49 replies to this topic

[Sera]

Just stop.

To the people who keep proposing stupid things just because they want them or think they would be 'cool,' just stop. Please consider the effect that the action would have on the game before opening your mouth.

I don't have faith that the GMs are able to discern 'good' ideas from 'bad' ideas, and so it's very irritating when people propose things specifically for personal gain:

It seems everyone here wants to be able to fly to 150/50 in a week, then run into an emp room, solo-kill everyone on-screen, break the emp, then go to PVP afterwards and kill everyone else. Classes are supposed to have strengths, but they're also supposed to have weaknesses, you aren't supposed do everything, so stop proposing that your class should be able to.

Stop saying that certain ideas are bad because you might not personally benefit from them. "They can't implement an easier way to get variant shoes! I still have twenty in my storage I need to sell!" Well, sucks to be you, but the game is not supposed to revolve around your financial speculations.

And you shouldn't propose things just because you think they would be 'neat':

That housing idea that was spammed all over the forums a while back is a great example of this. It's a 'neat' idea, but the amount of work required to actually implement it would be extraordinary, and the impact on gameplay would be almost nothing.

A good idea should benefit the majority of the general populace in the long-term in the most efficient manner possible. Anything that doesn't follow this is a waste of time and should not be proposed at all, unless you're just joking around.

Edited by Sera, 04 May 2011 - 06:46 PM.

[Hacks]

i propose we eliminate "working as intended" from the vocabulary of responses from gravity.

[Heimdallr]

This post is working as intended.

[Studmanly]

Yeah this forum is full of terrible ideas from terrible players but thats why i read it. Sometimes i rage a little at some but mostly i laugh.

[Scuba]

NERF SERA'S ABILITY TO MAKE GOOD POSTS!

[GuardianTK]

Sera wins again....

[Luckywhiterabbit]

ITT: A veteran posts something incredibly obvious and makes it sound all grand and preachy, and then everyone gives a +.

[GuardianTK]

ITT: A veteran posts something incredibly obvious and makes it sound all grand and preachy, and then everyone gives a +.

Some things simply aren't obvious enough. Therefore it requires a grand speech for the message to be passed on. Of course, I fear the OP might not be obvious enough. So the continued posting of stupid ideas may continue regardless.

[Luckywhiterabbit]

Well either way, if anyone actually has 20 variant shoes in storage and desparately needs to get rid of them, I'd be willing to take one off your hands :<

Also, everyone DOES want to be lv 150/50 in a week, because as far as PvP and WoE goes, you don't stand much of a chance unless you're lv 140 or higher.

In any competitive situation in a game, people like to know they are at the apex of their ability so that they can stop worrying about being handicapped by such things as level and concentrate on their own human skill. That is why it becomes so desparate to obtain lv 150 and get all the 'perfect' gears as fast as possible.

Coming from a fighting game background, the concept of MMORPG pvp is something I still have to come to terms with too, since my reflexes/skill/understanding of my character do not automatically mean I'll be able to have a fair fight with anyone else. Of course, the game is social, so of course we can't all just be automatically made lv 150 when we go into pvp, like the battle tower in Pokemon.

IMO, it's about time Gravity thought about making divisions for PVP. Brackets for players with similar level ranges so that they will be able to fight on fair ground without worrying about falling to super high level players.

Someone is probably going to turn around and say that this is another one of those 'stupid ideas' but in this case, I feel that it would benefit all players who enjoy PvP (I don't think such a thing could be applicable to WoE). So far we have very few options as far as PVP goes. It wouldn't hurt to have a bunch of other modes besides yoyo in which lower level, mid level and high level characters can go to scrap it out with players close to their own level range.

Edited by Luckywhiterabbit, 04 May 2011 - 10:50 PM.

[SpidyFreakshow]

we need an item that makes me trans, 3rd class and 150/50 instantly.

and of course i would be the only one allowed to use it

[akosinico]

Proposals are ideas,so what if I had an idea and you don't like it? It's only a matter of denial and approval of what you have in mind. You're not the only human being in this planet.

[HRdevil]

Also, everyone DOES want to be lv 150/50 in a week, because as far as PvP and WoE goes, you don't stand much of a chance unless you're lv 140 or higher.

You won't stand much of a chance even if you're 150, just saying. In Woe it's teamwork, in PVP is either the OP Classes, real life rich guys or veterans.

[Luckywhiterabbit]

yeah but if you're any less than 150 you'll stand even less of a chance.

Teamwork in Woe is good and all, but if you're getting one-shot by every dragonbreath that hits you, then you die before you get to do anything useful.

I play a shadow chaser. My role in WoE is important, but I am only lv 130. I find myself being one-shot by a lot of things from lv 140 to 150 characters before I can manuever into manhole/masq range, and I am geared fairly well (immune nid garb, cranial, green valk shoes, fire armor etc)

It can be disheartening to players to know that they will be severely handicapped until they reach 150/50 and there aren't enough things for lower level characters to do other than PvM, which a lot of people look down on for some reason.

[Sera]

It's not like I'm asking for people to + this, and the truth of the matter is that most of the things proposed when the GMs ask for suggestions are really bad.

For instance, you want the PVP system fixed. Can you think of a way to fix it fairly and easily within the pre-existing framework?

I consider the people who run RO to be in two groups, iRO and the asian devs.

The asian devs have the ability to overhaul the game, but quite frankly, they don't seem interested in any positive improvement as long as they can keep drawing cute sprites.

The iRO division seems interested in positive improvement of the game, but quite frankly, don't have the resources to overhaul any game system, and haven't proven themselves capable of implementing minor fixes very well.

When you suggest something, you have to have this management paradigm in-mind. If you propose some gradiose, sweeping change to the game's PVP system, it's simply going to get tossed in the wastebasket. If you pester heim about trying out a well-thought-out WoE/KVM/BG tweak, who knows, I've seen a couple of things go in like that recently.
But that's the thing, a tweak is not a sweeping overhaul. We can't do sweeping overhauls, but tweaks are possible.

My initial 'flowery' post can be summed up as such:

Anything you propose:
1. Should benefit the majority of players
2. Should be a long-term fix
3. Should be practical to implement

That's all I really said, and to be honest, the response to this thread actually annoys me a little bit, because I don't see it being reflected in the responses to the Seal Quest Update Proposals.
People aren't fully considering all of the things they're proposing (Asking for level 3 weapons from a quest that is specifically supposed to give level 4 weapons) or are proposing things for personal gain (Item X should/should not be implemented because of it's relation to people who farm MVPs).

A point that has been repeatedly brought up in that thread is the fact that some weapon classes are REALLY BAD in relation to others, but there's nothing that can be done about that without a game-system overhaul, which is not the point of the thread. Yes, the system does need to be overhauled imo, but we have to work with what we currently have, and what we currently have is a quest which gives badly outdated weapons and is not worth doing anymore.

To the people who are deriding me for being harsh on people who just have 'fun ideas':
Is it wrong of me to ask that the proposals that people submit for things which may actually be implemented into the game be rational and well-thought-out?
Is it wrong of me to ask that anything being considered for implementation benefit the majority of players, be within the competence of iRO to implement, and not just try to band-aid something up until it breaks again next week?

Edited by Sera, 04 May 2011 - 11:16 PM.

[Sapphic]

No more Censor Bar and Princess Knife fiascos please

IMO, it's about time Gravity thought about making divisions for PVP. Brackets for players with similar level ranges so that they will be able to fight on fair ground without worrying about falling to super high level players.

If I'm understanding you correctly, you want something that had been implemented for years to be reimplemented despite the fact that almost nobody used it.

Edited by Sapphic, 05 May 2011 - 02:21 AM.

[MeisterKirisaki]

This forum is a place to share thoughts in a moderated way. You may dislike a few ideas, but the discussion that might develop thanks to proposing a "stupid idea" (which is a brother term of "stupid question" which we all know does not exist but deserves to be asked) might lead into a creative or constructive direction.

What you basically ask for is for people to shut up who you consider more stupid than yourself. If everything would go your way, we would all start praising Stalin and Hitler by now, luckily people are different from you and me, thus different ideas emerge. Intelligent people are able to discuss any kind of idea and show flaws or offer improvements or better ideas.

[arsn89]

Just stop.

A good idea should benefit the majority of the general populace in the long-term in the most efficient manner possible. Anything that doesn't follow this is a waste of time and should not be proposed at all, unless you're just joking around.

[Puppet]

Just stop.

To the people who keep proposing stupid things just because they want them or think they would be 'cool,' just stop. Please consider the effect that the action would have on the game before opening your mouth.

I don't have faith that the GMs are able to discern 'good' ideas from 'bad' ideas, and so it's very irritating when people propose things specifically for personal gain:

It seems everyone here wants to be able to fly to 150/50 in a week, then run into an emp room, solo-kill everyone on-screen, break the emp, then go to PVP afterwards and kill everyone else. Classes are supposed to have strengths, but they're also supposed to have weaknesses, you aren't supposed do everything, so stop proposing that your class should be able to.

Stop saying that certain ideas are bad because you might not personally benefit from them. "They can't implement an easier way to get variant shoes! I still have twenty in my storage I need to sell!" Well, sucks to be you, but the game is not supposed to revolve around your financial speculations.

And you shouldn't propose things just because you think they would be 'neat':

That housing idea that was spammed all over the forums a while back is a great example of this. It's a 'neat' idea, but the amount of work required to actually implement it would be extraordinary, and the impact on gameplay would be almost nothing.

A good idea should benefit the majority of the general populace in the long-term in the most efficient manner possible. Anything that doesn't follow this is a waste of time and should not be proposed at all, unless you're just joking around.

Yes and this will work cause these forums just like every other forum out there are full of rational people that make sense or for that mater, dont enjoy trolling people and causing drama. And because gravity actual listen to us? I could make list of things broke in this game that people been telling gravity about, for years but are still not fixed. Either because there Dev's dont want to bothered, They dont have Dev's, Or they have to have kRO hand them the fix. Or they just dont care unless it makes them more money to not fix the things wrong.

Yes I have bad opinion of Gravity management and I have right to seeing I watched it get worse and worse over the years. event and management where fun till they add Karfa shop, shortly there after,all the fun event and town invasion and good community management went way of dodo bird. And short of them getting off there asses and fixing the stuff wrong in this game, instead of trying to make profit off them problems this opinion will not change, Sadly the only reason I still love this game is fact it is Sprite based which no game is these days.

Heim is nice guy but, he seem to be nothing more then Gravity spin doctor cause I hear more talk about we doing this and doing that, from him then gravity actually acting and fixes etc cause it seem if kRO dont hand deliver the fixes, to iro they are to few and far between,

Edited by Puppet, 05 May 2011 - 09:43 AM.

[Heimdallr]

I do agree with Sera on this, when we decide to do anything we look at :


Is it a response to a problem?
Is it a good idea that will be utilized and not screw up the game
Is it something sustainable for a long period (IE if its in for 3 years is it still usable then?)
Is it something we can fit into our schedule?
Is it something we can do with our own work?

Most of the stuff we are working on in May/June have all been building up since November, I am disappointed that some of the balance changes haven't happened yet, but it seems that we are coming out of that murky forest and will have our balance patches within the next month or so if not sooner. Reason we are pushing for our created content updates in May is mostly because our projects have been in a holding pattern and frankly we need to move forward so we can build on any momentum that our VIP system launch has given us.

A game that doesn't update is a game that is declining, iRO will not be in Decline, it may have some rough spots on its adventure but the overall direction is up.

[Heimdallr]

Yes and this will work cause forums are full of rational people that make sense or for that mater, dont enjoy trolling people and causeing drama. And because gravity actual listen to us? I could make list of things broke in this game that people been telling gravity about, for years but are still not fixed. Either because there Dev's dont want to bothered, They dont have Dev's, Or they have to have kRO hand them the fix. Or they just dont care unless it makes them more money to not fix the things wrong.

PM me the list of "Broken" things. So far I have a list of under 10 things that are not fixed and I'm sure some of those none of you know about. If you give me a concise list that allow us to actually test and confirm a bug/short coming we will do all we can to fix or push it to be fixed.

Reason for the PM is in case some of those things are exploit issues.

[KingOfBabylon]

LEAVE GRAVITY ALONE! HE'S A HUMAN! All you people want is MORE MORE MORE!

[HRdevil]

Is it a good idea that will be utilized and not screw up the game

Coming from someone that suggested GOD/MVP scroll buff. I wouldn't doubt you already thought of putting these kinds of stuff in lucky boxes and "Screw up the game" less. The game got screwed with KVM in lucky box, instead of making it easier to acquire and put more gameplay into the game people just got an effortless handout to whoever dishes their paychecks or simply buy KP from other players for ingame values and the oh so great HD's from +4 to +10. I wish i had gears at the time that was implemented.

I do hope we catch up to KRO I wanna scaraba dungeon, Alcabringer and weapon stat

[Beata]

There is a difference between really stupid ideas and short-sighted ideas. Sadly.. both mask the gooder ones.

[Xellie]

Humm, without stupid ideas where would we set the bar for ideas to be good?

[Fibrizzo]

This post is working as intended.

Who is the troll now?