266 replies to this topic

[BrownBear]

@mgon: I don't really understand your point. Why are you even arguing here if you think it is perfectly fine for them to make suggestions? I would actually understand what you were arguing about if you were against the very idea of this thread (suggesting changes to cleric skills). You are stating that you are fine with them suggesting it but you just don't like that they think their suggestions will happen? So you are trying to erase their hope? It really just seems like you are arguing for the sake of arguing.

It seems like you are trying to say that just because they have a set perception of the class, they cannot change that perception even if they read a good suggestion posted by a player. I'm speaking from a third person perspective here, and I did not read any change (in my opinion) that would make clerics "epic fighters" nor did I read anyone asking for that. They just want clerics to have some battle ability. They already have a few attack skills and several offensive passives. They are just asking for improvements on and around those skills because they make little difference. Because lets face it, if you are playing cleric full time and don't have any other characters to play, it can get boring simply healing and buffing all the time.

[mgon154]

Well you guys failed to see the point so you're too dumb to talk to me right now lol
We'll find out whos right anyway(It's already obvious). So let's cut to the chase, 1) It's not going to matter what you say anyway because in the end, what I was saying is still a fact thats SO OBVIOUS and I've yet to be proven wrong about clerics. 2) You will never get to have a cleric the way 'you' want them, not because they don't listen to 'suggestions', but because what you want for a cleric is not proper nor is it how they were 'created' to be in ROSE. I can say it over and over but you guys are too damn stupid to get it. If what I'm saying is bs, then they would have already made clerics the way you wanted them to be lol, but your suggestions for a cleric are improper, duh! And why would they 'nerf' clerics at one point the way they did? HMM GEE I WONDER WHY! 'I'M TOO STUPID TO UNDERSTAND WHY THEY DID THAT! HMM GEE'.... That's exactly what you guys sound like loll, you just don't 'get' it. Nothing I say will make you get it so you'll be wasting your breath on the forum asking for clerics to be soldiers (which is retarded). I have a tip for you guys, why not make a soldier? Why not make a mage? Stop trying to be someone you're not because that's amature. No need to reply to me anymore, just realize that there is a reason you haven't got what you wanted and that what I'm saying is OBVIOUSLY the 'way it is' for clerics so I couldn't be wrong about it. You just expect too much.

And stop replying. If you think I'm the retarded and stupid one, then why stoop down to 'my' level and keep arguing with me ruining YOUR reputation? shuttup lol (but obviously i'm hurting your feelings and you're butt hurt or else you would have ignored me after the 2nd post)

Edited by mgon154, 12 September 2010 - 09:07 AM.

[Phish]

Well you guys failed to see the point so you're too dumb to talk to me right now lol
We'll find out whos right anyway(It's already obvious). So let's cut to the chase, 1) It's not going to matter what you say anyway because in the end, what I was saying is still a fact thats SO OBVIOUS and I've yet to be proven wrong about clerics. 2) You will never get to have a cleric the way 'you' want them, not because they don't listen to 'suggestions', but because what you want for a cleric is not proper nor is it how they were 'created' to be in ROSE. I can say it over and over but you guys are too damn stupid to get it. If what I'm saying is bs, then they would have already made clerics the way you wanted them to be lol, but your suggestions for a cleric are improper, duh! And why would they 'nerf' clerics at one point the way they did? HMM GEE I WONDER WHY! 'I'M TOO STUPID TO UNDERSTAND WHY THEY DID THAT! HMM GEE'.... That's exactly what you guys sound like loll, you just don't 'get' it. Nothing I say will make you get it so you'll be wasting your breath on the forum asking for clerics to be soldiers (which is retarded). I have a tip for you guys, why not make a soldier? Why not make a mage? Stop trying to be someone you're not because that's amature. No need to reply to me anymore, just realize that there is a reason you haven't got what you wanted and that what I'm saying is OBVIOUSLY the 'way it is' for clerics so I couldn't be wrong about it. You just expect too much.

And stop replying. If you think I'm the retarded and stupid one, then why stoop down to 'my' level and keep arguing with me ruining YOUR reputation? shuttup lol (but obviously i'm hurting your feelings and you're butt hurt or else you would have ignored me after the 2nd post)

Have you seen the number of people who are saying to lower champs movement speed? Theres a new thread almost every day. Has their mspeed been lowered? No. Will it always be that way? No.

Stop acting like there is no such thing as change and everything is set in stone.

But anyway, I think I am done here. No point arguing with a brick wall.

Edited by Phish, 12 September 2010 - 11:27 AM.

[Kaizy]

Just curious, but why is it that every idiot on the forum after realizing they're wrong but can't admit it, brings up this reputation crap? Seriously? Are you 12? Internets is srs bsns for some I guess.

I stopped bringing up good points because as Phish said, there's no point when you're talking to a brick wall. You can mention anything you want and you won't get an intelligent response. All you get is a blah blah ur cleric cant b epix fiters!!11 blah blah things neva changes!

Edited by Kaizy, 12 September 2010 - 12:36 PM.

[Bendersmom]

I'm not looking for wild guesses, or 'maybe's. I'm looking for somebody who is pretty darn sure if your level increases your buff strength. I'm not talking about skill, because that's obvious if you level your skills can be increased. I'm talking about AFTER you max your buffs by the skills, does your LEVEL increase your buff power 'aside' from INT. Does it?

The "pro" on clerics posted this just a week ago. If he knows clerics so well, since his is 216 then he should have known this. He has no credibility and has ruined this discussion.

[ChickenBucket]

Well you guys failed to see the point so you're too dumb to talk to me right now lol
We'll find out whos right anyway(It's already obvious). So let's cut to the chase, 1) It's not going to matter what you say anyway because in the end, what I was saying is still a fact thats SO OBVIOUS and I've yet to be proven wrong about clerics. 2) You will never get to have a cleric the way 'you' want them, not because they don't listen to 'suggestions', but because what you want for a cleric is not proper nor is it how they were 'created' to be in ROSE. I can say it over and over but you guys are too damn stupid to get it. If what I'm saying is bs, then they would have already made clerics the way you wanted them to be lol, but your suggestions for a cleric are improper, duh! And why would they 'nerf' clerics at one point the way they did? HMM GEE I WONDER WHY! 'I'M TOO STUPID TO UNDERSTAND WHY THEY DID THAT! HMM GEE'.... That's exactly what you guys sound like loll, you just don't 'get' it. Nothing I say will make you get it so you'll be wasting your breath on the forum asking for clerics to be soldiers (which is retarded). I have a tip for you guys, why not make a soldier? Why not make a mage? Stop trying to be someone you're not because that's amature. No need to reply to me anymore, just realize that there is a reason you haven't got what you wanted and that what I'm saying is OBVIOUSLY the 'way it is' for clerics so I couldn't be wrong about it. You just expect too much.

And stop replying. If you think I'm the retarded and stupid one, then why stoop down to 'my' level and keep arguing with me ruining YOUR reputation? shuttup lol (but obviously i'm hurting your feelings and you're butt hurt or else you would have ignored me after the 2nd post)

you are stupid. heck ur beside span on "retardness"

[mgon154]

Have you seen the number of people who are saying to lower champs movement speed? Theres a new thread almost every day. Has their mspeed been lowered? No. Will it always be that way? No.

Stop acting like there is no such thing as change and everything is set in stone.

But anyway, I think I am done here. No point arguing with a brick wall.

There is such thing as change, but people are expecting unrealistic things to happen to clerics. I just disagreed and got flamed.

Just curious, but why is it that every idiot on the forum after realizing they're wrong but can't admit it, brings up this reputation crap? Seriously? Are you 12? Internets is srs bsns for some I guess.

I stopped bringing up good points because as Phish said, there's no point when you're talking to a brick wall. You can mention anything you want and you won't get an intelligent response. All you get is a blah blah ur cleric cant b epix fiters!!11 blah blah things neva changes!

Who do you think you're calling an idiot? And prove to me what good points you brang up lol I admit when I'm wrong. On the other hand, YOU, You have not backed up ONE thing I have posted about clerics but have just argued back giving your 'opinion' of what you think lol Don't be a hypocrite, now you look like a bigger-_-.

The "pro" on clerics posted this just a week ago. If he knows clerics so well, since his is 216 then he should have known this. He has no credibility and has ruined this discussion.

Yah that's because things change lol I been playing for years, but just came back after 2 years and first thing I wanted to ask was that question. ... ah wait a minute, aren't you the one who likes to assume crap? you're mr. assume right? Didn't I have to correct you several times before already about not assuming what people think? figures, stop stooping to a low lvl.

you are stupid. heck ur beside span on "retardness"

You must not be reading posts lol *sigh*

[CaNehDa]

how about give the cleric buffs an opposite effect when used on an enemy?

epic idea is epic

[Soda]

Who do you think you're calling an idiot? And prove to me what good points you brang up lol I admit when I'm wrong. On the other hand, YOU, You have not backed up ONE thing I have posted about clerics but have just argued back giving your 'opinion' of what you think lol Don't be a hypocrite, now you look like a bigger-_-.

I stopped bringing up good points because as Phish said, there's no point when you're talking to a brick wall. You can mention anything you want and you won't get an intelligent response

Thats the reason why he doesnt try to back up his posts further more and i really hope Calanerd will take another look at this thread 1k views still no sign of him.

[ChickenBucket]

You must not be reading posts lol *sigh*

no im not

[Soda]

BUMP

(want to keep this thread alive)

[poopiehead]

epic thread

[Soda]

I know right.. and they are just ignoring our suggestion :DD

+1

[Bendersmom]

Just because the GMs don't post in the thread does not mean they did not read it. But after this thread got argumentative it became harder to read the good ideas from the crap. Maybe, in a week or so, we should pull the good ideas out of the thread and start a new one with just the highlights, pro and con. Or we can just hope they read this one through and understand some of the things we would like to see changed. Calanor did post in the thread so we know he at least read it up to there. I think we all had some good ideas and I know they will not all be implemented but......here's hope.

[Soda]

I know but still .__. , just the post of calanerd proves that he wants us to be fs clerics only which im totally against with

[Soda]

Adam told me to bump this.. so..

BUMP!

[Phish]

It's been two months since this long going debate had been posted in, yet we haven't really seen anything applied in game about it. I hope this topic has not been forgotten by the devs.

[CaNehDa]

No, not a battle cleric. A strong support cleric.
As I said I dont like the sound of "Cleric" and "fighter" combination. I already explained why I am against "range" increases philosophy thats why I proposed defense increase.

Incrase in deff would be nice.. but there are some with already insaine deff...

Give me a bit of details on what you think a battle cleric should function as.

They can't be epic fighters, there is a point where we feel being a cleric surviving a PvM fight is fine, but being able to keep up in terms of EXP/hr to that of other classes is just making them a "generic" fighting class. Hope you understand where we are coming from, and as much as we would like to offer the clerics the building tools for battle we ask that you understand that being = to the fighting classes is not our goal. Being capable of lasting a PvM fight is idea for us, make it fun, but don't make it generic!

I think it would be epic if battle clerics would be epic fighters.... They are pretty darn strong now if you invest enough zullie into them - they are the only class that can use a FULL buffset (if u have mag deff up pots too )

PvE they are fairly strong - but are limited to bosses, there should be alot more bosses because boss's are just fun to farm

Pasted off the rose online website

Cleric

Using the power of holiness, Clerics can support their allies by restoring their health, enhancing their battle abilities, and reviving them from unconsciousness


I don't understand if you want offensive magic why not just go mage unless you have a wand fetish :3

I has huge wand fetish - and tbh - I think the HP/Def should be increased - AP doesn't need to be increased THAT much - but It could certainly use to be increased -

If battle cleric was top class(witch they should be), WarpPortal would make alot more USD from IM from buffs and passives....

Edited by CaNehDa, 11 November 2010 - 08:19 PM.

[Phish]

Defensively, clerics are not weak, offensively, they are pretty sad, even with all of the offensive passies maxed. GIving them more defense or hp would turn them into better tanks than Knights, they already received an additionaly 20% defense a couple months ago on dragon skin giving them the 3rd highest defense and highest magic defense now.

[CaNehDa]

Defensively, clerics are not weak, offensively, they are pretty sad, even with all of the offensive passies maxed. GIving them more defense or hp would turn them into better tanks than Knights, they already received an additionaly 20% defense a couple months ago on dragon skin giving them the 3rd highest defense and highest magic defense now.

yea my deff sux cuz my gear isn't reffed well enough ._.

[xdevourx]

i have recently made a ballte cleric and i will say that they do rather well in PVP versus most classes. They generally tear mages apart and do well against most champs. the suggestion of a decolak is one i have thought of several times. All other classes have a decloak as a common skill, save the muse class. Now to address this properly you have to take into consideration that this only implies to raiders. Well, look at a clerics accuracy. I have on my cleric a balanced weapon SA7 refine 10 and a DECENT accuracy buff set. even with an accuracy pot. i still cant hit most raiders anyways. The decloak would be nice but you have to spend a decent amount of money on different gears. I use full chiv set in most cases but against a raider you need a 30/30 {ap,accuracy} set just to get close to touching them. considering this, even if we had a decloak you would still have to spend tons to hit a dodge raider in buff sets. Is it really worth it? lets see you can heal buff and attack, you have 2 decent stuns and a mute........i think if anything, make us faster. So i can RUN when i NEED to. Just my 2 cents.

[Soda]

Defensively, clerics are not weak, offensively, they are pretty sad, even with all of the offensive passies maxed. GIving them more defense or hp would turn them into better tanks than Knights, they already received an additionaly 20% defense a couple months ago on dragon skin giving them the 3rd highest defense and highest magic defense now.

Totally agree, they dont need additional hp/def.. its already good (actually most clerics are even harder to kill now with that dragon skin passive). I dont think i need to keep on repeating myself on whats needed to be improved since this thread is like 5 pages long. Just doing a bump so this thread will be discuss more. Also Mom told me that they are looking into it. Calanerd just stopped posting cause it got out of hand.
*cough* THANKS TO THAT "ONE" HATER.. who has a lvl 216 char..

Edited by Soda, 12 November 2010 - 02:49 AM.

[Phish]

i have recently made a ballte cleric and i will say that they do rather well in PVP versus most classes. They generally tear mages apart and do well against most champs. the suggestion of a decolak is one i have thought of several times. All other classes have a decloak as a common skill, save the muse class. Now to address this properly you have to take into consideration that this only implies to raiders. Well, look at a clerics accuracy. I have on my cleric a balanced weapon SA7 refine 10 and a DECENT accuracy buff set. even with an accuracy pot. i still cant hit most raiders anyways. The decloak would be nice but you have to spend a decent amount of money on different gears. I use full chiv set in most cases but against a raider you need a 30/30 {ap,accuracy} set just to get close to touching them. considering this, even if we had a decloak you would still have to spend tons to hit a dodge raider in buff sets. Is it really worth it? lets see you can heal buff and attack, you have 2 decent stuns and a mute........i think if anything, make us faster. So i can RUN when i NEED to. Just my 2 cents.

Yes, even with a decloak a cleric's damage output against a decent raider is pitiful so it doesn't really matter if you can decloak them if you can't kill them while they are uncloaked. Because magic defense scales faster than defense, a raider with decently refined armor + mdef buff along with their high dodge makes a clerics damage output very weak as they only have magic attacks and cannot debuff the raider in anyway. To top it off, the 3 cleric skills that have statuses (voltage shock, votlage storm and soul doubt) have very poor priorety and raiders can easily stop the attacks with their high priorety stuns (sucker punch, triple slash, mystic knife).

Voltage shock is probably the worst stun in the game. 65% successs is about average, 320 power (lowest of all stuns), 22m range is nice but the priorety is so terrible it loses to stuns that have less range than it such as weapon launcher (16m range), mystic knife (18m range) concussive grenade (~16m range). If you happen to be at close range when using the skill it will lose to practically every other stun.


Sure a decloak can help a full support cleric, but the support cleric supports their allies, who would be the ones decloaking and killing anyway.




Yes, a cleric can beat a champ if the champ doesn't invest into magic defense, or better yet run away; which the cleric has no way of stopping since they have significantly less movement speed, no efficient stuns, and no mspeed debuff or any debuff for that matter. To top it off a champ can debuff the clerics mspeed to make running away even easier.

[Curculus]

i'm surprised mgon got to argue as long as hid did. without somebody coming on and saying "didn't your mother ever tell you not to feed trolls".

and wow....it's one thing to have some random player to say that clerics are good for nothing but healing/buffing "because that's what they're supposed to do". but to have an admin basically say the same thing....that's kinda sad.

out of all of the MMORPGs that i've seen, every support class has the ability to fight on a similar level as other classes with the only difference being the clerics just can't melee. they're mostly capable of this because they can heal themselves, debuff the enemy, have the speed to hit and run, or just something that requires them to fight with actual skill rather than spaming 2 or 3 attack skills. but at the same time they have to sacrifice some supportive skills so they can do this. unbalanced only if done wrong.

and it just seems like there is alot of unbalanced stuff in this game and the devs are frantically trying to balance everything but end up makeing the exact same mistakes as....well....every other mmorpg.

[twitch]

theres to much to read iskipped to page 5..anyways.. give clerics a burn! hey why not right? oh oh give thema decloak! i have no idea why u guys dont have it?and uhmm acc passives?well just my suggestions any comments on it?