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#1 TheDeadKeepIt

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 10:01 PM

Hello, I'm trying this game out.  Unfortunately, I don't think there is any decent public/world chat in the game to ask questions and socialise. Region chat is behind a paywall.

(poor decision for a massive online game where players want to play with others) 

 

So I have to ask my questions here and wait...

 

I'm interested in PvP and also being able to raid(I assume raiding is necessary for gear).  That might mean I have to make 2 characters or maybe its possible to do it all on one character.

 

I've looked at the battlefield score sheets, at least for last week and the accumulated totals to get an idea of how certain classes fair based on kill/death ratio and win/loss ratio.

 

I'm kinda leaning towards a Radiant to be a healer. I'm also leaning towards a Warlord or Berserker to just be a blunt warrior type.

I'm pretty sure neither of these is great at farming mobs fast since they dont have great AoE skills so grinding might be slow. (correct me if I'm wrong)

 

I know what to expect with the healer, but whats the warrior like in pve and pvp?  

Does a warrior need a premade party/healer before joining pvp?

How is being able to raid and do pvp on one character?  

Are most people who pvp regularly already set with gear and don't raid anymore?

 

And what is SCAD?  I keep seeing it all over the forums.


Edited by TheDeadKeepIt, 13 July 2016 - 10:38 PM.

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#2 DRAGONMANdavid1

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 11:43 PM

elementalist defiler mystic tempest good both in pve and pvp


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#3 Cleffy

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 11:51 PM

You can solo level from 1-85 in the game just doing quests.
Blunt weapons are not preferred. If your build uses skills, use a sword. If it doesn't use skills, use an axe.
Premaking a party doesn't matter since there usually isn't a battlefield with enough players in the queue.
You should be able to raid with a Radiant and pvp with a Berserker. Warlord is more a support character in raid and PVP, they don't do much of the killing. If you wanted to do both with 1 character, you would want to use the warlord.
The problem will be finding a Raid or PVP battleground. There just aren't enough players.
Most people already spent their way to top end gear. It costs hundreds in cash shop purchases to make competitive gear, otherwise you get squished. That's just insurance xeons that prevent breaking equipment when reinforcing which can happen with 100% success chance.
SCAD is Skill Critical Additional Damage. When you critical, you double your damage and add on the Skill Critical Additional Damage. The regular damage is affected by the single variable logarithmic function for damage reduction. Past level 80, everyone has 80% damage reduction. SCAD uses a different damage reduction formula. Previously it ignored armor all together. It still is only marginally affected by armor. As a result it's a way to get around the poorly devised damage formulas. However, there are actually 2 numbers, CAD and SCAD. When you use a skill, it's affected by Skill Critical. When you use an auto-attack, it's affected by Critical. Warlords and Berserkers have a low Skill Critical rate, so you first have to get Skill Critical to above 40% for SCAD to be effective. Then concentrate on SCAD. Warlords and Berserkers also have the highest base damage. I would not worry about auto-attacks since the developers broke the auto-attacks a couple years ago.


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#4 DRAGONMANdavid1

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Posted 13 July 2016 - 11:58 PM

That's just insurance xeons that prevent breaking equipment when reinforcing which can happen with 100% success chance.

wtf


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#5 Cleffy

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Posted 14 July 2016 - 12:06 AM

Reinforcement Insurance $0.75

Head, Upper, Lower, Gloves, Boots 5 items

Accessory, 2x earring, 2x ring, 2x bracelet, necklace, belt 9 items

Total 14 reinforcable items to +30. (using Reinforcement Insurance beyond +10)

14 * 20 * $0.75 = $210

 

There is a chance in the game that reinforcing an item with a 100% success rate during an event and 8% break rate could still fail the success and break.

This is also not factoring in the $1.00 deterioration rate decrease items and actually failing to reinforce.

You could get by with +20 equipment in PVP without being squished, but its still a bit of money.


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#6 Ninnghizhidda

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Posted 14 July 2016 - 02:54 AM

About the "gear up" cost and such, seriously, I was under the impression that was a thing of the past (and some of us idiots feeding Gravity our hard earned money). Sure.. you would need all this IF you don't plan / use one of those marvelous froge evenies, ah sorry to make it clear here, those rather regular events where you get a lovely huge boost to your upgrade % along the lines of 70% or so. If you Do plan and use one of those events, I fail to see why you need to spend anything, or at the worst case scenario just very minimal money in the cash shop.

 

As for classes, leveling, farming, grinding and PvP too, apart from the necessary top gear (see above how would you actually maximise your potential) just go for a caster / mage class, any that you prefer / fancy more. They are all much better than most of the melee / "warrior" type ones. Mystic for example is a solid choice, rather easy to master and level, Defiler too, etc etc.


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#7 Kazara

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Posted 14 July 2016 - 02:58 AM

Hello, 

I know what to expect with the healer, but whats the warrior like in pve and pvp?  

PvP with both Warlord and Berserker is pretty fine...Berserker is better on 1v1 situations while Warlord is better in team vs team such as battlefields because of the crowd control AOEs and damage AOEs.

For PvE, Warlord is the best because of the AOEs.

 

Does a warrior need a premade party/healer before joining pvp?

Nop, but is always good to have a Radiant in your team...as it is good to have a WL in your team ^^

 

How is being able to raid and do pvp on one character?  

Well for sure you can't solo RAID with a warrior, but WL is pretty good for RAIDs because of the defense debuff.

PvP on one character is fine on both.

 

Are most people who pvp regularly already set with gear and don't raid anymore?

Nah, not all. I am, but doing some RAID for lant is always useful even if my char is on top gears (or pretty much there).

 

SCAD = Skill Critical Additional Damage.

 

And don't listen to Cleffy, he/she doesn't play the game from long time.

 

If any other questions, pm ihgyug.

 


Edited by Kazara, 14 July 2016 - 03:00 AM.

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#8 ElfLord

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Posted 14 July 2016 - 04:17 AM

Reinforcement Insurance $0.75
Head, Upper, Lower, Gloves, Boots 5 items
Accessory, 2x earring, 2x ring, 2x bracelet, necklace, belt 9 items
Total 14 reinforcable items to +30. (using Reinforcement Insurance beyond +10)
14 * 20 * $0.75 = $210

There is a chance in the game that reinforcing an item with a 100% success rate during an event and 8% break rate could still fail the success and break.
This is also not factoring in the $1.00 deterioration rate decrease items and actually failing to reinforce.
You could get by with +20 equipment in PVP without being squished, but its still a bit of money.


This is absolute nonsense and please ignore.
You can +30 gear with no cost. Absolutely free.
With different methods too.
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#9 ElfLord

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Posted 14 July 2016 - 05:38 AM

You can solo level from 1-85 in the game just doing quests.

You can solo level to 90 which is max level just by doing quests. There are daily quests that give amazing exp. And during an EXP event it is easy to cap level.
Blunt weapons are not preferred. If your build uses skills, use a sword. If it doesn't use skills, use an axe.

Doesnt matter if you use skills or not, for a warlord and a zerk you use the Crystalia Axe. For a commander/prot you use a bludgeon.
Premaking a party doesn't matter since there usually isn't a battlefield with enough players in the queue.

There are plenty of people in battlegrounds throughout the day. You dont have to premake a party, or you can party with 1-2 other players. Unfortunately if you party with more, you wont be able to join the match.
You should be able to raid with a Radiant and pvp with a Berserker.

You can pvp and pve/raid with a Radiant. PvP with a Berserker is a bit hard and relies heavily on having great gear. And even then you wont get many kills in battlegrounds

Warlord is more a support character in raid and PVP, they don't do much of the killing.

Warlords are AMAZING for pvp especially if you have good gear, they allow your team to completely destroy the enemy team. And if you have good enough gear, you can get plenty of kills yourself

If you wanted to do both with 1 character, you would want to use the warlord.

You can use both radiant and warlord for pvp/pve
The problem will be finding a Raid or PVP battleground. There just aren't enough players.

There are plenty of players for battle grounds. Raiding will require you to find a guild that does them daily.
Most people already spent their way to top end gear.

Most people have spent very little to +30 (top end) their gear. The only thing that might require some cash investment is things like a pet, and a permanent costume. Thats about it

It costs hundreds in cash shop purchases to make competitive gear, otherwise you get squished.

It costs literally no money to make the best gear in the game. You can do it all using battlefield points or using items from events.

That's just insurance xeons that prevent breaking equipment when reinforcing which can happen with 100% success chance.

The chance of losing an item at 100% success is so small that its negligible. I have made over 30 items +30 and havent lost a single one
SCAD is Skill Critical Additional Damage.

First correct statement in this wall of nonsense

When you critical, you double your damage and add on the Skill Critical Additional Damage.

Second Correct statement

The regular damage is affected by the single variable logarithmic function for damage reduction.

This is only for Auto Attacks and Melee Skill Attacks. This is untrue for Casters using magic skills. 

Past level 80, everyone has 80% damage reduction.

This makes no sense. Please ignore this statement. You only have 80% magic resist if you have proper gear and/or enchants for it. Being level 80+ does not mean you have 80% damage reduction. In fact most casters do not have 80% Short range damage reduction unless they switch multiple gear parts

SCAD uses a different damage reduction formula.

SCAD uses no reduction formula.

Previously it ignored armor all together.

Scad is not affected by ARMOR in anyway whatsoever

It still is only marginally affected by armor.

Nope.

As a result it's a way to get around the poorly devised damage formulas.

I suppose. Though i doubt thats why scad was implemented.

However, there are actually 2 numbers, CAD and SCAD.

Third correct statement.

When you use a skill, it's affected by Skill Critical.

Fourth correct statement.

When you use an auto-attack, it's affected by Critical.

Also correct.

Warlords and Berserkers have a low Skill Critical rate,so you first have to get Skill Critical to above 40% for SCAD to be effective.

All end game gear gives plenty of Skill Critical Rate. As such, every player at end game that has decent gear is running 100% Skill Critical Chance. On top of that, there are plenty of enchants that allow you to reach 100+ critical chance.

Then concentrate on SCAD.

You concentrate on SCAD only when you have 100% critical chance. This does not apply to Radiants or Warlords. In both cases SCAD is a secondary. Radiants primary focus is mnd to increase heals, and Warlords need to have HP in order to survive.

Warlords and Berserkers also have the highest base damage.

That is only because their 2 hand weapons give enormous damage. If you choose to use shield + bludgeon instead of 2h Axe, you will have the same base damage or even less than an Assasin. And in fact an assasin with a Bow has more base damage that a Warlord or a Zerk

I would not worry about auto-attacks since the developers broke the auto-attacks a couple years ago.

Auto attacks are NOT broken. They have never been broken. Zerk currently has a small bug with its attack speed buff, where the cooldown and duration are off. While Assasins have no issue using Auto Attacks.

 


Edited by ElfLord, 14 July 2016 - 05:38 AM.

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#10 Kazara

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Posted 14 July 2016 - 05:46 AM

I agree with ElfLord on everything he said, was lazy to answer each thing like that so I just wrote "And don't listen to Cleffy, he/she doesn't play the game from long time.". xD


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#11 ElfLord

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Posted 14 July 2016 - 06:37 AM

To actually keep this topic on topic

Hello, I'm trying this game out.

Welcome

Unfortunately, I don't think there is any decent public/world chat in the game to ask questions and socialize. 

Well, theres either region chat or megaphones. There is also a Trifri group on facebook, and a TRIFRI 2015 group. As well as the forum, which has a couple of active helpful users. Such as Kazara.

Region chat is behind a paywall.

Yes it is. This game is F2P, so same as many others there are certain things you have to pay for in order to get. 

(poor decision for a massive online game where players want to play with others) 

Agreed

So I have to ask my questions here and wait...

Dont have to wait long

I'm interested in PvP and also being able to raid(I assume raiding is necessary for gear).  

Yup, gear is gotten from raids OR by buying it from other players. Some gear is obtainable without raiding, and by farming. That is the current lvl 90 Armor set, and the current Jewels. Weapons are from 2 different raids. Either Mythic Doom Cheras (easy to obtain) or Voxyon (hard to obtain)

That might mean I have to make 2 characters or maybe its possible to do it all on one character.

Well, you can do it with 1, but i recommend also making an AOE caster to farm honor. (Mystic/Tempest/Defiler) 

I've looked at the battlefield score sheets, at least for last week and the accumulated totals to get an idea of how certain classes fair based on kill/death ratio and win/loss ratio.

Unfortunately, there are quite a few people abusing the system and have way more kills than they should, thus making it a little off

I'm kinda leaning towards a Radiant to be a healer.

Rads are nice. My main is a Rad. Relatively easy to cap contribution. Useful in raids. And doesnt require the best gear to be decent.

I'm also leaning towards a Warlord or Berserker to just be a blunt warrior type.

Warlord. 

I'm pretty sure neither of these is great at farming mobs fast since they dont have great AoE skills so grinding might be slow. (correct me if I'm wrong)

You are correct, both are pretty bad farmers. Though warlord is DEFINITELY better than rad for farming

I know what to expect with the healer, but whats the warrior like in pve and pvp?

Its a little hard. You have to dash into a lot of enemies and their AoEs and take a lot of damage. Its a little difficult to kill. But once in a while, you get that amazing dash where you bind the entire enemy team, your teams defiler catches an amazing Trap of Stiffness, and in 5 seconds you demolish the entire enemy team.

Does a warrior need a premade party/healer before joining pvp?

Nah, most players dont bother premaking parties. I do it sometimes only when i want to play with a friend, or if (kazara) complains that im hushing him too often and wants me to hush someone else lol.

How is being able to raid and do pvp on one character?  

Both wl and rad are good for raiding and pvping. 

Are most people who pvp regularly already set with gear and don't raid anymore?

Most people who pvp do have their full armor and gears, and mostly raid for enchantments. But for raids, you might have to find a guild that does daily raids.

There is a plan to make raiding more popular and make it easier to acquire enchantments, but unfortunately, i cant give you an ETA nor even give you a preview.

And what is SCAD?  I keep seeing it all over the forums.

SCAD is

Sexy Cats And Dogs

Just kidding. its Skill Critical Additional Damage.
It is damage that is added when you do a critical hit. It bypasses resist and defense.
The only time that SCAD does nothing, is when you are using a Melee Skill and it is blocked by a shield. (This is a bug, and we are hoping that it can be fixed someday)

 

 

Anywho, hope this was helpful.
I used to be extremely negative and on the forum and try to drive players away, but it seems that being around kazara for the last month has really mellowed me out.

If you need help in game, i suggest joining either TREEKO (new guild focused on PVE) or Kazara's guild (Population Kontrol, only because kazara LOVES helping new players)

If you want to PK, then you can join either Inception (mostly russian players, though there are plenty of english players as well) or Disbalance/Dokdo (korean/philipino/weirdos) I recommend Inception. 


Edited by ElfLord, 14 July 2016 - 06:38 AM.

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#12 TheDeadKeepIt

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Posted 14 July 2016 - 09:10 AM

Great insight posts in here. Thanks!  I'm just bad at picking things so I'll be a while before I actually start playing. Cleffy made me think I didn't want to play, but Elflord says, 

 

It costs hundreds in cash shop purchases to make competitive gear, otherwise you get squished.

It costs literally no money to make the best gear in the game. You can do it all using battlefield points or using items from events.

 

Could someone elaborate on what you buy using battlefield points? Buy the insurance xeons? or what?


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#13 ElfLord

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Posted 14 July 2016 - 09:20 AM

Great insight posts in here. Thanks! I'm just bad at picking things so I'll be a while before I actually start playing. Cleffy made me think I didn't want to play, but Elflord says,

Could someone elaborate on what you buy using battlefield points? Buy the insurance xeons? or what?

OK so with a 72% reinforcement forge, items past +9 area no longer 100% chance to reinforce
SO a battlefield merchant sells reinforce success items. Which can be used to increase the chance back to 100%
There are also atmas that can be used to make reinforce success as well.
So it really takes no money to make gear +30
Only time
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#14 SandySandman

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Posted 14 July 2016 - 11:02 AM

if you want to know the Game, first you have to understand it`s not a Horror Game.

 

Actually it`s a Game that focus around the Blacksmith.

 

With every reinforce/enchant/compound step this World called Ethergia will lose it`s danger and charm more and more.

 

Until only Afk`ing in Alban left.

 

So my best advice for you would be: create 2 Characters. One for PvP other for PvE.

 

PvE will become a total disappointment if you go beyond +15 even on the average Items.

 

Besides the so called crafting for E-peenness.

 

There is nothing to accomplish , Temperions are just killer.

 

Deepest Storyline ever.

 

 


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#15 Cleffy

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Posted 14 July 2016 - 11:49 PM

Damage formulas for a physical based attack.

Physical Attack:

Damage reduction = [22.994 * ln(Target Total Defense)] - 101.19

Note: physical damage reduction formula reduced heavily over 80% reduction ~2700 defense without cracking open the source code its impossible to tell the variables involved and the above formula is the closest approximation.

Damage received = Damage * (1 - Damage Reduction / 100)

Critical hit = Damage received * 2 + CAD * (Defense / 4) / [(Defense / 4) + Target Lvl * 10]

Skill critical hit = (2 * Damage received) + SCAD * [1 - (Damage reduction / 4)]

 

The only skills not affected by Defense or Resistance are damage over time.

Casters with +30 armor and no enchant xeons has a 60%(1600ish defense) physical damage reduction at level 80. With Radiant enchant its at 80%. With Warlord debuff its around 40%. Why do Berserkers do so much damage despite the damage reduction? Because their base damage is the highest.

 

Warlord's are a support class. They just support their team in a different way. They allow your team to kill the enemy, but in the process usually get themselves killed. Unlike a Radiant's support ability, they don't get contribution from it. In Raids they are also mainly support due to their strong debuffs / buffs and off-tank ability. You can take Warlord to PVP and Raid because of their support abilities. They can do damage and contribute, but not as much as other classes. Berserker does a lot of base damage, and can get a lot of kills. They aren't the best in PVP, but more ideal than Warlord or Radiant when trying to deal damage. In Raids they are not ideal because they are in the damage area of the boss and don't hold up as well as a Defender type. Ranged classes, tankers, and support classes are more ideal to raid with. Radiant can support in PVP, but their damage is not that great. With clashes lasting a few seconds, their ability to heal isn't as great a factor compared to when clashes last longer. It may give a slight edge, but usually only 1 additional exchange of blows.

 

For the OP who is new just entering a matured game that has bleed almost all but the most die-hard players, it will be tough. Nearly all the maps are empty so good luck getting a party. When you get to the last maps, most of the players are already max equipment and level. So good luck trying to get a raid going on a constant basis in order to collect every part with 2~3 dropping per raid. Without reinforced equipment, good luck gaining a few hundred Reinforce insurance or increase xeons through battlefields. You are pretty much 1 shottable if you are not using a twink character on a lower level battleground. Also it might be tough entering getting max contribution playing against the same 6 or so people in battlegrounds that usually does not have enough players to start most of the time.

As far as reinforce events go, they are usually several months apart and require a nice savings of xeons costing in the 10s of millions of lant to make the most out of. Not too difficult to accumulate over a couple weeks with end-game content. The 100% reinforce issue where items break is real and for a person who has +20 equipment they spent a few million lant reinforcing and several weeks raiding, is the off chance the item breaks worth it to not use a reinforce insurance?

 

I will cut to the chase. The initial 1-60 game play in terms of PVE and PVP are compelling and enjoyable. However, this game play is done better by more modern games. It's also a short experience lasting a few days. Content begins to degrade in quality beyond level 60, and PVP is not enjoyable in the max tier unless you spent a lot of time on your equipment. The end game in general has become an unbalanced buggy mess that a new player doesn't have to experience if they played a better game that has more qualified developer support. For a person who has followed this game for a long time, I cannot suggest someone get started in playing this when they have so many better options.


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#16 Kazara

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Posted 15 July 2016 - 12:10 AM

I +30 over 200 items and never broke any on 100% success chance, and yes, I usually reinforce on 100% success chance. Usually I start use xeons from +15 or +20, so we can say I made over 2000 reinforces at 100% success chance, and never broke any. If there is any chance to break at 100%, it's insignificant.

 


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#17 Vulcano

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Posted 15 July 2016 - 12:15 AM

can u guys make me some +30 stuff ?


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#18 Kazara

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Posted 15 July 2016 - 12:16 AM

can u guys make me some +30 stuff ?

Nop.


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#19 Vulcano

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Posted 15 July 2016 - 12:53 AM

Nop. i will gift to you

ty

 

:DD


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#20 TheDeadKeepIt

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Posted 15 July 2016 - 11:32 AM

I cannot suggest someone get started in playing this when they have so many better options.

 

Yea I know logically this isn't the game to pickup. The staff (after watching a stream) completely dismissed any criticism of certain things that should be changed to make this game actually grow and retain players actually new to the game.

One example was letting there be a public chat/world chat.  Oh we get can get a megaphone once a day the person says. So we can say one thing publicly once a day?  Are you serious?  This is a perfect example of someone living in the past and can't see things need to be changed.  New players come along and they can't talk to anyone. They can't ask for help. I've been in the game for like 4 days now and I try to talk to anyone I meet and they all: run away, vanish, say something in another language, only one person said "Hello."   "This is my wife's account"  and then they mounted up and ran away. Oh its such a great way to make a game where players can not easily communicate with one another. 

New players come to the game, they are lost and quit the game in less than a week. You could experiment you know?  For 3 months let there be a world chat for everyone and see how much player retention you get. Does player retention = more $income$ ?

 

The person in question clearly just wants to keep their job and let the game stay as it is for the most part. They didn't seem to be very motivated either.

 

But I have this compelling need to play a game like this.  I still despise the management of this game. Many things should be changed.  


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#21 Kazara

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Posted 15 July 2016 - 01:11 PM

Use that megaphone to ask to join a guild....I am sure that guild TREEKO can help you.

 


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#22 Kazara

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Posted 15 July 2016 - 01:16 PM

But I disagree on having a free world chat for all. There would be too many idiots spamming in it. A free region chat and easier access to megaphones (in game) would make it better.

 


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#23 ElfLord

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Posted 15 July 2016 - 01:18 PM

Region chat for free and world chat for premium, that would be decent I think
But with an anti spam filter
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#24 Vulcano

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Posted 18 July 2016 - 09:14 AM

i vote for free regional chat, it would make easier for people seeling buying stuff, the megaphone its meh, our atlast in nova lux , if it became to be marketplace

 

i do remenber the nova server ( FB) had free regional chat, in the begin...


Edited by Vulcano, 18 July 2016 - 09:15 AM.

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