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Choosing between Sorcerer or Warlock


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#1 Hardc0re

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 11:49 AM

Hi there, I'm leveling a mage in iRO (my first char here, haven't played Ragnarok for more than 10 years back, 2-2 classes didn't even exist when I stoped, only 2-1).

 

I played all first classes to level 20 or so and the mage playstyle is the one I most enjoyed.

Yes, I know these playstyles will probably change drastically when I reach 3rd job but I had to start somewhere. So, mage class it is.

 

My mage is currently 35/35 with no zeny and no gear (account is new and I don't know anyone so no borrowed stuff and I basically can't buy anything usefull)

Now I have 15 job levels to decide if I want to be a Warlock or a Sorcerer (by becoming a wizard or a sage), can you help me?

 

My way of playing is basically:

- Solo player. Yes, it's an MMO, but I enjoy playing solo most of the time, so I would never play something like Full Support AB, I need to be able to hold my own in this game. Of course I won't play solo 100% of the time, but most of it, yes.

- PvP. I don't care if my leveling experience is hell, I want to be able to do decently in PvP (by that I mean both KvM/WoE and the regular PvP rooms. Since I'm a solo player, I'm pretty sure I'll spend a lot of time in the PvP rooms). I want to do WoE but I don't know if I can keep up with the schedule of it, so I guess i'll be playing PvP and BGs way more than WoEs

- Creative play. I like to do "random fun stuff" in the game. I don't want to just use the most damaging spell over and over and over, let's say I also enjoy "playing with my prey".

- Overpower/Underpower. I really don't mind if a class is the best or the worst in the game, as long as I can have fun with it. I'm reading these forums and everyone is saying that Warlocks are crap. If they are crap, but they are fun and compliments my way of playing more than a Sorcerer, so Warlock it is. So please don't let the current state of the classes be the judge here.

 

So, based on these points, wich of the 2 classes would best compliment my way of playing, and why? Please elaborate instead of just saying "warlock" or "sorcerer", it'll help me a lot!

 

Thanks in advance and sorry about my bad english.


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#2 GreenIvy

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 01:24 PM

Solo:

Both can solo leveling. However having a married Soul Linker will be much more efficient, especially for Sorcerer. And making a Soul Linker only for Kahii doesn't take much time. 

 

A huge component of iRO is Turn In. Both Warlock and Sorcerer won't have much difficulty finding a party to do it. Sorcerer is a little more popular in demand than Warlock is.

 

I'm not saying you should only do Solo leveling or Turn In. I just think it will eventually come to a point that you are bored with TI or Solo.

 

PVP:

Depends on what role you want to play. I think Sorcerer is more fun to play with in PVP. A debuff Sorcerer requires less expensive gears. If you want to kill someone with a mage class, you will need high-end gears. In that case your decision will depend on how much money you want to invest.

 

Creative play:

As far as I know, Warlock can solo Bio 3 and 4. Spell fist Sorcerer can solo some easy MVP. Caster Sorcerer can do a lot of stuff too. 

 

Sorcerer is more popular in demand in Endless Tower party thanks to soul exhale and magnetic earth. Warlock can tank many MVP with white prison. 

 

Overpower/underpower

I have to agree with many others that Warlock is underpower compared with not only Sorcerer but also other classes.


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#3 miliardo

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Posted 28 April 2014 - 10:40 PM

+1 ^

We'll said sorcerer first then make wl when got the gears for it and can try both see what like best

In my experience wl is a fun troll char and can do some dmg in pvp with tetra and little gears, but sorc is all around a lot more fun

Sorcerer not only got a lot of disabling skills, but good offense, and can build yourself a good def all around best char most flexible char
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#4 Hardc0re

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Posted 30 April 2014 - 10:06 AM

Anyone else?

My mage got job50 yesterday, it's time to make a decision :o


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#5 Tofu

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Posted 30 April 2014 - 10:43 AM

I'd say sorc.

Sorc is not nearly as reliant on other support classes to perform well, as a warlock is, so it'll perform better (and be more fun) in pvp as a solo player.


One aspect of sorcerers that I actually find really fun is their summons. The two I find the most interesting:

Ventus:
-can give you instant cast (any level)
-can make you sprint super fast (level 1)
-can create a 3x3 area protection from 90% of all attacks (level 3)

Aqua:
-can protect you from death once (level 1)
-can double the proc rate of Crystalization from Diamond Dust (level 2)


It's fun to watch a sura sprint up to you, cast an instant Gfist for 200k+ damage on you, and then laugh at them when they see all they've done is kill your level 1 Aqua.


I find it's much easier to solo MVPs as a sorc too. As long as you have at least level 2 of every element, you're capable of killing (or at least hitting) most MVPs, because your psychic wave can become 5 different elements (Neutral, Fire, Water, Wind, Earth). I used to solo Scaraba Queen on my sorc, using the fire summon.



And also, Sorcs feel less "spammy" than warlocks. Warlocks have a bunch of hard hitting spells, but in most cases, one of them is going to be clearly better than all the others in that instance. Sorc spells, on the other hand, are not as "bursty" as warlocks', but you rotate through your spells to maximize your DPS. So as an example, my rotation for my sorc on scarabs was:

Psychic Wave -> Varetyr's Spear -> Diamond Dust -> Varetyr's Spear

If you're fighting something that isn't immune to earth, it'd look more like:

Psychic Wave -> Diamond Dust -> Varetyr's Spear -> Earth Grave


If you've got a TON of cast delay reduction, you can squeeze quite a few VS's in there before your psychic wave cooldown finishes.


Sorcs also have a few more survivability tools than warlocks (Blinding Mist for ranged damage reduction, Extreme Vacuum to immobilize, Arullo to sleep target, Magnetic Earth to protect from AoE magic or ground effects)
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#6 Hardc0re

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Posted 30 April 2014 - 12:13 PM

Can level3 summons cast level1 summon's skills?
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#7 GreenIvy

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Posted 30 April 2014 - 12:29 PM

Can level3 summons cast level1 summon's skills?

 

no. and you can only have one summoned spirit in presence 


Edited by GreenIvy, 30 April 2014 - 02:40 PM.

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#8 Hardc0re

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Posted 30 April 2014 - 07:28 PM

Too bad :(

 

Well, anyway I'm trying to become a Sage now. Damn that quest is annoying! Need stones, elemental arrows, and now I'm stuck because I need Holy Water and no one is selling it =/


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#9 Tofu

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Posted 30 April 2014 - 08:48 PM

I've always found it strange that you literally need multiple people to complete that quest. A thief, archer, and aco to job change a Mage.

There are some vending now, if you still need it.
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#10 Hardc0re

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Posted 30 April 2014 - 09:04 PM

Yeah I got it, time to get to 99 and then go level 1 again... oh god


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#11 Hardc0re

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Posted 02 May 2014 - 08:38 AM

So I finally become 2nd class with my first char, and now I'm a Sage.

I'm really enjoying the class, specially the Free Cast, Cast Cancel and Magic Rod skills, seems like a very versatile character.

 

I have some questions about the class:

Elemental Change: It has 4 different skills, one for each element. The wiki says you can only learn one, is that right? When you chose one, are you forever stuck with that change, even after reborning?

Important question on Elemental Change: Can I cast this skill on players (including myself?)

Magic Rod: Is the chance of reflecting the spell 100%? Regardless of skill level?

 

Thanks in advance!


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#12 GreenIvy

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Posted 02 May 2014 - 08:54 AM

You can only learn one elemental change.

 

Magic Rod is useless. It's only effective towards single target magic (like monster's fire bolt, but not storm gust). And you have to cast it at the exact moment when monster's already casting on you but the magic hasn't hit you yet. It's too hard to execute. 


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#13 Tofu

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Posted 02 May 2014 - 09:10 AM

You can't use Elemental Change on players, only monsters.

Magic rod is really nice for high level monsters, like Kathryne Keyron. It's difficult to use it on players, however, because very few player used spells are single target. Tetra Vortex and Chain Lightning are the only ones I can think of off the top of my head.

But yes, assuming you do time magic rod properly, it works 100% of the time regardless of its level.
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#14 Hardc0re

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Posted 02 May 2014 - 10:05 AM

Nice, I guess Magic Rod it cane be some fun in PvP against Warlocks.

 

Too bad you cant use Elemental Change on yourself :(

I was already thinking of using it (Fire) on myself and then use Volcano/Fire Insignea. So it's more of a PvM thing then.

 

These skills that can't be cast on players, like Elemental Change, can they be cast on players pets? Like the Ranger's Warg, a Homunculus or my own Elemental? Or are they considered players as well?


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#15 Tofu

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Posted 02 May 2014 - 10:30 AM

Wargs aren't "pets" the same way homuns or sorc summons are. Wargs are untargettable, have no hp/sp bar of their own, and don't actually take up a cell on the spot they stand on.

I've never tested monster only skills on pets, but I have a feeling they are considered players as well. I can test that later today.
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#16 Hardc0re

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Posted 02 May 2014 - 12:58 PM

Wargs aren't "pets" the same way homuns or sorc summons are. Wargs are untargettable, have no hp/sp bar of their own, and don't actually take up a cell on the spot they stand on.

I've never tested monster only skills on pets, but I have a feeling they are considered players as well. I can test that later today.

 

Ooooh ok, so Wargs are basically the same thing as the Hawks before them.

It would be logical for Homunculi and Summons to be considered players yes, but this is certainly not the game where logic is applied the most, I gonna test it too if I can. But so far i'm enjoying Sage a lot :)


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#17 Mulder1

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Posted 02 May 2014 - 09:24 PM

Warlocks are more fun to play... that being said, you need experience to use a warlock at its fullest.

 

As Vierna and other said, perhaps as beginner, you may want to chose Sorcerers that are relatively easier to play and level; then, after you gained necessary experience, you can start playing Warlock and enjoy it better.


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#18 Gyges

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Posted 02 May 2014 - 11:20 PM

Warlocks are more fun to play... that being said, you need experience to use a warlock at its fullest.

 

As Vierna and other said, perhaps as beginner, you may want to chose Sorcerers that are relatively easier to play and level; then, after you gained necessary experience, you can start playing Warlock and enjoy it better.

 

the only things left for Warlock are White Imprison and Stasis, that cannot be resisted so far.


Edited by Gyges, 02 May 2014 - 11:21 PM.

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#19 Mulder1

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Posted 03 May 2014 - 02:06 AM

the only things left for Warlock are White Imprison and Stasis, that cannot be resisted so far.

 

Those 2 spells actually can be resisted to a certain level.


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#20 Hardc0re

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Posted 03 May 2014 - 01:04 PM

Well, I'm already a Sage, and I won't play this game so much as to have more than a high level char, so from now on I'm stuck at Sorcerer.

Warlocks seems kinda fun too I agree, but so far I'm enjoying my Sage skills. But the professor ones looks a million times better/more fun so I'm also looking forward to reborn... I'm still level 75 tho...


Edited by Hardc0re, 03 May 2014 - 01:05 PM.

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#21 Hardc0re

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Posted 03 May 2014 - 08:09 PM

One question about summons: Can you control WHEN they do their attacks?

 

For instance level 3 Ventus:

 

Spoiler

If I see a Sura casting a level 10 GoH on me, can I command Ventus to cast Zephyr, so it'll protect me? Do you controll the skills like Homunculus' skills rr are the summon's skills casted at random?


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#22 Tofu

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Posted 04 May 2014 - 10:27 AM

You don't control Summons like you can control a homun. You use the skill "Spirit Control" to command your spirit.

 

There are really only 2 things you can do that's useful:

 

Spirit Control 1: Put them into passive mode. This grants you their passive bonus (-1s fixed cast on all spells with a ventus)

Spirit Control 2: Instantly activate their defensive ability (Zephyr, with ventus 3, water screen (sacrifice) with aqua 1)

 

Spirit Control 3/4 are not worth getting, as the damage the summons do is pretty lackluster. The summons are powerful for the passive effects/active defensives they give, not their damage output.

 

 

Oh also, your summon can only be in one mode at a time. So for example, if it's currently in Passive mode, and you use Spirit Control 2, the passive effect ends, and the defensive skill activates.


Edited by Tofu, 04 May 2014 - 10:41 AM.

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#23 Hardc0re

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Posted 04 May 2014 - 11:11 AM

Oh okay, so If I click Spirit Control 2 while controlling level 3 Ventus, she'll activate the "Zephyr" skill instantly right? Is there some kind of delay?

What happens If she is alredy in defensive mode and I click Spirit Control 2? Is she going to use Zephyr or nothing gonna happen?

 

Sorry about that large ammount of questions, but I really like to learn everything in detail to plan my gameplay :o


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#24 GreenIvy

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Posted 04 May 2014 - 04:46 PM

If she is already in defensive mode and you click spirit control 2 again then nothing will change. 

 

level 3 ventus

Zephyr

  • Defensive Mode: Creates a 3x3 cell barrier of Wind on the summoner. Within the barrier it increases Flee rate by 25 and blocks ranged attacks. Also has a small chance to nullify incoming damage. Stacks on Blinding Mist and Safety Wall, but does not work on Magnetic Earth.

 

It says "within the barrier", which means you can't leave the 3x3 cell barrier.


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#25 Hardc0re

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Posted 04 May 2014 - 05:25 PM

So if I want Zephyr castd again, I'll have to change to another mode and then get back to Defensive, got it.

 

Where can I find the cooldown of the Summon's Skills? Irowiki does not have them.


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