135 replies to this topic

[ChakriGuard]

Quit Chaos and start over in Odin!

[Hissis]

you're doing it in the wrong way.

Support classes were offensive too in the past, since arrow vulcan was 1 hit pvp and mvp skill.. minstrel was a gene ok

200-500k you can reach in izlude eggs

ranger reach 700k in mvp

that's a hughe difference

 

The only one bow u get a good dmage is the bow of storm: the cooldown reducer

doesn't matter if your weak Sr do 500k in 3 sex  + 5 sex cooldown.. this is fun with izlude eggs but for mvp, pvp,this is garbage as my dmg is since it's the same as your...

 

If you think performers  should be supportive, please go to classic and enjoy old times wich proofs you're 100% wrong .

reverberation, deep sleep lullaby, MS,.. offensive skils for a GREAT offensive class in the past..

 

I don't even get why r u posting in wanderers post to incentivate no updates for wanderers...

 

I will try to say it again,i'm a archer/bard/hunter player since i started on RO.

 

Minstrel was really good in pre renew for damage but it was not a 1 hit K.O skill (only if you were fighting glass cannon players),i know a lot of players with the same kind of thinking and this is the worst way to compare something (for example :just because you kill someone as super novice doesnt mean the class is useful).

 

Again,400k~600k was a damage i was able to reach 2 years ago using almost NOTHING for pure damage,nowadays you can easily reach this mark,rangers can sure put a lot of damage if you build one but they cannot do this kind of damage using low/mid gears and without No Limits(which is a 5 minutes CD skill),Maestro/Wanderer can put as much damage as a ranger,tank way more and still support a party if they need/want.

 

You talk a lot about Cooldown and damage per second,if you think like that for every single situation in this game,classes like GF Sura are really bad cause you can only put some damage after a ~15 seconds (GF CD+ZEN+FURY+ZEN+2nd GF  Cast).

 

I don't think performers should be supportive,don't put words in my mouth please,i said they ARE designed since the start of the game to be Supportive classes and it's a fact.

 

Deep Sleep Lullaby and MS are support skills as much as they are offensive skills,they can be used in both playstyles.

 

P.S: I'm not against Perfomer buffs,i just think it's stupid to complain about the wrong thing (in this case,SR),as i already said,SR is strong nowadays. If you want to complain about the class and ask for buffs,complain about the right things (like deep sleep lullaby being useless) and not why you can't hit 1m damage like a pure damage class.

 

I hope you understand this time 

Edited by Hissis, 18 July 2017 - 06:01 PM.

[lorenz1375]

SR is totally weak and in need of a buff. It's totally not possible to oneshot anything in NCT at 150. Not.
Just slapping random gears from other chars on my Wandy I get this result:



- the bow doesn't even have a card
- I'm not even using any racial/elemental shadow gears
- my base Agi is actually way too low because I went for more supportish stats first
- not using any buffs other than Improve Concentration (and Swing Dance wich does not affect damage in any way)
- etctectetc

Now I want to level mah lowlvl wandie, seems a good change of phase from rollin around like a madman, SR is da real deal

[ShinobiEX3]

I will try to say it again,i'm a archer/bard/hunter player since i started on RO.
 
Minstrel was really good in pre renew for damage but it was not a 1 hit K.O skill (only if you were fighting glass cannon players),i know a lot of players with the same kind of thinking and this is the worst way to compare something (for example :just because you kill someone as super novice doesnt mean the class is useful).
 
Again,400k~600k was a damage i was able to reach 2 years ago using almost NOTHING for pure damage,nowadays you can easily reach this mark,rangers can sure put a lot of damage if you build one but they cannot do this kind of damage using low/mid gears and without No Limits(which is a 5 minutes CD skill),Maestro/Wanderer can put as much damage as a ranger,tank way more and still support a party if they need/want.
 
You talk a lot about Cooldown and damage per second,if you think like that for every single situation in this game,classes like GF Sura are really bad cause you can only put some damage after a ~15 seconds (GF CD+ZEN+FURY+ZEN+2nd GF  Cast).
 
I don't think performers should be supportive,don't put words in my mouth please,i said they ARE designed since the start of the game to be Supportive classes and it's a fact.
 
Deep Sleep Lullaby and MS are support skills as much as they are offensive skills,they can be used in both playstyles.
 
P.S: I'm not against Perfomer buffs,i just think it's stupid to complain about the wrong thing (in this case,SR),as i already said,SR is strong nowadays. If you want to complain about the class and ask for buffs,complain about the right things (like deep sleep lullaby being useless) and not why you can't hit 1m damage like a pure damage class.
 
I hope you understand this time 

I couldn't put it any better than this.

But I still want to know if natal came from bro -.-

[HeresNatan]

Now I want to level mah lowlvl wandie, seems a good change of phase from rollin around like a madman, SR is da real deal

 

 

Well.. I preffer hp and sp leech gears, since it last 3 seconds easily ou can rec HP and SP.

Enjoy the power of dance XD

 

[PervySageMarty]

Um.. if we are really discussing that the damage can ve truely good can i please get some help on how to gear up my maestro to do good 1 sequence SR damage that kills stuff at lvl 130? A pm for it would be nice. Budget is low so let me know guys!

[BlackMeow]

Sorry i was late. The popcorn line was too long

[HeresNatan]

Um.. if we are really discussing that the damage can ve truely good can i please get some help on how to gear up my maestro to do good 1 sequence SR damage that kills stuff at lvl 130? A pm for it would be nice. Budget is low so let me know guys!

What's decent damage?

[Kusanagisama]

Just conceptually speaking here, 1-hit skills ARE more powerful than multi-hit skills, since once you deal the full damage, assuming it kills the target, your risk of taking damage and dieing is over. Also, once you hit the enemy, the damage is done and you can't miss anymore, in multi-hit skills the enemy can get out of the AoE and avoid some of the damage. This is specially true in PVP environments. So, a multi-hit skill is not neccessarily more powerful than a one-hit skill because it potentially deals more damage, they can be similar or it can even be weaker, depending on context. In Ragnarok's context however, there's some compensation for multi-hit skills. They have a higher chance of benefitting from on-hit procs, like Eddga, Hawkeye, Runaway Magic (since Crimson Rock was mentioned...), etc., unlike one-hit skills, that if it procs on that hit the chance of you wasting the effect is significant.

 

So, judging by the damage alone is not a good way to judge between what's more powerful: SR or AS. Among what has already been said, both classes can wear different gears, have different skills that can buff these (like No Limits), and each class has other unique funcionality that the other lack, which makes the balancing between them way more complex than the damage dealt by their main AoE damage skills.

 

I discarded the thought of wandy/maestro being weak after I saw a wandy dealing much more damage than my second warlock, while I was leveling him in NCT right after I got my NAM Card. And despite being able to support much better than Warlock (after all, that's what they were designed to do), that Wandy also had it easy with killing mobs. I don't know how it fares for instances and MVP, but "weak" is certainly not a fitting adjective.

Edited by Kusanagisama, 19 July 2017 - 07:49 AM.

[Spoon]

Did Kaddy change her forum name?

[Ashuckel]

no, but behemothjr did

[wadoichimonji]

At least Kaddy have good reasons to consider Performers are weak

[LoveWinter]

Quit Chaos and start over in Odin!

 

[Kirx]

Um.. if we are really discussing that the damage can ve truely good can i please get some help on how to gear up my maestro to do good 1 sequence SR damage that kills stuff at lvl 130? A pm for it would be nice. Budget is low so let me know guys!

MAD BUNNY SPECIAL, Thanatos Violin, Evil Dragon Armor ,Fallen Angel Wing,

Vanargand Helm, Diabolus boots are U into PVP, MVP or P2P?

[fuyukikun]

Did Kaddy change her forum name?

 

 

no, but behemothjr did

 

i dunno behemothjr already give up his slow attacking musika wearing battle AB, and now moving on wanderers.

[HeresNatan]

Wanderers aren't only a Gauche caviar class

They are sexy as much... OP hotness   

celebrity

 

 

[yaguhLOLOL]

!!!
Omfg, I forgot about this thread I was hella busy leveling on Restart.

Didn't wanna read everything but just wanna reiterate that there's justice needed for performer classes.

This isnt just a matter of Severe Rainstorm but a matter of the limited 3rd class skill options and how useful the skills are.

 

Our solo 3rd class skill options are :

1) severe rainstorm - pvm - decent damage

2) deep sleep lullaby - pvp/WoE - useless (the effect is close to 0% and it last less than Arullo)

3) Reverbation - any - semi useless (damage is split - only useful to use skills on )

4) Metallic Sound - any - useless imo (solo target, damage is comparably low, only useful to drain sp)

5) Death Valley - Pvm - kinda useful (res people in case no AB/no bgem/leaf)

6) Song of Despair - any - useful but has it gambles ( it effects allies in pvp/woe and COMPARED TO SURAS with CC / GENES with Thorn Trap /Fiberlock Accessory its useless) 

7) Gloomy Shyness - any - USELESS (it's a gamble - it can buff damage of skills but risk of strippin dragon.... like please make either a buff or debuff zzzz)

8) Improve Song - any - useless 

9) circle of nature - pvp/woe - USELESS (was once required to get to cancel deep sleep / sirens voice)

10) Siren's Voice - any - semi useful but the nerf made it HELLA BAD! once upon a time, siren's voice worked to where it only goes off by another performer or until the performer theirself hits the target, now the effect wears out if the target gets hit by anyone.....

 

Our chorus skills are all -_-TY PVP/WoE Wise. Barely any performers left, let alone enough to put 2 in oneparty >.>

1) Saturday Night Fever got insanely nerfed; normally you can keep casting until it works NOW it doesnt even work like that..... and the time effect on it is BAD as HELL. the cast time puts caster at risk too

2) Dances With Warg was nerfed a bit from my research and imuke shield just makes ranger damage = -_-ty. plus gets canceled with sirens so if i cast sirens in my precast for protection....bye bye buff

3) Lerad's Dew barely gives HP bonus and canceled my siren's so USELESS.

4) Sinking Melody used to be the -_-, but it's success rate is so -_-ty =( and the cast puts caster at risk.... 

5) warcry from beyond was alright but it works differently then one would think so if this could be further elaborated that would be nice :x

 

all of the skills needs a buff in success rate, how long it last, and making buffs buff all of guildies/members 

[fuyukikun]

SR is not decent, it is fantastic.
Have you tried metallic sound with mob scarf set, it is decent now. Still not a good DPS skill, but already better.

[Silvianna]

Ohh i do understand,

what he mean in PVP/WoE all the debuff/support skills are useless  because the success rate is low / the effect got nerfed ?

so he want them to buff Wandy a bit

 

not in PvM i think.

[HeresNatan]

SR is not decent, it is fantastic.
Have you tried metallic sound with mob scarf set, it is decent now. Still not a good DPS skill, but already better.

 

Well... in my opinion SR is'nt fantastic but will be good with bio hat XD... not that bad, but not that good since dont hit as good like  we do with izlude eggs...

its like get that: 400-500k to get 60k in deafult a mvp with 2m HP

 

.. But anyway, Also can better with your 1stat int performer XD...

 

Mettalic sound fantastic? lol... 100k dmg (mob scarf build) with righ cooldown

100k 1 target  not good to leveling, not good to pvp, mvp, AV is so much better even if it's not good enough...

 

Do you have fun with MS?

Cause its so nothing to nothig even to have fun     .. i preffer improvised song...

Or you think that a mob scarf  improvised song is good too   

 

 

https://gaming.youtu...g&feature=share

Edited by HeresNatan, 23 July 2017 - 01:46 PM.

[HeresNatan]

!!!
Omfg, I forgot about this thread I was hella busy leveling on Restart.

Didn't wanna read everything but just wanna reiterate that there's justice needed for performer classes.

This isnt just a matter of Severe Rainstorm but a matter of the limited 3rd class skill options and how useful the skills are.

 

Our solo 3rd class skill options are :

1) severe rainstorm - pvm - decent damage

2) deep sleep lullaby - pvp/WoE - useless (the effect is close to 0% and it last less than Arullo)

3) Reverbation - any - semi useless (damage is split - only useful to use skills on )

4) Metallic Sound - any - useless imo (solo target, damage is comparably low, only useful to drain sp)

5) Death Valley - Pvm - kinda useful (res people in case no AB/no bgem/leaf)

6) Song of Despair - any - useful but has it gambles ( it effects allies in pvp/woe and COMPARED TO SURAS with CC / GENES with Thorn Trap /Fiberlock Accessory its useless) 

7) Gloomy Shyness - any - USELESS (it's a gamble - it can buff damage of skills but risk of strippin dragon.... like please make either a buff or debuff zzzz)

8) Improve Song - any - useless 

9) circle of nature - pvp/woe - USELESS (was once required to get to cancel deep sleep / sirens voice)

10) Siren's Voice - any - semi useful but the nerf made it HELLA BAD! once upon a time, siren's voice worked to where it only goes off by another performer or until the performer theirself hits the target, now the effect wears out if the target gets hit by anyone.....

 

Our chorus skills are all -_-TY PVP/WoE Wise. Barely any performers left, let alone enough to put 2 in oneparty >.>

1) Saturday Night Fever got insanely nerfed; normally you can keep casting until it works NOW it doesnt even work like that..... and the time effect on it is BAD as HELL. the cast time puts caster at risk too

2) Dances With Warg was nerfed a bit from my research and imuke shield just makes ranger damage = -_-ty. plus gets canceled with sirens so if i cast sirens in my precast for protection....bye bye buff

3) Lerad's Dew barely gives HP bonus and canceled my siren's so USELESS.

4) Sinking Melody used to be the , but it's success rate is so -_-ty =( and the cast puts caster at risk.... 

5) warcry from beyond was alright but it works differently then one would think so if this could be further elaborated that would be nice :x

 

all of the skills needs a buff in success rate, how long it last, and making buffs buff all of guildies/members 

 

200% d'accord 

XD

[PervySageMarty]

People complaining about SR must be complaining why survival is so low, doing high SR damage is nice, but if you cant defend yourself long enough to fell the mobs then its kinda bad...

[HeresNatan]

People complaining about SR must be complaining why survival is so low, doing high SR damage is nice, but if you cant defend yourself long enough to fell the mobs then its kinda bad...

yeah... u're right.. SR will get good gears... but you 're wrong only about one thing

If we don't ask for buffs (not that bad since SR isn't that OP and it's the only AoE skill), they wont give us nothing....

Also better damage gears= higher HP proc...

 

I love another maestro skills.... but they dont care about that, and they wont to do balance.... so sad..

Tarot, unbarring....

so style...

 

the hipster class   

[fuyukikun]

SR survivability SC is better than performer since they can combo it with feint bomb to escape. While performers only rely on maneuvering to not being mobbed while kiting them on SR AOE.

[fuyukikun]

Dopost

Edited by fuyukikun, 24 July 2017 - 02:49 PM.