27 replies to this topic

[Phreshes]

I will try to put this in the most polite way, but I know for sure that I am gonna get blasted away anyways either by the community or the staff itself, so I am just gonna put it out there.

If you are going to read this I do not know how you are going to take this post, positively or negatively. You are free to express your opinion on it and you are free to disagree or agree as well. One may see the post as a rant, if I lost your interest already, save yourself some time and don't bother to read. In this topic I use the person "We" / "Us" when I target the community, if you don't want that, pretend I am talking from my perspective (i) only. I will find it sad if the topic gets locked or deleted, as that will just prove my point. Here goes.

 

TLDR; I/We want the staff to take action and to request help from their fellow Warpportal staff members. It is clear to see that with whatever topic we start we achieve nothing, we raise issues, voice opinions, start discussions and conversations but every single time nothing happened in the end. It is time the staff takes action. The goal is to get the staff involved, ultimately to get a bigger development team working on ROSE Online, some marketing and most importantly that the higher power recognize us and ROSE Online.

It is obvious to see that the game is going downhill (NOTE: I am not starting an uproar or whatsoever or am not intending to start a rally against the rules, just stating the facts). Whatever attempt the community makes to provide proposals, suggestions, possible solutions for whatever issue, constructive discussions or constructive critism, is Never heard or received by the staff nor Warpportal. We have been doing this for more than years and many, I say many, well-thought or thought-through proposals have been made since but have never been given the proper attention needed. There is no point having a proposal section if nothing gets to see the light anyway, there is no point in having a community forum if opinions are not welcome.

We are currently in a situation where everything in game seems to be a mess, the community is crooked and selfish to the fullest, the economy is beyond waterfalls and out of reach for any new player, there is this ever ongoing duping issue which never gets fixed, all the items eventually get account locked, whatever opinion we raise is shutdown by the staff, the staff always has something backed up by saying its against the rules. <breath> A majority of the areas in ROSE are descendants from Desert of the Dead, everything is a ghosttown, new players join and quit after they reach Valley of Luxem tower, the rich are selfish af and will not agree with any proposal that cut their wealth, the poor will never make money unless they join a clan that dupes or grinds their way up to max and do dungeons. Quests are not worth it, too time consuming and the reward is like giving a kid a tootsie roll for running 10 laps. <breath> Our main and only developer Genesis, has not been online (on forums) for nearly a month, we get a new CM for what use? welcome btw. Every addressed issue gets the default response that its a work in progress. We have been coping with issues from months ago still to this day. Don't get me started on the <beep> ton of bugs. The test server has been offline for months, the costume quality does not fit the ROSE theme in anyway (targetting the community contests), the costume community contest are receiving bad quality entries just so they get the IM points, and we have to deal with that. Its fun to notice the first entry was posted ~3-4 days before the deadline, but hey we dont give af about the quality, except for the reward. If it is a community contest, at least give us the right to like or dislike an entry.

If you have lost respect for me or disagree with what I said, that is fine with me, I am not here to gain your respect or trying to make you agree with me. Having said that, staff, isn't it clear that there are members of the community who try their best to make ROSE great "again"? Every single proposal gets shutdown or does not even get heard. Isnt it clear that what we need is a way to populate the game and not focus on content that the new player never gets to see anyways? Isnt it clear that with every proposal, discussion, opinion or conversation we start, we lowkey cry for the attention of the staff to make changes? Isnt it clear that we try to announce the current state of the game and deeply feel something needs to be done asap to prevent further consequences?

In my opinion, I think it's time that YOU, the staff, should request help and support from the whole Warpportal team and to let them Focus on ROSE online more. It is time that YOU, the staff, requests more work power, an expanded development team to focus on fixing everything stated above for ROSE Online. Don't tell me the team is too little and we have to deal with the team we have, because hey you haven't opened 3 (The-uh-ree!) Ragnarok games right? If you, the staff, care about ROSE in anyway, atleast try to do something with the power you have. Because, obviously, we the community have no power at all and every voice we raise will not be heard anyways. We are the puppets that are controlled, we can not do or say anything ourselves, we get punished for saying something wrong - we will not receive the proper attention anymore. You are the puppeteer, and controll, you decide and your voice is heard. If you want to make a show, you better make sure the scenery is top notch, so that the puppets get to play in a good scenery, and amuse the audience - and you get cash.

 

I truly care about this game, even so much that I take the time till 02;00AM to write this post while I have to wake up early for work. If you feel like I am just bashing and ranting around, trust me, I have given my 2 cents over the years, and trust me when I say, there are others that have done much greater so.

Edited by Phreshes, 10 August 2017 - 01:22 PM.

[calder12]

I'd like to go on record asking the moderators not to delete this thread, rather just monitor it. If we can have a clear and mature discussion on the state of the game and possible solutions that benefits us all.

 

For the most part I agree with you. I am not really sure the game is in decline, I come back every few years and if anything it's just stagnant more than declining. As to the community, I am primarily a solo player, I don't talk a lot so maybe my opinion here is off, but for the most part I think the community is pretty decent. There is a vendor that names their shop "proper prices for ..." at least I think it is always the same person, and they buy and sell for acceptable prices. In Zant quite often which is nice to see people not profiting off newbies the way so often happened in the past. I was accepted into Truth, which is a clan that has a mandate of helping, and they're all great people that have answered a myriad of my questions and helped me find my game again.

 

As to the issues this frustrates me too, especially duping because it IS fixable. Trust me on that. In fact 3+ years ago I sent a PM to Leonis explaining why it was possible. Either he didn't believe me, didn't care or no one knew how to actually implement the fix. Regardless there is no excuse for it to still be an issue.

 

When it comes to developers, and the fact we only have one, this is a place where the company could turn to the community. There are people here who know how the game works and are more than capable of creating basic gear, carts, quests etc. It isn't that difficult, and it isn't honestly that time consuming, but when you only have one person doing all of it, well it just doesn't get done. Now some are going to give some BS reason that it's a company and they aren't allowed to do this, that is garbage. Lots of modern games incorporate community built content into their games. They have IM points they can pay with if cash is an issue, most would accept that.

 

There are other points about why this particular server is hurting that I'd love to make, but that is against the rules. A rule that in cases like this needs to be suspended or at least the complete silencing needs to stop. If you aren't allowed to reference competition you can't grow.

 

Like the OP I am not slamming the game, or hating on it, quite the contrary. I don't believe either of us would have bothered to post if we hated the game or didn't care. I think having this discussion shows very clearly a desire for the game to survive and thrive.

 

For a 12 year old game this game still looks decent. It's still fun and it has potential. It needs attention though, and by attention I don't mean shutting the servers down for 4 hours on a Friday night to update the Lucky Spin items. It needs to focus on being a great game, and if that means a little less immediate focus on pushing the Item Mall then maybe that is what needs to happen.

 

I'd like this discussion to continue, to debate ideas, and for the staff to be involved. Whether that happens remains to be seen, but a guy can hope.

Edited by calder12, 03 August 2017 - 03:21 PM.

[Feuer]

I like the entirety of both your posts.

 

But I'd like to point out:

A: Genesis hasn't been on the forums for a month [like Phreshes noted] and has absolutely no interest in the forums at all. Reaching him requires you go through a CM.

B: Lark is gone. As literally the only way to get Genesis attention was through her as the CM, that option is now gone. I mean no offense to the new CM that's taking over for Lark, but they're fresh, new to the community and possibly the company. They're going to do the standard of jumping through the hoops, giving the same copy+paste responses they're instructed to do [the ones written by the PR person to be generic, uninformative and vague] and nothing will come of it.

C: Until the either the new CM gets acclimated to the game, or Genesis returns, absolutely nothing will be done on this matter. Policy changes won't be made, and feedback will not be heard.

D: Forum MOD's don't particularly count, as they're not paid, and have absolutely no say in the game content. They can't host events, nor can they even mute spammers or kick botters / dupers from the game.

 

In short, right now is the worst time to expect any change for the better. We're effectively on a one man show with a new CM who'll be a PR puppet -no offense intended- and the complete disinterest of the upper management. We're the cash cow, the whale of Warpportal, Sadly, I suspect it will forever remain that way. Cheaper solutions to non-issues, silencing of anyone pointing it out, and ignorance of the real problems with nothing more than dismissive statements of "we're working on it" to quell the outrage. 

[Buffiies]

This is a very good post and I like it's being discussed because it needed to happen someday. I hope the staff takes a close look at this and read.

Edited by Buffiies, 04 August 2017 - 12:57 AM.

[MarK1789]

the costume quality does not fit the ROSE theme in anyway (targetting the community contests), the costume community contest are receiving bad quality entries just so they get the IM points, and we have to deal with that. Its fun to notice the first entry was posted ~3-4 days before the deadline, but hey we dont give af about the quality, except for the reward. If it is a community contest, at least give us the right to like or dislike an entry.

 

I thought I was the only one.. cause every time they release the new costumes the comments are all good.. like seriously? pls stop the costume contest focus on making new content.. maybe something that will actually welcome new players, something that will actually make them enjoy the game.. or just something that will put all maps of rose to use.. something like Cards? like ragnarok where in they have cards that gives Good stats/effects but can only be hunted in low lvl maps.. or something to that effect.

[calder12]

Aside from the quality of the designs, is the quality of the implementation. I quite like the pixie wings, but they're rendered on a flat plane. Seriously, Rose already suffers from an engine that requires very low poly counts in items, rendering them on flat plains just makes it look worse. 

 

Quality matters. This is another concern that we should be addressing.

[Feuer]

I thought I was the only one.. cause every time they release the new costumes the comments are all good.. like seriously? pls stop the costume contest focus on making new content.. maybe something that will actually welcome new players, something that will actually make them enjoy the game.. or just something that will put all maps of rose to use.. something like Cards? like ragnarok where in they have cards that gives Good stats/effects but can only be hunted in low lvl maps.. or something to that effect.

 

No, you'r far from the only one. Anytime I have anything negative to say about that specific area, my comments are deleted, and I'm given 'warnings' from random MOD's who are never on and haven't played the game actively for several years. They silence anyone who doesn't like the costumes so it seems and reads like it's always positive. But that's far from the case. 

[dixymen]

Everything everyone has said so far is completely true and valid. This is the biggest issue - it's there lowest performing title on the books. Ragnarok is the focus, always has been, says it right in the sec filings.

 

https://www.sec.gov/...d506087d20f.htm

 

 

The amount of revenues from R.O.S.E. Online represented less than 1% of our total revenues in each of 2016 and 2015.

 

They can't justify putting any additional (or any, as it seems) resources towards the game so would rather milk it further from the cow it's become over the past 2-3 years.

 

Edited by dixymen, 04 August 2017 - 11:58 PM.

[Feuer]

I'd like to propose that if from this point on, you feel you're being silenced,  and haven't broken any rules, you submit a ticket in addition to whatever action you feel in necessary, to alert the support staff. Think of it as a quality survey constructed manually via the input into the support system. It might not only help the staff assess how their actions are received by us, but to be more aware of the issues. The forums don't seem to be a medium they use to conduct research on anymore, so perhaps it's time to take it directly to them via support tickets. Cheers. 

Edited by Feuer, 05 August 2017 - 10:37 AM.

[calder12]

To be fair, I am pleased this topic has been allowed to remain. It would be nice to at least get one staff member to chime in, but letting it live is at least a good thing.

[iMatt]

I would love to see a Q&A twitch stream session with Genesis and a CM, to answer questings regarding Rose...example: I see a big issue in the rune system, simply because no (close to) equal gems were released to close the gap between "god tier" fully runed characters and characters which try to gear up....same with potion, why do we have no new consumable tiers since 2008? etc etc etc

[Phreshes]

For the most part I agree with you. I am not really sure the game is in decline, I come back every few years and if anything it's just stagnant more than declining. As to the community, I am primarily a solo player, I don't talk a lot so maybe my opinion here is off, but for the most part I think the community is pretty decent. There is a vendor that names their shop "proper prices for ..." at least I think it is always the same person, and they buy and sell for acceptable prices. In Zant quite often which is nice to see people not profiting off newbies the way so often happened in the past. I was accepted into Truth, which is a clan that has a mandate of helping, and they're all great people that have answered a myriad of my questions and helped me find my game again.

 

[...]

 

For a 12 year old game this game still looks decent. It's still fun and it has potential. It needs attention though, and by attention I don't mean shutting the servers down for 4 hours on a Friday night to update the Lucky Spin items. It needs to focus on being a great game, and if that means a little less immediate focus on pushing the Item Mall then maybe that is what needs to happen.

 

I'd like this discussion to continue, to debate ideas, and for the staff to be involved. Whether that happens remains to be seen, but a guy can hope.

I have to correct myself for the part about the community, I meant to say a large part of the community is selfish and crooked. It is true that there are some kind people within the community still. I mainly target those who trash talk in ROSE via Trade-chat, when they get corned they call their clannies for help and those who make a big fuzz out of something small. A simple offer for an item nowadays is made fun of if the seller is not compliant with the offer, then immediately you are getting a shoutout for it in trade chat, fairly childish.

 

As for the second part, yes ROSE is in my opinion one of the better looking games who have aged quite some years. If you look to its sibling games here on Warpportal I always wonder why those are more popular than ROSE is, but then ofcourse there are some obvious answers to that question. I truly feel that with whatever power we have we must bring these issues to light by the Warpportal Team, like Feuer said, if needed, directly contact them through their ticket system.

 

I like the entirety of both your posts.

 

But I'd like to point out:

A: Genesis hasn't been on the forums for a month [like Phreshes noted] and has absolutely no interest in the forums at all. Reaching him requires you go through a CM.

B: Lark is gone. As literally the only way to get Genesis attention was through her as the CM, that option is now gone. I mean no offense to the new CM that's taking over for Lark, but they're fresh, new to the community and possibly the company. They're going to do the standard of jumping through the hoops, giving the same copy+paste responses they're instructed to do [the ones written by the PR person to be generic, uninformative and vague] and nothing will come of it.

C: Until the either the new CM gets acclimated to the game, or Genesis returns, absolutely nothing will be done on this matter. Policy changes won't be made, and feedback will not be heard.

D: Forum MOD's don't particularly count, as they're not paid, and have absolutely no say in the game content. They can't host events, nor can they even mute spammers or kick botters / dupers from the game.

 

In short, right now is the worst time to expect any change for the better. We're effectively on a one man show with a new CM who'll be a PR puppet -no offense intended- and the complete disinterest of the upper management. We're the cash cow, the whale of Warpportal, Sadly, I suspect it will forever remain that way. Cheaper solutions to non-issues, silencing of anyone pointing it out, and ignorance of the real problems with nothing more than dismissive statements of "we're working on it" to quell the outrage. 

Thank you for clarifying those points, it is unfortunate to realize that those who I thought were capable of making a change have no / very little power as well, and by reaching the one who actually does have some power it requires quite some work to get to. Feels like we are in the chain and the experience of bureaucrasy to me, even though we are not working there.

 

I'd like to propose that if from this point on, you feel you're being silenced,  and haven't broken any rules, you submit a ticket in addition to whatever action you feel in necessary, to alert the support staff. Think of it as a quality survey constructed manually via the input into the support system. It might not only help the staff assess how their actions are received by us, but to be more aware of the issues. The forums don't seem to be a medium they use to conduct research on anymore, so perhaps it's time to take it directly to them via support tickets. Cheers. 

Unfortunately thats the truth, the forum quite seems like a place for us to say what's on our mind in the hopes that changes will made but in the end we are silenced anyways. I like the idea, I will also try to contact Warpportal and its team through other possible ways, but I have yet had the time to look into those.

 

To be fair, I am pleased this topic has been allowed to remain. It would be nice to at least get one staff member to chime in, but letting it live is at least a good thing.

Me too, hopefully this topic won't get deleted or locked, what we can do is to keep it civil and clean. One of the goals of this topic is, like you said, to get the staff involved.

 

I would love to see a Q&A twitch stream session with Genesis and a CM, to answer questings regarding Rose...example: I see a big issue in the rune system, simply because no (close to) equal gems were released to close the gap between "god tier" fully runed characters and characters which try to gear up....same with potion, why do we have no new consumable tiers since 2008? etc etc etc

Unfortunately I think the answers are fairly simple to the raised questions. I think the development team is just too small and has to prioritize certain features over other features, in addition I think that Genesis only has the power to implement said features, and does not have the privilege to make priorities as them come from higher up, the higher power. But I can be wrong, perhaps Feuer knows more about it and can enlighten us on this? Also, I think in the past we have had a QnA before and if I remember correctly Feuer, and some other members, had some good questions regarding the game-state-of-the-art and more technical related questions. But quite a lot of technical questions weren't even answered or have been given the default response of "we are working on it".

Edited by Phreshes, 06 August 2017 - 06:38 AM.

[Phreshes]

I have made a post on Warpportal's Facebook page with the following message:

 

As it seems it's impossible to get hold of any Warpportal employee, specifically ROSE Online employees, I will share our concerns through the provided media. 

 

We, a majority of the ROSE Online community, truly feel our game does not get the attention it deserves. By saying the attention it deserves I aim at the Warpportal Team who is in control of making priorities and creating teams, as well do I aim the higher power. We have been silenced too many times whenever we raised our voices for the goodwill of ROSE Online. Over the years we have been giving a lot of constructive feedback, proposals and suggestions, possible solutions and opinions to help the team controlling, noticing and realising issues. We have had civil and mature conversations and discussions to figure out what could be good for ROSE Online. But whatever voice we raised is never heard or it had been shutdown by the staff.

 

It is unfortunate, but obvious, to see that ROSE Online is the game that is given the least amount of interest or attention from the Warpportal team. We feel forgotten, desolated and abonded by the Warpportal team and start to believe we are the cow that gets milked untill it has no more to give.

 

ROSE Online was once a great game with a huge player base and so much potentional. Nowadays we feel lucky to even be able to login to the game still, but I hate to see that taken away from us as well. There is this part of the community, new and old members, who truly care about ROSE Online and only hope to see the better days of it. It has been years that we have been playing in a dark-hole and think now is the right time to give this game a little more shine. We hope our voices will make the Warpportal Team notice and recognize our game more and seek support and help from the team to focus more on ROSE Online. We are tired to see the same message every single time we raise our voice and get silenced in the end.

 

We discuss and have conversations, we hope to get the Warpportal team involved in our conversation and hope you, Warpportal, will recognize our game again and give it the attention it deserves. Ragnarok has been given so much attention lately, we feel that now is our time.

 

Join our conversation on the Warpportal forums in the ROSE Online section, direct link to the topic: https://forums.warpp...-taking-action/

 

 

 

The next couple of days whenever I find time to focus on ROSE Online I will try to contact whomever from the Warpportal team through other media I haven't touched yet. I don't want this topic to be just raised and forgotten, I want action to be taken.

 

Edited by Phreshes, 08 August 2017 - 08:26 AM.

[beachbabyc]

I have to say I totally agree with everything you said Phreshes!  Thank you for giving us a voice!  I just hope it makes a difference.

Edited by beachbabyc, 09 August 2017 - 04:28 PM.

[KatsuraKujo]

This post is amazing and finally someone notices the important things in regards to this game. FULL SUPPORT ALL THE WAY!

Edited by KatsuraKujo, 10 August 2017 - 06:57 AM.

[kappakeepokupo]

I don't play Rose, but as a fellow WP customer I wish you all the best.

[HoneyBunz]

I have to say that this vigilante approach is not something I agree with or support so please do not imply that you speak for all or even most of the ROSE community because you definitely do not.

 

Thb, I think it's insulting to go above the ROSE team's head and "ask for help".  Despite the current issues, the game has been chugging along for 12 years give or take and continues to chug along. Things that are broken are being worked on. Some issues take longer to resolve than others but just because you don't always see the team here at the forum, it does not mean they aren't doing everything possible. Who is to say they need your "help" in getting them more help?  If you have ever worked for a big company, you'd know how counter-productive that approach is. I've managed to get many things changed or improved by quietly working behind the scenes. Ofc, I have never been one to want the spotlight either. I don't need or want to be the center of attention.

 

We have a brand new cm and it will take her some time to get up to speed on everything but I have found her to be willing to listen and eager to learn about ROSE.  We all loved Lark but in a big company, employees are often moved around. We are lucky to have AndraSyte as our cm. The job of the community manager is to handle the forum and social media and to be the go- between for the community and the devs/ producers. That system makes perfect sense. The cm's are very active on the forum and she will be more and more as she gets used to everything. Rather than question why we need her, why not support her and help her learn about this game that we all love so much.

 

Not sure where you get your information but I meet new people pretty much every day and no, they don't all  "quit when they get to Luxem".  Yes, prices in Junon are insane but players are to blame for that. As in any other game, players drive the economy. There are greedy players in every online game. It's a shock for new people but nothing sold in a player shop is necessary to play and enjoy the game.  The important things can be gotten in the game itself with some time and effort. The Item Mall contains items of convenience for those who want to and can afford to get them but not required.

 

As for suggestions- I just took a look at the most recent two pages and honestly with a few exceptions, most of them are just self-serving. Some person wants w/e to serve their own personal ends and that's what prompts them to make a suggestion.  Genesis has to look at the whole picture and how one change affects everything else. Suggestions that are logical and wanted by a majority of the community often get implemented in some fashion. A good example of that is Junon Cartel. Every suggestion is brought to the staff for consideration. Not sure what more you'd want to happen.

 

Some things get account or character bound but guess what? That is no different from every other mmorpg. It was a new concept in ROSE but it's been in the game for over 3 years now. Time to accept and move on.  Anyway, bound items can be unbound and you can get the unbinder ingame if you don't want to buy one from the Item Mall.

 

Regarding the costume contests- I think it's wonderful that we even have something like this. The website should be revamped and that fact should be featured. A player created item can be permanently added to the official ROSE game. We should advertise that- it's very impressive for a new or prospective player to see. I experienced firsthand how subjective community voting  is during the Ms ROSE contest. Also, only the staff knows how or if a design can be modified and added to the game so it makes sense that they are the ones to decide the winners. There just needs to be a thorough investigation to be sure that nothing is taken from someone else's work and when one of us does find something suspicious, it should be brought to the attention of the cm via private message.

 

This turned out to be a much longer post than I ever intended but this is long enough lol. I truly do love this game and I will continue to work with the staff to improve it rather than trying to destroy it with threats/false statements and implications that they can't do their jobs.

 

 

 

[Ballistic]

In all honesty, a lot of the issues that you bring up are the same issues that were in the game when i left.  This game will never get fully developed and will never get the attention it needs to be successful.  You have to be content with fixes that are not really fixes and most of the time (regardless of the cm) the pleas and complaints of the community will be ignored.  I played this game from the start and even when it went pay to play.  I just finally gave up and moved on.  I'm glad it is still around, but don't expect it to be fixed, because it never will be.  

[Phreshes]

I don't play Rose, but as a fellow WP customer I wish you all the best.

Thank you for your support, I appreciate it!

 

1. I have to say that this vigilante approach is not something I agree with or support so please do not imply that you speak for all or even most of the ROSE community because you definitely do not.

 

2. Thb, I think it's insulting to go above the ROSE team's head and "ask for help".  Despite the current issues, the game has been chugging along for 12 years give or take and continues to chug along. Things that are broken are being worked on. Some issues take longer to resolve than others but just because you don't always see the team here at the forum, it does not mean they aren't doing everything possible. Who is to say they need your "help" in getting them more help?  If you have ever worked for a big company, you'd know how counter-productive that approach is. I've managed to get many things changed or improved by quietly working behind the scenes. Ofc, I have never been one to want the spotlight either. I don't need or want to be the center of attention.

 

3. We have a brand new cm and it will take her some time to get up to speed on everything but I have found her to be willing to listen and eager to learn about ROSE.  We all loved Lark but in a big company, employees are often moved around. We are lucky to have AndraSyte as our cm. The job of the community manager is to handle the forum and social media and to be the go- between for the community and the devs/ producers. That system makes perfect sense. The cm's are very active on the forum and she will be more and more as she gets used to everything. Rather than question why we need her, why not support her and help her learn about this game that we all love so much.

 

4. Not sure where you get your information but I meet new people pretty much every day and no, they don't all  "quit when they get to Luxem".  Yes, prices in Junon are insane but players are to blame for that. As in any other game, players drive the economy. There are greedy players in every online game. It's a shock for new people but nothing sold in a player shop is necessary to play and enjoy the game.  The important things can be gotten in the game itself with some time and effort. The Item Mall contains items of convenience for those who want to and can afford to get them but not required.

 

5. As for suggestions- I just took a look at the most recent two pages and honestly with a few exceptions, most of them are just self-serving. Some person wants w/e to serve their own personal ends and that's what prompts them to make a suggestion.  Genesis has to look at the whole picture and how one change affects everything else. Suggestions that are logical and wanted by a majority of the community often get implemented in some fashion. A good example of that is Junon Cartel. Every suggestion is brought to the staff for consideration. Not sure what more you'd want to happen.

 

6. Some things get account or character bound but guess what? That is no different from every other mmorpg. It was a new concept in ROSE but it's been in the game for over 3 years now. Time to accept and move on.  Anyway, bound items can be unbound and you can get the unbinder ingame if you don't want to buy one from the Item Mall.

 

7. Regarding the costume contests- I think it's wonderful that we even have something like this. The website should be revamped and that fact should be featured. A player created item can be permanently added to the official ROSE game. We should advertise that- it's very impressive for a new or prospective player to see. I experienced firsthand how subjective community voting  is during the Ms ROSE contest. Also, only the staff knows how or if a design can be modified and added to the game so it makes sense that they are the ones to decide the winners. There just needs to be a thorough investigation to be sure that nothing is taken from someone else's work and when one of us does find something suspicious, it should be brought to the attention of the cm via private message.

 

8. This turned out to be a much longer post than I ever intended but this is long enough lol. I truly do love this game and I will continue to work with the staff to improve it rather than trying to destroy it with threats/false statements and implications that they can't do their jobs.

First of all, thank you for taking the time and effort to voice your opinion and to give your input on this topic, I am welcome for discussions and appreciate it to stand corrected when I am wrong. Your post is a rather long post so I numbered them and give them my opinion / reply to each. I apologize in advance if I take some things you stated wrong or make wrong accusations based on your comments in the post.

 

1. I have clearly stated in the original post that if you don't agree with me talking for the community that you should see this post as I am talking for myself and my perspective only. That this topic is written from my opinion. I think in the society we live nowadays a single opinion is quickly considered a bash or rant and is given no attention. If I had written this topic truly from the first person perspective I haven't had gotten the attention on this topic that I wanted. One of the goals of this topic is that I wanted to start an open discussion where anyone can voice their opinion. Having said that, I know there are people ingame and guests on the forums who have the same or similar opinion like me but don't have a forum account to share that opinion with. Therefore instead I chose to write from the perspective of the community - and give the disclaimer that if you did not agree with that you should see this from the first person pespective view, my opinion.
    
2. I have a different view on this matter. What I am trying to achieve is to raise awareness for the issues we have in ROSE and to have a bigger team focussing on ROSE. Our sibling Warpportal games, I am targeting the whole Ragnarok franchise, is given a lot of attention, good for them really. What I think is just a little fair is that ROSE is also given a little more attention so that (old) issues won't continuously be raised and hopefully will be solved more quickly. I think we live in a gaming era where everything has to be fast, this has to fast, that has to be fast, fixes have to be solved more quickly. Because if you look at the bigger games in the ocean it is not acceptable anymore to have old issues laying around that can be exploited or be used for unfair advantages. Not is it fair only for the game its community, but also is it good for the game its own health or to say, its own reputation. How could they fix such issues faster is by having a bigger team. It's not that they need My help to get help, it is just that I want to raise awareness of the issues and how a part of the community slowly gets frustrated and dissatisfied more. Perhaps the ROSE team is aware of this already, but I am not sure if the (higher) Warpportal team is aware of this, and if they were I think it would only be fair to put a little more work-power on ROSE. The only reasonable way I see that possibly happening is by making our staff do it or by raising awareness. But it seems you disagree with me on that.
    
3. I have been alerted by Feuer about this matter. At the time of writing the original post I had no clue why all the sudden we have gotten a new CM, mainly the reason why - therefore I said in the post: for what use? If, according to you, it seems to be common to move around employees in big companies, why can't they move some developers to ROSE? That said, it would be good to have a go to topic where it states what the different titles of members on the forums mean, what their purpose is and what we can reach them for. Because in the end it is only through comments where I understand and learn what their purpose is. 
    
4. I get my information from reading the forums, reading the opinions of the members - yours often as well, observing ingame what is changing, observing in game what it currently looks like, starting new characters - forming a party with new members and playing through the game. I rarely voice my opinion, but after speculating and gathering information during the process, I will. Only if I truly believe I should. I haven't said "all" new players quit after they reach Luxem but I can understand where you are coming from because it is my fault of leaving words out. I partly agree with your statement that the current economy is our fault, however I hope you realize that the duping issue also plays a role in the current economy and I think that is something we are not all for to blame. It could have been fixed earlier if it was given the proper attention - but that is just my opinion.
    
5. Yes a lot of suggestions are self-serving but there are also good suggestions from which the whole community can benefit from. I am aware that Genesis has to prioritise the changes he is to make and that he has to look at the whole picture, I am a developer myself so I can relate. In addition, mainly because I can relate to Genesis, I have defended him in a previous post but unfortunately the post was removed by DragonLark because I stated something she felt I wasn't allowed to say or made the assumption with what I said I broke a rule. I asked her several times if she could send me the original comment so I could make proper adjustments to it and erase what caused my comment to be removed. I haven't been answered and I felt silenced and my commend went to vain. That aside, what I currently want the most to be looked at is the recently brought up topic about the ROSE economy. In there I feel there are several logical and reasonable suggestions which can solve something major that we started.
    
6. I am completely content with the locking / bounding thing. In fact, I have accepted it a long time ago, especially when I finished my Dragon mount collection, but I do not agree that (useful) items get locked because of the duping issue, to me that seems just the easy way out. Therefore I raised the issue that eventually everything will be account locked to make aware that instead of doing that, it would be better to look into the issue more deeply to get a permanent fix and not a temporary solution. I think it is fair to say that the attention is more focussed on end-game, which involves the action of continuously upgrading your armor to fit the situation better. Having the (useful) upgrade material to be locked is just painful to watch, yes it is a temporary solution, but in the end the dupers will find something else to dupe - this time it being the Upgrade material Boxes.
    
7. If I made the impression that I do not like the community costume contests I have to correct myself and perhaps word it better. In fact, I like the contest a lot, I often come up with ideas that I think could fit the theme of the said event. Unfortunately I find myself having little to no time to focus on designing a costume and am not able to finish nor start drawing the idea. I then believe I should not bother entering the contest because the drawing is unfinished. Perhaps it is just my personality, but I believe one should not enter a contest, where the winner gets to have its design in game, if you have a copy and pasted entry of just images on a clothing piece. Being a newcomer in drawing does not justify your quickly pasted entry. If you truly believe your design is neat atleast give it some more attention to further detail it, personally I am not asking for 3D models or whatsoever, but that is a perfect example how one should give their entry more attention.
    
8. I have never said the staff can't do their jobs and I have never said the staff do their jobs poorly. I only raised statements which I believe they could do and I have given my opinion if they are going to take action what I think they could be focussing on. I don't appreciate it when words are taken out of my mouth that I have never said. If you think my intentions were to destroy the game with this topic, then please, just don't. I think that is truly unfair to say. Perhaps I could have used better wording or was better of leaving more words in than currently are, but I felt the original post was long enough and long post usually don't catch the interest. If you think I have made false statements atleast tell me which, I have no use by you just saying that other than taking it personally as you are potraying me as a person I am not.

 

 

In all honesty, a lot of the issues that you bring up are the same issues that were in the game when i left.  This game will never get fully developed and will never get the attention it needs to be successful.  You have to be content with fixes that are not really fixes and most of the time (regardless of the cm) the pleas and complaints of the community will be ignored.  I played this game from the start and even when it went pay to play.  I just finally gave up and moved on.  I'm glad it is still around, but don't expect it to be fixed, because it never will be.  

That is exactly the issue I am trying to raise right now. I too have been playing the game from the start but not when it went pay-to-play because being a teenager at the time I 1. did not have the money and 2. was scared and insecure about internet transactions. Over the years I have taken a lot of actions with a grain of salt because in the end it is them to decide, and did move on. But I think it is this type of behaviour that I cannot agree with, things will be fixed in the end, but it can be fixed more quickly if ROSE gets the proper attention it deserves.

Edited by Phreshes, 12 August 2017 - 05:19 AM.

[calder12]

Honey and I have had this discussion privately and we're on opposite sides here, but I'll reiterate what I've said privately.

 

None of this should be taken as a slight on the current or even previous staff. If, on the infinitesimally small chance, someone in the upper management of WP is reading this, they need to understand that we don't think the Rose staff is doing a bad job. We don't think they're incapable of doing their jobs or that someone else could do it better. What we're suggesting is that the amount of development the game would require to bring some life back to it is simply too much for the size of the team. Nothing more.

 

I want to make it clear here, I am a developer for a living.

I have developed for Rose in the past.

 

So I am well aware of what it takes to create content, and to make that content balanced and fun, while balancing that with keeping the server running well. It's not an easy job and I commend Genesis for the job he's doing being a one man show, that isn't easy.

 

The thing is, and this goes for literally everything in life, the status quo is crap. Saying "it's good enough" isn't good enough, and it just creates this false sense of security or complacency. I said this before and I'll say it again, no one commenting here is hating on the game or the staff, quite the contrary, if we didn't care we wouldn't bother.

 

Are a lot of the requests in the suggestions self serving? Of course they are, by definition most requests are exactly that. Not all requests/suggestions are going to be good, but some are, the thing is the longer you have a suggestions area and don't implement any of them the more and more people don't bother. Part of the point of having this discussion is creating a dialogue with the staff and the users where there is genuine discourse.

 

Oh, and while we're at it, please stop with the "just PM them". This needs to be an open discussion where the players can see some sort of actual discussion otherwise it has no value.

[HoneyBunz]

Well, the last thing I want to do is to call attention to this thread because of its vigilante overtones so this will probably be my last post in here. Just wanted to reply to a few things.

 

You may have a disclaimer in this topic saying that this is just your opinion, but other places that I have seen you post, you start off with something like “The ROSE community…”. That clearly implies that you think you are representing the whole community and you definitely do NOT represent me or the many other players like me.  Anyone who has a WP account already has a forum account, so those who care to voice their opinion can easily do so.  Many players simply do not use forums.  They just play the game and enjoy themselves.  Maybe if there were more positive topics instead of rants, threats and negativity, more players would use the forum. Think of the first impression a guest or prospective player gets from a topic like this and then see if you still feel it helps the game or hurts it.

 

Warpportal is a business and  they allocate their resources based on many factors including profitability. They are not obliged to tell us why they make the decisions they make. Ragnarock is the franchise that generates the most income, therefore it gets more of the resources. But I’ve looked at the other game forums and they all have the same issues ROSE has despite having lots of “help”.  More people is not a guarantee of better or faster results.  Often too many people involved in something just makes things worse.

 

When Leo left, WP could have assigned ROSE to some already overworked producer who would barely glance at it but instead, they promoted Genesis. We are damn lucky that we have him. He is a true ROSE person and he has real love for this game,  Yes, he is just one man but I think he is doing a great job.  He had to finish everything that had been started while Leo was still here, and also learn his producer responsibilities. No one could have done better.

 

The issues that have yet to be fixed are being worked on every day.  There won’t be some kind of “announcement” as fixes are applied for obvious reasons. Many have already been quietly implemented while support continues to weed out the people engaging in illegal activities. The process is ongoing. It's taking longer than any of us would like but if Genesis feels he needs more help, he is more than capable of asking for it himself.  He doesn’t need anyone to speak for him.

 

As far as account locked items are concerned, personally I am fine with it. If you purchase something from the Item Mall, you are still able to gift it to your other accounts from the purchase tab in most cases. I know it’s always been this way here but I never did understand why those kinds of items could be sold in the game for zulie. It might be argued that account locking everything from the Item Mall would result in less sales but with IM boxes being duped and sold, I’d imagine that revenue has already been impacted.  If everything from the IM was account locked, there would be no incentive for people to dupe those items. I’m not advocating this action, just saying that the economy would be very different if only items gotten in-game (from monster drops or things crafted by an artisan) were all that could be sold.

 

With regard to suggestions, of course a suggestion will benefit the person who is making it because that’s what caused them to make it in the first place. But in addition to looking at how a suggestion affects every other aspect of the game, the staff also looks to see how popular the suggestion is with the community. That’s the reason there is a forum rule forbidding the bumping of topics other than in market sections.  For example, Feuer’s suggestions are always well presented and he tries to think of the ways his suggestion will affect gameplay as well as the bottom line.  Generally his suggestions are popular with the community.. That can not be said for most suggestions in general.

 

No matter what your true intentions are, a topic like this implies that you do not think Genesis can do his job and I find that very insulting to him. I’m pretty sure you would feel the same way if someone did this to you at your job. I know I wouldn’t like it or appreciate it. It’s extremely disrespectful and he does not deserve that.

 

 

Ps @calder12- We are indeed on opposite sides here, and no offense to you at all but you can’t compare your experiences as a ROSE developer to what Genesis deals with as a producer/dev for a legal game server. They are like apples and oranges, both technically fruit but that’s where the similarity ends.

 

 

 

[calder12]

As to your last comment I'd suggest that shows nothing but your complete misunderstanding of the position at hand and the work that goes into it. There are no technical differences, nor are their community differences, the only difference is the legal structure of the company and the fact I had no one but the community to answer to. My experiences with Rose and the inner working exceed most of the rest of the community, my understanding of programming in general as a living do as well, as does my understanding of how this looks as a reflection on Genesis, and I absolutely promise you no one is saying what you're implying and no one feels on either end that anyone is putting Genesis or his job in jeopardy.

 

I don't know what you do for a living, but I'm willing to bet it isn't in the tech sector, nor in gaming directly, the assumptions you make and the implications you put on things just don't exist in this sector the way you think they do. Not at any decent company at least. I think we've all made it very clear that no one is blaming Genesis, nor any of the staff, actually not even blaming the company. What we're doing is looking for a discourse with the staff, nothing more.

 

Here are some hints to take from game companies that make Warp Portal look like a joke in the sector.

 

1. Nothing has to be secret, gamers in general like to be kept in the loop and when they aren't they look for other ways to get info or cause problems. Hiding what's being worked on is stupid, it doesn't promote the game, it doesn't give anything to look forward to and sounds like a cop out.

 

2.Accepting community created content is intelligent, legal and completely above board. Tons of companies do this regularly, BIG companies.

 

3. Asking for discourse, and asking for communication is not being ungrateful, nor is it being insulting. What's insulting is the idea that we should just "live with it". That we aren't allowed to want better, because well hey you're happy with the status quo. I've said this multiple times and I'll say it again, if we didn't care about the game we wouldn't bother posting. I don't believe most of the people that agree with this post are here with personal agendas other than trying to rekindle the spirit Rose once had (one and admittedly you haven't been around the game long enough to actually witness first hand).

 

I'm getting more than a little tired of the "tow the company line, you guys are all bad people attitude". I like you, I really do and you and the clan have helped my character a lot. But I am getting rather tired of your condescending tone regarding my experience in this particular field, and your implications that the people that want better are somehow just greedy looking out for themselves only. I don't play this game for WP, I don't play it for Genesis, or any of the other staff, I give them my hard earned money to produce a good product, and if I have suggestions on how they can improve that product it is my right to say so without having to listen to someone tell me I'm being greedy.

The moderators are there in a heartbeat when people on the forums put down other members, or their costume ideas or whatever. Interesting they have no interest in handling the exact same behaviour directed at people that have questions or concerns about the game. It's okay to speak out against just those people? Is that how it works?

 

I come back to this game every few years, I leave shortly thereafter because it's the same thing, the same attitude, the same no communication with the community. Some day I guess I'll just walk away for good, no one will care, they'll still have their cheerleaders telling them what an awesome job they're doing as the community stays the same few people and turning over a few hundred new people a year that don't stay.

Edited by calder12, 12 August 2017 - 01:09 PM.

[Snuwfer]

The biggest issue I feel is the community

There's players in game that go to the extent of making fake life stories, to 1 up others, etc... I got told earlier today by an 19 year old ROSE player that he has a PHD.. 

There's players in game constantly duping, selling zulie to others, and so on...

There's players in game that have learned how to use a debugger and packet inject...

 

Packet Injection via DEBUGGER (A BIG PROBLEM)

Zulie sellers \ Faith sellers (A BIG PROBLEM, THEY'RE BEING DUPED INTO THE GAME) (they're getting removed though so I suppose ROSE team is watching those who duped them to begin with, not going to point any fingers)

A big issue I have, is if you go onto the ROSE Online face book groups, or even the official one and look at wall posts I recognize names in game that I have been acquainted with, literally trying to sell zulie on their facebook....

 

 

Start with our community first, then address the problems. (Of course duping should be changed first thing, that will require you to change the source code values so debuggers can't dupe\packet modify any longer on ROSE.)

IP-Ban\HWID bans are a thing in 2017 for almost every game for a reason, it's ok to HWID or IP Ban somebody.

I understand HWID can be bypassed, but it takes an effort and time to do that.

Does ROSE Online even have an anti-cheat? I remember long ago ROSE Online using GameGuard... but lately I don't think there is any protection.

 

 

 

You can't even go through and put proposals & suggestions anymore for the game without having community members lash out in nasty ways, that are un needed and don't help anybody nor the game.

Edited by Snuwfer, 12 August 2017 - 06:10 PM.

[HoneyBunz]

@calder12- I didn't mean to sound condescending and I apologize if it came off that way

 

 I was just referring to the fact that you did not work for a company, with rules and internal systems; with bosses to answer to and goals to achieve so your experiences are not the same. That's all

 

 

[calder12]

I appreciate that response, thank you. To be fair, as I said, I only answered to the community because I was "the boss" but also to be fair we weren't some fly by night operation run by kids, we had structure, quality control, and a staff that took their "jobs" seriously. I believe there were a lot more parallels than people realize.

 

Anyway, this has gotten completely off topic.

 

As I've said, we (I speak for myself and the people that have commented in kind, not everyone) would just like a discourse, a feeling that we actually matter. This post is now 10 days old and there has not been a single response from the staff. That isn't very encouraging is it? I don't expect, nor do I think anyone expects, them to come in here and just lay everything on the table, but as paying users (at least I am) I do expect for something that some of us take very seriously not to be utterly ignored for a week and a half.