96 replies to this topic

[Viri]

You mean RG not sura right?

[LordVader]

You mean RG not sura right?

RG is nowhere NEAR as broken as sura.

RG has 1 skill, Exceed Break, that can feasibly one shot most people with an extensive and interruptible cast time. Also Exceed Break is based on hit of RG. Got enough Flee and it's of no concern. Also Pdodge can delay anyone from being killed from EB aswell.

Suras can perform multiple gfists/GoH before RG can load up one exceed break and get close enough to even use it.

Edited by LordVader, 10 July 2011 - 12:31 AM.

[Viri]

Thank you for proving you have no idea what you're talking about. A++ post.

[meoryou2]

Buff.

Kind of a buff.... have you ever tried using the Sura combos? Going from Dragon Combo > fallen empire is NOTHING like RTB > RQuad. I tried combo on my Sura, unless you sit there and hit the Fallen Empire key repeatedly it won't go off, after the Dragon Combo goes off you have to sit there for like 1-2seconds before Fallen Empire then manage to get Tiger Cannon off after that, taking away your own and targets SP / HP, and then finally get GoH off taking further SP. At least with this "buff" if the Sura wants to do the extra damage it's not going to be snap on screen > GoH > GoH >GoH > snap away and cast Zen, rinse and repeat. Especially since some of the combo skills take spheres themselves. A sura is going to have to carry a lot more SP and healing items if they start doing GoH through the combos. Not to mention they are going to have to get up close and personal to do the combos, they won't be able to stand half a screen away where you can't touch them at all.

Anyone who can repeatedly get the whole combo chain off in WoE legit is gonna get props from me... it will be like old times seeing someone actually manage to full combo chain a GFist to bypass the cast bar, it CAN happen but you won't see it very often.

EDIT: Misremembered the exact wording on Tiger cannon: it says CAN beused after Fallen Empire, not MUST be used in combo. Irowiki says cast can be interrupted, I suppose it depends on the cast time when not used in combos ( which do 2X damage with TC ). If the cast time is long enough it shouldn't be too big an issue, if it is damn near instant like most GoHs get then its a bit different.

If you say rampage blaster you should probably stop WoEing on level 50 baby characters.

A dual belted Sura with RD 10 does a fairly decent RB even in WoE, combine that with a RK partner with a decent DB and hit with DB / RB at the same time and you can do a lot of damage in a decent sized AoE. Obviously it's not the best skill a Sura has but it's decent. Leveling wise for Suras it is actually really good, I have seen non belted Suras hit 30-35K pretty easy with it.




That said the only thing a Sura is really NOT so good at is leveling the first bunch of jobs until you hit Rising Dragon at least level 5 so you can LR twice in a row without Windmill mobbing.

Edited by meoryou2, 10 July 2011 - 09:05 AM.

[Scuba]

I think windmill is a pretty good AoE. And Cursed Circle is also a pretty good AoE. Just because they don't have successful AoE damage doesn't mean they don't have any powerful AoE skills.

[FiskBlack]

*sarcasm detector explodes*

That wasn't sarcasm, maybe you missundertand me. o_o

I still think he is awsome

[Nombus]

Unless it has changed in the last month or so windmill also has a short delay ( maybe 1 second-ish? ) after snapping, shorter than gfist but you can't do it right after a snap.

I don't know if it ever had a 1 second delay but I asked someone to test it last WoE and Windmill is usable immediately after snap according to him.

[meoryou2]

I don't know if it ever had a 1 second delay but I asked someone to test it last WoE and Windmill is usable immediately after snap according to him.

Hmm interesting. I just logged on my Sura to test and the very first snap > windmill after Rising dragon / Zen is immediate, all snap > Windmill after that has the ~0.75-1second delay after snap, even after waiting for RD to expire and recasting it... going through a map change resets it so the first snap > windmill has no delay. And yes I did wait for the re-use delay to be up on windmill while testing....

[HRdevil]

Suras can perform multiple gfists/GoH before RG can load up one exceed break and get close enough to even use it.

Unless its a n00b RG that does not have Defending aura and reflect.

[Viri]

If you have shield spell 1 reflect mode up, reflect damage, defending aura and guard up you can AFK and a sura can't kill you without double KOing at the very least rofl. You're all terrible

[Mefistofeles]

If you have shield spell 1 reflect mode up, reflect damage, defending aura and guard up you can AFK and a sura can't kill you without double KOing at the very least rofl. You're all terrible

and that remove the fact that skills from sura are really broken? first of all, they dont have fixed cast time, and in case of GoH can be spamed in middle of precast of 40 sorcs, why? it doenst being interrupted when the sura receive damage, WOW IF A SORC, WARLOCK, ARCH BISHOP, MAESTRO, WANDERER, CAN DO THE AMAZING SNAP+GOH= 1 HIT KO OR SNAP+CURSED CIRCLE(WICH NOW DONT HAVE SUCCES RATE, BECOUSE NOW ITS 100%)= A WHOLE GUILD TOTALLY USLESS FOR A MASSIVE RAPE, they even can debuff maestro/wanderer skills, they can drain FULL SP WITH 100% SUCCES RATE AND DEALING A HEAVY DAMAGE.
A balance? make gloria domini the only skill with cast time that CANT BE INTERRUPTED IN WOE, also fixed cast time and after cast delay on all sura and genetic skills OR REMOVE FIXED CAST TIME AND AFTER CAST DELAY FROM MAESTRO/WANDERER, SORCERER, RUNE KNIGHT, ROYAL GUARD, ARCH BISHOP(FAIL EXORCISMUS ITS STUPID) RANGERS, AND ANY OTHER CLASS

in case of rg skills, the balance could be: make clearance and dispell a way to remove those buffs, like shield spell and reflect damage

Edited by Mefistofeles, 10 July 2011 - 01:15 PM.

[FiskBlack]

Unless its a n00b RG that does not have Defending aura and reflect.

Eve with DA a GoH 2x megged still hurts, i wonder how is with the other classes witouth DA? =o

[LordVader]

If you have shield spell 1 reflect mode up, reflect damage, defending aura and guard up you can AFK and a sura can't kill you without double KOing at the very least rofl. You're all terrible

LoL you bad. Let's just address this terribad situation you place in front of me.

RG with SS1 reflect mode up, RD, DA, and Guard are your arguments vs. sura. Sura uses Tiger Canon first, burns sp of RG to 0, Reflect Damage drops. RG in most cases cannot afford to have maxed guard to lvl 10, normal is 5, but for sake of argument we will assume 10 (30% chance to guard). Any sura worth a damn will have modified his gears to not severely overkill and without Reflect damage up there is 70% chance the first gfist will connect and kill minus the reflect damage that has been removed. Sura will laugh and hump the gryphon until he respawns. Broken class is broken.

lrn2play

[Viri]

If you tiger cannon someone with 100% reflect on while being hit on a sura you're going to die straight away. Don't be stupid. You can get well over 100% reflect, you're bad.

I'd be more afraid as a single person in a room full of 39 sorcs and 1 sura than 40 suras. Arullo is extremely powerful and would be instant death the second it landed on you given no one pokes you out of it with something useless.

Edited by Viri, 10 July 2011 - 02:52 PM.

[LordVader]

If you tiger cannon someone with 100% reflect on while being hit on a sura you're going to die straight away. Don't be stupid. You can get well over 100% reflect, you're bad.

I'd be more afraid as a single person in a room full of 39 sorcs and 1 sura than 40 suras. Arullo is extremely powerful and would be instant death the second it landed on you given no one pokes you out of it with something useless.

You can get over 100% reflect but it will require more than SS1, now you want to add other things to try and make your bad argument good? Want to add a +10 valk mant while you are back pedaling? B/c the SS1 reflect by itself even at 65% won't be enough to kill a sura or with 100%+ reflect. You bad and it is showing more with each post. Stop trying to derail this thread with troll type nonsense that is WAY off base.

[Viri]

SS1 stacks with reflect damage, that's 95% by itself with a 130 defense shield which is pretty standard. So a +0 valk mant, my bad. Expensive gears I know. If you have less hp than a sura you're pretty bad.

[JAYRAD]

any decent sura knows not to fist a rg

end of discussion

Edited by Makk, 10 July 2011 - 06:12 PM.

[SethTheSecond]

SS1 stacks with reflect damage, that's 95% by itself with a 130 defense shield which is pretty standard. So a +0 valk mant, my bad. Expensive gears I know. If you have less hp than a sura you're pretty bad.

you're joking,right? who keeps a +0 valk mant...at least a +4 at the very minimum (still 13% reflect)

and it's not 95% reflect. it's 105% reflect. SS1 = 65% and + 40 from reflect = 105%. Add a +4 valk mant reflect and you have 118% reflect. A good RG should at least have over 40k hp. No normal shura is gonna survive that without one shotting himself. DA will also make it so the shura will take forever to kill the RG if he decides to try to GoH or KA.

[Viri]

It was to prove a point, and if you're trying to kill a rg in DA with KA or GOH they can outpot you with red pots rofl.

[CeruleanGamer]

They should give GoH and GFist a 5 minute delay like what they have for Warlock's Comet.

Really, it's a fair fix I swear. xD

Also, the buff on GoH is LOL..... Who the hell uses GoH on a combo? >_>

Edited by CeruleanGamer, 11 July 2011 - 01:07 PM.

[Fibrizzo]

aoe damage

Really?

Hmmmm, no.

[CeruleanGamer]

Lightning Ride and Sky Blow says hi.

[Viri]

Solid 2k damage in WoE. YEAHhhhhhhhhhhh

[Scuba]

^ CSI Miami YYYYYYYYYYYEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH

[Alca]

Rampage blaster still does decent damage in woe and is highly effective for lvling purposes. With how broken sura class is I can see how it looks like the rest of us are on lvl 50 baby chars.

Curious on what your definition of "decent" is.