104 replies to this topic

[YangeWenli]

Its for sure 2 secs Fixed Cast on IRO

[Sewasan]

Because F.U., Entweihen Crothen Card!

 

 

Going back to reality, what do you think of the Hero Magic Robe in comparison to the Diabolus Robe, Haseo? I didn't test it yet because... reasons... but I'd like to know your opinion nonetheless.

 

Better for Crimson rock, nothing else, i use to CR a lot but consider CR has a 5 sec cooldown, so is not by any means something you can spam, contrary to for example CL. I tend to use it as a finisher if doesnt one shot the mob im hitting, or as an opener depending on the element of the mob. beside that, the robe only adds 10 matk wich is not really noticeable with the no matk from Diab Robe. Now consider that with your TSOD, and some other gear the cast delay reduction is noticeable, but i dont know at what extent. Ill say that actually CR can do a lot of dmg (over 150k, without Crimson set) but im not sure if can compete on terms of DPS with CL because CL can be spammed and CR no, i mean you can release spells, but that is not totally reliable tbh when you are doing stuff beside TI.

 

Anyway i have one and i use it when i know i need to CR stuff, then i switch to my agav carded armor when im doing SE, basically i kept it on when im killing mob.
 

[Sigma1]

Old Magic Stone Hat reduce cooldown of Crimson Rock by 1 second and 0.1 second per refine.

 

 

Edited by Sigma1, 12 May 2016 - 09:15 AM.

[Sewasan]

Old Magic Stone Hat reduce cooldown of Crimson Rock by 1 second and 0.1 second per refine.

 

You cant imagine how much i want that hat to came to iRO (and sunflower boy also :v) xDDD, i've been following those updates since they came up on kro, but im referring to our current situation were, CR is by no mean as spamable as CL
 

[Kusanagisama]

Yeah, but CL has a long delay... On the one hand, if you doesn't stack delay reduction gears, it's as spammable as CR, though it can be greatly reduced by Strings. On the other, you have CR's unspammable burst. I use CR exactly like you, and that's why I kept the Hero Magic Robe in my storage, accumulating dust there. XD

 

I'm really thinking of selling it, but I wanted the opinion of more experinced players before doing so.

 

It seems good for Sorc, though, but my to-be Sorc (isn't even a Scholar yet XD) won't be able to use it for a veeeeeery long time...

[Ashuckel]

Crimson rock has 5s cooldown while CL has 3s cast delay, they deal aproximated damage single target when not amped(amp is better for CR than is for CL). Due to their reuse times, in a period of 15s you can use 3x CR and 5x CL, so CL wins dps wise. It's also boosted by Elviras up to 40%, CR dont have that type of card yet.
If you use a diabolus robe and a +12 TSOD, means you have 28% cast delay reduction, and now in that 15s window you can cast CL 7 times.

Edited by Ashuckel, 12 May 2016 - 10:08 AM.

[Sewasan]

Well, semi-true, on 10 seconds you can do 3 CL and 2 CR so, still better DPS, because the global delay of CL is 3 seconds with no cooldown, and CR still has that long 5 sec cooldown that cant be reduced, so is 2 burst hits of 150+ each vs 3 CL (wich each deals 50k+ per bounce), still CL do better DPS.

 

About the 10% on CR is noticeable, is like 15k or something depending on your overall dmg before the robe. I think is one of those things i use a lot because is never bad to add more dmg to your spell chain. This is like every other class (i think) you need to switch gears on instances, because sometimes make things quicker, i like my hero magic robe, but that being said, i dont have more than one, maybe 2 of the more common element and thats it.

[Sewasan]

Crimson rock has 5s cooldown while CL has 3s cast delay, they deal aproximated damage single target when not amped(amp is better for CR than is for CL). Due to their reuse times, in a period of 15s you can use 3x CR and 5x CL, so CL wins dps wise. It's also boosted by Elviras up to 40%, CR dont have that type of card yet.
If you use a diabolus robe and a +12 TSOD, means you have 28% cast delay reduction, and now in that 15s window you can cast CL 5 times.

 

XD that :V there is better explained

[Ashuckel]

Edit in quote, i typoed :v

[Kusanagisama]

Ash, I agree with your overall analysis, but not totally with the numbers.

 

Amp only affects the first hit of CL, while CR has it's whole damage amplified. Also, consecutive hits of CL have a decay in damage.

 

You can increase CL's damage with the following:

 

2x Elvira + 2x Tikbalang = 20%+20%+10%+5% = 55%

 

You can increase CR's damage with:

(2x Alchemy Gloves + 2x Red Lichtern) + (HMR  + OBMH) = [1+(10%+10%+10%+5%) x 1+(10%+10%)]-1 = 62% (not sure about the math here, so please correct me if I'm wrong)

 

Also, the elvira cards will likely be in +7% or +6% MATK accessories, while the Alchemy Gloves can only have +40 MATK total for 2 Scaraba Cards.

 

The main problem is: if you can't one-shot the target with CR, you'll have to use Release for up to 3 non-Amped recasts. Another one: you can freeze most targets with Jack Frost, while it's not easy to Stone Curse with Siena Execrate, which is also riskier to use due to short range...

 

So, the comparison is still very debatable. Maybe it's not such a no-brainer as... at least as I used to think it was.

[Sewasan]

ummm i dont think we are even considering amping the CL tho, is like an unamped CL i was doing 50k per bounce average to for example the orcs on "isle of bios" (they are earth), consider 4 bounces and you get 200k on one CL, while with the same setup i was doing 175-180k amped CR, (using the HMR and OBMH, no gloves tho), so i can do 3 CL that will be 600k, vs 2 CR that will be 350k, difference is, CR hit a group, and CL hit a single target ideally, because in a group the thing is totally different and then i agree CR is better.

 

But maybe with better gear and everything on, you can pair both damages and make CR goes higher, im just saying what i see based on my own gear wich is not that good.

[Kusanagisama]

ummm i dont think we are even considering amping the CL tho, is like an unamped CL i was doing 50k per bounce average to for example the orcs on "isle of bios" (they are earth), consider 4 bounces and you get 200k on one CL, while with the same setup i was doing 175-180k amped CR, (using the HMR and OBMH, no gloves tho), so i can do 3 CL that will be 600k, vs 2 CR that will be 350k, difference is, CR hit a group, and CL hit a single target ideally, because in a group the thing is totally different and then i agree CR is better.

 

But maybe with better gear and everything on, you can pair both damages and make CR goes higher, im just saying what i see based on my own gear wich is not that good.

 

Until this discussion came around, it was a no brainer for me that CL was better, but when you put this kind of stuff on the table, you start to question it, specially when you're thinking about ditching CR in your build.

[Sewasan]

WHAT!? why you will ditch CR, i mean, both are useful

[Ashuckel]

If it wasnt for the WL katryne card and Old Magic Stone hat, i would totally ditch CR out of my build lol

[TothWL]

I'm thinking of letting CR on 2 and going with Drain Life on 5.

I hardly ever use CR on bRO, we don't have OGH yet and what i'm doing lately are MVP's and Celine Kimi Instance (my warlock can win against genetic and we don't even have Elviras yet, hype!!!), but I COULD use Drain Life a lot. Mainly when I'm doing Dark Lord and he uses Coma, or on my way to face Celine, etc.

I don't know, the only thing I'm uncertain about is how much life I would get with Drain Life. I have done a rough math and it's about 9k regen with amp... but it's something, contrary to CR I never use anw.

[Kusanagisama]

I barely used it after I left Scaraba and Hazy Forest around level 150. After the last reset I left it on 4, to rush Intensification and get drain life 5 at job level 60. CL is way better in almost anything, mostly because of that stupid cooldown and the way that it spreads the mob, sometimes destroying your Firewall positioning. There are monsters that you can't even 3-shot with it, and it's useless in those situations, while a FM>JF>CL combo never gets old.

 

I'm still unsure, but as it will take quite some time for me to get there, I'll have a lot of time to think about it. CR 5 and DL 4 or CR 4 and DL 5? Or even CR 2, DL 5, Radius 3? XD

[Jezs69]

If it wasnt for the WL katryne card and Old Magic Stone hat, i would totally ditch CR out of my build lol

 

You have a WL Kathryn card?
 

[Ashuckel]

2 of them lol

[Ashuckel]

So, iirc Chain Lightning doesn't changes it's damage per hit when hitting only 1 enemy. If thats correct then we have this situation:

Empowered Golden set+2x evliras+ 2x tikbalangs:
CL= 1000% x175/100 = 1750%/hit *4= 7000% per CL. With those gears:7000*2.15= 15050%

Empowered Crimson set+ alchemy glove+ 2x fire lichtern
CR= 3925%*1.85= 7261.25%

None has amp considered. Again, the values may be a bit off as i'm not 100% sure if thats how CL works(i need to start playing again lol)

Edited by Ashuckel, 12 May 2016 - 02:04 PM.

[Sewasan]

Well, i dont know i never use tetra vortex, i actually ditch that skill to favor the other elemental skills, but i think is a matter of taste.

[Sigma1]

Gioia card for more 100% of CL.

Nightmare Ancient Mummy card also increase fire magic dmg by 3% per refine, compounded on garment.

[cory]

I tested in TRO. You should recheck it since it's almost 5 years after that balance.
 

 

There's no Post-Post-Balance patch.  So that's the best information you can get unless you directly ask Warpportal.

 

Check yo self boy.

[Kusanagisama]

Gioia card for more 100% of CL.

Nightmare Ancient Mummy card also increase fire magic dmg by 3% per refine, compounded on garment.

 

They REALLY should make placeholder cards, so that we could farm such items and have them on day 0 when they are implemented...

 

I want a Time Holder Card too...

[Darksorrow1234]

You have a WL Kathryn card?
 

 

its not yet available in iRO bruh XD

 

btw i think i red somewhere that Sigma said the "True" mobs are actually "regular" mobs (weapon card) , and the MVP is the one with the job name (garment card)

Edited by Darksorrow1234, 12 May 2016 - 11:53 PM.

[Ashuckel]

Well, follows the rule of actual bio mvp/mob cards.

Lord Knight Seyren, Assassin Cross Eremes, Sniper Cecil, etc are MVP