30 replies to this topic

[GalenDresden]

So, I'm thinking of making a Swordsman and wanting help with a few things.

First: What is the best Stat layout for Swordsman and than going beyond to the upper classes.

Second: What is the best class path? Knight or Crusader?

Third: Weapon Selection?

I would want it rated this way

Easiest
Fastest to Level
Skills

Thanks to anyone who can provide assistance in this.

[GalenDresden]

Figured I'd add in I am thinking of going RG and would like a little help? Not sure if I want in on the WoE as I've realy not got the time in real life. But I do love bashing monsters. ^_^

So any advice would be nice.

[TheSquishy]

I'd suggest trying them both. It's not to hard to level up both a crusader and a knight.

Agi, str, dex, with crescent scythe (a spear) for a weapon works for both classes.

For stats dex first (40).
Then str 30
Then agi 50.

You can add a little int if you want for sp but gear will help better.

This should get you through swordie-dom.

Post back when you get job 40.

[GalenDresden]

I'd suggest trying them both. It's not to hard to level up both a crusader and a knight.

Agi, str, dex, with crescent scythe (a spear) for a weapon works for both classes.

For stats dex first (40).
Then str 30
Then agi 50.

You can add a little int if you want for sp but gear will help better.

This should get you through swordie-dom.

Post back when you get job 40.

I was hoping to go Royal Guard as it's story appeals more to me so I guess the question should now be Paladin or Crusader?

Also, considering what I want to do...I'm saving skill points except for the first one in Sword Mastery. Any idea where to put the others?

Edited by GalenDresden, 20 September 2011 - 07:56 PM.

[TheSquishy]

Well you don't get serious about skills till you're a paladin.

the recommended progression is:
swordsman>crusader>high novie>high swordie>paladin>royal guard

Paladins and RGs are divided into 2 primary types
-Spear: good offensive with good tanking abilities
-shield/support-limited offensive ability in exchange for superior defensive ability.As

As a crusader, you will focus on spear quicken/spear mastery/holy cross for offense
Your goal is to reach trans as fast as possible.

As a paladin you will decide which play style suits you best. You also get 1 free stat/skill reset if you
change your mind or make a mistake.

[MrBudd]

It's entirely possible to make a spear based battle support rg. The only major support skill you need is sacrifice and defending aura, everything else can go towards offensive spear skills.

Pure battle rgs are ok for soloing but a battle support is far more versatile when you start moving as a party to keep other support characters alive.

[GalenDresden]

I was more interested in what skills I grab right now as a Swordman.

[TheSquishy]

Bash 10
Magnum Break 10
HP Recovery 10

Sword Mastery 10 ( only if you can't get a spear anytime soon or you already own a super awesome sword)

Otherwise, get Provoke 5, Endure 1, and whatever else you like till job 40.

If you are planing to use a sword, please post here because you'll be taking different skills as a crusader.
Okays?

[GalenDresden]

Bash 10
Magnum Break 10
HP Recovery 10

Sword Mastery 10 ( only if you can't get a spear anytime soon or you already own a super awesome sword)

Otherwise, get Provoke 5, Endure 1, and whatever else you like till job 40.

If you are planing to use a sword, please post here because you'll be taking different skills as a crusader.
Okays?

I got my hands today actually on a Guirsame[2] today and sent it to him from my Merchant and it seems I am doing just fine on the skills so far. Anything else I should watch for?

[EvilLoynis]

Read the Mah Agi Sader thread thats pinned in here it should answer all questions.

[GalenDresden]

Read the Mah Agi Sader thread thats pinned in here it should answer all questions.

Thanks and it did, though I think I need to do the stats fixing as I level.

Which reminds me, at 22/21 right now and wondering where I should level my swordie right now. I'm also loving my spear though I wish I could put a weapon card or 2 on it. Any cards I should look for early on? >_>

[TheSquishy]

Cards for a nub spear.

I'd say wolf card is cheap enough and undesired enough to put it in random weapon.

it give Atk+15,Crit 1.

also Skeleton Card, Hornet Card.

[GalenDresden]

Still haven't found the cars but I finally decided on what I am going to do for my non-trans second job after watching Roan in the Ragnarok anime. O_o You Crusaders are really awesome losoking! That just sells it for me.

Is it possible to hybrid the Grand Cross and Shield builds together into a combination of both?

Also, just to update you all on my progress

Levels: Base 33(77.2%)/Job 32(64.1%) Any ideas where I should level would be nice as I am working the Payon Cave right now for something.

Stats: STR 20/VIT 25/AGI 23/INT 5/DEX 23/LUK 1 I am thinking to boost INT a bit and keep working on STR and VIT mainly.

Skills: Went to the Hypnotist and redid the skills. I maxed HP Recovery and Sword Mastery with 5 into Bash and Provoke. There is 1 in Magnum Break. I am heading to get the Quest Skills as we speak and got most of the items for it. I just need Horrendous Mouths, Banana Juice, Padded Armor, Royal Jelly, and Tentacles.

Equip: I have the Eden Saber I and most of that. I have Chainmail and a Shield as well. Got a suit of Full Plate in storage for when I hit Level 40.

[EvilLoynis]

Stats: STR 20/VIT 25/AGI 23/INT 5/DEX 23/LUK 1 I am thinking to boost INT a bit and keep working on STR and VIT mainly.

Skills: Went to the Hypnotist and redid the skills. I maxed HP Recovery and Sword Mastery with 5 into Bash and Provoke. There is 1 in Magnum Break. I am heading to get the Quest Skills as we speak and got most of the items for it. I just need Horrendous Mouths, Banana Juice, Padded Armor, Royal Jelly, and Tentacles.

Equip: I have the Eden Saber I and most of that. I have Chainmail and a Shield as well. Got a suit of Full Plate in storage for when I hit Level 40.

The Sword Mastery is a WASTE. reset again before you hit 40 and get rid of it.

Also in your opening post you wanted info on quickest build to level with as well. This deffinately does NOT include using Grand Cross at all. Grand Cross sucks quite a bit. HOLY Cross is a Single Target hit kind of like Bash.

You quickest leveling option is to make a Spear/Agi Sader. Below is a Link to the skills you want.

http://irowiki.org/~...XHNcA1GAakGS1cL

Also for this build you will want to grab a Crescent Scythe Spear as soon as you hit level 48.

Stat wise you will want to focus on Agility/Dex and then Str. Don't worry about Vitality as you will not be getting hit enough to need it much. Below are the BASE stats my Crusader had when he was just level 90 were:

66 Str
90 Agi
10 Vit
01 Int
40 Dex
30 Luk

I can also tell you that most of the Str here was added after level 80.

The reason my Dex is so low is that using a Crescent Scythe gives 30 Crit, + Spear Quicken lvl 10 gives another +30 and 30 Luck gives 10. All this adds upto 70% critical hits. I followed same build as a Paladin as well.

Edited by EvilLoynis, 02 October 2011 - 09:14 PM.

[GalenDresden]

The Sword Mastery is a WASTE. reset again before you hit 40 and get rid of it.

Also in your opening post you wanted info on quickest build to level with as well. This deffinately does NOT include using Grand Cross at all. Grand Cross sucks quite a bit. HOLY Cross is a Single Target hit kind of like Bash.

You quickest leveling option is to make a Spear/Agi Sader. Below is a Link to the skills you want.

http://irowiki.org/~...XHNcA1GAakGS1cL

Also for this build you will want to grab a Crescent Scythe Spear as soon as you hit level 48.

Stat wise you will want to focus on Agility/Dex and then Str. Don't worry about Vitality as you will not be getting hit enough to need it much. Below are the BASE stats my Crusader had when he was just level 90 were:

66 Str
90 Agi
10 Vit
01 Int
40 Dex
30 Luk

I can also tell you that most of the Str here was added after level 80.

The reason my Dex is so low is that using a Crescent Scythe gives 30 Crit, + Spear Quicken lvl 10 gives another +30 and 30 Luck gives 10. All this adds upto 70% critical hits. I followed same build as a Paladin as well.

I don't like to rely on crits and luck. I'm more a speed/endurance/defense minded kind of person. And part of what made me think of doing a hybrid was seeing the Ragnarok anime. ^_^*** (Yes there is one).

Anyways, I got my stats crossed. AGI is 25 and VIT is 23.

Redid my skills though so now they are this> 10 HP Recovery / 8 Bash & Magnum Break / 5 Provoke / 1 Endure

I am thinking of waiting till Job Level 50 so I can max out the Endure or save points for the change over to Crusader. I am also still in need of a dungeon to level in for the time being. Sunken Ship at all useful?

Edited by GalenDresden, 03 October 2011 - 05:57 AM.

[EvilLoynis]

I am thinking of waiting till Job Level 50 so I can max out the Endure or save points for the change over to Crusader.

Need to inform you that you can NOT carry unused skill points over to the next job class. You actually won't be allowed to change until you spend all the skill points you have.

In short this means that as a Crusader you will only be able to get 49 Skill points MAX.

Also in regards to "relying" on crits, you won't be but it will do most of your damage. I mean Spear Quicken already gives 30% critical hits and the CScythe spear gives another 30%. 70% means that 7 out of 10 will be crit hits but you still have quite a bit of Dex as well, the 3 that are not crit will prob still hit for normal damage.


FYI Critical hits now do 140% damage that a normal one does.

The other fact is this, if you bother with the shield skills it will take you forever to level. You may be able to tank for others but really won't be able to kill efficiently by yourself. This means you will be curtailed to leveling with a Party ALL THE TIME. This also means you will have to share exp from kills meaning you don't get as much and will take longer to level.

Just so you know THIS will be my ultimate build as a Royal Guard. You can see as a Paladin I did get some of the shield skills to help out with tanking a bit. But the problem is that needing 26 points as Crusader to max Spear/Peco skills and then 10 in Faith doesn't leave much else. Shield type builds will usually NOT get the Spear skills but that sucks as the best skills a RG can have NEED those spear/peco skills. I mean Spear Quicken also increases the damage of OVERBRAND. Plus the fact that Riding Peco and have Spear mastery eliminates size Penalties to Med guys so you do Full damage to Med & Large and 75% to small with a 2h Spear.

[GalenDresden]

Need to inform you that you can NOT carry unused skill points over to the next job class. You actually won't be allowed to change until you spend all the skill points you have.

In short this means that as a Crusader you will only be able to get 49 Skill points MAX.

Also in regards to "relying" on crits, you won't be but it will do most of your damage. I mean Spear Quicken already gives 30% critical hits and the CScythe spear gives another 30%. 70% means that 7 out of 10 will be crit hits but you still have quite a bit of Dex as well, the 3 that are not crit will prob still hit for normal damage.


FYI Critical hits now do 140% damage that a normal one does.

The other fact is this, if you bother with the shield skills it will take you forever to level. You may be able to tank for others but really won't be able to kill efficiently by yourself. This means you will be curtailed to leveling with a Party ALL THE TIME. This also means you will have to share exp from kills meaning you don't get as much and will take longer to level.

Just so you know THIS will be my ultimate build as a Royal Guard. You can see as a Paladin I did get some of the shield skills to help out with tanking a bit. But the problem is that needing 26 points as Crusader to max Spear/Peco skills and then 10 in Faith doesn't leave much else. Shield type builds will usually NOT get the Spear skills but that sucks as the best skills a RG can have NEED those spear/peco skills. I mean Spear Quicken also increases the damage of OVERBRAND. Plus the fact that Riding Peco and have Spear mastery eliminates size Penalties to Med guys so you do Full damage to Med & Large and 75% to small with a 2h Spear.

Ah okay. Well that means I will just max Magnum Break as I want to avoid any Item Gathering. ^_^* Your also making my +6 Partisian look good again! Though I will be in the market soon for Elemental Spears.

So how about this as a possibility? Agi/Spear Cross Hybrid? I know you said Grand Cross sucks but I want to be versatile as both a tank and solo. And looking at the builds, they start out rather similar. Any thoughts?

I also still need a suggestion for a place to level up decently.

Edited by GalenDresden, 03 October 2011 - 02:44 PM.

[EvilLoynis]

For leveling do the Eden group quests.

http://irowiki.org/w...vel_26_.7E_40_2

These get you going pretty quick even with not so good gear or even the free eden gear.


The problem with trying to get Grand Cross in any build is that it requires so damn much. Remember as well this skill hurts YOU as well as monsters unless you wear Holy Armor (BTW Holy armor card costs 99m+). The max you could get would be GC level 7 without sacrificing points in needed skills. This would also mean sacrificing Holy Cross and only getting 6 points in it instead of maxing it.

The MAIN problem with Grand Cross is how it changed with renewal. You see both Normal and Magic attack are involved in this, but the problem is you really can't get any decent MAtk as a Crusader anymore. Before stats used to give you the most matk so it was possible to have a High Int/Str/Dex build to deal massive damage. Now Int doesn't contribute nearly enough MAtk to make it worthwhile you need a weapon with decent MAtk, but weapons with High MAtk have pretty low Normal atk so your just trading.

I would rather have a single target Holy Attack that does 900% normal Atk damage than one that does 500% of both MAtk & normal Atk but also hurts you. Not to mention HC takes only 20sp and GC takes 100sp at max levels.

Genesis Ray as Royal Guard is an upgraded version of Grand Cross. At max level 5 it does 1800% Physical and 1500% Magic Damage, both Holy element. Only costs 60sp.

Lol I am just getting excited thinking of GRay. You can use it by Banding or under Inspiration, Inspiration gives +300 atk not to mention +20 to stats at max level. Think about that an extra 300 * 1800% = 5.4k damage.

Edited by EvilLoynis, 03 October 2011 - 06:31 PM.

[GalenDresden]

For leveling do the Eden group quests.

http://irowiki.org/w...vel_26_.7E_40_2

These get you going pretty quick even with not so good gear or even the free eden gear.


The problem with trying to get Grand Cross in any build is that it requires so damn much. Remember as well this skill hurts YOU as well as monsters unless you wear Holy Armor (BTW Holy armor card costs 99m+). The max you could get would be GC level 7 without sacrificing points in needed skills. This would also mean sacrificing Holy Cross and only getting 6 points in it instead of maxing it.

The MAIN problem with Grand Cross is how it changed with renewal. You see both Normal and Magic attack are involved in this, but the problem is you really can't get any decent MAtk as a Crusader anymore. Before stats used to give you the most matk so it was possible to have a High Int/Str/Dex build to deal massive damage. Now Int doesn't contribute nearly enough MAtk to make it worthwhile you need a weapon with decent MAtk, but weapons with High MAtk have pretty low Normal atk so your just trading.

I would rather have a single target Holy Attack that does 900% normal Atk damage than one that does 500% of both MAtk & normal Atk but also hurts you. Not to mention HC takes only 20sp and GC takes 100sp at max levels.

Genesis Ray as Royal Guard is an upgraded version of Grand Cross. At max level 5 it does 1800% Physical and 1500% Magic Damage, both Holy element. Only costs 60sp.

Lol I am just getting excited thinking of GRay. You can use it by Banding or under Inspiration, Inspiration gives +300 atk not to mention +20 to stats at max level. Think about that an extra 300 * 1800% = 5.4k damage.

Maybe it would be possible to only take GC up to just 5 and leave it there than take Genesis Ray as an RG? That stats could be mainly still put into AGI & DEX with VIT close behind followed by STR & INT? GC wouldn't be your main damage dealer (that is what the Spear is for) but would be good to weaken a mob of enemies than Magnum Break (which when Maxed might be better not taking into account attributes) or what not? Bonus would be if you MB with Berserk in effect, you might actually kill everything. Would need Heal though to stay worthwhile and possibly some Blue and White Pots for backup without a dedicated Healer.

I will be doing the quests for Eden I think later this week. I am right now hard at work getting the Moth Wing, 30 Tentacles, and 2 more Royal Jelly to get the Quest Skills. ^_^

Edited by GalenDresden, 04 October 2011 - 07:31 AM.

[EvilLoynis]

Maybe it would be possible to only take GC up to just 5 and leave it there than take Genesis Ray as an RG? That stats could be mainly still put into AGI & DEX with VIT close behind followed by STR & INT? GC wouldn't be your main damage dealer (that is what the Spear is for) but would be good to weaken a mob of enemies than Magnum Break (which when Maxed might be better not taking into account attributes) or what not? Bonus would be if you MB with Berserk in effect, you might actually kill everything. Would need Heal though to stay worthwhile and possibly some Blue and White Pots for backup without a dedicated Healer.

I will be doing the quests for Eden I think later this week. I am right now hard at work getting the Moth Wing, 30 Tentacles, and 2 more Royal Jelly to get the Quest Skills. ^_^

Bottom line is GC does not work well for leveling. If you want to get it then drop the spear skills as a Crusader. Also you would no longer want an Agi build but a Vit build for mobbing.

Good Luck, you'll need it.


It is not a good idea to mix the Spear skills as a Crusader other than with Holy Cross as there just are not enough points what with Faith needing 10 (even if it didn't need 10, it's still a great skill).

As a Paladin you would be able to get both if you want. And that fastest way to get to Paladin is as Spear/Agi Sader lol.

If you choose to drop spear skills then you get Sacrifice and Guard if your helping others. Makes you a Great Tank and soak up others damage.

Here is a build for a GC Paladin with Rapid Smiting.
http://irowiki.org/~...JkINcKlfJf2s3bx
or
http://irowiki.org/~...JkINcIliJfbn5bx

To modify the above for a Sader you would ofc drop Rapid, Lower Guard to 8 (only 2% difference from 10), <HC to 6, <Sac to 1 and still have 3 points to either boost Sac or get Defending Aura.

Edited by EvilLoynis, 04 October 2011 - 07:02 PM.

[GalenDresden]

Bottom line is GC does not work well for leveling. If you want to get it then drop the spear skills as a Crusader. Also you would no longer want an Agi build but a Vit build for mobbing.

Good Luck, you'll need it.


It is not a good idea to mix the Spear skills as a Crusader other than with Holy Cross as there just are not enough points what with Faith needing 10 (even if it didn't need 10, it's still a great skill).

As a Paladin you would be able to get both if you want. And that fastest way to get to Paladin is as Spear/Agi Sader lol.

If you choose to drop spear skills then you get Sacrifice and Guard if your helping others. Makes you a Great Tank and soak up others damage.

Here is a build for a GC Paladin with Rapid Smiting.
http://irowiki.org/~...JkINcKlfJf2s3bx
or
http://irowiki.org/~...JkINcIliJfbn5bx

To modify the above for a Sader you would ofc drop Rapid, Lower Guard to 8 (only 2% difference from 10), <HC to 6, <Sac to 1 and still have 3 points to either boost Sac or get Defending Aura.

Now that is what I was saying. I was thinking after transcendence, not before. I want to get to rebirth ASAP. Afterwards would be the time to work on a possible Royal Guard build that uses both Spears+Spear-based Skills and Genesis Ray to do it's damage.

Anyways, just switched into Full Plate and got myself the Lance today (Merchant is awesome !) and right now just working still on the Quest Skills! *rolls eyes* Help me if you can! I don't want to spend forever hunting down Horrendous Mouths, Tentacles, Royal Jelly, and Moth Wings.

Edited by GalenDresden, 04 October 2011 - 07:20 PM.

[EvilLoynis]

Now that is what I was saying. I was thinking after transcendence, not before. I want to get to rebirth ASAP. Afterwards would be the time to work on a possible Royal Guard build that uses both Spears+Spear-based Skills and Genesis Ray to do it's damage.

Anyways, just switched into Full Plate and got myself the Lance today (Merchant is awesome !) and right now just working still on the Quest Skills! *rolls eyes* Help me if you can! I don't want to spend forever hunting down Horrendous Mouths, Tentacles, Royal Jelly, and Moth Wings.

What did you think of this link?

Good Luck, you'll need it.

[GalenDresden]

What did you think of this link?

Good Luck, you'll need it.

It is not luck but skill. ^_^

Anyways, My Swordie is now 46/43 with this stat spread: STR 28/AGI 30/VIT 28/INT 18/DEX 28/LUK 5

Still using the hat and now leveling in the Orc Dungeon to 50 still. Might throw a few extra Skill Points after maxing Endure into Provoke.

[EvilLoynis]

It is not luck but skill. ^_^

Anyways, My Swordie is now 46/43 with this stat spread: STR 28/AGI 30/VIT 28/INT 18/DEX 28/LUK 5

Still using the hat and now leveling in the Orc Dungeon to 50 still. Might throw a few extra Skill Points after maxing Endure into Provoke.

Why bother going to job 50? The reward for Saders who change at 50 sucks, it's only 6 more white pots lmao.

[GalenDresden]

Why bother going to job 50? The reward for Saders who change at 50 sucks, it's only 6 more white pots lmao.

Made a promise to an Acolyte friend who is going to go FS Priest and is working to job 50. We Party together and seem to make an awesome team. Wouldn't mind picking up a dedicated ranged support (archer or mage or both even!) and maybe a thief or one of the other classes. ^_^

So what do you think of my stats by the way Lyonis?

Edited by GalenDresden, 07 October 2011 - 08:40 PM.