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Arquien's Necklace details


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#1 Latsabb

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Posted 21 May 2017 - 11:41 AM

I have been testing drop rates for the items, as well as the stacking of the effects, and after a few thousand kills, I can confidently say the following:

 

- Arquien's Necklace stacks additively with itself and Supplement Part Con, and multiplicatively with the damage bonus from a wind weapon. Sea Captain's hat stacking unknown.

 

- Drop rates stack additively.

 

- Drop rate of Candy is 20% per necklace.

 

- Drop rate of Candy Cane is 20% per necklace.

 

- Drop rate of Chocolate Drink is 1% per necklace.

 

- Drops are calculated on kill, not given by proc. ie, similar to Snowier, not Witch's Pumpkin hat.

 

Keep in mind that since Chocolate Drink is a relatively low drop item, it is easy for variation to influence the drop rate. That is why I also referenced the amount of Chocolate Drinks per Candy/Candy Cane, and with ~1700 Candy dropped, there were 5% as many Chocolate Drink, or 1/20. That corresponds well with the 1% drop rate per necklace.

 

Edit: I spent the last week grinding in Nogg Road with them on, but not eating any of the drops. I looted everything as best I could, but some were not looted. From this last week, I currently have 5176 Candy Cane, 5053 Candy and 379 Chocolate Drink. That makes the Chocolate Drink drop at around 7.5% of the rate of the candies. As they drop at 40% with two equipped, that makes the drop rate of the Chocolate Drinks approximately 3% overall, not the 2% I had originally assumed. So it looks like the Necklaces give a 1.5% chance each of dropping Chocolate Milk, rather than 1%.


Edited by Latsabb, 29 May 2017 - 04:48 AM.

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#2 Ethanasael

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Posted 21 May 2017 - 12:42 PM

Very nice, thanks for sharing.


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#3 Latsabb

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Posted 29 May 2017 - 04:49 AM

Edited to reflect a larger sample size. Added this information:

I spent the last week grinding in Nogg Road with them on, but not eating any of the drops. I looted everything as best I could, but some were not looted. From this last week, I currently have 5176 Candy Cane, 5053 Candy and 379 Chocolate Drink. That makes the Chocolate Drink drop at around 7.5% of the rate of the candies. As they drop at 40% with two equipped, that makes the drop rate of the Chocolate Drinks approximately 3% overall, not the 2% I had originally assumed. So it looks like the Necklaces give a 1.5% chance each of dropping Chocolate Milk, rather than 1%.


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#4 mungmungah

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Posted 29 May 2017 - 12:02 PM

That's a lot of candy :heh:
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#5 Ward20th

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Posted 29 May 2017 - 02:04 PM

I think that item should be at not lower 300m+above each,

i find it very useful compare to those items at 300m to 1b and it actually replace fish/condense.

 

edit:

I just sell my toy syringe (one of my mech primary item). no regret  :heh:


Edited by Ward20th, 29 May 2017 - 02:09 PM.

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#6 Ethanasael

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Posted 31 May 2017 - 08:37 AM

At scarabas i make almost 400 candy, 400 cane per run, chocolates i'm not counting, very nice item. Dumpling Kid card it and it recovers even more. PS: Creamy carded one, and other is clean waiting for this card.


Edited by Ethanasael, 31 May 2017 - 08:38 AM.

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#7 Latsabb

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Posted 31 May 2017 - 09:26 AM

Wow. I was not even aware of the Dumpling Kid Card. Depending on how everything stacks with each other, that could make Candy Cane's insanely good for healing. Almost as good as a slim white with a Toy Syringe.


Edited by Latsabb, 31 May 2017 - 10:04 AM.

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#8 Ethanasael

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Posted 31 May 2017 - 11:21 AM

Yes, and now that it's a core item for axe mechanics, having it combo with 1 or 2 dumpling kid is a must. Without dumpling it already heals a little lower than slim with syringe, with dumpling it will be almost same healing, for much cheaper, with any level 30+ char.


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#9 vividort

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Posted 31 May 2017 - 11:47 AM

actually its not even close to syringe, the way the healing increase works is by increasing the base healing rate of the item:

 

Candy Cane has 105hp min rate and 145hp max rate which would be multiplied by the 300% from double arquien and 2 dumpling and would still be 580hp at most

Condensed White has 325hp min rate and 405hp max rate which would be multiplied by the 150% from syringe in mouth and would go up to a maximum of 1012,5hp

 

so even with all the increase is almost half the efficiency of syringe.

 

Ps.: Unless the item is broken then> Screw Calculations ¬¬'


Edited by vividort, 31 May 2017 - 11:49 AM.

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#10 Ashuckel

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Posted 31 May 2017 - 12:09 PM

your way of tought is correct.

in terms of pure healing eficiency, there will hardly be any contender for white slims because of stuff like tpy syringe and flamel card.

these are some "cheaper" alternatives, cheap as in price per healing item (as the price of the accessories is already going up and will continue to)
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#11 Latsabb

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Posted 31 May 2017 - 12:13 PM

It depends on how they stack, as mentioned. If it is additive, then you are correct. However, if they are separate effects, and are multiplicative, then it is a different story. So you have the following scenarios.

 

1) They are all additive. 100%+100%+100%+50%+50%=400%, and therefore 580 max heal.

2) They are additive with each other, but multiplicative between types. 100%*(2+1)*(1.5+0.5)=600%, and therefore 870 max heal.

3) Arq. Necklaces are additive with the base, but the cards are multiplicative. (100%+100%+100%)*(1.5+5)=600% and therefore 870 max heal.

4) Cards are additive with the base, but the necklaces are multiplicative. (100%+50%+50%)*(2+3)=600% and therefore 870 max heal.

 

As you can see, every scenario other than everything being additive ends up with 870 max heal, which I consider to be very close to condensed with Toy Syringe.


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#12 Ashuckel

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Posted 31 May 2017 - 12:17 PM

same category = additive

his example is correct


and well while yeah the necklace does increase mech's damage on some skills, if that is not needed and using just for the heal boost, you are sacrificing 2 accessories slots wich can often be very valuable for damage/etc, while syringe sacrifices a low hg, wich is often useless :v

Edited by Ashuckel, 31 May 2017 - 12:19 PM.

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#13 Latsabb

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Posted 31 May 2017 - 12:20 PM

But how do we know that it is in the same category? As an example, Arq Necklaces are additive with each other, as well as with Supp. Part Con. However, having a wind axe has a 25% multiplicative bonus, not additive. But they are all listed as increasing damage for Axe Tornado by a percentage.


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#14 vividort

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Posted 31 May 2017 - 01:01 PM

arquiens category = skill % modifier

wind axe category = elemental modifier

 

actually it would act like physical modifier i guess

got it?


Edited by vividort, 31 May 2017 - 01:03 PM.

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#15 Ashuckel

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Posted 31 May 2017 - 01:23 PM

because the wind element bonus to axe tornado is part of it's skill formula

Basically

Damage (ATK) = ([(Base_Damage + VIT) × (BaseLv ÷ 100)] * 1+ Wind Element Bonus)

and gear % will multiply that final value

the gears sum with each other because they are of the same category.
If you wear 2x the exact same bonus (lets say 50%) you'll have 50%+50%=+100%, not 1,5 × 1,5= 225%

if every single % in the game would multiply with each other, when being the same type, you wouldnt see ppl using diversified multipliers ans cards, but just use the same one with highest values over and over and over, and everyone would have an insane high damage, specially GXes (like 4x what it is now)

Edited by Ashuckel, 31 May 2017 - 01:27 PM.

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#16 vividort

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Posted 31 May 2017 - 01:29 PM

exactly ^


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#17 AllenR

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Posted 31 May 2017 - 06:51 PM

adding the dumpling kid card to the accessory will open the slot for tengu set. I mean the heal is close to toy syrnge but adding a tengu scroll is better rather than getting gold scarabas and toysyrnge. Im not that good in math but i can tell bec I have access to those acc with cards, can someone tell me how to record a vid? ill want to show some vid. ty. i want to attach file here


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#18 Silvianna

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Posted 31 May 2017 - 09:45 PM

Correct me if im wrong

 

Normal Recovery Item : Restored Amount =  Floor[ Healing_Value × ( 1 + User_VIT × 0.02 + HP_Recovery_Lv × 0.1 ) ]

Ranked Slim : Restored Amount = { Floor[ Healing_Value × ( 1 + User_VIT × 0.02 + HP_Recovery_Lv × 0.1 ) ] x 1.5

 

Assuming you have 120 vit and Lv 10 Increase Hp Recovery ( swordsman classes ) by total = ( 1 + 120 x 0.02 + 10 x 0.1 ) = 4.4

 

the healing rate has variant as well but here

the one that i calculated is the highest one,

ex : slim ( 325 - 405 ) i use the 405 one

 

Base Healing

Normal Slim = Floor (405 x ( 4.4 )) = 1782

Ranked Slim = Floor (405x (4.4 x 1.5)) = 2673

Candy Cane = Floor (145 x 4.4) = 638

Pumpkin = Floor ( 19 x 4.4 ) = 83

Fresh Fish = Floor ( 150 x 4.4 ) = 660

 

Other Classes with 90 Vit and No Increase Hp Recovery ( applied to swordsman without that mastery as well )

Normal Slim = Floor (405 x ( 2.8 )) = 1134

Ranked Slim = Floor (405x (2.8 x 1.5)) = 1701

Candy Cane = Floor (145 x 2.8) = 406

Pumpkin = Floor ( 19 x 2.8 ) = 53

Fresh Fish = Floor ( 150 x 2.8 ) = 420

 

Total Heal ( 120 Vit Lv 10 Mastery & 90 Vit No Mastery )

Now assuming you have Syringe Toy, the healing value would be

Normal Slim = Healing Value x Total Healing Rate ( 150% ) = 4455 & 2835

Ranked Slim = 6682 & 4252

 

Now for Candy Cane

lets say you have 2 x Arquien's Necklace carded with Dumpling Kid

Candy Cane = Healing Value x Total Healing Rate ( 100% + 100% + 50% + 50% ) = 2552 & 1624

 

WPH Combo

Pumpkin = Healing Value x Total Healing Rate ( 2000% ) = 2490 & 1590

WPH Combo + Trans Yellow

Pumpkin = Healing Value x Total Healing Rate ( 2000% + 2000% ) = 4980 & 3180

 

Scatleton Pet + Fish in Mouth

Fresh Fish =  Healing Value x Total Healing Rate ( 100% + 25% ) = 1485 & 945

 

What if you have Syringe Toy, Flamel carded garment and Isia Rune active ?

it would be 

Normal Slim = Healing Value x Total Healing Rate ( 150% + 200% + 50% ) = 7740 ~ 8910 & 4550 ~ 5670

Ranked Slim = 10725 ~ 13365 & 6825 ~ 8505

 

 


Edited by Silvianna, 05 June 2017 - 08:31 AM.

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#19 PTroy

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Posted 31 May 2017 - 10:55 PM

is it worth to put 2 dumpling card on arquien necklace?


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#20 Ethanasael

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Posted 01 June 2017 - 03:26 AM

Realy worth it.


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#21 AllenR

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Posted 03 June 2017 - 12:30 AM

We are talking Mechanic users with 2x Necklace.. Anyway, whatever it is, I really do not regret getting those cards.

 

The necklace has a high chance to get these recovery items, alright? if ya don't use it, It would be really annoying and you would just drop it from time to time since mech use greed. Why don't we make use of these items and boost it a little more? That would be great. 

 

Tengu Scroll > Toy Syrnge, if ure using a mechanic. I am not a FAN of OP G.Scaraba cards, Not wise for a mech to lose -2% Max HP just to gain additive +40atk. I rather get Wakwak Card and use these restoring items + TENGU and other leech gears.. thanks for reading


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#22 Ethanasael

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Posted 05 June 2017 - 06:01 AM

plus, mech already have such high atks, but thanks to skills formula... a rk with 600 atk would do HELL of dmg, mechanic with 600 atk do regular dmg...


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#23 DataDrain

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Posted 05 June 2017 - 08:12 AM

Hi Silvianna, how about well baked cookie with WPH-Alarm Mask combo vs syringe toy-flamel combo on ranked slims?

 

I've been wondering which is better ? :hmm:


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#24 Ashuckel

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Posted 05 June 2017 - 08:17 AM

you only really need to apply the items% to the potion base healing, it's not difficult.

btw, that Isia rune calculation there isnt correct.
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#25 Silvianna

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Posted 05 June 2017 - 08:31 AM

thanks for correction  :p_laugh:


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