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Flashbang Destroyer


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#1 Sheylaa

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Posted 31 August 2017 - 12:21 PM

Hi everyone, 

 

I just create this topic for say something about a skill : the flashbang of the destroyer ! This skill is totaly insane and too powerful .... u can be stun in the air !! and even if destroyer are already one of the best class for pvp 1v1, with this skill, they have like "a shield", "a protection ". It's too hard to go on a destroyer, u will be immediately stun for 4 SEC ! As for me, this skill is unbalanced and must be nerf !

 

Thanks for read my topic, 

 

~~ Good game ~~ 


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#2 Apocryphos

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Posted 31 August 2017 - 01:55 PM

Sad to see a complaint on a skill that was not working properly, now that's it's been fixed to not have lagwalk it now considered OP?, In reality the essence of the skill remains the same as before the change,stops the player for 4 seconds. Sorry you weren't receiving all the damage you were suppose to because you ran off on the destroyer's screen,  now that they finally fixed it destroyer has it's single crowd control skill working properly[with a weird flight path]. You should've voiced your concern in the following threads, but the general consensus there was along the lines of "As long as we can stop the lag walk from happening while keeping the duration".
https://forums.warpp...ternative-idea/
https://forums.warpp...work-feed-back/

 

b7e9ad0837f399ea7ac5f89be2eaf2b0.gif


Edited by Apocryphos, 31 August 2017 - 01:56 PM.

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#3 manege

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 10:47 PM

I do not see the difference from the flashbang to barbarian. Both "stuns" the opponent for 4 seconds.


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#4 Precrush

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 10:52 PM

Barbarian is easier to hit.
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#5 Onyzer

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 11:38 PM

Barbarian is easier to hit.

 

And has AoE and can hit from far away due to lag.


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#6 TurtleTuber

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Posted 16 September 2017 - 08:24 AM

Not like flashbang doesnt hit in a huge range thanks to lag huehuehue
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#7 easykill1215

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Posted 20 September 2017 - 04:57 AM

Not like flashbang doesnt hit in a huge range thanks to lag huehuehue


In the lag case u talked about the attacker still has to successfully land the Flashbang on the enemy in their screen to make the "huge range due to lag" happen. And about landing the Flashbang on the enemy, it's again about the attack range and aoe range and about both of this factor, it's nothing compares to barbarian. Try to control a destroyer and land a Flashbang on a moving enemy, then control an involker and use barbarian to do the same then you will see the difference huehuehue.
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#8 TurtleTuber

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Posted 20 September 2017 - 06:16 AM

sorry to disappoint you but Onyzer clearly said that Barbarian, compared to Flashbang can hit further thanks to "lag" and that Flashbang has no bugged range. I just pointed out that flashbang can also hit over a huge distance thanks to lag and no, the enemy doesnt need to be in the "original atk range" to get hit. why do i know his? watching 2 videos: people using flashbang while their opponent wasnt in range and they got stunned and vise versa. neither attacker nor victim were in range and it still hit.

 

and it was never a discussion about which skill is more affected by lag or more painful, so calm your horses and dont use huehuehue.


Edited by TurtleTuber, 20 September 2017 - 06:17 AM.

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#9 Kristof3195

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Posted 20 September 2017 - 09:27 AM

Nope I think its way too convenient of a skill. 100% stun for 4 sec nope. Ur comparing again just invokers and archers. How about my class rocket punch has just a 95% chance on lvl 10 and hitting it is way way more dificult since it does not hit fallen enemies. And dont come me with Rocket punch is easy to hit blah blah. What archers need to do is shotdown ( which hits no matter how hard u try ) AA spam to avoid air recovery and a easy Flashbang stun. What about Violent blow the random succes or death skill with a 25% chance to stun. Archers have too convenient stuns atm. 

 

PS : Dont compare every skill just between 2-3 classes there are others too :P


Edited by Kristof3195, 20 September 2017 - 09:30 AM.

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#10 Onyzer

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Posted 20 September 2017 - 09:50 AM

huehuehue

 

and it was never a discussion about which skill is more affected by lag or more painful, so calm your horses and dont use huehuehue.

 

Besides that, I never said Flash Bang didn't hit from far away thanks to lags. This is the case with every skill. Though, Flash Bang isn't affected by lags as much as Barbarian, because this is a projectile, and not an instant AoE spell.

 

 

@Kristof3195 : Sorry but I don't know many spells of other classes. And I'm comparing Barbarian and Flash Bang because they have some common points (and also because Invoker is the most used class in BSQ).


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#11 TurtleTuber

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Posted 20 September 2017 - 12:22 PM

"some common points" but points out before that one is an aoe spell and the other one a projectile. One hits targets at the ground and air, the other one not. One does stun, the other one does freeze.

I see.. many things in common. Almost the same skill huehue

Also why did you make an extra post just to mention that barb got an increased hit area if affected by lag without mentioning that flashbangs can also hit over the half map?! Arent you aware of that or did you just want to make one of these skills looking way worse than the other one without mentioning the flaws of flashbang?

Edited by TurtleTuber, 20 September 2017 - 12:34 PM.

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#12 Kristof3195

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Posted 20 September 2017 - 12:27 PM

Yes almost like Shadow leap and Ghost fighter teleports to the enemy target . Except for one thing. One is usefull the other is not guess which is which :P .

Back to the topic its slightly too long that stun in bsq facing 2 archers u gotta endure 8 seconds of x spam right in your face which is basicly a death sentence.


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#13 qweweqweqwq

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Posted 20 September 2017 - 09:27 PM

real hit box doesn't exist in this game


Edited by qweweqweqwq, 20 September 2017 - 09:27 PM.

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#14 NeaDCampbell

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Posted 20 September 2017 - 10:35 PM

Yes almost like Shadow leap and Ghost fighter teleports to the enemy target . Except for one thing. One is usefull the other is not guess which is which :P .

Back to the topic its slightly too long that stun in bsq facing 2 archers u gotta endure 8 seconds of x spam right in your face which is basicly a death sentence.

 

Boi pls dont talk bad about Shadow Leap if u dont know how to use it. :(

Thanks.


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#15 Onyzer

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Posted 21 September 2017 - 03:33 AM

and it was never a discussion about which skill is more affected by lag or more painful, so calm your horses and dont use huehuehue.

 

huehue

 

What I meant by "common points" is the 4s duration (which seems to be the problem here) and the effect, that is almost the same in BSQ. Because frozen or stunned, you don't launch the enemy in the air to let your OP classes kill the enemy. The only difference is that Archers will be able to use Shootdown on someone frozen (This is just an example, but other classes also have skills that are powerful, but launch the enemy). I guess I should have use the word "similarity" instead, sorry for that, english is not my native language.

 

About the extra range, I mentionned it because Barbarian is affected by it a lot because it is an instant spell, compared to Flash Bang which is a projectile. At least that's what I see, so maybe with a different delay it's different.

 

But my main point is : 4s for Flash Bang isn't too high. There are many other spells that can lock you for way longer like Blizzard or Rolling Stone or the same duration like Barbarian.


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#16 TurtleTuber

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Posted 21 September 2017 - 04:37 AM

So some common points is only the debuff/ status effect which lasts 4 seconds? And yes, freeze and stun is basically the same, because no one ever launches or knock down the enemy huehue.

For me it doesnt really matter if 3 seconds or 4. Also as you can see the whitescreen is already disappearing at 3.xx. not totally sure but i think you were already able to move when the whitescreen starts to disappear.
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#17 Precrush

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Posted 21 September 2017 - 04:41 AM

4 seconds isn't too long indeed when compared to other skills, but I can see where people come from with 100% stun rate making flash bang quite strong.


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#18 TurtleTuber

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Posted 21 September 2017 - 04:42 AM

How long lasts rocket punch stun? I think that duration quite fits for flashbang
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#19 Onyzer

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Posted 21 September 2017 - 08:18 AM

Yes, there is 100% success rate, but I'd like to mention that sometimes the enemy that you stun is stunned but still appears like if he was in mid-air, but on the ground. Which makes him impossible to attack and free to escape easily after the 4sec. Also, remember this is our only real control in 1vs1, I don't think people would enjoy us spamming chain combos to death. And in BSQ this is our only chance to lock + damage, because chain combos aren't meant to damage and are quite hard to use to lock to death in BSQ because of the FPS rate going down (and it's not like using a spell by just pressing a key, it requires hours of training to be able to use them properly).

 

Also, to answer you, TurtleTuber : People launching the enemy in BSQ just gives him the opportunity to escape, and you can launch someone stunned by Flash Bang, which means the skill has less synergy with the current meta. And as far as I know there is no whitescreen effect anymore.

 

And if the Flash Bang's duration gets decreased then decrease all the other "too long" controls. Just thinking about Rolling Stone's duration which just means you're dead if you get caught which also has a way too huge AoE Plus, I don't know why it's stunning, flinching should be enough imo when you know how huge Summoners' DPS can be.


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#20 Agitodesu

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Posted 21 September 2017 - 09:38 AM

This argument is going no where because people are arguing about things that are all right in that particular scenario which they talk in, but solve different points which doesn't help at all and just makes it more confusing.

 

1. The entire point of the rework was because the majority of the community would rather have it to stun to prevent the extremely high rate of lag walking when executing the skill which would make it buggy.

2. The stun duration is practically the same as the white screen shown above, however the only reason why some players like myself weren't happy with the stun duration being so long was that, it was to provide a sort illegal counterplay that shouldn't have existed. Chase lag clone->free escape taking some damage, don't chase the clone, you can air recover properly on whatever combo they do afterwords if you have more IQ than a stick of gum.

3. Community wanted destroyers to have "reliable" cc other than chain combos.


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#21 TurtleTuber

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Posted 21 September 2017 - 11:51 AM

Dont know why all the destroyer act like end of the world is coming. Talking about myself destroyer was a beast in 1o1, BSQ and group pvp at the old times and with the flashbang bug. Just watch some BSQ videos back then of destroyer against a bunch of other classes. Destroyer was never underpowered.

Problem is that magical classes, dps (xattacks ele dmg) and heals decide the game. If you look at chapter 1 pvp classes were more balanced than they are today.

Changing the stun to 3 seconds wont harm destroyer as long you dont increase the cooldown. But it will help the other classes alot. Alone 1 sniping within the 4s stun deals more damage than a Dragoon in a normal combo.

Just wanna repeat that BSQ battlefields are way too small for all that magical classes skills which cause alot of lag and that the gap between magical classes and physicals is still too big. Thats something that even a 6second stun wont be able to change. In such crowded BSQs with so much lag every class that needs combos to deal damage instead of xspam will lose regardless if its Destroyer, ninja, savage, dragoon, overlord or sentinel.

And @Onyzer: yds
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#22 easykill1215

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Posted 21 September 2017 - 01:00 PM

Since when was destroyer a beast in pvp again? XD combo dmg waaay lower than few other classes and even than senti even before the snipe nerf, hard to catch, there was almost none cc, doesn't x-spam in room pvp, lower health than most other classes for using solar (need for snipe dmg) very very small amount of skill that can be used xD

A lil bit more about the duration of 4s.
Involker: barbarian same 4s, wider range, if you saw an involker with one barbarian n lock 5 of ur team members then you will know how op it is lol. 95% success chance lv10 (need confirmation). Magnet and the stun at lv60 skill page also ~3s. Frog can disable someone for even a lot longer until they get hit.
Summy: spell trap snares 5s, rolling Stone stuns ~5-6s, then with chain combo stun 2s and another chain snare 3s. Worse, it can be repeatable.
Senti: ice trap no need to say more. Then netbind 5s snare can be combined with tesla to make it just like stun effect. The hook at skill page lv60 also ~2s stun.
Sorc: time freeze, octopus, penguin, blizzard
2 warriors classes: they have both few stun skills and also few knock down skills that can make enemy not moving for a certain amount of time.
Ninja: yeah the stun duration of a single skill may be low but you have also 2 stun skills 2s each and that skill that put enemy to sleep for quite a long time also.
Savage: not sure but at least 4 stun skills

And we only have 1 skill which is 4s duration, also not that "one key to win" you also have to hit it correctly, long cooldown so not repeatable. Didn't also mention that some of those above skills has quite very low cooldown and repeatable.
Anyway you got a list of comparison to every classes and not only mage. We understand that it's annoying for you to have more chance to lose to a class that u always beat easy in the past but not anymore since now we got what WE SUPPOSED TO HAVE from the beginning. Anyway if 4s is still too long for you then.... Huehuehue

Edit: didn't read all the comments but read the one said if there are 2 destro then the duration will be 8s xD sorry but it's just stupid to say so. If there are 2 person from each classes then the duration from them is also double xD

Edited by easykill1215, 21 September 2017 - 01:02 PM.

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#23 Agitodesu

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Posted 21 September 2017 - 02:27 PM

89% chance for barbarian level 10. Frog lasts 25 seconds until being hit.


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#24 easykill1215

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Posted 21 September 2017 - 08:10 PM

Thanks for info :D
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#25 TurtleTuber

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Posted 21 September 2017 - 09:14 PM

You cant compare totally different skills like that. Also in comparision, all the other classes need to land a catch, stun to ditch out damage in a combo. Destroyer skips that with one single snipe. Its catch and combo in 1.

And no, i nerver beat destroyer easy in the past it actually was always an intense match but probably i had just good opponents. Actually the fixed flashbang doesnt change much since a good destroyer wouldnt let his enemy lagrun away. But that doesnt mean that 4 seconds might be a bit too long.
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