135 replies to this topic

[Gojio]

Its hazardous to say scout damage was too high...aside from impact arrow the other skills tickle..

[LexLoyalty]

Exactly. That is why I was/am supporting the DEV team to reduce the damage output of the scout and raider. The scout and raider were tooooooooooo powerful. We need to give every classes a fair change in war. But what I want more than reducing the damage output of the raider and scout is fixing the stun animation. Give other classes an equal change in war, please.

 

axe champ isnt op still ?

[mongetet]

Mage for one will utterly wreck any knight especially if it's a CC mage. 

 

Im guessing you havent seen a knight with full lumi,mdef sets. Even the stacks from fire element wont hurt it

[iMatt]

In general, scout is not weak. Speaking from someone, who was being attacked by scout in war, the damage I received from being hit by the scout is not weak nor strong. What I hate the most is not the damage. What I hate the most is it's stun. When I get hit from the scout, my character is unable to move for about 1 second (without having the stun status). The duration is not long, but the attack speed of the scout is more than enough to cover the short duration. If I was attacked by 2 scouts, I can forget about moving, all I can do is waiting to die, regardless of being champ or cleric. The situation will not change even if I max out sense or dodge (I tried both). I saw the situation repeated over and over again in many CD that I had joined. In fact, I saw the entires team was hold up by just 2 scouts. They dealed massive damage, and you guy complained about damage output being reduced. What I am real want is seeing the DEV Team to remove or fix the stun animation when we are being hit by the scout. Seriously, it is annoying and frustration when there is nothing we can do but waiting to die.

 

could say same when 2 axe champs hit my scout tho - the thing is for doing what 2 scouts do you just need 1 axe champ. the problem of you being stuck in a stun might come from a bad connection which means a massive delay?

[LexLoyalty]

An axe champ that spams skills is way more op than a scout with 1 impact + axes got high def and hp.

[ChampPower]

could say same when 2 axe champs hit my scout tho - the thing is for doing what 2 scouts do you just need 1 axe champ. the problem of you being stuck in a stun might come from a bad connection which means a massive delay?

Agree, but I can run away from 2 axe champs when I see them because they have short range and relatively slow. However, with the scout and raider, I cannot do so. The scout has range. I was hit, stunned, and locked to the ground before I could do anything. The raider, in other hand, is too fast for me to out run it. On too of that, it has cloak and stealth. I will be in the never-ending cycle of sleep, stun, critical, and die without a chance to do anything. It is seriously frustrating, and some of you said they are balanced. What is the balanced you are talking about? Total domination balance?

[iMatt]

well if you heva really problem with raiders movementspeed you play wrong -  i know plently of good champs that go like 2000-2200 mspeed and still 3shot targets - so if runspeed is your problem you really do something wrong.

This is what champ means at the moment; and asking for buffing it can't be your serious opinion:



btw I will remove this video later its just to show you how unbalanced champs are

 

 

[LexLoyalty]

Agree, but I can run away from 2 axe champs when I see them because they have short range and relatively slow. However, with the scout and raider, I cannot do so. The scout has range. I was hit, stunned, and locked to the ground before I could do anything. The raider, in other hand, is too fast for me to out run it. On too of that, it has cloak and stealth. I will be in the never-ending cycle of sleep, stun, critical, and die without a chance to do anything. It is seriously frustrating, and some of you said they are balanced. What is the balanced you are talking about? Total domination balance?

 you play it wrong

[Gojio]

That dictator's laugh l0l

Edited by Gojio, 08 November 2014 - 12:39 PM.

[ChampPower]

you play it wrong

Agree if you are assuming I have the opportunity to do something about it. The deal is I do not even have the opportunity to do anything about it in war. The raider popped up from nowhere and I was stunned, slept, critical, and died. The scout shot from undisclosed location (with stealth and distance), and I will be stunned, locked to the ground, and died. I do not even have the opportunity to run away or fight back. Frustrating? Yes, you bet.

[Feuer]

Im guessing you havent seen a knight with full lumi,mdef sets. Even the stacks from fire element wont hurt it

 

I'm guessing you've never fought a proper CC mage. you dont go fire for CC, you go sorc/light and a few frost. And you get the mdef pierce passive. even if that knight stacks mdef, it won't do a damn ting against aural + mdef pierce stacks. and when its muted/stunned/rooted/aspeed constantly, GG. I played his CC build in the tourney for the hell of it, and until I fought a BC [which i think are currently the best 1v1 class] I wrecked everything, including a knight. 

[mongetet]

I'm guessing you've never fought a proper CC mage. you dont go fire for CC, you go sorc/light and a few frost. And you get the mdef pierce passive. even if that knight stacks mdef, it won't do a damn ting against aural + mdef pierce stacks. and when its muted/stunned/rooted/aspeed constantly, GG. I played his CC build in the tourney for the hell of it, and until I fought a BC [which i think are currently the best 1v1 class] I wrecked everything, including a knight. 

 

I'm saying even if you go fire. Fire stacks wont help you and the nerf on aural pierce isnt helping at all. The pvp tourney is irrelevant as they cant even gem themselves with opal. There were no oro accessories opal 7 and 75 mdef substats on bs and I dont even know if some of those knights ever though of wearing a lumi. 1 vs 1, bc is not as good in pvp as you think. I have seen bc's get wrecked a lot of times. Doesnt mean u lost to bc make bc a strong class  in 1 vs 1 but if they take heals thats a diff story though

Edited by mongetet, 08 November 2014 - 05:25 PM.

[Phish]

well if you heva really problem with raiders movementspeed you play wrong -  i know plently of good champs that go like 2000-2200 mspeed and still 3shot targets - so if runspeed is your problem you really do something wrong.

This is what champ means at the moment; and asking for buffing it can't be your serious opinion:



btw I will remove this video later its just to show you how unbalanced champs are

 

 

This is a bad example.... This was with Bugged Berserk that gave 90% enhance damage, and before the old damage change. Plus with full stat buffers damage people are stronger overall.

[iMatt]

it is an example that underlines my point in a very extreme way - just linked it to shut any attempts of "buff champs" down anywhere because they really do not need any buffs offensive wise (even if i would love to see sprint again).

[ChampPower]

it is an example that underlines my point in a very extreme way - just linked it to shut any attempts of "buff champs" down anywhere because they really do not need any buffs offensive wise (even if i would love to see sprint again).

Agree, you should not worry about it. I am very down to Earth. I do not request for something ridiculous. I am only asking for everyone to be fair and objective. Currently, I do not think we need to do anything for the champ, but I do think we need to do something about the scout and the raider to give other classes an equal chance to do something about the raider and scout.

For the scout, fix the stun lock, reduce the critical rate, and reduce the attack speed are necessary because we could not move when we faced the scouts. How much should we reduce? I do not care as long as we can move. It is seriously frustrating to see our characters to be locked to the ground by the scouts, without the abilities to do anything about it.

For the raider, increase the cold down of sleep and stun skills as well as reducing the critical rate along with removing / fixing the stun animation (from being hit by critical) are necessary. Some attack speed should be adjusted as well. Give us some way to break out of the never-ending cycle of stun-sleep-critical-and die. I do not care how the DEV Team does it as long as we have some fighting chance because we cannot break out of that cycle at the moment.

[mongetet]

Agree, you should not worry about it. I am very down to Earth. I do not request for something ridiculous. I am only asking for everyone to be fair and objective. Currently, I do not think we need to do anything for the champ, but I do think we need to do something about the scout and the raider to give other classes an equal chance to do something about the raider and scout.

For the scout, fix the stun lock, reduce the critical rate, and reduce the attack speed are necessary because we could not move when we faced the scouts. How much should we reduce? I do not care as long as we can move. It is seriously frustrating to see our characters to be locked to the ground by the scouts, without the abilities to do anything about it.

For the raider, increase the cold down of sleep and stun skills as well as reducing the critical rate along with removing / fixing the stun animation (from being hit by critical) are necessary. Some attack speed should be adjusted as well. Give us some way to break out of the never-ending cycle of stun-sleep-critical-and die. I do not care how the DEV Team does it as long as we have some fighting chance because we cannot break out of that cycle at the moment.

 

That is too much for the bow scout. I have no bowscout but reducing attackspeed and critical for them is too much dont you think. Have pity on that class. They die easily and cant almost pvp other classes.. Seriously bow scouts are not much of a threat if you take them down first.. If you are a champ just hit em but if they run, dont chase them. Thats what happens in war. Thats their advantage. The range and surprise attack. Axe has crits, knights are tanky then bowscouts are like that..

 

I dont know about the raiders but because of the nerfed damage to all classes, they lose a bit of their firepower too. What should be addressed are the clerics, knights and xbowscouts that are outright crazy in cd's pvps because theyre so tanky as a result of the reduction in damage from all classes.. I saw 3 buffed raiders and cant even kill an unbuffed cleric...
 

Edited by mongetet, 08 November 2014 - 10:26 PM.

[ChampPower]

That is too much for the bow scout. I have no bowscout but reducing attackspeed and critical for them is too much dont you think. Have pity on that class. They die easily and cant almost pvp other classes.. Seriously bow scouts are not much of a threat if you take them down first.. If you are a champ just hit em but if they run, dont chase them. Thats what happens in war. Thats their advantage. The range and surprise attack. Axe has crits, knights are tanky then bowscouts are like that..

I dont know about the raiders but because of the nerfed damage to all classes, they lose a bit of their firepower too. What should be addressed are the clerics, knights and xbowscouts that are outright crazy in cd's pvps because theyre so tanky as a result of the reduction in damage from all classes.. I saw 3 buffed raiders and cant even kill an unbuffed cleric...

Agree, that is why I leave the adjust rates to the DEV Team. All I am asking for is the ability to move, so I can run or fight back when facing the scouts, instead of being locked to ground and killed like a possum.

The same to be said for the raider, but I have to admit that, in the last 6 months to now, I have not seen any cleric (buffed or not) would not die when it is attacked by raider(s). I am not saying that you are incorrect. I am only saying that I have not seen it yet.

[mongetet]

Agree, that is why I leave the adjust rates to the DEV Team. All I am asking for is the ability to move, so I can run or fight back when facing the scouts, instead of being locked to ground and killed like a possum.

The same to be said for the raider, but I have to admit that, in the last 6 months to now, I have not seen any cleric (buffed or not) would not die when it is attacked by raider(s). I am not saying that you are incorrect. I am only saying that I have not seen it yet.

 

Um there was this unbuffed cleric. she has full gems damage deduct and with the recent reduction on overall damages. in the first place katar has low ap then that cleric has high blockrate.. she was just healing herself..
 

[bl0b]

Agree, you should not worry about it. I am very down to Earth. I do not request for something ridiculous. I am only asking for everyone to be fair and objective. Currently, I do not think we need to do anything for the champ, but I do think we need to do something about the scout and the raider to give other classes an equal chance to do something about the raider and scout.

For the scout, fix the stun lock, reduce the critical rate, and reduce the attack speed are necessary because we could not move when we faced the scouts. How much should we reduce? I do not care as long as we can move. It is seriously frustrating to see our characters to be locked to the ground by the scouts, without the abilities to do anything about it.

For the raider, increase the cold down of sleep and stun skills as well as reducing the critical rate along with removing / fixing the stun animation (from being hit by critical) are necessary. Some attack speed should be adjusted as well. Give us some way to break out of the never-ending cycle of stun-sleep-critical-and die. I do not care how the DEV Team does it as long as we have some fighting chance because we cannot break out of that cycle at the moment.

We might aswell just kill off the scout class so no one plays them any more, if you nerf scouts even abit, that's what's going to happen. Scouts weren't in the best shape before the damage nerf, now it just made them worse. You suggesting reducing the crit on supposedly "crit classes" is like saying reduce the effect of berserk on champs. And, wow, reduce attack speed? any idea how that sounds? while we at it, let's make give champs 100% stun resistance and crit resistance too...

 

From what I understand, you play champ and cleric right? *I can forget about moving, all I can do is waiting to die, regardless of being champ or cleric*  and you don't play axe champ otherwise you wouldn't be complaining of the crits (correct me if I'm wrong). Sword champs have pierce defence, and if you pay attention, you'll notice sword champs can do more damage with  most of they skills (this is without crits) than a bow scouts does with the 20 second cooldown "Overrated" impact arrow (a crit). Here you complaining of being crit'd, wear a luna set, the soldier class actually have that option unlike other classes. You might not believe this, but the scout tree does not have a single crit passive, critical damage yes, but no crit. As for clerics, I'm assuming support cleric, you don't have crit. You are going to be crit'd, alot, they is no avoiding it, usless you build crit which isn't worth it for a support cleric. Even then they are still the tankiest class after knights, only difference is that clerics have heals to make up for it. 

 

Maybe it's just me, but from your posts that I have read[Posts from the past], you have always been against scouts from the very beginning, first it was crossbow scouts are too strong or something or the other, now you seem to have included bow scouts and raider too. I can't really tell if you're just against the hawker class in general or if you just want the soldier class or whatever class you play to be Stronger. I play scout, you don't see me or other people suggesting nerfs on the classes we don't play(unless something is really out balanced), do you?, I ( as a scout) don't know what other classes go through so I tend to not comment on them, I don't go around saying nerf gun bourgs cuz they kill me in 2 seconds, or nerf champs cuz they do too much damage. Here you are suggesting nerfing other classes because you don't play them. Of course no one is gonna suggest nerfs on they own class either, but here, I'de suggest you play the other classes and see what they have to do to survive ( maybe you do, or have played these other classes, in that case you probably wouldnt be suggesting nerfs on them).

 

P.s. Don't get me wrong, I mean no offence or disrespect, but you suggesting nerfing a class just because 2 bow scouts kill you, that's wrong. 

Edited by bl0b, 09 November 2014 - 01:25 AM.

[ChampPower]

We might aswell just kill off the scout class so no one plays them any more, if you nerf scouts even abit, that's what's going to happen. Scouts weren't in the best shape before the damage nerf, now it just made them worse. You suggesting reducing the crit on supposedly "crit classes" is like saying reduce the effect of berserk on champs. And, wow, reduce attack speed? any idea how that sounds? while we at it, let's make give champs 100% stun resistance and crit resistance too...

From what I understand, you play champ and cleric right? *I can forget about moving, all I can do is waiting to die, regardless of being champ or cleric* and you don't play axe champ otherwise you wouldn't be complaining of the crits (correct me if I'm wrong). Sword champs have pierce defence, and if you pay attention, you'll notice sword champs can do more damage with most of they skills (this is without crits) than a bow scouts does with the 20 second cooldown "Overrated" impact arrow (a crit). Here you complaining of being crit'd, wear a luna set, the soldier class actually have that option unlike other classes. You might not believe this, but the scout tree does not have a single crit passive, critical damage yes, but no crit. As for clerics, I'm assuming support cleric, you don't have crit. You are going to be crit'd, alot, they is no avoiding it, usless you build crit which isn't worth it for a support cleric. Even then they are still the tankiest class after knights, only difference is that clerics have heals to make up for it.

Maybe it's just me, but from your posts that I have read[Posts from the past], you have always been against scouts from the very beginning, first it was crossbow scouts are too strong or something or the other, now you seem to have included bow scouts and raider too. I can't really tell if you're just against the hawker class in general or if you just want the soldier class or whatever class you play to be Stronger. I play scout, you don't see me or other people suggesting nerfs on the classes we don't play(unless something is really out balanced), do you?, I ( as a scout) don't know what other classes go through so I tend to not comment on them, I don't go around saying nerf gun bourgs cuz they kill me in 2 seconds, or nerf champs cuz they do too much damage. Here you are suggesting nerfing other classes because you don't play them. Of course no one is gonna suggest nerfs on they own class either, but here, I'de suggest you play the other classes and see what they have to do to survive ( maybe you do, or have played these other classes, in that case you probably wouldnt be suggesting nerfs on them).

P.s. Don't get me wrong, I mean no offence or disrespect, but you suggesting nerfing a class just because 2 bow scouts kill you, that's wrong.

Agree, the problem is not the damage. The problem is the stun animation when I was hit by the scouts. The scouts did not even need to use the stun skill, yet I was glued to the ground to do anything. You are also correct about me being hostile to the scout, and I still am because I was/am glued to the ground by the scouts. I was not kidding when I said that I once saw the whole team was stop by just 2 scouts when they glued the cleric and anyone tried to attack them to the ground. All I want is the ability to move, blob. Is that too much to ask?

[Charas]

high atk speed + high crit + good acc... on a target with no dodge + no crit + low mvt speed + probably a bad internet connection = crit lock

 

I very highly doubt 1 single scout could ever crit lock anyone.... but 4 scouts or raiders could definitly crit lock someone, if they all are on the same target. But imo, there s no problem at all with that.

[DestinyDeoxys]

high atk speed + high crit + good acc... on a target with no dodge + no crit + low mvt speed + probably a bad internet connection = crit lock

 

I very highly doubt 1 single scout could ever crit lock anyone.... but 4 scouts or raiders could definitly crit lock someone, if they all are on the same target. But imo, there s no problem at all with that.

 

If you want to run off, click on a location far away once, then don't do anything else. Otherwise, if you spam click to run off, you will get the stun lock, because every time you click, you reset the client and server coordinates.

In my opinion, critical knockback only exist for clients, it doesn't exist for server side.

[Feuer]

I'm saying even if you go fire. Fire stacks wont help you and the nerf on aural pierce isnt helping at all. The pvp tourney is irrelevant as they cant even gem themselves with opal. There were no oro accessories opal 7 and 75 mdef substats on bs and I dont even know if some of those knights ever though of wearing a lumi. 1 vs 1, bc is not as good in pvp as you think. I have seen bc's get wrecked a lot of times. Doesnt mean u lost to bc make bc a strong class  in 1 vs 1 but if they take heals thats a diff story though

 

Yes i also couldn't gem myself for attack power, so the effects were fair.

 

Look my point was, using fire passives + skill on a knight is the LEAST optimal to kill them. Fire Mastery won't help it either. What I was saying is that you evaluated the best case scenario [sorc mastery] when representing your idea that knights have no counter, or at least your implied message that knights have no counter due to recent changes. This is false, and I was merely suggesting a better way for you to kill them. Also, Mage's are not the only way to kill a knight. 

[bl0b]

I can't believe you, a champ, is and complaining about scouts... should be vice versa.

[kwayan19]

they nerf aural piece from mages, now their damage is puny and die in 1 to 2 hits... you didnt see me complaining... more nerfs pls