61 replies to this topic

[Painkiller14]

I played with logging in and out from character select screen today. Not to reset the hourly clock, tho that sometimes happened too.

I was trying to understand why my attendance calendar would change during the course of the day; diamonds > seals > diamonds.

I still have no clue, tbh. It seems random. Each character has a different day count, and the days it counted would change as well.

Logging the same character repeatedly, I'd go from day 21, to day 28, to day 1, to day 9, all on the same character, same account.

Also, on that one character, it was diamonds when I started my day online, but went to seals, to seals to diamonds & to diamonds.

I was bewildered after logging in my 10 characters, in cycle, repeatedly, several times; so I gave up trying to understand the glitch.

Sorry I have no insight to help the GMs/Devs, but I am certain this is bugged. I'll make a ticket tomorrow. I'm sleeepy now. G'night.

 

 

Edit: Ticket made.

 

 

@Maxscha, it isn't just you. When I first login after 00:00, I get my usual daily attendance but when I login later during the day, the diamonds become seals and the seals become diamonds on other chars and the days get shifted as well. This kinda happens for everyone but most don't bother opening daily attendance window to check this weird change after the first login during the day. Even though the day of attendance gets shifted and the rewards are displayed wrongly, it auto-corrects itself when you login again after 00:00 the next day. I've been getting daily attendance on 3 of chars and it seems to be fine so far. I didn't relog one of my chars after 00:00 and just left it on for over 24 hours, so it didn't count that's day's attendance I think? because all my diamonds reverted to seals when I logged in the next day. 

 

Another think I find weird about the Loki cube reward system is that it just stops after the 2 hour attendance. But when I relog after a while It just resets and starts over from the beginning. Why not change it back to hourly?  Right now within an hour you get 3 cubes and you just need to relog to get another 3 cubes again.

Here's my proposed rewarding system,

1 hour - 1 cube

2 hours - 2 cube

3 hours - caps at 3 cube 

4 hours - 3 cube 

5 hours - 3 cube 

and so on...

This way players will remain on for 3 hours or more to get 3 cubes, which would be ideal for the server(more players online) rather than having people relog every hour or so to get 3 cubes. 

 

 

Sadly, it didn't autocorrect for me. I have played my 2 regular characters every day. I was logging in on the same one character every day till now.

I haven't missed a day of playing those two characters since this system began; and yet, this morning, it did not autocorrect to diamonds on them.

It's bugged (and not just visually). Just sayin'

___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

 

Also, I agree with Rider, the new not-hourly system is odd/awkward as-is. I am more likely to log out if during a 2 hour countdown, than stay online.

If the rewards increased over time, I'd more likely find stuff to do online, like helping new people thru dungeons, to round out the hour for the boon.

As it is, I am more likely to go afk to cook/eat/whatever offline, if during the 2 hour countdown, knowing I'd be more rewarded if I log in again later...

Seems this system is better for people playing multiple accounts, rather than playing multiple characters on one account. Others might prefer this.

Personally, I'll keep playing my one account.

Tho, perhaps offline more often. Just sayin'

 

I have the same issue with my main account, secondary and my brother account. Play with my accounts and kill monsters or farm something  and only log in with my brother account with the same character, and the same thing actually month and past month in all the accounts, when 9 day comes: 2nd, 3rd and 4th diamonds turn to Seal, but the first month i don't have this bug, and not only graphic issue, because the diamonds turn permanent to seals.

 

EDIT: Please fix the bug/issue soon. 

Edited by Painkiller14, 26 February 2016 - 12:00 AM.

[Greven79]

im okay with multi-purple slot for costume and acc.. the pvp-def player still can stick with their def build.. and the opposite still can maxed their pvp attack build.. 3% for both its still the same..
the pve player still can use +80 Runes

 

If you combine 17 CLS runes, you either achieve 51% damage reduction or 51% damage increase. The former means you take only half the damage. So how much more damage do you have to deal to negate half damage? Really +51%? Or isn't it more like twice the damage (i.e. +100%).

 

The disparity created out of the 3% bonus for both the offensive and defensive rune version was introduced to compensate other inbalances. Despite that, there is still another problem: The first strike issue.This means, classes who attack first get a greater advantage than classes with a slow or delayed attack, up to the point where the faster ones can oneshot other characters. And that's the reason why other players complained about additional rune sockets.

 

The former can be fixed by altering the way a total percentage is calculated. The latter however can only be solved either by lowering the percentages or the percentage difference: So this could also be a possible fix (at least as long as you exclude the typical issues around hitpoint recovery (heal skills)).

 

CLS offensive runes: 3% damage increase plus 2% damage reduction

CLS offensive runes: 2% damage increase plus 3% damage reduction

 

There are two other approaches to address this in a smoother way:

 

#1: values rather than percentages:

Similar to penetration, Gravity could replace the percentual bonuses with a fix value. I.e. +300pts per rune rather than 3%.

The corresponding percentual benefit can be controlled more easily and might include diminishing returns.

 

#2: Restrict CLS runes to (specific) non-purple rune slots:

Since WarpPortal already managed to remove off-hand seeds, it should be possible to repeat the process with CLS runes as well, preventing them from being tucked into purple rune slots again. Suddenly, the devs have many new options. F.e. they could restrict them golden rune slots, to particular gear parts only (weapon & chest piece) or even copying the element system, adjusting the granted percentage accordingly.

Edited by Greven79, 26 February 2016 - 06:05 AM.

[AdAbsurdum]

If you combine 17 CLS runes, you either achieve 51% damage reduction or 51% damage increase. The former means you take only half the damage. So how much more damage do you have to deal to negate half damage? Really +51%? Or isn't it more like twice the damage (i.e. +100%).

 

The disparity created out of the 3% bonus for both the offensive and defensive rune version was introduced to compensate other inbalances. Despite that, there is still another problem: The first strike issue.This means, classes who attack first get a greater advantage than classes with a slow or delayed attack, up to the point where the faster ones can oneshot other characters. And that's the reason why other players complained about additional rune sockets.

 

The former can be fixed by altering the way a total percentage is calculated. The latter however can only be solved either by lowering the percentages or the percentage difference: So this could also be a possible fix (at least as long as you exclude the typical issues around hitpoint recovery (heal skills)).

 

CLS offensive runes: 3% damage increase plus 2% damage reduction

CLS offensive runes: 2% damage increase plus 3% damage reduction

 

There are two other approaches to address this in a smoother way:

 

#1: values rather than percentages:

Similar to penetration, Gravity could replace the percentual bonuses with a fix value. I.e. +300pts per rune rather than 3%.

The corresponding percentual benefit can be controlled more easily and might include diminishing returns.

 

#2: Restrict CLS runes to (specific) non-purple rune slots:

Since WarpPortal already managed to remove off-hand seeds, it should be possible to repeat the process with CLS runes as well, preventing them from being tucked into purple rune slots again. Suddenly, the devs have many new options. F.e. they could restrict them golden rune slots, to particular gear parts only (weapon & chest piece) or even copying the element system, adjusting the granted percentage accordingly.

 

dude, you just make it complicated with other variabels... no matter you arguing, 3% for both its still the same... all you notes there are on outside "pvp increase decrease damage calculation"
its people benefit of their investment on multi slot purple runes.
do you still get 1 shotted in pf/mf? added more pvp dec !
you did maxed your pvp decrease but still get 1 shotted even with +20 on refinement? pump hardly on your HP
i did give a simple example.. its coloseum where cards, seeds and rune are not applied.. 
even w/o all of those, ppl still can 1 shot in coloseum. 
its just about unbalanced buffs and skills.
do you ever enter coloseum?
if you weren't, its always held every 14.00-15.00, 18.00-19.00 and 22.00-23.00 server time. 

[crafter4epics]

dude, you just make it complicated with other variabels... no matter you arguing, 3% for both its still the same... all you notes there are on outside "pvp increase decrease damage calculation"
its people benefit of their investment on multi slot purple runes.
do you still get 1 shotted in pf/mf? added more pvp dec !
you did maxed your pvp decrease but still get 1 shotted even with +20 on refinement? pump hardly on your HP
i did give a simple example.. its coloseum where cards, seeds and rune are not applied.. 
even w/o all of those, ppl still can 1 shot in coloseum. 
its just about unbalanced buffs and skills.
do you ever enter coloseum?
if you weren't, its always held every 14.00-15.00, 18.00-19.00 and 22.00-23.00 server time. 

 

3% is not the same if we compare an already imba class to a not - even if both have max runes/hones/cards. 3% pvp inc rune from a BT or penetration w/ a 100k-300k dmg is very large compared to a pvp useless char like ranger or wiz w/ average of 50k dmg. surely anyone won't use pvp def w/ these dps classes to counter each pvp inc rune of BT/penetration OP classes. would you like to use all pvp def to ranger or wiz to negate an all pvp inc BT or penetration class? you might also want some tests w/ BT classes for 1 shotting even by having full pvp def.

 

now pumping HP would be a solution but ro2 lacks +50 & +80 vit. add some WP rune remover sales & more money for WP/Gravity

 

colo is imbalanced also w/ these said classes w/ BT penetration. BT is a dmger who can tank, penetration is x4 w/ crit & hide(hider classes have crit buff 10% added by pump pills,etc)

[AdAbsurdum]

3% is not the same if we compare an already imba class to a not - even if both have max runes/hones/cards. 3% pvp inc rune from a BT or penetration w/ a 100k-300k dmg is very large compared to a pvp useless char like ranger or wiz w/ average of 50k dmg. surely anyone won't use pvp def w/ these dps classes to counter each pvp inc rune of BT/penetration OP classes. would you like to use all pvp def to ranger or wiz to negate an all pvp inc BT or penetration class? you might also want some tests w/ BT classes for 1 shotting even by having full pvp def.

 

now pumping HP would be a solution but ro2 lacks +50 & +80 vit. add some WP rune remover sales & more money for WP/Gravity

 

colo is imbalanced also w/ these said classes w/ BT penetration. BT is a dmger who can tank, penetration is x4 w/ crit & hide(hider classes have crit buff 10% added by pump pills,etc)

 

dat's my point... BT classes need to get nerfed.. there's so many Knigt/Warrior player either in Odin or Indonesian Server.. even my friend rename his folder onto Swordman Online instead.   

again, im agree with 2s/3s purple rune slot on costume and acc. Niflheim are coming, also with stronger mobs. we need more +80 runes for that.. don't we?

[KuroiKoneko]

just with mixed serenia\eddga set + full 3s purple slots costumes you can easily get 90% dmg reduc so add some dmg reduc hones and you immortal... (unless MoD and Raw Tlit, tho you can use armor rune and dmg reduc skill\buff)

[flukeSG2]

The corresponding percentual benefit can be controlled more easily and might include diminishing returns.

 

I would like someone on the ITS to test this, because I think CLS Damage Reduction runes already have diminishing returns just as defense does.  In fact I think that the Reduction runes are a modifier attached to our defensive stats.  I say this because I did a lot of in game testing on my knight to try and balance my reduction and increase stats.  Now I don't have my post-it notes I wrote my characters info down on but it was something along these lines, keep in mind these are not real numbers just representations of my findings on my knight.  With 50% reduction I took 15000 damage from Cross Impact, 53% I took 14500 damage, 56% I took 14250 damage, 59% I took 14125.  Like I said thats just representative, but it was along those lines.  If someone can test something like that on the ITS I'm very curious.  Some believe that if you reach 100% Reduction you will in fact take 0 damage, I however do not believe that is true.  I've attacked people with 94% Reduction and do quite a bit of damage and I cant believe that gap would close to 0 with the last remaining 6% they could get.

[crafter4epics]

a simple explanation of atk formula : pvp inc of atker is negated by pvp def by target also w/ power rune of dmger minus armor rune of defender lastly hitter's penetration over enemy's % defense. so i assume your pvp inc was 0% while attacking the 94% pvp def now we go for power over armor if both maxed -> power40 vs armor 25 makes a 7.5% deficit(7.5% is 20% dmg minus 12.5% from armor rune). and in some cases penetration is the killer. many ignores this but this stat is the best in the game & an obvious explanation would be the 1 shot hits of hiders even vs tanks. for formula just search the forums

 

 

damage minus reduction

• pvp inc - pvp def
• power rune - armor rune
• penetration - defense

 

[flukeSG2]

 

a simple explanation of atk formula : pvp inc of atker is negated by pvp def by target also w/ power rune of dmger minus armor rune of defender lastly hitter's penetration over enemy's % defense. so i assume your pvp inc was 0% while attacking the 94% pvp def now we go for power over armor if both maxed -> power40 vs armor 25 makes a 7.5% deficit(7.5% is 20% dmg minus 12.5% from armor rune). and in some cases penetration is the killer. many ignores this but this stat is the best in the game & an obvious explanation would be the 1 shot hits of hiders even vs tanks. for formula just search the forums

 

 

damage minus reduction

• pvp inc - pvp def
• power rune - armor rune
• penetration - defense

 

 

You would be assuming incorrectly, my damage increase was 67% when I attacked the SM with 94% reduction.  It was on my sin in both instances, so yes penetration does have an effect.  For a comparison my SM has no armor rune and no pvp reduction at all and has approximately same defense stats as the SM with 94% reduction.  I hit my SM for a critical of 132k, the SM with 94% reduction I hit for 66k.

[Chidorie]

 

oii mbam gila aja di nerf lagi BT
baru kena bash 26k doang kecil itu mah , lu HH jga penuh lagi
lah PR dotnya aja skrng ada yg sampe 10-11k oratio + credo, pake purple pot mana nutup eeq, ada CDnya itu pot 

 

 

he's talking about coloseum, you stup!  which priest DOT 10-11k at coloseum? plz visit coloseum once in a while would you? or rather... go and learn your english. pfffttt...

Edited by Chidorie, 27 February 2016 - 09:10 PM.

[RlDER]

dude, you just make it complicated with other variabels... no matter you arguing, 3% for both its still the same... all you notes there are on outside "pvp increase decrease damage calculation"
its people benefit of their investment on multi slot purple runes.
do you still get 1 shotted in pf/mf? added more pvp dec !
you did maxed your pvp decrease but still get 1 shotted even with +20 on refinement? pump hardly on your HP
i did give a simple example.. its coloseum where cards, seeds and rune are not applied.. 
even w/o all of those, ppl still can 1 shot in coloseum. 
its just about unbalanced buffs and skills.
do you ever enter coloseum?
if you weren't, its always held every 14.00-15.00, 18.00-19.00 and 22.00-23.00 server time. 

 

I believe you're missing the whole point of how this affects gameplay as a whole. Whenever a bonus to damage for PvP is provided, it doesn't simply balance itself out just by giving a counter of reduced defense. For instance, you're making those who prefer going DPS hit even harder than they already do and the rest who do not wish to go pure DPS are forced to go on the defense but sacrifice all possibility of increasing their own dmg even by the slightest because the total dmg intake has significantly increased due to all the bonus dmg modifiers. 

 

Which do you think is better balanced?

Having the option of stacking more damage modifiers and defensive counterparts. 

(or)

Not having as many damage modifiers and sticking to basic damage and defense stats.

 

Not to mention there is a ridiculous attribute that pierces defenses called penetration that already throws the balance off scale. How do you think this affects pvp balance when you have the option of stacking even more dmg over your defense piercing damage? 

 

If you have any concern for balance you don't go giving more dmg and defense bonus. Pure DPS classes are going to be able to boost their overall damage output stacked with penetration. Classes like assassin and rogue have a distinctive advantage here because they can hide and don't need to worry much about taking any defense so long as they can one shot anyone. Tank classes have the choice to go max defense if they want to survive the high damage intake but due to penetration that pierces all their defenses, they'd rather go full DPS and be able to one shot any class. Other classes that are non-tanks like Cres, Archer, Sorc, Wizard, Priest, etc do not have a choice here at all. Even if they try to counter these high damage with max defense runes, they are not going to be able to survive the high damage thanks to all these modifiers. 

 

In short, damage boosters puts certain classes at a much better advantage than the rest who are do not have any such advantage by maximizing their offense or defense. On the other hand, defense boosters do not give any class a distinctive advantage over the rest at all. 

 

In order to achieve better balance, you should be sacrificing something of equal value when you gain something. What do classes like assassin and rogue have to lose here when they already have the absolute advantage of remaining undetected and out of harm's way? 

 

My point is that when you gain something, you need to lose something of equal value or you shouldn't be given such opportunities in the first place and more purple seed slots does just that. Now if you add a restriction on each rune to make them balance each other out then it's a totally different story.

For example:

CLS (attack): 3% more dmg but lose 5% HP

CLS (defense): 3% reduced dmg and gain 3% more HP

 

Here defense rune sounds better than attack rune but then it is something that would benefit all classes unlike attack which isn't beneficial to all classes. DPS classes will have to work on a combination of attack and defense rune to be able to survive than go all out boosting their damage without risking any loss. 

[AdAbsurdum]

I believe you're missing the whole point of how this affects gameplay as a whole. Whenever a bonus to damage for PvP is provided, it doesn't simply balance itself out just by giving a counter of reduced defense. For instance, you're making those who prefer going DPS hit even harder than they already do and the rest who do not wish to go pure DPS are forced to go on the defense but sacrifice all possibility of increasing their own dmg even by the slightest because the total dmg intake has significantly increased due to all the bonus dmg modifiers. 

 

Which do you think is better balanced?

Having the option of stacking more damage modifiers and defensive counterparts. 

(or)

Not having as many damage modifiers and sticking to basic damage and defense stats.

 

Not to mention there is a ridiculous attribute that pierces defenses called penetration that already throws the balance off scale. How do you think this affects pvp balance when you have the option of stacking even more dmg over your defense piercing damage? 

 

If you have any concern for balance you don't go giving more dmg and defense bonus. Pure DPS classes are going to be able to boost their overall damage output stacked with penetration. Classes like assassin and rogue have a distinctive advantage here because they can hide and don't need to worry much about taking any defense so long as they can one shot anyone. Tank classes have the choice to go max defense if they want to survive the high damage intake but due to penetration that pierces all their defenses, they'd rather go full DPS and be able to one shot any class. Other classes that are non-tanks like Cres, Archer, Sorc, Wizard, Priest, etc do not have a choice here at all. Even if they try to counter these high damage with max defense runes, they are not going to be able to survive the high damage thanks to all these modifiers. 

 

In short, damage boosters puts certain classes at a much better advantage than the rest who are do not have any such advantage by maximizing their offense or defense. On the other hand, defense boosters do not give any class a distinctive advantage over the rest at all. 

 

In order to achieve better balance, you should be sacrificing something of equal value when you gain something. What do classes like assassin and rogue have to lose here when they already have the absolute advantage of remaining undetected and out of harm's way? 

 

My point is that when you gain something, you need to lose something of equal value or you shouldn't be given such opportunities in the first place and more purple seed slots does just that. Now if you add a restriction on each rune to make them balance each other out then it's a totally different story.

For example:

CLS (attack): 3% more dmg but lose 5% HP

CLS (defense): 3% reduced dmg and gain 3% more HP

 

Here defense rune sounds better than attack rune but then it is something that would benefit all classes unlike attack which isn't beneficial to all classes. DPS classes will have to work on a combination of attack and defense rune to be able to survive than go all out boosting their damage without risking any loss. 

it depends on your playstyle... im priest and i dont bother with cls def.. i can throw credo for 20k-25k dots on hider class even 14k on Knight classes.. yeah, i died a lot at pf/mf so what's wrong with that? i just need to respawn..
just realize your class, and match your role.  clothes armor are the lowest defense's rate.. eventhough, you still can survive from hider class.. ask chidorie above your post.


i said it once again, its people benefit of their investment (in these case penetration stat). its not easy to get high penetration number, right? even you have Osiris epic x5, that wont guaranteed you can dominate at pf/mf

just for comparison, there is so many imbalance buff in Indonesian server (F.e. Tiger Balm). Rogue with Condor Cards x5 can 1 shot knight only with that buff.. do we complaining? nope even once...

if you not prefer build for pvp def, then go for full DPS. that means you have low pvp def and be ready for enemies attack.. the problematic case is on Knight classes. even they build for pvp def, they still can deal high DPS cause of Battle Tactics.

i doubt that HP gain and HP lose will be balancing pvp mode. folks will be disappointed and leaving.. trust me..