The New IM Rule

ppl actually buy stuff from gold sellers? Lol

ppl actually buy stuff from gold sellers? Lol

Throw pudding getsum

Has made the 4 people actually LEFT on my flist wanna quit too.

To be fair some of them are probably just waiting to be banned.

So the problem is gifting? Easy! Just remove the fact insurance is UNtradable and I believe we'd be good

We can't even sell or trade Shop Points and Shop Scrolls anymore which was not noted in ANY of the patch notes.. I am severely disappoint, with what high levels you have had left, this is a just sad.

I agree 100%.

Well there goes me ever soulcrafting,enchanting, or randomizing for me or other people anymore.

Too bad meganekko talked before me, but, you have a problem with scammers? then hey the only thing you need to do is make insurances and randomizers tradeable again, is there any problem with it? I mean its not a big deal, its the way it used to be and you goin to be preventing a lot of scams!

Edited by Astronix, 05 August 2011 - 03:04 PM.

It's okay guys, there's always surveys!

Too bad meganekko talked before me, but, you have a problem with scammers? then hey the only thing you need to do is make insurances and randomizers tradeable again, is there any problem with it? I mean its not a big deal, its the way it used to be and you goin to be preventing a lot of scams!

You know they become untradable right? people were doing CC scams in large amounts for Ins and Randoms.
it's an endless cycle. Either deal with real money scamming or deal with in game gold scamming.
Personally i say deal with real money scamming, since after the first time people should learn not to buy IM from random people. I bought IM from people who actually sold to guildies or sold to friends or were well known for IM selling after i got scammed the first time.

Edited by StormHaven, 05 August 2011 - 03:10 PM.

It's okay guys, there's always surveys!

I HATE SURVEYS!

well i feel bad for everyone in the guild that ive supplied im for.

would it be possible for me to get banned if i gift IM from one account to another of my account??

would it be possible for me to get banned if i gift IM from one account to another of my account??

No because ur not selling

Why not just make it so that

If you got scammed via gifting it's simply your fault and you simply won't get any support in regards to this instead of threatening to ban.

No because ur not selling

i was just wondering how are they going to tell the difference.

You know they become untradable right? people were doing CC scams in large amounts for Ins and Randoms.
it's an endless cycle. Either deal with real money scamming or deal with in game gold scamming.
Personally i say deal with real money scamming, since after the first time people should learn not to buy IM from random people. I bought IM from people who actually sold to guildies or sold to friends or were well known for IM selling after i got scammed the first time.

well I dont have any other option than make them tradeable, but to let people know DONT BUY IM TO STRANGERS!

So the problem is gifting? Easy! Just remove the fact insurance is UNtradable and I believe we'd be good

We can't even sell or trade Shop Points and Shop Scrolls anymore which was not noted in ANY of the patch notes.. I am severely disappoint, with what high levels you have had left, this is a just sad.

No, that was an issue too. Since ISS And Soul Randomizers are high in demand, we get these shady deals in the market where at midnight there are hundreds and hundreds of ISS being sold at the fraction of their usual price. Of course, the gold sellers that are buying these IM items off of stolen credit card numbers, and you only encourage them to keep doing it. In turn, Warpportal loses money, and its exactly why they made ISS untradable.

ppl actually buy stuff from gold sellers? Lol

You'd be surprised. When you're extremely desperate for a certain item, or you're just pure lazy, you probably have thrown out your common sense to buy gold from these "sellers."

i was just wondering how are they going to tell the difference.

I'm assuming that they're going to check gold gains that you have earned. When you trade IM for gold, you're giving nothing back to them technically in the trade window. Then the item comes through the gift function. ( Correct me if I'm wrong, I believe that there are trade logs, or action logs that each individual character does.)

Due to the high increase of scam incidents being reported as well as users purchasing Item Points from the Gold Sellers, we are required to instate this policy. The wording will be rephrased again due to the ambiguity.

Basically, anyone found selling Item Mall Points or selling Item Mall Items via Gifting, may be permanently suspended.

Scam incidents? I got scammed once when making a trade, and the support team told me they were unable to help me because I took a risk. Why not just declare that your general policy, make sure everyone is well aware of it, and let players who choose not to listen to the caution suffer the consequences and learn the hard way? I learned my lesson that way. Anyway, I'm willing to bet scam reports aren't the main issue. Are you guys getting hit with credit card fraud and money laundering again? We had a thread filled with tons of suggestions when that issue arose and WP decided to make insurance so that you couldn't sell it in the market. Perhaps that thread should be revisited.

If you implement this restriction, I am willing to bet that there will be a good amount of players who need IM enough that they will be willing to break the rule. There were on THQ! With this type of a restriction you are just rebuilding a barrier between the cash spenders and the free players who wish to be competitive. You will end up banning the free players who wish to be competitive, and ultimately just end up with a game where the only competitive people are a very small population of cash spenders. WP needs to fix the problems with balance, competition, and pvp in this game before making changes that add more problems. As Megan said and even warned us in her lovely song about buying IM long ago, the reason you are having this problem now with scamming is because WP originally made insurance and randomizers untradable.

Need to find a way to hammer down on the IM sellers instead of repeatedly swinging at the whole community without making any distinction and hoping to hurt the sellers. The legit players get hurt by this type of thing more! I've suggesting limiting payment options and making gamecards more widely available before, but last time I was told that WP would lose too much money. Have you guys taken any poles on how many players who purchase IM via credit card would be willing to switch payment method? Are you sure that limiting payment options would be a more detrimental change? Can you guys really not handle these sellers in any other way? When you were having the problem with the IM seller who sold 10g insurance, I saw his shop open a bunch of times, and I barely ever see more than one bot in PoW at the same time. What about getting more moderators in game to go hunting for the sellers or adding a report function to the game that will notify a staff member to come use his ban hammer?

More importantly, why aren't we made aware that any of these changes are going to be made in advance?

@DonkeyKong, I know it is bad news, but no need to literally shoot the messenger!

Edited by Maronu, 05 August 2011 - 03:50 PM.

In a worst case scenario they can always announce people who get banned for scamming and such to discourage people
I remember Rohan did that there was an entire thread just to show who got banned and for what.

Edited by StormHaven, 05 August 2011 - 03:55 PM.

I'm assuming that they're going to check gold gains that you have earned. When you trade IM for gold, you're giving nothing back to them technically in the trade window. Then the item comes through the gift function. ( Correct me if I'm wrong, I believe that there are trade logs, or action logs that each individual character does.)

Ya, but some people mail the people the gold and what if ur just mailing the gold to one of ur new characters cuse usually when i make a new character, i mail that character like 100g so i have something to work with so my noob has some kind of money

Hold on does this involve people selling Item Mall items like the costumes or set items in the market, or is this something different entirely? I've seen different version of the message pop up telling us about being banned for something, but the wordings have still left me confused.

Hold on does this involve people selling Item Mall items like the costumes or set items in the market, or is this something different entirely? I've seen different version of the message pop up telling us about being banned for something, but the wordings have still left me confused.

No gifting in exchange for gold. If the game lets you sell it in the market, that is fine.

Edited by Maronu, 05 August 2011 - 03:59 PM.

I agree that if there is a long-term solution in mind, the simple option would be to make popular and plentiful items like Insurance Scrolls, Randomizers, W-coins and such tradeable. In fact you could even remove the gifting feature entirely and make most Item Mall items tradeable. However, these are suggestions and kind of open up range to a brand new string of ideas. I think anyone willing to think up alternative solutions to what WarpPortal put in place should instead create a discussion thread in the Suggestions forum that we could ask the higher ups to take a look at or even pin.

But in the short-term, since this is what that sounds like, this seems like a viable solution. Of course it feels a little like a quarterback just tackled you onto the pavement while you had NO idea anyone was even playing football--and that was an amazing metaphor-but if it really is an issue of that level of urgency I doubt WarpPortal would make this harsh decision without cause.

EDIT: I just want to say that I personally agree with Maronu that the tried and true method of responsibility on the buyer has always worked nicely and, even if there are the many fools who do get scammed and send a ticket or something, it is not worth effectively punishing the whole community on their part.

Edited by Kazu731, 05 August 2011 - 04:32 PM.

I understand cracking down on scammers but if your trading to someone you dont know, you bring it on yourself. This is gonna ruin the endgamers who cant buy IM cause they arent gonna be able to compete with people with IM, the rule "Real Money Wins" is gonna become an even stronger truth than it is now.

EDIT: Just goes to prove the old saying "the one ruins it for the many"

and like the person above me said, as a long-term solution, if IM items could be traded, then you could just cancel the trade if you dont see their gold in the box.

Edited by FrigidImpulse, 05 August 2011 - 04:43 PM.

While I don't like that people are actually being banned for this (I think that's too harsh), I fault the community for allowing it to escalate to this point. I always found it incredibly stupid to blare out advertisements for Selling or Buying through megaphones and forums, especially when its legality was so subtle and unenforced.

Partly I would blame WP for not suspending advertisers; I think public advertisers opens the doors for players who will not be as smart about it than someone who knows where to look and how to protect themselves from scam.

The IM tradeable thing has already been discussed, they won't be tradeable because it opens the doors for mass chargebacks which was why they made them nontradeable in the first place.

Like everyone is saying
Just make insurance scrolls and other popular consumable IM items tradable and everyone will be able to
accept the new rule.