really lucky, you'll get an fs. Of course this just means that the fs is left completely out in the open for all the other stealthed enemies to gang lol.

[jerremy]

How to counter raiders 101:

 

[DestinyDeoxys]

[jerremy]

Were any of them dual raiders?

[DestinyDeoxys]

Of course no, any dual raiders are not serious player, they are just pure tryhards

[Nifa]

It would appear that this morning, everyone has decided knights and anything not raider is the way to go to counter all those raiders. Just one extreme to the next~

[jerremy]

Actually my dual raider is pretty serious. Sometimes. Usually just trolls the -_- out of people with accu and mspd down, then dances as katar raiders can't land a single hit with their horrible accu.

[ChickenBucket]

As Jeremy said the secondary status effects on launcher skills are really minor (I'm referring to the status effects influenced by charm). On defense down status effects this is partially an issue with all classes overall but the bourgeois really stand out.

 

Because defense scales so slowly and at high level the defense value for players and monsters gets to be a high number overall. Most of the time being the highest stat value-wise sans hp and mp sometimes. 

 

Look at Shrapnel burst: 5%  + 30 defense down. Even if you go with a crazy charm build (say 450 con 450 charm) thats only going to equate to 5% + 210ish defense down. Practically nothing when enemies have over 4k defense, (often times much higher depending on the class). And the difference between lowering their defense by 100 with a charm build won't even do anything. 

 

Launcher Bourgeois shouldn't have powerful debuffs, but something a little stronger wouldn't hurt. Though I do feel most secondary effects on defense down skills are too low.

 

Tru. as a faithful Launcher Bourg, Launcher bourgs are like ignored completely(like always)

[SlowBob]

I'm seeing duals more often in CD again, about that screenie with all those raiders, this happened to me only once right after the patch so far + the team just lost since protecting the cleric with that many katars is impossible.

[lisent]

10 Gold bar =10m=150im points?can you make it more value plz?(st-patricks lucky box)or can chang in premium point?

[IAfjiBa]

Hello!

 

I have find out that Cure (First Heal) does 1 debuff. Purify at lvl 1-5 1 debuff . Cure has a cooldown on 2 sec. I dont know but I am sure Cure has a lower cooldown than Purify at lvl 5. So what I mean is that Purify is a waste to learn, if you dont wanna learn to mute. Cure is better than Purify I guess? So if you could make so Purify 2 debuff or make so Cure has like 30% chance to debuff or make so cure has a longer cooldown so Purify is more worth it to learn.

 

[lisent]

eggs event spawn too slow, many times run around valley of luxem tower not seen 1 egg yet.

[Feuer]

Tru. as a faithful Launcher Bourg, Launcher bourgs are like ignored completely(like always)

 

.... nah. Leonis has posted several times now that the reason they haven't been updated yet is because there were vastly more complaints about raiders, clerics mages then any other classes. Not only that but the skills + systems they wanted in place for the bourg's updates weren't ready by the time the rest of the other classes were. The same was for the traps, those weren't ready but the scouts still got the other portions of their update.

 

Next on the block are Artisans, Bourgs, Knights, Champs. 

[IAfjiBa]

Eggs can disipear for some sec and then come back, I guess its like that to make it harder.