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Patch Notes v.377


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#101 MsHotShot

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:29 PM

lol omg ur so stupid we are not all coming form the same contry what about if u try to talk to me in my language u morrons LOL

Maybe you should learn English then, this game is called NArose <-NORTH AMERICAN. If you don't like these changes, you should move to another server
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#102 Phish

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:30 PM

2. I was hoping champ defense would go down and i've never seen somebody use Geon Archangel Crumpler, so i hate to see it get worse (the best named move in the game)

  • Just because you don't see anyone use it, doesn't mean it isn't still overpowered in comparison to other skills.



People didn't use it because it is a non reliable single target skill. Which, even if you don't miss the damage is still less than reliable skills because the additional damage buff does not affect these skills and it has been that way for almost 2 years. Not to mention the status effect is not particularly useful for champions (10% acc down) the same applies for the other non reliable champ skills Longinus' Attack and Champion Hit. People spent their skill points on other skills because of this.



The changes to mage skills aren't even a nerf. Remember while they can miss now they can also crit, it's a neutral trade. The mage class needs some work.

Edited by Phish, 20 December 2011 - 04:33 PM.

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#103 Oerba

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:30 PM

Guys, It would be appreciated if you can stop the insults to each other.


Back on topic:

Seems most of the classes have lost a stun.
So overall I don't feel that a particular class was nerfed considerably.
This could also promote the scouts.

Until we get a chance to properly play the characters and the classes once the patch has been implemented.
We can't really give much more than a general opinion.
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#104 Stach

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:32 PM

now artisan is for crafting only..if you want to pvp or war..make other job..lol..


Thanks for stating the obvious.
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#105 Cloudius

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:32 PM

ptit criss de con toé en ta tu fini de te penser plus frais ke les autre criss denfant de chienne farme don ta yeul pi asseye dme parler dans ma langue esti de-_- moé chu deja capable de parler ta langue de amrde toé té mm pas capable de dire 1 criss de mot dans la mienne esti de sans dessins farme don ta yeul si ta rien a dire


1000 0001 0011 1011 0011 0111 1000 0100 0101 0111 1011 1000 1101 1100 1100 1111

Me no understand. :P

Edited by Cloudius, 20 December 2011 - 04:33 PM.

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#106 Amnesia101

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:33 PM

I have a few questions regarding balancing:

1. Are there plans in returning class main stat to be the preferred stat? For example Str stat being the preferred over pure AP?
2. There seems to be a strong push for Acc to become a much more important stat, is there a plan to reduce Acc increasing skills for the different classes?
3. Is Champion weapon differentiation something that will continue to occur, if so how are Spear vs. Sword going planned to be unique?
4. With champion mobility reduced and stun success rate reduced are there plan to address the ability for a champ to catch up to high mobility targets?
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#107 jesuslandry

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:34 PM

1000 0001 0011 1011 0011 0111 1000 0100 0101 0111 1011 1000 1101 1100 1100 1111

Me no understand. :P

yeah bwoy quebec ftw !!!!
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#108 Oerba

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:37 PM

I have a few questions regarding balancing:

1. Are there plans in returning class main stat to be the preferred stat? For example Str stat being the preferred over pure AP?
2. There seems to be a strong push for Acc to become a much more important stat, is there a plan to reduce Acc increasing skills for the different classes?
3. Is Champion weapon differentiation something that will continue to occur, if so how are Spear vs. Sword going planned to be unique?
4. With champion mobility reduced and stun success rate reduced are there plan to address the ability for a champ to catch up to high mobility targets?


At this point in time, I can give feedback only to 2 and 4.

Since all the classes had something done to their stuns, whether if it was reduced %, less stuns, everyone gets a trade off so in terms of Acc, it's across the classes.

Champs are still relatively quick, even though they lost their mspd passive marginally, they still have that passive which makes them faster in comparison to other classes.
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#109 Teus

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:39 PM

So for people that go for Axe Champs, they will have way less accuracy than a 2handed champ right?
and since raiders get 4k+ dogde rate wouldnt this make raiders OP? (since im assuming most people will change to axe champ)
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#110 CoolCat420

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:41 PM

So for people that go for Axe Champs, they will have way less accuracy than a 2handed champ right?
and since raiders get 4k+ dogde rate wouldnt this make raiders OP? (since im assuming most people will change to axe champ)



Well, as with Sword champs who used Axe Mastery for more Crit, I assume Axe champs will use the 2-hand sword passive(s) for more accuracy?
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#111 onicdesigns

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:41 PM

I seen champs level at kenji at 45 with the AOE they used to hit, but now they will miss cause it is like they are normal attacking. Also, at the underground prisons it will be less 140-160 champs cause the AOE skill is now like normal weapon. yes? I was missing normal attacks at those levels, but the AOE hit everytime.
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#112 VnzlaGuille

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:42 PM

So for people that go for Axe Champs, they will have way less accuracy than a 2handed champ right?
and since raiders get 4k+ dogde rate wouldnt this make raiders OP? (since im assuming most people will change to axe champ)


yeah rider now op , as in previous version of the rose :P
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#113 Metzy

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:42 PM

im kinda impressed that the Knight Class had no changes only for Soldier class why?... knihgts has useless skills that i bet they need to be balanced at all, the xbow knight its just a pointless tree , the accu that is in the xbow passive skill should be at the 1h wepn passive skill
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#114 Teus

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:44 PM

Well, as with Sword champs who used Axe Mastery for more Crit, I assume Axe champs will use the 2-hand sword passive(s) for more accuracy?

Woow i didnt know that x.x i thought the axe passive will only apply if u used an axe.... woow
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#115 Santa1K

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:44 PM

Interesting.

Stop whining about champs being useless. Obviously you guys didn't read the changes thoroughly.(or just too dumb to understand it)

As for the devs,

Not a bad start on the balancing. Although, I agree with Phish, it is pretty sloppy. It doesn't look like it was well thought out.

To everyone else,

Quit crying about the changes, eventually most of you will adjust. Don't like the game? Quit. Every time they put something out, everyone just starts complaining regardless of what it is. If you're one of those people, try a different game.


Merry Christmas ;]
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#116 Oerba

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:46 PM

So for people that go for Axe Champs, they will have way less accuracy than a 2handed champ right?
and since raiders get 4k+ dogde rate wouldnt this make raiders OP? (since im assuming most people will change to axe champ)


There's always reliable skills.

Also, there's always the dodge down skill called Battle Howl which reduces the dodge by 20%.
For example, if a raider was on that 4k dodge, -20% of that would be 3.2k dodge (although that's just a guide, and the numbers are probably wrong)
On another note, the raider has a reduced % on sucker punch stun I think.

Still a champ should have no problems PvPing how it should, minus the one stun.
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#117 Leonis

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:48 PM

People didn't use it because it is a non reliable single target skill. Which, even if you don't miss the damage is still less than reliable skills because the additional damage buff does not affect these skills and it has been that way for almost 2 years. Not to mention the status effect is not particularly useful for champions (10% acc down) the same applies for the other non reliable champ skills Longinus' Attack and Champion Hit. People spent their skill points on other skills because of this.

The changes to mage skills aren't even a nerf. Remember while they can miss now they can also crit, it's a neutral trade. The mage class needs some work.

Hey Phish, I understand what you're saying about the damage. But part of me can reason that because you missed, you don't get the additional damage buff bonus, however it is just as arguable that it is still a buff and damage was applied. At the moment, I cannot honestly say whether or not it was intended because the time period of when we did those skill changes between reliable and not, was quite some time ago and under different guidance. So, here we are in the current time and faced with the question of whether it is a bug or not, more so rather, should it the buff work or not because of it's impact it could have on damage output.

The reliability of a skill hitting, even on a miss, isn't intended to be a penalty but more so was to make certain aspects guaranteed so stalemates would happen less because you have no hope of landing a blow.

As for the status effects, those were bigger adjustments to change at this moment than to just take away or adjust the strengths of their effect. There was a small stipulation in today's skill balances in which we weren't trying to launch the full extent of changes intended for Pegasus, but get a solidi step in the direction we're going to be heading in once Pegasus is online. I feel a little like a broken record for saying that so many times, but never-the-less, it is the truth.

And your comment regarding Mages is very true, it is a double edged sword and intentional that way. While you may now miss with certain Muse/Mage skills, you may also do extra damage because of a critical roll, if built for it. Something to think about or plan for the ice / electric skill tree? This is what we want you as players to decide, what fits you best. There will be much more work being prepared for Pegasus.
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#118 Xieg2

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:48 PM

Raider should be OP. They have awesome claws!

But IMHO Champs should be OP or just a margin. They aren't called Champions because they hold 2 Handed Swords
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#119 Aymee

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:50 PM

Okay so let me get this straight. We were told that there is no "free" stat reset because this only affects skills. But you also make so many skills that couldn't miss be capable of missing now. Then you tell us to build more accuracy. GETTING MORE ACCURACY MEANS GEAR AND MORE CON. CON IS A STAT. WE NEED STAT RESETS.

Seriously use some logic.
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#120 Amnesia101

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:51 PM

At this point in time, I can give feedback only to 2 and 4.

Since all the classes had something done to their stuns, whether if it was reduced %, less stuns, everyone gets a trade off so in terms of Acc, it's across the classes.

Champs are still relatively quick, even though they lost their mspd passive marginally, they still have that passive which makes them faster in comparison to other classes.


With reduced stun success and mobility nerf and slow weapon speed it seems like there is no reliable or at the very least lacking assurance of a champion close-gapping high mobility/dodge classes, tagged with lower accuracy, there needs to be some sort of compensation, like, if a champion DOES manage to get in your face, you'll be sorry, kind of deal.
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#121 CoolCat420

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:52 PM

Calanor, is there gonna be a change to the Merry Christmas Box in the IM? they give out Skill Resets...
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#122 Teus

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:53 PM

I want 2 know about the stats resets x.x
they should put them in Npc too :x
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#123 jesuslandry

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:53 PM

Calanor, is there gonna be a change to the Merry Christmas Box in the IM? they give out Skill Resets...

hahaha true that :P
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#124 Oerba

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:55 PM

With reduced stun success and mobility nerf and slow weapon speed it seems like there is no reliable or at the very least lacking assurance of a champion close-gapping high mobility/dodge classes, tagged with lower accuracy, there needs to be some sort of compensation, like, if a champion DOES manage to get in your face, you'll be sorry, kind of deal.


My guess would be launch a space attack, weapon launcher or charge in, battle howl (for dodge down) and do the usual.

On a raider's point of view, Champs will still be tough due to their high def, hp and attack power.
Whereas they themselves have a much lower attack power and low hp.
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#125 Phish

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Posted 20 December 2011 - 04:56 PM

Hey Phish, I understand what you're saying about the damage. But part of me can reason that because you missed, you don't get the additional damage buff bonus, however it is just as arguable that it is still a buff and damage was applied. At the moment, I cannot honestly say whether or not it was intended because the time period of when we did those skill changes between reliable and not, was quite some time ago and under different guidance. So, here we are in the current time and faced with the question of whether it is a bug or not, more so rather, should it the buff work or not because of it's impact it could have on damage output.

The reliability of a skill hitting, even on a miss, isn't intended to be a penalty but more so was to make certain aspects guaranteed so stalemates would happen less because you have no hope of landing a blow.



At 2:24 in my bug compilation vid I demonstrate what is going on if you want to check it out:


With reduced stun success and mobility nerf and slow weapon speed it seems like there is no reliable or at the very least lacking assurance of a champion close-gapping high mobility/dodge classes, tagged with lower accuracy, there needs to be some sort of compensation, like, if a champion DOES manage to get in your face, you'll be sorry, kind of deal.



Space attack and soul wreck were untouched and these are more than enough to catch someone running away.
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