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Durability v360 Update


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#1 Leonis

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 10:24 AM

Hello everyone!

As you're now aware, the way durability works on items has been changed.

First, let me start with the two major reasons durability was worked on.

  • The act of repairing equipment was rare when leveling.
  • The cost of repairing was negligible and didn't seem to increase by very much as equipment increased in value.
Both major points involve a natural drain on zulie in the economy. There are few drains within the game play of significance, but many faucets. We felt this particular drain could stand to be increased in proportion to the value and effect of a piece of equipment.
So the factors in the expense of repairing damaged equipment are: durability, the item's base price, any appraisal stats or gems and the refine grade it is.


So #1; originally the act of reduction was effectively, random chance. Not only that, but the act of initiating that chance of being damaged was based on attack, not a successful strike. So if you were to just swing at someone or something, you had the chance to lose durability life. We didn't like seeing that. So we started by reasoning "what would cause a weapon or armor to become damaged?" The answer was simple, making contact. The first step was to make it so durability loss is only based on a successful hit. But that seemed a little unfair and too quick of a loss. So as a measure of helping reduce the rate of durability life loss, we provided a 'resistance' mechanic. The durability of the piece of equipment now acts as a resistance chance against taking damage to durability. As it stands right now, the durability on weapons and armor is nearly the percentage of resistance it has to taking damage. Each durability point is worth about 1% resistance, so a 50 durability item would have about 50% chance to resist. That's not exact, but that's a simple way to look at it.


#2; As stated above, the factors of what's taken in to consideration has been changed. Previously the cost of repairs had little basis to what made the value increase and with how ROSE has evolved over the years, we saw a need to adjust where the value was being considered. A lot of this reason is influenced by the concept that's been heard from the community, "the rich get richer, the poor can't catch up" or something to that effect. In this we wanted to ensure the cost of repairs reflected the value of the item and it is expected, if you are able to afford such a luxurious and well refined piece of equipment, you can also afford a higher repair bill. Now, this isn't all done on the reason that because you have the money, we are forcing you to spend it. It also stems from the reasoning that if you have a more advanced piece of equipment, it stood to reason that it would require more expertise to repair it without further damaging it. You don't have the same repair bills for a 1980 car with hardly any electronics in it compared to a car built in 2012, do you? :wacko:

So those are the major reasons behind why the durability was changed. Now that we've gotten that out of the way, on to the next topic!


How does it work?

When attacking:
  • Land an attack that caused damage.
  • Chance of durability life loss is put against the item's durability.
  • Resistance succeeded - no durability life loss.
  • Resistance failed
  • The damage dealt is converted in to durability life loss, which should be roughly a 0.1% loss in durability life.
[/list]When defending
  • Received an attack that caused damage.
  • Was the attack blocked by a shield?
  • Yes - The shield will automatically be chosen for the chance to receive durability life loss.
  • Resistance succeeded - no durability life loss.
  • Resistance failed
  • The damage dealt is converted in to durability life loss, which should be roughly a 0.1% loss in durability life.
[*]No - One piece of equipment, that is equipped, will now be selected for durability life loss.
  • A piece of equipment is selected at random with the chance rate based on the exposure of the body. (See more below for explanation)
  • Resistance succeeded - no durability life loss.
  • Resistance failed
  • The damage dealt is converted in to durability life loss, which should be roughly a 0.1% loss in durability life.
[/list][/list]Equipment Selection for durability life loss

The rate of equipment being selected was based on two things, the expectancy that you wish to defend yourself and the exposure of said armor piece. What you will see listed below is the rate in which has been designated the chance of selection. Based on the facts, if you had a shield, you would raise it to defend yourself with, giving it the greatest chance of absorbing an incoming attack. Next, exposure, your body would have the greatest exposure to being struck otherwise, and as you typically are facing an opponent, the body and back have the larger chances of being struck. Next, the arms, legs and head, all extremities and felt to have equal chance of being struck. Then finally, the face. As most would have the reflexes to not want to be punched in the face, we've left that as the smallest chance overall.

Here are the actual rates of chance, when struck, (assuming a shield is equipped) in equipment selection:
30% Shield
25% Body
12% Back
9% Head
9% Arms
9% Legs
6% Face



Item Mall

I'm not going to hide the fact that the Item Mall had a part to play in this, but not where you might think. The repair hammers removal was the only influence behind this update. As it was seen, repair hammers were almost never used, it was seen as a little difference to remove them from game play and place all 'portable' means to repair equipment unto the Item Mall's Perfect Repair hammer. It gives added benefit and usefulness to what was generally seen as a 'useless' Item Mall item. Now, it not only repairs equipment to full, but costs no money to make that repairs. So the now added benefit of the Perfect Repair Hammer is savings, especially for high valued equipment. But that is all the influence the Item Mall had to this aspect of the update.


Final Note

As much as we felt the new durability design was working as we intended, we are very much aware that there may be many instance and situations where this new system may not play out as intended. So please share your experiences with it and how you feel about it. I would personally ask that you try to keep the reasons above in mind, when offering your viewpoint, because until now, how often did you really repair your equipment? And when paying for repairs, how much does it really affect what you may have just made for the time you spent out in the fields?

So far, I've seen some pretty accepting feedback and experiences already, which is a very pleasing thing to see! But I know there are many of you out there being affected by this so please, when offering your experience, opinion or suggestions. Provide as much detail as you can, particularly what item(s) and durability are involved, for repair cost comments; include grade and any gem/appraisal stats that are on it.

I wish everyone a fun filled Halloween~

Leonis :wacko:
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#2 DestinyDeoxys

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 10:42 AM

Is it true that dodge is independent from resistance?

And I guess durability cannot be altered anymore? I used to have a very nasty habit after crafting an item or buying an item from shop, I always take down to kenji beach and let the mobs hit me and repair them with NPC repair hammer until the durability reach to a number divisible by 5... :wacko:
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#3 KTFlash

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 10:53 AM

Uhm... can you explain why after using a Perfect Repair Hammer on a 68 dura Endless Blade +15 D7, from 1/68 it became just 5/68? Did I miss something?

EDIT: Now that I think about it... it was 4/68 instead of 1/68, my apologies.

Edited by KTFlash, 14 October 2011 - 10:56 AM.

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#4 Leonis

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 11:06 AM

Is it true that dodge is independent from resistance?

And I guess durability cannot be altered anymore? I used to have a very nasty habit after crafting an item or buying an item from shop, I always take down to kenji beach and let the mobs hit me and repair them with NPC repair hammer until the durability reach to a number divisible by 5... :wacko:

Because of the punishing effect of the Repair Hammers in-game, the function was intended to be removed where it would degrade the durability upon each use and instead only repair a small portion of the item. But the logistics behind it were difficult to explain and as it stood, the items were hardly used so the difference in just removing them outright and making a complicated system to keep them as part of game play seemed like more work for little benefit. So we just removed them. Durability of items can still fluctuate from crafting and monster drops versus their NPC shop counterpart.


Uhm... can you explain why after using a Perfect Repair Hammer on a 68 dura Endless Blade +15 D7, from 1/68 it became just 5/68? Did I miss something?

EDIT: Now that I think about it... it was 4/68 instead of 1/68, my apologies.

That shouldn't happen and I will have that investigated immediately, because it should go straight to full when a perfect hammer is used.
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#5 KTFlash

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 11:21 AM

Indeed, It looks like the p.rep hammer just gave me 1 dura pt. I don't want to use 63 more hammers to make it 68.

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#6 Genesis

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 11:42 AM

Indeed, It looks like the p.rep hammer just gave me 1 dura pt. I don't want to use 63 more hammers to make it 68.

Posted Image

I have looked into the issue and there was a problem with the Perfect Repair Hammer, the issue has now been corrected and will be applied in the brief maintenance that will be happening today. You may want to submit a ticket to have the repair hammers you used replaced.
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#7 onicdesigns

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 12:07 PM

Same here, I used a repair hammer and it went to 40/64 instead of 64/64. I used two hammers.


AOE from Champs really wears down the weapons fast. I was leveling and from 103 to 107 I had to repair 3 times. Dura was 44. :wacko: I was in B3 of temple and it sucked having to come out to repair and then go back.

Might have to just start bringing multiple weapons.

When submitting tickets what do we put it as? I did it as a bug report.


I wasn't paying close attention, but I think this did happen. When my weapon hit zero. I go to Crune to repair and it costs 0 zulie to repair.


When Crune repairs does it loose any Dura?

Edited by onicdesigns, 14 October 2011 - 12:20 PM.

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#8 MistahDi

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 12:11 PM

this new dura thing aint goof for raiders, as they geting hited they'r dura of equipment is degrading, so it means that they are loosing dodge rate continuously, or am i wrong?
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#9 KTFlash

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 12:31 PM

If you want my suggestion, rather than a npc repairing a weapon, make a common skill "Repair", wich will cost money. This may avoid the problem of repairing while you're somewhat far from npc, or no time to do so. Just my two cents.
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#10 Zurn

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 12:34 PM

When Crune repairs does it loose any Dura?

no npc repair should decrease dura
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#11 onicdesigns

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 12:40 PM

I hate to report this bug if it is a bug, but.. When item hits Zero dura it costs 0 zulie to fix it.


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#12 Gojio

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 12:41 PM

The explanation sounds fair enough. :>
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#13 Rooster

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 02:25 PM

this new dura thing aint goof for raiders, as they geting hited they'r dura of equipment is degrading, so it means that they are loosing dodge rate continuously, or am i wrong?


This is a good point. Dodge based characters will be more affected by this change than non-dodge based characters. Defense-Based characters will barely be affected.

I'm sure there are more changes to come in the future that will probably offset these changes. Won't there? :wacko:
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#14 Wxii

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 02:30 PM

I think the dur of items go down to quick...I was lvling my knight in prison today and went in there with full dur items and after like 10minutes my sword was 24/64 and shield was 25/50, I am a tank and I like killing doing one on one not aoes, but with this new system I can not stay any where to lvl up for long before my items need to be repaired....it will be hard to have any fun if this is not changed.
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#15 Niluje

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 03:22 PM

[Repair Hammers] were hardly used so the difference in just removing them outright and making a complicated system to keep them as part of game play seemed like more work for little benefit. So we just removed them.

Lies
Repair hammers were used to increase the value of useless equipment before selling them to NPC's, you know this perfectly well
Just admit that you removed them to avoid creating more zulies with this method (a zulie drain is a good thing anyway) and to increase the sale of IM hammers for those who use it on the battle field, and stop using lame excuses, seriously this kind of hypocritical speech is becoming annoying


And now the real problem with this update:

Why on earth have you changed the way dura and life span are displayed? What we have now makes NO sense at all...
We used to have life span and dura, now we have dura and... nothing else
And it is displayed "Dura: 15 / 45" so it's actually not dura, it's our former life span which is now displayed in base numbers instead of percents ! The dura, here, is 45 !
So it should be displayed "Life span: 15 / 45", where 45 is the dura

I saw that in your post you tried to introduce the name "durability life" to TRY to replace "life span", and I'm sorry but "durability life" doesn't mean anything and is just a fail attempt to merge everything. Why "fail"? Because it just confuses people and then nobody understands what you're trying to say since everybody mixes up durability and your "durability life" (life span). And to make it even worse, sometimes you even say durability when actually you're talking about life span

So:

- In your posts, just stop with that "durability life" crap and say "life span" again

- In the UI:
  • Display it this way: "Life span: 15 / 45", or
  • Just put back the old way of displaying dura and life span, percentages were way more accurate than what we have now anyway!
And, since I know how you work by now, you're certainly not going to do the 2nd solution because you never put things back to the way they were, so just display "Life Span: 15 / 45" or "Item Life: 15 / 45" or anything else that is not what we have at the moment

Edited by Niluje, 14 October 2011 - 03:25 PM.

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#16 Leonis

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 04:03 PM

When Crune repairs does it loose any Dura?

No, it will not reduce durability when you repair from an NPC, this was not changed.

this new dura thing aint goof for raiders, as they geting hited they'r dura of equipment is degrading, so it means that they are loosing dodge rate continuously, or am i wrong?

Dodge would not be effected because you aren't losing actual durability, only the durability's life. Effectively, "lifespan" is now displayed on the left of the displayed durability. i.e. (Lifespan / Durability)

I think the dur of items go down to quick...I was lvling my knight in prison today and went in there with full dur items and after like 10minutes my sword was 24/64 and shield was 25/50, I am a tank and I like killing doing one on one not aoes, but with this new system I can not stay any where to lvl up for long before my items need to be repaired....it will be hard to have any fun if this is not changed.

This is not an area I would expect soloing to come easily. To lose durability that fast, you would have to be doing AoEs, which would speed up your chances of life lost because you're hitting multiple targets at once. Likewise, you have multiple targets hitting you, you are going to have an increased rate of durability life loss. If you were truly soloing, you wouldn't be able to lose durability life that fast.

--
Niluje,

Repair Hammers were hardly used, plain and simple. You may have used them, however your use of them wasn't an intended design to help you generate more money.

Thank you for showing how easy it was to make the leap from the old display to the new. You have quite simply shown how the new display has been translated from the old, so I have every confidence that other players will be able to make the leap in understanding the new display. My own choice of reference to what this new display is how I refer to it. You can refer to it however you wish to, durability life, durability point, lifespan, the mechanic is still the same, just displayed differently.

However, the idea of making it display "Life span" is inaccurate, since it is the item's durability and how it resists taking damage in addition to displaying how many durability points are left before breaking.
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#17 Leonis

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 04:07 PM

I hate to report this bug if it is a bug, but.. When item hits Zero dura it costs 0 zulie to fix it.


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I very much appreciate that you did report this, because this is obviously wrong. The issue with this was found and will be included to the patch that will be applied today, once ready.
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#18 Zurn

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 04:25 PM

i actually really like the setup for this. idk what you guys are complaining about but at low lvls its hardly noticeable at all (to me anyway).
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#19 Wigglez

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 06:30 PM

What am I supposed to do about this? My Daring Rabbit Shoes 60/40 are now entirely broken and useless now. Is this now a wasted 1b zulie or what?

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#20 Genesis

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 06:39 PM

What am I supposed to do about this? My Daring Rabbit Shoes 60/40 are now entirely broken and useless now. Is this now a wasted 1b zulie or what?

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Please submit a ticket to have the durability reinstated on that item, it can only be updated manually at this point.
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#21 VnzlaGuille

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 06:42 PM

seems to me very good idea, but as a friend said above much harm done by aoe weapon, I farming and low too fast and I do not have time to go to a npc repair, if you hammer im is different but the truth is reduced too fast = S, with the price if I agree the cost is just expensive repair expensive equipment :wacko:

Edited by VnzlaGuille, 14 October 2011 - 06:44 PM.

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#22 trupein

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 06:55 PM

+1 for repair skill for in the field.
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#23 VnzlaGuille

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 06:57 PM

certainly some skill in inventory to heal as the NPC, charging and everything so for example: mu online , and other games xD
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#24 coolera

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 07:01 PM

We could make repairing armour a dealer skill you could put it in like your vend :wacko:
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#25 Phish

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Posted 14 October 2011 - 07:03 PM

What if a unique skill is implemented that can be used to repair items? It could have a high mp to use and only repair 1 dura at a time.
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