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#51 Ahya

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Posted 13 May 2015 - 06:16 PM

With right timing and proper teamwork that has 30 k mp can easily be killed. What if those mages also have right timing and proper teamwork?

 

A duo or trio of mages have to be lucky to land those stun. Thing is they dont need to land those stuns. The mdef down is aoe. Almost no one will wear full mdef just for the aoes of mages. Even if they never hit a critical it will land 3-5 k or even higher in earnest

 

To take the risk to spam manashield. How long is the animation on manashield with virtually 2.5 sec cooldown. I don't see any risk there. As a mage I can just play it safe. Land 2 aoes, manashield again, 2 aoes then manashield again. Doesn't seem too risky especially if there are other allies of the mage and of course with their cleric. In actuality if you are up against 2-3 mages with decent allies and decent cleric, thats the time you will know.

 

Look we are not killin the mage class or saying nerf this nerf that. Remove that mentality that everyone is on a blood brawl. I said I used a katar raider and I'll admit the dodge is out of proportion especially with stat buffs and duals but what I'm saying is the manashield should be gradual in effect.

 

A lot of people here seem to be looking for blood that much. If leo says lower my dodge, I dont care I already know with enhanced reflexes buff, the dodge will have to change. Sooner or later everything will change and that is my own personal opinion and I think theres a lot who agrees with me too, so to each his own

 

Then whoever has the better timing and finer teamwork will claim victory. :P

 

If a mana shield mage can cast 2 aoes before having to mana shield again, it means the enemy isn't paying enough attention to him. It can also mean that the mage has 2-3 clerics on his team supporting him.

 

When you're up against 2-3 mages with decent allies and a decent cleric, then the composition of your team will also be at play. It always depends on the roster and the manuevering, which I know that you recognize.

 

I've tested the full mana shield mage, and it's quite tanky given the right team. Faced with a good enemy however, I find survival not as easy, though not as virtually impossible as before.

 

I concur. To each, his own.


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#52 LunaXavier

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Posted 13 May 2015 - 06:22 PM

Yeah Katars are more broken LOL. They have everything now, better defense, higher dodge, enough accuracy to hit a mage, high crit, atk spd, i call that op. They can stealth and run away to pot when hp is low. Mages when got stunned, can die within that duration of stun when 2-3 raiders gang on it without even being able to recast mana shield. Mages only have high ap,high mana shield, high accuracy and thats pretty much it. Raiders got waaaay more advantage just on stats. Not to mention their crit stacking yet... Try to think logical before crying something is op. 6k-7k dodge with 5k-6k def(which is almost similar to almost other classes defense due to new damage reduction Curve) on raiders is just broken already.

 

Note that there is no damage cap on mana shield, which means by crit, a single raider can do 10k dps per second. a 30k-50k mana shield can be easily broken with just 2 raiders. Or just mute it for 5seconds, dead mage there already ._.


Edited by LunaXavier, 13 May 2015 - 06:28 PM.

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#53 thetrangdamvn

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Posted 13 May 2015 - 06:42 PM

:heh:   :heh: I'm a PvM katar  :heh:   :heh:  


Edited by thetrangdamvn, 13 May 2015 - 06:42 PM.

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#54 irresistablechic

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Posted 13 May 2015 - 06:47 PM

Axe damage, Raider dodge, Manashield and Third Eye time to use the nerf hammer

 


The manashield having no damage cap is imo senseless. Only axe can hit above the damage cap anyway


Edited by irresistablechic, 13 May 2015 - 06:46 PM.

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#55 thetrangdamvn

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Posted 13 May 2015 - 06:55 PM

Axe damage, Raider dodge, Manashield and Third Eye time to use the nerf hammer

 


The manashield having no damage cap is imo senseless. Only axe can hit above the damage cap anyway

Don't forget about dual raider and burn katar raider.

I can do up to 30-35k (crit) with both classes.


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#56 helloitsme

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Posted 13 May 2015 - 06:57 PM

Scouts too if used properly
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#57 irresistablechic

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Posted 13 May 2015 - 07:01 PM

Don't forget about dual raider and burn katar raider.

I can do up to 30-35k (crit) with both classes.

 

Damage cap is 1 hit and is limited to i think 35 percent of the total hp

 

Katar raider is attack speed right? Only people with insane attack power applies for the damage cap. eg axe champs

 

Exceeding damage cap on manashield is using 1 skill and dealing like 15-20k damage in just 1 hit, how can a burn katar raider exceed damage cap in 1 hit??


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#58 thetrangdamvn

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Posted 13 May 2015 - 07:18 PM

Damage cap is 1 hit and is limited to i think 35 percent of the total hp

 

Katar raider is attack speed right? Only people with insane attack power applies for the damage cap. eg axe champs

 

Exceeding damage cap on manashield is using 1 skill and dealing like 15-20k damage in just 1 hit, how can a burn katar raider exceed damage cap in 1 hit??

Damage cap in PvP is 45% of max HP.

Burn katar doesn't mainly rely on attack speed.

Katar raider has a advantage of reaching 180% crit damage ability.

He has high skill power (375% + a), which is only a bit lower than Bloody Assault of Dual Raider.


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#59 irresistablechic

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Posted 13 May 2015 - 07:25 PM

Can you send me a screenshot of that with the mage having honor gears +15. Sorry but i dont buy it even with that. If the mage has full gear even with 180 percent crit it cant exceed the damage cap in 1 hit. I doubt it coz there's no enhance damage for them.


Edited by irresistablechic, 13 May 2015 - 07:33 PM.

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#60 thetrangdamvn

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Posted 13 May 2015 - 07:42 PM

Can you send me a screenshot of that with the mage having honor gears +15. Sorry but i dont buy it even with that. If the mage has full gear even with 180 percent crit it cant exceed the damage cap in 1 hit. I doubt it coz there's no enhance damage for them.

:sob: I'm at work & I have no access to game. In addition, taking screenshots is such a boring and troublesome task that I refuse to do. Let's forget what I've said XD. I'm too lazy to discuss or prove anything.


Edited by thetrangdamvn, 13 May 2015 - 07:43 PM.

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#61 irresistablechic

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Posted 13 May 2015 - 07:57 PM

Its ok, Goodluck with your work!


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#62 KatsuraKujo

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Posted 13 May 2015 - 09:49 PM

Someone go take a video or something about mages being hit in pvp. 1 v 1 or cd or whatever. If these people want proof, then show it.

 

There's always a video editor incase you don't want people to see your skills, name and whatever.


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#63 irresistablechic

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Posted 13 May 2015 - 10:44 PM

Not just any video about the mana shield having no damage cap because I said only the axe has enough ap to hit above the damage cap. I wanna see a katar raider 1 hit and do damage exceeding the damage cap which is applicable in the mana shield


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#64 turnermanxi

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Posted 14 May 2015 - 12:02 AM

If you need a video it's obvious you never even played the class to understand it at all.  Make a mage, fund it, play cd/aa a few times, then come back and tell us how your experience was.


Edited by turnermanxi, 14 May 2015 - 12:02 AM.

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#65 irresistablechic

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Posted 14 May 2015 - 12:44 AM

If you need a video it's obvious you never even played the class to understand it at all.  Make a mage, fund it, play cd/aa a few times, then come back and tell us how your experience was.

 

How rude.. Have you even read what is being talked about? Like srsly. Its funny how people go on and comment but obviously didnt read anything at all. lol


Edited by irresistablechic, 14 May 2015 - 01:15 AM.

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#66 KatsuraKujo

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Posted 14 May 2015 - 01:22 AM

Just messed with a mage today (for pvm cuz i don't play pvp)

 

Cou and died many many times lol

The mana shield helped reduce the death and i kinda like it. If not i would have died 10 times more than i have. Note i died cuz i am a newbie using mage and its not properly geared yet.

 

Doing so, i can understand why the mages in pvp stages would be angry about someone crying over mage mana shield. Its not easy indeed. You have to manage aoe, and mana shield, and your health. It may not sound like much but its hard work, almost the same as the feeling of playing clerics in a way. Only this time on a character that deals damage.

 

Its not actually too convenient, my max mana shield was only 10k, and it didn't last long in dg being the fact that mage aoe happens to agro very fast, and well, COU has a lot of spiders lol. If i put it into pvp situations, dual, katar, champ, has enough skill power to break that 10k shield. But of course this is me not geared yet. I can see why people would want to go max mana. But it also sacrifices something for it. 

 

Again, this is just me, playing a class in pvm that i'm not familiar with, ungeared and not maxed. All this takes into consideration. Just leaving my thoughts about the class after i played it.

 

Agreed that its not too convenient, this even brings back the mages after like 2-3 months since the def scaling.

 

Peace! ^_^)v


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#67 irresistablechic

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Posted 14 May 2015 - 01:29 AM

Well sure if its 10k mana shield then its no problem but it makes a lot of difference if you have a big mana pool. As a mage you just have to play it safe then spam aoes.


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#68 zonyzony

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Posted 14 May 2015 - 01:35 AM

Played against my friend mage today

 

I can see as to why some people are hating on the manashield. There are some mages that are tanky but there are some that are not

I think that those that can utilize this skill properly is deadly while those who wont take advantage of the manashield are definitely managable. In the end its all in the playstyle and how to counter each other


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#69 KatsuraKujo

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Posted 14 May 2015 - 01:36 AM

Not exactly much different, take my situation, times 3 so about 30k (not max cuz i doubt it)

 

Just means 3 more extra skills for the classes i mentioned, and if players in CD don't focus on mage 1st, well then its teamplay problem ^^;

 

so if 40k, everyone focus on a mage, or half mage half cleric, those people that has high skill power + damage should hit mage, while the melee people or mute champs go after the cleric, while the other team tries to defend both of them.

 

40k, break it with 4-5 skills, mute, 5 secs later stun. There were have an almost dead mage.

 

Basically saying, team composition helps as well as teamwork. If you're a group of melee katar raiders and have absolutely no teamwork or skill power, you're better to just sit at spawn point lol


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#70 irresistablechic

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Posted 14 May 2015 - 01:57 AM

Not exactly much different, take my situation, times 3 so about 30k (not max cuz i doubt it)

 

Just means 3 more extra skills for the classes i mentioned, and if players in CD don't focus on mage 1st, well then its teamplay problem ^^;

 

so if 40k, everyone focus on a mage, or half mage half cleric, those people that has high skill power + damage should hit mage, while the melee people or mute champs go after the cleric, while the other team tries to defend both of them.

 

40k, break it with 4-5 skills, mute, 5 secs later stun. There were have an almost dead mage.

 

Basically saying, team composition helps as well as teamwork. If you're a group of melee katar raiders and have absolutely no teamwork or skill power, you're better to just sit at spawn point lol

 

Actually you sound like its like 10 people vs that 1 mage, but in reality it will be more complex than that because there are other enemy players and other mages that will join in the fray/ 4-5 skills mute, you should take into account that a good mage knows how to hide and know how to play it safe + there are other team mates out there right? There's no mage thats gonna stand there idly waiting for him to be targetted by everyone. Even if you kill that single mage, he will be able to dish out a large enough damage to warrant your team eliminated by whats left of the enemy. By the time you are able to kill the mage the enemy team has dealth enough damage to your team


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#71 KatsuraKujo

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Posted 14 May 2015 - 02:17 AM

Actually you sound like its like 10 people vs that 1 mage, but in reality it will be more complex than that because there are other enemy players and other mages that will join in the fray/ 4-5 skills mute, you should take into account that a good mage knows how to hide and know how to play it safe + there are other team mates out there right? There's no mage thats gonna stand there idly waiting for him to be targetted by everyone. Even if you kill that single mage, he will be able to dish out a large enough damage to warrant your team eliminated by whats left of the enemy. By the time you are able to kill the mage the enemy team has dealth enough damage to your team

Like i said, its a way to possibly counter, 4-5 skill is enough, so 1-2 champs. But ganging up on one mage would help more as it would/might increase the chances killing the mage.

 

Its not exactly hard to spot a mage, they are not far away, but far enough, and they are most of the time jumping into the air for their aoes. Just have to pay attention. Sure there are a lot of other players, i know. I can imagine a team with 1-2 mages, 1-2 knights, large number of katar raiders, and champs. 1-2 clerics on the 1 team.

 

And if this is the same on your side, then i see a fair fight, unless either team makes a mistake or by luck someone important (in this case, everyone in cd is important) dies. 

 

Also like what zony mentioned, not all mages are dependent on mana shield, in the end, its their playstyle and build of their mage.

 

Once again we are back to. Instead of argueing about it now without any sort of agreement, how about trying new ways to counter mages. Coming here, everyone is giving suggestions to how to counter and also telling their experiences with mages. 

 

Edited

If you're talking about mages from a katar point of view, then FINALLY i can understand why you want to discuss this. Like Feuer said, mana shield is a perfect counter for melee attackers but have no damage cap hitting it. Katar skills have high skill power (specifically the katar skills) which is almost the same as their counterparts, dual raiders, plus they BURN, like BURN HARD. Consider that =p


Edited by KatsuraKujo, 14 May 2015 - 02:23 AM.

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#72 bl0b

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Posted 14 May 2015 - 03:40 AM

Mages can die within that duration of stun when 2-3 raiders gang on it without even being able to recast mana shield. 

 Lol, you say this like every other class are able to survive whilst being attacked by two or more offence oriented characters, and mages should be able to survive too.

 

Other than that, raiders do have the best of everything.


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#73 Krizalis

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Posted 14 May 2015 - 03:45 AM

Don't forget about dual raider and burn katar raider.
I can do up to 30-35k (crit) with both classes.

dont forget abt cannon bourg.. They can do up to 27-28k crit dmg too ;)
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#74 helloitsme

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Posted 14 May 2015 - 04:36 AM

Cannon bourgs are like tankier version of mages... they are even deadlier
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#75 zonyzony

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Posted 14 May 2015 - 04:38 AM

Cannon bourgs are like tankier version of mages... they are even deadlier

 

Say it ain't soooo :bow:


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