108 replies to this topic

[Cleav]

If summoners are so op as you claim to be, then how come they are so scarce in pvp to every other class and their win record is like 7lose:1win ratio

Dragonkin classes lack common appearance in PvP because the amount of people that play non-dragonkin classes severely outweighs the number of people who play dragonkin classes. Not because they suck. With your reasoning, the majority of PvPers should be Dragoon. Your reasoning is obviously flawed because that isn't the case.

And just because your win-lose record is 7lose:1win, that doesn't mean every other summoner/twin doesn't know how to play the game and shares the same abominable, you-shouldn't-even-play-this-game-cuz-you-suck record.

well if we can only pvp in a team-pvp perspective then we really do suck. Claiming a class op just because they are better orientated in team-pvp just doesnt make sense

Blatantly fallacious. The level of a class' "suckiness" bares little correspondence to its purpose, utility, or environment. If a summoner could OHKO every player and had infinite HP but had the same skills he has now, your reasoning says he sucks(oh and btw, nation fury).

[JoeyLe]

I don't think you're catching the entire drift. When I bring up Mana Burn, thing of it as the representative of the need for balance. Clearly this skill didn't pop out of the Development oven baked perfectly, and doubtless everything else is perfect. You're not trying hard enough to see the big picture and instead taking it as some kind of personal insult that people call for a degree of balancing work in the field of Dragonkin characters. It's almost like the "Dragonkin racism" joke isn't a joke.

I understand that new classes may have imnbalances and i can see what you are getting at, but i just dont get why people claim dragonkins to be so op when theyre not(excluding twin-glitch and mana burn ofc). The reasons they give too are also very laughable and makes it quite obvious that their biased. For example, i quote" Summoners are op because their skills have debuffs". I believe this argument is nonsense, yeah so what if the skills have debuffs, what about the other 5 classes that have skills with debuffs? Are dragonkins not allowed to have debuffs? have u even considered other negative factors, maybe like cast time. And no i dont find responses as insults, i just find them to be quick easy ways to bandwagon dragonkins to be nerfed

[Flovios]

Why dont we make a forum post where only Dragonkin players lv70+ can give feedback. I have noticed that many dragonkin players with suggestions constantly are maliciously attack by other non-dragonkin players who have a biased agenda against the dragonkin, thats why very few even bother to give their feedback,including me. You can always look at at post about dragonkin and i will guarantee you that their will be negative posts from players making up this and that,attacking the dragonkin class. I believe it would only be honest if only dragonkin class with exp to only give valuable feedback rather than other players ranting about how op dragonkins are with their poorly made-up assumptions

By your logic, at the end, we will also need a forum separated by each class (we have that already), only someone who has the class can give opinion, and at the end every class will be OP on its own (because they dont want to nerf their own skill) and will lead more imbalance.

While i am agree that summoner has too long casting time and animation, it doesnt mean mana burn is not OP. To achieve the balance, of summoner, i believe the developer should do something to their casting time/animation AND to mana burn.

This may be a factor why summoners are scarce in pvp, but i believe its the fact that our skills just basicly arent orientated for pvp. Its the same with any other class, just like warmages,invokers, and grens. If your class is very poor in pvp in general, then ofc anyone with that class would be discouraged to pvp. This is the exact situation with summoners, since mana burn is now unoffically bannned in pvp, summoners have no legitimit way of winning in pvp

I have WM and i like to pvp using her. For WM, i would say, WM is not poor in PvP. You just need to learn how to use it, and it apply to every class. I often PvP 1vs1 with summoner and destro too, and i would say it also apply to them. As long as you are willing to learn how to use your class, you can compete in PvP. What i see is, people tend to search for "easy way". Once they already have an OP skill they tend to too rely on them. And once a skill is considerable as useless skill, they dont even try to use it, or find how to use it.

If they stop pvp because they think their class is really suck in PvP and have no hope in pvp, they cant improve their skill in PvP. And PvP is different with PvE. While we can ask other's opinion, which skill is good and which skill is bad for PvP, only by pvping many times and learn how to use and when to use the skill, we can do well in PvP.

EDIT: I would respect you more if you didn't try to use others name.
EDIT2: Somehow this thread has strayed away from its topic....

Edited by Flovios, 21 December 2011 - 11:15 AM.

[JoeyLe]

By your logic, at the end, we will also need a forum separated by each class (we have that already), only someone who has the class can give opinion, and at the end every class will be OP on its own (because they dont want to nerf their own skill) and will lead more imbalance.

While i am agree that summoner has too long casting time and animation, it doesnt mean mana burn is not OP. To achieve the balance, of summoner, i believe the developer should do something to their casting time/animation AND to mana burn.



I have WM and i like to pvp using her. For WM, i would say, WM is not poor in PvP. You just need to learn how to use it, and it apply to every class. I often PvP 1vs1 with summoner and destro too, and i would say it also apply to them. As long as you are willing to learn how to use your class, you can compete in PvP. What i see is, people tend to search for "easy way". Once they already have an OP skill they tend to too rely on them. And once a skill is considerable as useless skill, they dont even try to use it, or find how to use it.

If they stop pvp because they think their class is really suck in PvP and have no hope in pvp, they cant improve their skill in PvP. And PvP is different with PvE. While we can ask other's opinion, which skill is good and which skill is bad for PvP, only by pvping many times and learn how to use and when to use the skill, we can do well in PvP.

EDIT: I would respect you more if you didn't try to use others name.
EDIT2: Somehow this thread has strayed away from its topic....

i agree that it invovles some skill with every class to learn how to pvp other classes. Yes a skilled wm could easily beat other classes as long as he would know how. I guess what im mainly adressing is a dragonkins point of view on the skills and what other players deem to be unbalanced

[Maronu]

This thread now appears to be about Dragonkins because you guys managed to derail the out of it. gg

[StormHaven]

This thread now appears to be about Dragonkins because you guys managed to derail the out of it. gg

I don't even...

[GrapefruitGod]

Out of curiosity, who's been saying dragonkin are op?

[Luckywhiterabbit]

If every class is OP, then game is balanced. Works for Marvel vs Capcom 3.

[funinfrance]

Er... even though this is off topic... I'd like to say that I've managed to win a few 1v1 matches... Just takes me a long time to get the persons movements down so I can properly catch... But once caught, summoners can maintain a really good combo >.> and after that with the movement speed debuff + dash/jump block its much easier to catch... Not to also mention we have pretty high defense I think >.<

No offense to anyone