20 replies to this topic

[Rinami]

I've seen alot of people looking for heirloom Bone dragon pieces lately, and they are usually unable to find one or two missing parts. I propose that players with 4 or more pieces be given some chance at obtaining a full set, since the odds of someone selling the rare pieces of a set is low for many jobs.

This rarity is because back in the THQ days, the pieces did not have an equal chance of dropping, and some were much rarer than others. (This my guess at the matter, but for almost all sets of concern there's that one or two pieces that you can take several months to buy a seller)

Missing a full set costs the alot of defence that is vital for some jobs in PvP. The set is also much more powerful than other options for some jobs such as both mage jobs, whose sets are geared towards PvE instead of PvP, and make much more use of the massive defence, than int/aim/cd. Invokers recieve a nice Drakos set to make up for this, but sorcs are mainly limited to int stack, crit dmg stack, full light for the aim, or Heirloom BD.

These rare pieces are also almost impossible to convince a player to part with, due to the set being heavily upgraded by most players who obtain it, and the fact that losing the equip is of a large disadvantage compared to a reasonable amount of gold for the value of a unused equip of equal stats, driving the value of these pieces possibly as high as kimarts(Speculation here, but with almost no supply, and large demand of people who gathered the nonrarer pieces, and the stats on the piece after heavy enchanting(The equip is being used by the seller), these items are of a much higher value than they would be if we had more full sets on the market later.

This suggestion gives some people an unfair disadvantage, but weakening the undead set to what it is, instead of preserving at least the defence values, already has caused unfair advantages in gear between newer players, and older players with heirloom BD. This is an attempt to balance out the availability of the set which is of advantage to all players without a full set, even those without any, by making more pieces available.

If you're quitting the game and have the rare parts, please sell them or give them away instead of never playing again and removing a set someone else could make great use of from the game permanently. Pick away at any errors now.

[Ramune]

I've seen alot of people looking for heirloom Bone dragon pieces lately, and they are usually unable to find one or two missing parts. I propose that players with 4 or more pieces be given some chance at obtaining a full set, since the odds of someone selling the rare pieces of a set is low for many jobs.

This rarity is because back in the THQ days, the pieces did not have an equal chance of dropping, and some were much rarer than others. (This my guess at the matter, but for almost all sets of concern there's that one or two pieces that you can take several months to buy a seller)

Missing a full set costs the alot of defence that is vital for some jobs in PvP. The set is also much more powerful than other options for some jobs such as both mage jobs, whose sets are geared towards PvE instead of PvP, and make much more use of the massive defence, than int/aim/cd. Invokers recieve a nice Drakos set to make up for this, but sorcs are mainly limited to int stack, crit dmg stack, full light for the aim, or Heirloom BD.

These rare pieces are also almost impossible to convince a player to part with, due to the set being heavily upgraded by most players who obtain it, and the fact that losing the equip is of a large disadvantage compared to a reasonable amount of gold for the value of a unused equip of equal stats, driving the value of these pieces possibly as high as kimarts(Speculation here, but with almost no supply, and large demand of people who gathered the nonrarer pieces, and the stats on the piece after heavy enchanting(The equip is being used by the seller), these items are of a much higher value than they would be if we had more full sets on the market later.

This suggestion gives some people an unfair disadvantage, but weakening the undead set to what it is, instead of preserving at least the defence values, already has caused unfair advantages in gear between newer players, and older players with heirloom BD. This is an attempt to balance out the availability of the set which is of advantage to all players without a full set, even those without any, by making more pieces available.

If you're quitting the game and have the rare parts, please sell them or give them away instead of never playing again and removing a set someone else could make great use of from the game permanently. Pick away at any errors now.

My solution might not be perfect but here it goes...

I can't really explain it in words at this time but I think they could find a middle ground (and make both parties happy) by doing it like this:

If I had 2 pieces of Heirloom Invoker BD pet, I get the first buff of the Heirloom set for 2 pieces
However, if I added 2 pieces from the current Undead set, I get the Undead buff for 4 pieces.

Another Example:

If I had 4 pieces of Heirloom BD set, I get the first two buffs from the Heirloom set (for 2 piece and 4 piece).
The next 3 pieces of the undead BD set will count towards the next 2 buffs for the Undead BD set (for 5th? and 7th piece).

This way, old THQ players can still have their special "Heirloom" stats while newer players can still complete the set look and receive the last stat (from the new set).

Hope that made sense! ^^

[Yurai]

My solution might not be perfect but here it goes...

I can't really explain it in words at this time but I think they could find a middle ground (and make both parties happy) by doing it like this:

If I had 2 pieces of Heirloom Invoker BD pet, I get the first buff of the Heirloom set for 2 pieces
However, if I added 2 pieces from the current Undead set, I get the Undead buff for 4 pieces.

Another Example:

If I had 4 pieces of Heirloom BD set, I get the first two buffs from the Heirloom set (for 2 piece and 4 piece).
The next 3 pieces of the undead BD set will count towards the next 2 buffs for the Undead BD set (for 5th? and 7th piece).

This way, old THQ players can still have their special "Heirloom" stats while newer players can still complete the set look and receive the last stat (from the new set).

Hope that made sense! ^^

Some people do not want the full set bonus, so your suggestion will hurt them. For example, a savage stacking movement speed would opt for 4 piece old bone and 3 piece new bone for a total of 50% movement speed.

[StormHaven]

They should just let you trade X amount of Undead Pieces for 1 BD part or something..

[Ramune]

Some people do not want the full set bonus, so your suggestion will hurt them. For example, a savage stacking movement speed would opt for 4 piece old bone and 3 piece new bone for a total of 50% movement speed.

Holy moly, never knew that! That's a lot of freakin' movement speed.

Like I said, my suggestion is not perfect but it could be viable for some other classes or for people who just wants all the green lighted up on their set stat window. However, since you pointed that out, I think it could be better if both options are available to everyone.

[Rinami]

The problem is that, there are say 94 helms,shoulderpads,backs,gloves,bottoms, and 21 boots and tops on the server for job Y. If we were still in Thq, we could farm and eventually every person who lacked thoe pieces and we'd not have 21 people of job Y being in control of the two equips the other 73 people need. The drop system was made to last infinitely, but Barunson decided to rebalance sets, and save time by just making new sets so now only 21 of those equips exist. The other 73 players are missing two of the set bonuses since Heirloom BS is 2,4,6,7 and have no shot of finishing the set due to Barunson redoing everything on a whim. The THQ server also had a period of time without server restarts that made some channels not even function properly on shard drops to fight bone dragon, so we could not even farm the equips fully.

[Maronu]

Heirloom is heirloom. Just because my main has every rare equip that I want besides Kimart wings and Antares necklace, I should have an opportunity to obtain these items without needing to buy them from other players (same availability issue)? And only players who have 4 pieces get a chance? That sounds exploitable. I have an Invoker that I would like to have Old Bone on, but I'm against giving players an opportunity to get their missing pieces, unless every other heirloom item in the game returns as well.

[Rinami]

The black market idea from earlier versions would work for heirloom equips(The equips would be clean and auctioned in a thread, 1-3 sets released per month for each job, players are not allowed to win multiple copies of a piece(Have to buy from market if it breaks) and a minimum bid of 3-5k per piece(For BD other heirlooms would be 200-400 per piece) would be required to help keep some value on the equips though demand will be high constantly if our population recovers) Boss equips would also be released,(300-1200 depending on equip, 4.5k for kimarts). The item will be CoD at the winning price by a gm to the winners within one business day.

Yes I know the mods would have to do alot of work to help sort all of the items better than just in one topic in this system, but the items will be available for everyone eventually without flooding them into the game. Also we'd have to ask Barunson to consider making an ingame system for our version otherwise, so forums would be the best way to let everyone have a chance at winning an item.

[Ramune]

The black market idea from earlier versions would work for heirloom equips(The equips would be clean and auctioned in a thread, 1-3 sets released per month for each job, players are not allowed to win multiple copies of a piece(Have to buy from market if it breaks) and a minimum bid of 3-5k per piece(For BD other heirlooms would be 200-400 per piece) would be required to help keep some value on the equips though demand will be high constantly if our population recovers) Boss equips would also be released,(300-1200 depending on equip, 4.5k for kimarts). The item will be CoD at the winning price by a gm to the winners within one business day.

Yes I know the mods would have to do alot of work to help sort all of the items better than just in one topic in this system, but the items will be available for everyone eventually without flooding them into the game. Also we'd have to ask Barunson to consider making an ingame system for our version otherwise, so forums would be the best way to let everyone have a chance at winning an item.

Oooh, man, not that it's a bad idea but the Black Market is really risky business (that's why it's the Black Market!). There was like a month worth of drama on the forums when they launched the Black Market back in THQ. It was quite an interesting month, lol!

But that gave me another idea... perhaps they could have some contest events for people to get a chance at a special full Heirloom Bone Dragon set where it can be substituted for any class. <-- that's probably a really fail idea but I put it out for fun anyways =P.

Quick and dirty option: Revert and make all heirloom items the standard item.

Edited by Ramune, 06 January 2011 - 04:54 PM.

[Rimmy]

Quick and dirty option: Revert and make all heirloom items the standard item.

Be prepared for mass raging and quitting and rage-quitting if and when this happens. *shiver*

[Maronu]

The black market idea from earlier versions would work for heirloom equips(The equips would be clean and auctioned in a thread, 1-3 sets released per month for each job, players are not allowed to win multiple copies of a piece(Have to buy from market if it breaks) and a minimum bid of 3-5k per piece(For BD other heirlooms would be 200-400 per piece) would be required to help keep some value on the equips though demand will be high constantly if our population recovers) Boss equips would also be released,(300-1200 depending on equip, 4.5k for kimarts). The item will be CoD at the winning price by a gm to the winners within one business day.

Yes I know the mods would have to do alot of work to help sort all of the items better than just in one topic in this system, but the items will be available for everyone eventually without flooding them into the game. Also we'd have to ask Barunson to consider making an ingame system for our version otherwise, so forums would be the best way to let everyone have a chance at winning an item.

Last black market the gms just had a shop that they set up. You are suggesting an auction, correct? Anyway, how do you keep players from obtaining more than one copy of an item?

[Rinami]

I considered the term black market as in the gms made the equips and sold them.

The one of a item per person was to help prevent abuse of trying to make a profit from the system by taking over the equips(It owuld be rather expensive anyways but someone might pull it off with a month til the next sets are released and if they sell it they can get the next item put up) No one needs more than one set with randomizers now anyways.


I feel while hard to manage, an auction would be much fairer than making it where the first person to click buy gets it.

A month would be a reasonable period of time inbetween auctions to help keep the rarity of heirloom, while also giving newer players a chance of obtaining it.
(Heirloom 20-54 sets could be ssold in sets because of soul binding)

[Ramune]

Be prepared for mass raging and quitting and rage-quitting if and when this happens. *shiver*

Haha! I was only joking! Though, it could get quite crazy if this actually happened. But I think the populace can handle it if it ~theoretically~ happens XD!

Give us more credit, Rimmy! we've survived THQ's Black Market, Skill Forges fiasco, Guild Madness Event, and various other things!!

[Rimmy]

Haha! I was only joking! Though, it could get quite crazy if this actually happened. But I think the populace can handle it if it ~theoretically~ happens XD!

Give us more credit, Rimmy! we've survived THQ's Black Market, Skill Forges fiasco, Guild Madness Event, and various other things!!

This would be a completely different scenario. In those events you mentioned, the effects on the general population were relatively minor, IMO (Black Market items were OP but not really game-breaking; SFs were nice but not all that important until recently when Level 6+ skills were announced, etc.).

This wouldn't be about some players getting an unfair advantage over others b/c they got access to some extra stuff... This would be about players who spent countless amounts of gold/IM points and endless hours upgrading equips watching as all of that work and money gets flushed down the toilet in a single moment.

[Ramune]

This would be a completely different scenario. In those events you mentioned, the effects on the general population were relatively minor, IMO (Black Market items were OP but not really game-breaking; SFs were nice but not all that important until recently when Level 6+ skills were announced, etc.).

This wouldn't be about some players getting an unfair advantage over others b/c they got access to some extra stuff... This would be about players who spent countless amounts of gold/IM points and endless hours upgrading equips watching as all of that work and money gets flushed down the toilet in a single moment.

I don't really understand your argument. Why would the old players complain if it was just reverted back (they still get to keep all their items as is). As in, Bone dragon drops sets with our old stats. Lavalon gives us weapons with the old stats and everything else too. Just make the drop rates lower. I already have my set, and I wouldn't mind at all. Some people have complained that it's too hard to sell heirloom BD sets since you can't even farm it anymore.

Edited by Ramune, 07 January 2011 - 12:10 PM.

[Rimmy]

I don't really understand your argument. Why would the old players complain if it was just reverted back (they still get to keep all their items as is). As in, Bone dragon drops sets with our old stats. Lavalon gives us weapons with the old stats and everything else too. Just make the drop rates lower. I already have my set, and I wouldn't mind at all. Some people have complained that it's too hard to sell heirloom BD sets since you can't even farm it anymore.

I think I may have misunderstood your original statement. I thought you meant that all heirloom items (including those players currently have) revert to the NEW stats. Not the other way around.

[Ramune]

Haha, that's ok, happens to me all the time. ^^ My wording could of been better so I can't blame you XD

Sorry I can't quote you, Rimmy, my quote button broken now also >.<

[Meganekko]

While were at it how about everyone get a pair of Kimarts or Antares neck? Just get OVER the fact OLD players got Heirloom gear, better stuff comes out, people quit, games evolve. SURE it sucks, but just deal with it.

[canajew]

While were at it how about everyone get a pair of Kimarts or Antares neck? Just get OVER the fact OLD players got Heirloom gear, better stuff comes out, people quit, games evolve. SURE it sucks, but just deal with it.

I'm not sure why but I have this feeling that you have a full heirloom bone set as well as kimarts and an antares neck.

[Meganekko]

I'm not sure why but I have this feeling that you have a full heirloom bone set as well as kimarts and an antares neck.

Yes I have full bone set seeing as how back in THQ I worked hard for it and got it. As for Kimarts and Antares I have no access to either, back in THQ I felt it would be immoral of me to buy a pair since at the time no one had access and I had hopes THQ would take care of their customers and correct the fact they let a bad tester misuse his powers. I then had hope they'd eventually just release the content. So as you can see you're feeling was incorrect.

I have a feeling you saw Ascension and just assumed <3

[canajew]

Yes I have full bone set seeing as how back in THQ I worked hard for it and got it. As for Kimarts and Antares I have no access to either, back in THQ I felt it would be immoral of me to buy a pair since at the time no one had access and I had hopes THQ would take care of their customers and correct the fact they let a bad tester misuse his powers. I then had hope they'd eventually just release the content. So as you can see you're feeling was incorrect.

I have a feeling you saw Ascension and just assumed <3

Good Guess ^o^