25 replies to this topic

[AtlasThunderbeef]

Remember when we could gear up and adventure out to GH or some place and level up wherever we wanted to?


Wouldn't that be great to have again?



Occupy iRO - we are the 99%






In all seriousness, this needs to be put as the main objective of 2012. Maps are literally being unused because people aren't in the correct range. The logic there is so stupid.

[ExplosPlankton]

Wasnt the "level range feature" implemented because only a few maps were being used? Current system encourages you to move to new areas. Its fine.

[Okii]

Maps are being unused because...
A. turn ins (aside from the maps chosen for that week)
and
B. party experience not being good enough and monsters giving terribad experience.

(That's what I summarize out of the countless posts about maps being dead anyways.

[AtlasThunderbeef]

Wasnt the "level range feature" implemented because only a few maps were being used? Current system encourages you to move to new areas. Its fine.

The freedom is strangled severely. You can't choose freely what you want to do, it's very complicated now as you need to match level range to monster through an online database.

While it makes you run by a couple more maps you have to stick to those, as you gain nothing level-wise from exploration. There are tons of quests you hardly see because the leveling no has no exploration.
It's also one of the reasons there are still so many that stick to pservers, because they run prerenewal where you still have this.

[morphine]

In theory, the level ranges would encourage people to try different maps and have many options for levelling. For most players though, it just means that instead of going to maps with the highest exp, you now go to the easiest and/or mobbiest maps available - it's all quantity over quality when it comes to hunting things down now. People still generally flock to the same areas, though now it's because they are easy to manage and have large spawns. It was a nice idea I guess, but didn't really work out the way anyone was hoping, I think.

What I miss most of the old system is simply that "yay I massacred something strong!" feeling from everyday levelling. Even if the exp wasn't the most efficient possible, it was fun, especially for people who fight best 1 vs 1. Even if you get together with a bunch of low level 1st classes now and fight a level 100+ enemy, sure, you might feel a little happy beating the rich creamery butter out of it, but then the game is like "haha, puppy you noob" and punishes you for it. What the hell, game? Don't you love me anymore...? I would have been content with the measly 4k exp... :/

[bored]

We Are the 33% of the 99% and we-

eh screw it, but in theory the level range was good, but sometimes its just not worth it to explore but stay in the same place. be it exp or loot worth

[MizunoAoi]

I don't know.

I kind of miss mindlessly staying on the Geographer map with all my ranged classes. But that's what it was, mindless.

Now I'm forced to wander the world. I've had to learn new things. Overall, I suppose this is a good thing.

[Xellie]

I approve of this thread.

[Mowi]

It should be rewarding to beat a high level monster, but this brings leeching to the table... perhaps if it was with a big party only?

In practice, the easiest solution is the level penalty, however unpleasant.

[Kadnya]

Since when does the level system encourages us to explore different maps? In theory it was maybe nice, but in realty, it's always [whatever maps in the few days/hours to 99] -> magma -> jupe/current TI map -> abbys/current TI map -> scaraba/current TI map.

Yus, you might say like "look, you listed TI maps, you are exploring different maps in the game!". Well, TIs have nothing to do with the level restricting system...

It should be rewarding to beat a high level monster, but this brings leeching to the table... perhaps if it was with a big party only?

In practice, the easiest solution is the level penalty, however unpleasant.

Current turn ins are a form of leeching, if anything, with leeching you have to stay in range; while with several TIs you can walk with a max level chara as a killer dragging other charas if you wanted. I don't see any reason or anything to fix, or anything being fixed.

[Ali0510]

Remember when we could gear up and adventure out to GH or some place and level up wherever we wanted to?


Wouldn't that be great to have again?



Occupy iRO - we are the 99%






In all seriousness, this needs to be put as the main objective of 2012. Maps are literally being unused because people aren't in the correct range. The logic there is so stupid.

I agree with this the level restrictions are annoying and silly, It just stops us from going where we want to go....

Wasnt the "level range feature" implemented because only a few maps were being used? Current system encourages you to move to new areas. Its fine.

Not really, I go where the level system tells me to, ( my thing being Payon ( Spore / cave - TOy Fact - Orcs - sandman ect. ), I don't explore other maps just pick the fastest route.

Maps are being unused because...
A. turn ins (aside from the maps chosen for that week)
and
B. party experience not being good enough and monsters giving terribad experience.

(That's what I summarize out of the countless posts about maps being dead anyways.

A. Ruins the point of partying or leveling in any other area other then the actual turn in spot.

B. This does need an overhaul, and apparently, its only getting worse....

[Gangstaz]

It is really getting worse. You no longer hear of people

Partying to level

@ GH Prison
@ GH Churchyard
@ Kobolds
@ High Orcs
@ Clocks/Alarms (Usually wizzies & sins combo, may sound funny now, but pre-2004 days you had alot of those around)

Another problem is most maps, there will always be 1 or 2 "pests" around. This really discourages leveling there.

Punk/Ridewords in CT
Ridewords in GH
Gargoyles in GH sewers
Arclouze in GH/CT
Pests/Nereids in Comodo
Mantis/Harpys at most geographer maps (but those are not much of a problem, not a very good example probably...)

These pests are aggro and that's fine... but they move fast, hit fast, hit hard, and are plentiful on the map. Mage classes are ruled out. Flee chars with mediocre gears will be discouraged to level too, due to being hit too frequently from these pests. And pests like these usually give exp.

And people will always compare em with TIs. Leveling in regular fields/dungeons, when you die, you have to walk 3~5 maps back there. With TIs, you just ask Grandpa nicely and then scream "GWING PLZ GWING PLZ I'M INNNNNNNNNNNNNNN!!!!!!"

Who wants to explore maps anymore? I might as well follow a TI party and just gangbang all the mobs to oblivion. Easy. Efficient. Saves my money and time.

[Gigahertz2011]

Drop the TIs and raise the exp for all monsters. Wouldn't that work?

Edited by Gigahertz2011, 11 December 2011 - 08:16 AM.

[asayuu]

They should add more monsters like Mutant Dragonoid or Tendrilion on some dead maps.

Strong monsters with huge exp and bad drops, and hard to beat on the level range. Very few classes can kill solo them on the level range. If I'm sure, I've only seen a LK being able to kill the dragonoid on the level range, with gloomy spirals.

If they can solo, let them solo. Maybe the dead maps could be added to be new options to leveling, yes. HEAVY mobbed maps like that roween/anopheles map during the turnin week, or a map with huge stapos with twice HP/damage/exp, and so on.

For whoever says the dead maps are gone, no. They are taking space in the client... And for nothing.

And if we talk about party share settings... Turnins are supposed to give 100% EXP for everyone in party, right? So why not making this being the normal party settings then?

Edited by asayuu, 11 December 2011 - 08:40 AM.

[Kitten]

I think forced variety is just as bad as intentionally staying on the same map your entire character's life.

[TheSquishy]

The upward cap for exp penalty is too low. It should be like +/-30.

We need a combination or rescaling of experience points and monster spawns.
I hate to be on the side of "this "x" was better than "y" pre-renewal"
but pre-renewal did do some things right when it came to monsters and how their stats where distributed
and the density of their spawns.

The only thing that was missing was a fix to partying. So many classes aren't "level-able" now because
current monster have these cookie cutter stat builds. We need old monster stat spreads.

Examples
-high damage, low hit for the high flee but squishy types
-high damage, high def, slow moving but no mdef for the mage types
-low spawn rate but high xp for the AOE-less classes

I would like to see a area by area redistribution of monster stats to ensure that everyone has a place
they can level as well as bigger bonus for having a party. I've always like trickster party system
that rewards for not only having more members but members of different classes too.

[Ali0510]

And if we talk about party share settings... Turnins are supposed to give 100% EXP for everyone in party, right? So why not making this being the normal party settings then?

If everyone got 100% there would be a lot of partying.. but in saying that it could easily be abused and people will QQ at the easy 150's....

[EvilLoynis]

Sad fact is that asside from Turn in's Partying is pretty dead in this game.

Only exception being perhaps 2 man parties with one usually a Healer.

Edited by EvilLoynis, 11 December 2011 - 03:17 PM.

[asayuu]

If everyone got 100% there would be a lot of partying.. but in saying that it could easily be abused and people will QQ at the easy 150's....

If the party settings gave 100% to everyone, turnins would be redundant, therefore not necessary, and then they could be switched for killcounts for eden merit badges only.

[Ali0510]

If the party settings gave 100% to everyone, turnins would be redundant, therefore not necessary, and then they could be switched for killcounts for eden merit badges only.

True that, but in saying that 12 person party each killing on a different spot on the map.... each getting 100% per kill kinda defeats the purpose of partying....

[Zeniachan]

My opinion on this...

As far as soloing is concerned, at the very least...it wasn't just the crap exp and level dependency that made so many maps no longer fun to level on. I think the values of several rare item drops have also decreased severely on many maps, because there are better items that make all the other ones seem useless. Also there are some relatively newer, overhunted items which have these silly, special yet practically worthless effects, and some of the older items are preferred over them (due to higher stats, slots, ATK/MATK) so people struggle to vend them for ridiculously crappy prices.

I think renewal damage mechanics and 3rd jobs are to blame for most of the item depreciation that's been going on. Remember when you'd hunt for those 20% race/property/size damage cards to make that weapon for wherever you were going to hunt/level for the next 20 levels, and those cards were actually worth something? (several million in some cases) I used to hunt in a lot of places on old iRO even though the exp sucked (back then, too) but it was because of the potential for profitable items, often to be sold for large amounts of zeny.

The exp changes (being based on level differences) poses another problem: You level too fast while you're in an area, so you don't get to enjoy it as much. Then when the exp gets crappy and it's time to move on to the next area, you have to walk (or teleport) across several maps to get there, killing nothing worthwhile. You know how every MMORPG nowadays has those quests where you deliver milk, notes, letters, secret packages and booze to the next NPC, so that you spend more time traveling than you do fighting anything? How fighting the wrong stuff is unrewarding and fighting the right stuff is too rewarding, but the "right stuff" and "wrong stuff" are constantly changing as your quests change, thus necessitating travel between areas during which you probably won't be fighting anything?

Yeah...that's what I think is happening to RO now. It had been happening gradually the more updates and areas we got, but renewal kind of exploded it. >_<

[AtlasThunderbeef]

No it doesn't, partying is very bad, unless you have some kind of godlike setup that works only in a party then alright, but for the most part all killing can be done solo. Partying just isn't rewarding enough when it comes to exp.

[TheSquishy]

If the party settings gave 100% to everyone, turnins would be redundant, therefore not necessary, and then they could be switched for killcounts for eden merit badges only.

True that, but in saying that 12 person party each killing on a different spot on the map.... each getting 100% per kill kinda defeats the purpose of partying....

Just make it so you gotta be on the same screen to get the bonus, just like with kill counts. I'd even give it an icon
so people know when they are wandering too far off and have deacticated the bonus.

On the business side of things, I'd sell it as a kafra shop passive skill, +10 percent xp for each party member on
your screen for up to 10 members. So no reason not to have a big party where ever you may go.

Edit:superr grammer fail...fixed it

Edited by TheSquishy, 11 December 2011 - 09:00 PM.

[Okii]

Just make it so you gotta be on the same screen to get the bonus, just like with kill counts. I'd even give it an icon
so people know when they are wandering too far off and have deacticated the bonus.

On the business side of things, I'd sell it as a kafra shop passive skill, +10 percent xp for each party member on
your screen for up to 10 members. So no reason not to have a big party where ever you may go.

Edit:superr grammer fail...fixed it

Hey this sounds really good x3
I'd hope the GM's could manage something like this.

Was only thinking about like... if two actual players get together and one huddles around their alts (protecting them), while the other mobs and brings them back or something. Idk it's possible for people to get around things like this. But I'd rather have this than not, tbh. More people will do what's right =)

[Ali0510]

Just make it so you gotta be on the same screen to get the bonus, just like with kill counts. I'd even give it an icon
so people know when they are wandering too far off and have deacticated the bonus.

On the business side of things, I'd sell it as a kafra shop passive skill, +10 percent xp for each party member on
your screen for up to 10 members. So no reason not to have a big party where ever you may go.

Edit:superr grammer fail...fixed it

Something like that could work.... Even an extra exp Item would be nice...