152 replies to this topic

[Lijona]

and I thought I was on topic...

[Tormented]

It's dead simple people.. Whether Gravity Interactive wishes to comply with GDPR or not the problem is Gravity states to 'Disable' all of the account on the 25th of May.

This is not allowed as the GDPR  regulation works with retroactive effect, Gravity Interactive has to REMOVE all the data of EU Citizens they have collected of the years.

 

If they persist on disabling the accounts rather than deleting them, it's probably because they are trying to get things sorted otherwise it would just be plain stupid as they are in breach of the GDPR.

 

Just relax and play some other games.

 

Thanks for the reply it does seem to sort it out so that we know what could happen. It just seems that maybe Gravity really doesn't know 100% what they will actually do yet.

 

Sounds to me that maybe they're hoping to comply but are keeping quiet about it like they keep quiet about other things affecting the game lol.

 

Maybe we'll be surprised now and they'll announce that they will be complying with the GDPR but until they have the system in place they'll ban the EU countries from accessing the game. (This still means they are breaking the GDPR though).

 

As long as they haven't issued refunds to players yet then maybe we have a chance of them doing something with  the compliance issues. Once they issue refunds I think that will be the sign that it's all over. I don't see them going to the trouble of refunding and then complying at a later date - it would be a waste of time and money on their part.

 

Anyone know or has had a refund yet?

 

ps. one thing I have read here in the UK, the compliance team in Govt has said that at first they would be willing to help companies to comply rather than coming down heavy with fines. So maybe Gravity has an opportunity whereby they want to comply but need assistance from an EU Govt department etc in order to bring in the compliance system. Just a thought.

Edited by Tormented, 17 May 2018 - 10:55 PM.

[PureCreativity]

Thanks for the reply it does seem to sort it out so that we know what could happen. It just seems that maybe Gravity really doesn't know 100% what they will actually do yet.

 

Sounds to me that maybe they're hoping to comply but are keeping quiet about it like they keep quiet about other things affecting the game lol.

 

Maybe we'll be surprised now and they'll announce that they will be complying with the GDPR but until they have the system in place they'll ban the EU countries from accessing the game. (This still means they are breaking the GDPR though).

 

As long as they haven't issued refunds to players yet then maybe we have a chance of them doing something with  the compliance issues. Once they issue refunds I think that will be the sign that it's all over. I don't see them going to the trouble of refunding and then complying at a later date - it would be a waste of time and money on their part.

 

Anyone know or has had a refund yet?

 

ps. one thing I have read here in the UK, the compliance team in Govt has said that at first they would be willing to help companies to comply rather than coming down heavy with fines. So maybe Gravity has an opportunity whereby they want to comply but need assistance from an EU Govt department etc in order to bring in the compliance system. Just a thought.

 

Keeping things quiet is one of the worst things they could do, as nobody is trusting Gravity Interactive anymore due this reason.

Besides that, from what I've heard they already issued refunds, that's why i'm trying to point out that Gravity is in breach of the GDPR on the 25th of May when they still have EU Data.

[Lijona]

I don’t know anyone who got a refund yet. Perhaps we can post here when we got a refund, so we know, that it is actually happen

[soudou]

Over on the Ragnarok Online section some got a refund, though they say they had to ticket in first to speed the process up. Also some who paid via certain payment methods like Xsolla are having trouble. I paid with PayPal and still waiting, so decided to ticket in.

Some posts from there:

sickgaming: "Today I got the paypal refund from Feb1 to May 2018. Yes, ticket speed the thing up. - confirmed."

Bonislav: "I received a full refund for my purchases between Feb 1st, 2018 and April 30th, 2018. I submitted a ticket right after they told us we should in here."

TheQuietStorm: "I was pleasantly suprised to receive the refund today as well. I dunno if it has anything to do with the fact that I send a ticket to payment support."

[SparkNiche]

Over on the Ragnarok Online section some got a refund, though they say they had to ticket in first to speed the process up. Also some who paid via certain payment methods like Xsolla are having trouble. I paid with PayPal and still waiting, so decided to ticket in.

Some posts from there:

sickgaming: "Today I got the paypal refund from Feb1 to May 2018. Yes, ticket speed the thing up. - confirmed."

Bonislav: "I received a full refund for my purchases between Feb 1st, 2018 and April 30th, 2018. I submitted a ticket right after they told us we should in here."

TheQuietStorm: "I was pleasantly suprised to receive the refund today as well. I dunno if it has anything to do with the fact that I send a ticket to payment support."

 

It's almost as if they aren't automatically processing refunds, and rather are only processing refunds to players who specifically request them via a ticket.

 

Ho hum.

[AndraSyte]

Thank you so much for your patience everyone. The original FAQ post has been updated.

[Lijona]

Dont thank me for my patience please... because I didn't have any.

I just had no other choice than to wait.

 

And btw... I got a refund for the IM I bought in February.

[Lybis]

Question: What information will be kept which is relevant to the laws and regulations in the United States

[Feuer]

Question: What information will be kept which is relevant to the laws and regulations in the United States

 

Most likely, things like credit statements, fund transfer logs and internal receipts for IRS and tax purposes along with other financial liability things necessary to retain financial integrity. You know, if I had to take a guess. 

[SparkNiche]

Question: What information will be kept which is relevant to the laws and regulations in the United States

 

If you're from Europe, put in a GDPR request on May 25 and find out.

 

They have 30 days to reply to any GDPR request whether they want to or not.

[LadyPsyber]

Question: What information will be kept which is relevant to the laws and regulations in the United States

I'm not aware of anything in the USA nearly like GDPR because like most things involving regulation it's often saber rattling. Of course people howl for blood when there's a breech but it's impossible to protect against everything in a huge IT infrastructure.

 

Look, there's no doubt that regulations need to exist to make sure that companies take as much work as they can to protect their users information however I am deeply concerned about the punitive nature of the regulations happening. That's what Gravity is afraid of and rightly so. The EU threats of taking up to 4% of a company's WORLDWIDE sales??? That's insanity even if some company was a little loose with their security. NOBODY wants or chooses to be hacked so they do their best not to be but this stuff expects perfection.

 

At some point somebody needs to reel these people in. The problem is that the EU has ZERO need to make the environment favorable for Gravity to exist there because they figure that Gravity employs nobody, doesn't pay taxes to them so they set up a way that they CAN tax Gravity in the way of fines if something happens. Who decides what is "too lax" as far as security. Who decides how much their "tax" is?  It's insanity for a company just trying to sell some membership to their games.

 

I can't find blame in Gravity blocking EU because their whole company could be at risk over things out of their control. 

 

Someone needs to set up a petition or way to fight back against the EU making it too scary for external companies to do business there. We're talking people just trying to play games.

 

I have a question for the representatives here from Gravity. Is there a way for someone from the EU to give up all rights and liability of the GDPR. Like agreeing to a new set of terms and services but tailored for just the GDPR.  Something that doesn't allow someone to just hit "OK:.  Like a twenty line agreement that needs you to physically click "ok" twenty times agreeing that you don't wish to be bound by the GFPR. God it'd be insanity if it didn't allow you some way to just tell GDPR that you didn't want anything to do with it in exchange for being able to play a game.

 

Does the GDPR even allow you to "opt out" of it somehow?

[SparkNiche]

I have a question for the representatives here from Gravity. Is there a way for someone from the EU to give up all rights and liability of the GDPR. Like agreeing to a new set of terms and services but tailored for just the GDPR.  Something that doesn't allow someone to just hit "OK:.  Like a twenty line agreement that needs you to physically click "ok" twenty times agreeing that you don't wish to be bound by the GFPR. God it'd be insanity if it didn't allow you some way to just tell GDPR that you didn't want anything to do with it in exchange for being able to play a game.

 

Does the GDPR even allow you to "opt out" of it somehow?

 

You cannot, as a company or a player, opt out of GDPR. If a company has collected data in the past on EU citizens or at any point after May 25, they must comply with GDPR. This applies to all companies across the world regardless as to where their home base is.

[PureCreativity]

You cannot, as a company or a player, opt out of GDPR. If a company has collected data in the past on EU citizens or at any point after May 25, they must comply with GDPR. This applies to all companies across the world regardless as to where their home base is.

 

This is correct as the GDPR works with retroactive effect, that's why i'm so curious why Gravity is going to 'disable' our accounts.

[Feuer]

Huh, now I wonder about all those streamers who took donations from EU citizens. 

 

Found some interesting financial information for investors etc.
http://www.gravity.c...89&curfileSeq=1

Sourced from: http://www.gravity.co.kr/en/

 

Seems like Gravity as a whole is doing fine in Taiwan and other areas, but NA is almost none of it's Revenue and their mobile department is now taking the majority of their attention up. 

 

All of that points that ROSE is either going to go mobile, or it'll just fizzle out soon, according to their own investors information. That being said, I could only find 2 references to ROSE Online on their entire website, and not a single reference to it in any of their strategy plans. The first reference was them stating that after the success of the original Ragnarok title, they published ROSE Online which has ...*rolls eyes* 500,000 current players [yea right, maybe in like 2009 and counting ALL regions including now closed servers..] The second being on their Company History when they mentioned the opening of the Korean and Japanese closed betas in 2005, but absolutely zero mention of the NA beta or even it's launch. 

 

As far as I can tell, ROSE isn't even on their corporate radar AT ALL. It's a fluff title they have to draw more click towards Ragnarok, even by their own information provided it seems. 

 

Something else I kinda had a chuckle about was this:

 

Spoiler

 

PRIVACY It is Company policy to protect individual consumer, medical, financial and other sensitive personal information that the Company collects from or maintain about personnel or individual consumers or customers by complying with all applicable privacy and data protection laws, regulations and treaties. Employees must take care to protect individually identifiable personnel, consumer or customer information and other sensitive personal information from inappropriate or unauthorized use or disclosure. Furthermore, employees must provide individual customers with, as required by law and by the Company's privacy policies: notice of relevant privacy policies descriptions of the types of information being collected and the uses to be made of the information choices regarding certain uses of the information by your business access to the information for verification and correction security for the information Employees may not acquire, use, or disclose individual personnel, consumer or customer information in ways that are inconsistent with the Company's privacy policies or with applicable laws or regulations. Finally, employees should consult with the Corporate Audit Department before establishing or updating any system, process, or procedure to collect, use, disclose, or transmit individual personnel, consumer or customer information, medical or financial records, or other sensitive personal information.

 

 

I couldn't help but think how ironic it is, that this GDPR law passed, when such laws already existed, very serious ones. But because of how this new one is enforced, EU has to be terminated. 

Edited by Feuer, 19 May 2018 - 07:15 PM.

[soudou]

Seems like Gravity as a whole is doing fine in Taiwan and other areas, but NA is almost none of it's Revenue and their mobile department is now taking the majority of their attention up.

 

Yes, in the case of their other title, Ragnarok Online, they launched a Taiwan RO server and we were surprised to see thousands of viewers on Twitch for streams from that server when streams of iRO from WarpPortal have such such little viewers.

Also Japan already modified their privacy laws back in May 2017 to adopt GDPR changes, but the Japanese server for RO is very profitable for Gravity I think (it's the birthplace of many costumes and powerful equipment, all of which come via cash shop loot boxes that give a low chance at the most popular items), so they likely decided to go along with the new law.

So I'm guessing Gravity just don't perceive each game's server population / profits over here to warrant the investment to adapt.
 

 

I couldn't help but think how ironic it is, that this GDPR law passed, when such laws already existed, very serious ones. But because of how this new one is enforced, EU has to be terminated.

Yeah, as far as UK is concerned the GDPR is just a modification of existing privacy laws that have been in place since the 1990s. Any company already following previous privacy laws don't have as much to change. So for the European Ragnarok Online server hosted by WhyBe all they are doing is the following:

"We are currently working with a third party company to apply the new legislation to our services. Since we were already almost up to date, this should only have a small impact on your game experience. There will be a new line in the Terms of Service and/or a reminder of the Terms of Service that has to be accepted when launching the game."

However Gravity requested WhyBe block all territories they don't have a license for, so all non-EU users. Although being GDPR compliant shouldn't mean they can't do business outside the EU... So I think this decision is not only about GDPR, but also about licensing.

Edited by soudou, 20 May 2018 - 05:43 AM.

[MaxMan]

so i have some questions

 

1. i know Russia and CIS do not get banned,now what dos CIS stand for ?

 

2. am from norway and thats in scandinavia,it has nothing to do whit europe or EU union,so way do we get ban then ?

 

 

[soudou]

2. am from norway and thats in scandinavia,it has nothing to do whit europe or EU union,so way do we get ban then ?

 

Some countries are still adopting GDPR, or their own version of it, though they may not be a member of the EU, like how UK is planning to leave the union but will still update their privacy laws.

Under the European Economic Area (EEA) Agreement, the Regulation applies throughout the EEA as well as in the 28 Member States of the EU. Thus, the three EEA countries not in the EU – Norway, Iceland, and Liechtenstein – will become subject to the Regulation at the same time as the EU countries.

Source: https://www.infolawg...ion-regulation/

[AndraSyte]

Please try to stay on topic everyone. More off topic posts have been removed from the thread. If you want to post regarding other topics please post within appropriate sections (Off Topic Lounge, Proposals and Suggestions, etc.). 

 

[Lijona]

Warpportal wide maintenance on 24th... I guess that is the let’s kick and block all Eu player-maintenance

[Lijona]

just curious... will you delete us from forums too? Will you delete all our posts? Will you delete all the quotes of our posts? Will you delete everything where our name appears?

Will you delete everything we ever wrote?

Will it be as if we never have played the game and never have written anything on forums?

 

Do we have to unlike facebook and twitch and unfollow twitter?

Or do you kick us there too?

[Lijona]

21 hours left

 

the final countdown is running....

[KingArthur]

I feel i must say something, but i dont have words... After more then 15 years. The only thing left to say is goodbye.

 

Rose brought me alot.. I found my wife on Rose, it made me emigrate to another country, so thank you for that rose.

 

As rosearian i will always have great memory´s

 

Maybe till later, but for now.. Goodbye

 

[Dimmizer]

so i have some questions

 

1. i know Russia and CIS do not get banned,now what dos CIS stand for ?

 

2. am from norway and thats in scandinavia,it has nothing to do whit europe or EU union,so way do we get ban then ?

 

Commonwealth of Independent States

 

https://en.wikipedia...ependent_States

Edited by Dimmizer, 23 May 2018 - 08:40 PM.

[Fishnet]

I feel i must say something, but i dont have words... After more then 15 years. The only thing left to say is goodbye.

 

Rose brought me alot.. I found my wife on Rose, it made me emigrate to another country, so thank you for that rose.

 

As rosearian i will always have great memory´s

 

Maybe till later, but for now.. Goodbye

 

Seeing your name brings back lots of memories from long ago...