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#1 Kusanagisama

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Posted 30 September 2017 - 08:39 PM

Since I'm not good at analysing MVP Cards prices, I wanted to the specialists' opinion on what's going to happen to Fenrir Card's demand after the release of Bio 5 hats, the reason being, of course, Magic Essence enchant.

 

Is it still as useful as before? Is there a niche to whom it's still as appealing? What should happen to it's price?

 

I want to have as many fundaments as possible to decide whether I should quit doing GMT or not, since it's quite time consuming, and Fenrir Card is the only good reward from this instance. XD


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#2 yauhoilun

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Posted 30 September 2017 - 08:45 PM

I already quit doing GMT because I think Fenrir card would not be BIS anymore for genes.

 

Option 1: HWHB + Fenrir Card

 

Option 2: Bio5hat + Kiel Card

 

Obviously option 2 wins


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#3 LordYggdrasill

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Posted 30 September 2017 - 09:35 PM

It should drop a bit since for physical classes it may not be as necessary as before, but dont expect it to fall too much. For warlocks at least, Fenrir Card is still BIS in most circumstances since the new Bio 5 hat for warlocks do not have MDEF bypass. There is a big difference between mere 50% MDEF piercing vs 86% MDEF piercing with +13 OBMH. Also lets not forget getting magic essense to above lv.5 is extremely difficult.


Edited by LordYggdrasill, 30 September 2017 - 09:36 PM.

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#4 Darksorrow1234

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Posted 30 September 2017 - 09:37 PM

OP for biochemists in woe te  :lv:


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#5 Nirvanna21

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Posted 01 October 2017 - 12:17 AM

Fenrir Card is -_-.


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#6 Ashuckel

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Posted 01 October 2017 - 12:37 AM

price will stay mostly the same


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#7 Doomsquare

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Posted 01 October 2017 - 01:04 AM

Since I got it, I only use it for bombing Fenrir. It's really nice on a bomber gene, not so much for a CC gene.

 

Using it on magic classes like Sorc and Warlock is really really nice too.


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#8 Nirvanna21

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Posted 01 October 2017 - 01:11 AM

Since I got it, I only use it for bombing Fenrir. It's really nice on a bomber gene, not so much for a CC gene.

 

Using it on magic classes like Sorc and Warlock is really really nice too.

 

It would be useless for CC, since it has no fixed cast time.

 

Bomb can be 100% reduced with Temp Dex + Level 5 Enchant.

 

Most skills on Sorc and Warlock can be reduced by the above combination as well.

 

Dorams can get up to 80% fixed cast time reduction if people were legit stupid about upgrading their gears, however they can also just stick with an easy 55%+ with a far smaller sum.

 

Fenrir card is neat to have I suppose? But there are far more interesting things now over this item that are far more effective for their purpose.


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#9 Zayaan

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Posted 01 October 2017 - 01:35 AM

Fenrir is good on Sura and in WOE TE. That's about all the usage it has nowadays.

Sellers should have traded them for Megs, Kiels, GTBs, Taos, Thanatos, etc while they could have.


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#10 LordYggdrasill

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Posted 01 October 2017 - 01:52 AM

Fenrir Card also adds raw MATK, upgrade your OBMH or Bio 5 Hat to +14 and you get 120 raw MATK from Fenrir Card. If you have 1500 raw MATK as I do, this will be about 8% increase in damage(1620/1500 = 1.08). Red Lichtern Card gives 10% increase if without other fire magic damage cards, but with NAM(+42% in a +14 FAW) and another Red Lichtern Card in Mid-head gear(+5%), the increase is mere 6.8%(157/147 = 1.068). The MATK increase from Fenrir Card works for all skills, not just spells from one particular element, so it saves you from switching. For this reason, Fenrir Card is the BIS for top headgear even just for the raw MATK it provides alone, and of course 70% reduction in FCT just makes things much much better.


Edited by LordYggdrasill, 01 October 2017 - 01:53 AM.

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#11 Doomsquare

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Posted 01 October 2017 - 08:50 AM

I'll best prefer that Fenrir be in glasses for the mob scarf combo. Having it in a top headgear makes yourself really really vulnerable in woe/pvp where everyone should wear CEB/RPB.

 

For pvm, it's not nice using CEB/RPB against non-demi human mobs.


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#12 Kusanagisama

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Posted 01 October 2017 - 09:03 AM

Fenrir Card also adds raw MATK, upgrade your OBMH or Bio 5 Hat to +14 and you get 120 raw MATK from Fenrir Card. If you have 1500 raw MATK as I do, this will be about 8% increase in damage(1620/1500 = 1.08). Red Lichtern Card gives 10% increase if without other fire magic damage cards, but with NAM(+42% in a +14 FAW) and another Red Lichtern Card in Mid-head gear(+5%), the increase is mere 6.8%(157/147 = 1.068). The MATK increase from Fenrir Card works for all skills, not just spells from one particular element, so it saves you from switching. For this reason, Fenrir Card is the BIS for top headgear even just for the raw MATK it provides alone, and of course 70% reduction in FCT just makes things much much better.

 

Yeah, but its main usage has always been the FCTR, as a Raw MATK provider it was nice in the past, but after Mob Scarf became quite dank. As Nirvana and Zaayan said, it's usage became quite retricted and overshadowed by other gears now. I don't think anyone would pay 50~70 B to get 120 MATK in a +14 hat (which would cost a few billions just to upgrade to this level as well). If it didn't have other uses than this, maybe 10~20 B might sound right (because it's still a great thing pre level 170).

 

Fenrir is good on Sura and in WOE TE. That's about all the usage it has nowadays.

Sellers should have traded them for Megs, Kiels, GTBs, Taos, Thanatos, etc while they could have.

 

It would be useless for CC, since it has no fixed cast time.

 

Bomb can be 100% reduced with Temp Dex + Level 5 Enchant.

 

Most skills on Sorc and Warlock can be reduced by the above combination as well.

 

Dorams can get up to 80% fixed cast time reduction if people were legit stupid about upgrading their gears, however they can also just stick with an easy 55%+ with a far smaller sum.

 

Fenrir card is neat to have I suppose? But there are far more interesting things now over this item that are far more effective for their purpose.

 

So, it should be a sub-Kiel card nowadays? Good to know. I might reduce my GMT activities to once or twice a week just because. Thank you for your insight.


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#13 Nirvanna21

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Posted 01 October 2017 - 10:24 AM

Fenrir Card also adds raw MATK, upgrade your OBMH or Bio 5 Hat to +14 and you get 120 raw MATK from Fenrir Card. If you have 1500 raw MATK as I do, this will be about 8% increase in damage(1620/1500 = 1.08). Red Lichtern Card gives 10% increase if without other fire magic damage cards, but with NAM(+42% in a +14 FAW) and another Red Lichtern Card in Mid-head gear(+5%), the increase is mere 6.8%(157/147 = 1.068). The MATK increase from Fenrir Card works for all skills, not just spells from one particular element, so it saves you from switching. For this reason, Fenrir Card is the BIS for top headgear even just for the raw MATK it provides alone, and of course 70% reduction in FCT just makes things much much better.

 

That's not how damage increases work Ygg. RAW Matk gives a boost scaling to your existing MATK, if you have 1500 base as is then it is most definately not going to give you an 8% boost.


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#14 LordYggdrasill

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Posted 01 October 2017 - 12:15 PM

Yeah, but its main usage has always been the FCTR, as a Raw MATK provider it was nice in the past, but after Mob Scarf became quite dank. As Nirvana and Zaayan said, it's usage became quite retricted and overshadowed by other gears now. I don't think anyone would pay 50~70 B to get 120 MATK in a +14 hat (which would cost a few billions just to upgrade to this level as well). If it didn't have other uses than this, maybe 10~20 B might sound right (because it's still a great thing pre level 170).

 

Dont get me wrong, Id be very happy if Fenrir Card's price drops like falling stocks so I can buy immediately. Just, dont think the change of price will be this dramatic. Even if it falls by 50%, its still 30-40b and out of my budget range. If it does ever get to 10b or around, then I get it immediately.

:)
 


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#15 Kusanagisama

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Posted 01 October 2017 - 04:51 PM

No, it probably will take people a very long time to accept this reality, if at all. Veterans which have these cards which usually have their pockets full won't sell them, and if they try to, they probably try to get full 50B+ price. Maybe fresh cards will sell for less, but it will also take a few months to sell.


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#16 Nirvanna21

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Posted 01 October 2017 - 05:23 PM

No, it probably will take people a very long time to accept this reality, if at all. Veterans which have these cards which usually have their pockets full won't sell them, and if they try to, they probably try to get full 50B+ price. Maybe fresh cards will sell for less, but it will also take a few months to sell.

 

If they had done their research they would have sold off their Fenrir Cards a while back, but it is what it is, personally there are better cards for your headgear now :U


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#17 LordYggdrasill

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Posted 01 October 2017 - 07:07 PM

If they had done their research they would have sold off their Fenrir Cards a while back, but it is what it is, personally there are better cards for your headgear now :U

 

Umm so what are better options for warlocks other than Fenrir Card in your opinion?

 


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#18 Nirvanna21

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Posted 01 October 2017 - 07:09 PM

Umm so what are better options for warlocks other than Fenrir Card in your opinion?

 

Currently, the Malangdo boss cards give more damage. But there are other new ones which will be released that will be even better.


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#19 Sigma1

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Posted 02 October 2017 - 12:40 AM

Currently, the Malangdo boss cards give more damage. But there are other new ones which will be released that will be even better.


Even with +14 headgear. How could +9% Matk be better than +120 EquipMatk?

Since %Matk modifier suffers diminished return as well.
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#20 Nirvanna21

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Posted 02 October 2017 - 01:28 AM

Even with +14 headgear. How could +9% Matk be better than +120 EquipMatk?

Since %Matk modifier suffers diminished return as well.

 

Situational of course, but as there is only so much MATK% gears, and you want to swap up your damage specific modifiers as much as possible via other slots, it means that on average you will roll around 20% MATK boost at any one time. And most MATK users can get 600+ MATK easily. Ultimately the coel would suck if you were rolling 40%+ MATK % but what you would sacrifice in order to achieve that would be nuts. I know it's a shuffle but at the end of the day, we are getting more and more flat MATK boosting items, therefore it will be made redundant quicker than MATK %.


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#21 Gabrielr04

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Posted 02 October 2017 - 07:49 AM

Could anyone provide the name for Malangdo bosses? Have never seen their card and i don't remember their name xd
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#22 Kusanagisama

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Posted 02 October 2017 - 08:46 AM

The one he's referring to is Mutant Coelacanth.

 

[item]4528[/item]

 

But, well, Fenrir Card will allow you to get almost instacast with Temporal Int boots or Pororoca Shoes. :v


Edited by Kusanagisama, 02 October 2017 - 08:48 AM.

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#23 PervySageMarty

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Posted 04 October 2017 - 10:49 AM

Everythings a -_-ing diminishing return in this game.
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#24 TothWL

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Posted 04 October 2017 - 03:00 PM

Wish I had fenrir on bRO, I've been killing her on a daily basis with 4 chars and still nothing. 

But since it's very rare and with a somewhat unique effect that most consumables in iRO doesn't make up for it (in bRO there's a candy that reduce FCT by 70% and increase matk for 1 minute), I'd say the price will be 90 or 85% of what it was before.

 

Now what I came to say for real:

 

I don't have Fenrir but I have Kiel's and it's VERY strong with SE. I used to defeat Celine with a ~11min timer without Kiel, with Kiel I can burst her down in 5 minutes, more than HALF the time I used to take.

The time should be considerably lower if mob scarf comes to bRO unnerfed some day.


Edited by TothWL, 04 October 2017 - 03:01 PM.

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#25 Kusanagisama

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Posted 04 October 2017 - 03:23 PM

Is guess there's no Pororoca Shoes in bRO, is there? I remember taking ~3 minutes to kill her when Pororoca was released here and we could finally bypass 100% of an enemy's MDEF. It's sufferable to kill her without 100% bypass. It was doable with NP Combo + OBMH, which bypassed about 80%, but still terrible. XD A Kiel card would allow me to strike at 182 (?) ASPD, IIRC, which would be great, and you just confirmed it to me. :no1:


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