Feelings about Renewal

I've been looking forward to Renewal for a long time, and for the most part, I think they have the right ideas... there's 3 main things I'm concerned about, however.

The translations are absolutely terrible. I made it about 4 NPCs into the training grounds before everything starts reading like I plugged a Korean website into Babel Fish. This is the first thing newbies are going to see, and if they can't understand the NPCs trying to explain the game, they're going to quit. Renewal is the last chance to save RO - PLEASE don't drive the newbies away with translations that are almost at the "I could fly if I fall off" level.

The item drop scaling is going to result in 1 billion zeny raydric cards. The game is already unfriendly enough to newbies without that. I know the goal is to weaken bots, but it's going to hamper real players far more. Would it be possible to ditch on that on the premium servers, where bots aren't much of a concern?

Unless I'm missing something, the mage class has been pretty much removed from the game. No one is going to want to party with one when melee can match their damage while of course also not being squishy. Is there any chance we can get jRO's MATK formula instead of kRO's worthless one? As I'm mainly a caster player, I'm not sure if I even want to stick with the game at this point, as the classes I mainly play have been buried by the new matk formula.

That actually raises a major question - do we actually have any say in how our renewal is going to work beyond very minor adjustments, or are we stuck with what kRO hands us?

Edited by Mwrip, 09 September 2010 - 07:43 PM.

My pre-conceived notions have been grim: renewal will be a complete disaster. Your only real hope will be having most old players finding your changes bearable enough and having the completely new system still be intriguing to new players. Unfortunately, since I do not p2p and play on the free server, I cannot even test things out to see if it's not as bad as I thought. Sorry, but for my post, it seems all you are going to get from me at this point is why renewal was never a good idea.

From the very beginning, it seems as though the purpose of renewal was to make it just like every other MMO out there. Flat damage boosts with boring weapon mechanics. Flat or even arbitrary armor effectiveness. Level means everything in the world and even affects item drops. But I'm telling you, RO was successful because it was RO, not some other run-of-the-mill MMO with spectacular 3D graphics. If you tried to make RO just like every other MMO, it would fall on its face because its mechanics would be nothing special but everything else -- quests, graphics, content, activities -- would be severely lacking.

Here's what I don't like about renewal:

Sprites: All the 3-x class sprites are ugly, over-baked, and overall just unappealing. The names for the classes even seem to become absurd, as they are just more random synonyms on top of more random synonyms which could have easily been a lower job instead...

Variety problems still not fixed: So I hear, the guys in charge of developing this thought there was a problem with weapon variety. It would be "too hard" to make new content that was desirable. They did not like how the trend was typically maxing your attack stat, then using a 4 slot weapon carded optimally. So what they did was jack around with the mechanics, make the % cards only affect the weapon's attack... and basically, they only change what became desirable. NEWSFLASH!! Now everyone will be after the weapons with LARGE attack and a few slots. EVERYONE NOW. Before, if you had really low str or dex, it was a pretty good idea to use the lv 3 weapons with only 1-2 slots that no one else wanted. But now... guess what, those weapons will be optimal for everyone! Look, if they wanted to make new content that was really useful, all they needed to do was grow some balls and use their head. Weapons that only have like 2% chance to inflict some status or proc some mediocre skill and still don't have any slots are definitely not going to be desirable. Why wouldn't they just try to increase the slots or % chance or the power of such skills instead?

Level means everything: It was pretty cool how badly geared high level characters could get taken down by lower level characters. For instance, think of a level 95 knight with no mdef or any protection from freeze getting killed by 2 frozen JTs from a wizard. Or flip that around, level 70 knight catching a high level wizard off guard who has no vit, stunning him, and killing him. It could work both ways, and it also means the higher level player who IS more skilled and has better gear would definitely trash any low level player. But the reasons why are simple: stats, gears, and skill. Now you look at how renewal handles everything... if you are much lower level than someone else, you can't even put a dent in their HP. It isn't fair at all. When you get beaten by someone because they are higher level, it used to be because those levels gave them more HP and more stats to distribute. Now... you lose to someone who's higher level just because they are higher level. This will greatly ruin WoE too... for the players that aren't max level. Basically it boils down to this: achieve max level like everyone else or you will die super-easy and won't be able to do crap.

Now you take a look at how monsters are handled. You get less exp if the monster is lower level than you... well, OK... if we did this in RO now, I could see where developers are coming from, but with the increase in the amount of exp needed to level anyway, it seems highly redundant and unnecessary even for mild exp penalties. But no, 10 levels above and you get NOTHING. It's probably also because those monsters do no damage to you anymore and you get a huge bonus on them but... they seriously went too far with the level factoring into everything. Hell, even if you are too many levels below a monster, you still get penalized! What's with that? If anything you should get a BONUS. Messing with the item drops is also stupid. RO is not any other MMO where items you find at low levels are worth absolutely nothing to the high level players. Think about this: in WoW, when you are a low level blacksmith, you can find stuff like copper and smelt it into copper bars. Who wants copper bars? Only people your level! The high level players would only be looking for stuff like adamantium. In RO's case, everyone is going to want jellopies for stupid quests, everyone is going to want ray cards, everyone is going to need yoyo tails for making food, and everyone is going to need steel for forging. It doesn't matter what level the monster is who drops the item or what level you are when you need them.

Defense: I don't even understand what the initial problem with the old RO system was. I think it was, again, developers freaking out because they lack the problem solving abilities or imagination to come up with gears that are desirable but won't break the limit of say... making 95+ defense possible. Even then, one might ask why would it matter considering there are such things as MAGIC which takes a different type of defense into account, and a plethora of skills, items, and abilities which ignore or even do MORE damage based on defense. The thing is, now all we have with renewal is VIT and STR being able to add to your defense, and armors being able to add defense in the hundreds... but it still nearly boils down to the same thing. The defense cap is at 1000, and even when you get that, it's 66% - 90% reduction. Or something like that; I don't know. What I do know is it all just seems hella arbitrary to me.

Monsters: From what I hear, monsters are all pretty much the same. They might have some different skills (especially boss monsters) but the only real thing that makes each different is -- you guessed it -- their level. And for that matter, as you level up and stay around monsters about the same level as you... fighting each of them is also pretty much the same. They've all got about the same amount of HPs, same defense, same accuracy, dodge, and attack. It's not really the same if you remember how RO used to play... mimics and wanderers have really high flee and attack speed and were the bane of every caster. Turtles and golems have high defense, tough to kill, but could still take huge damage from OI.

Cast time: Ok, personally I thought it was crap to let people get instant cast too. So what did they do for renewal? They made it so there was a fixed cast time -- one that cannot be reduced at all by stats or level. I feel they did at least have the right intentions this time, but they did it in an awfully clunky, inelegant matter. I hate hard caps on things. Consider this: what if your cast time was: (Base Time)*.99^Dex*.995^Int

That means, each dex point shaves off 1% of the cast time, and each int point takes off .5%. BUT, the next point in dex does not additively stack to take off 2%. More like it takes 1% off of the remaining time that had 1% taken off of it. Or in other words, it reduces exponentially. Our exponents are .99 and .995. You keep increasing their power, and they will continue to approach zero... BUT, the rate they approach zero decreases, as the power increases, and they will never actually reach zero. With the formula I suggested, having 160 Dex and 180 Int would give you an 8% cast time. So essentially, having dex wouldn't necessarily be an "all or nothing" scenario. Each stat point takes off the same portion of cast time remaining as the last... this would just mean returns become somewhat diminishing. And it would be up to players to decide how much dex they want. The numbers do not have to necessarily come out like this. You can tweak the exponents around for some more desirable effects. Still, I just believe that using an exponential formula is always better than a formula that involves some value, x/cap.

I believe the same thing could even be done for status effects, such as stun resistance = 1 - .99^VIT. This is somewhat of a different matter though, although the situation is still probably not any better than it is on non-renewal servers...

Edited by LethalJokeChar, 11 September 2010 - 09:21 PM.

The Quests are nice but they don't give enough reward for the trouble of doing them (mainly eden quests); because of the cooldown they seriously need to give alot more EXP (I completed 2 and STILL didn't level at base 11) and Zenny as well (to buy new pots/new gear); otherwise you can just grind out the monsters and you level so much more quicker. Even then it feels like a grind fest = Not fun.

Me personally, I hate grinding thus why I enjoy quests because it feels like I'm working towards something. However, even questing feels like a grind fest since you only gain EXP from it. It would be much more appealing if you gained other rewards such as Zenny/Items/Points to redeem for better gear. This is based on 1-1.5hrs of playing, I got from 6 base to 12 base only x_x.

Edited by AnhHero, 10 September 2010 - 06:12 AM.

The Quests are nice but they don't give enough reward for the trouble of doing them (mainly eden quests); because of the cooldown they seriously need to give alot more EXP (I completed 2 and STILL didn't level at base 11) and Zenny as well (to buy new pots/new gear); otherwise you can just grind out the monsters and you level so much more quicker. Even then it feels like a grind fest = Not fun.

Me personally, I hate grinding thus why I enjoy quests because it feels like I'm working towards something. However, even questing feels like a grind fest since you only gain EXP from it. It would be much more appealing if you gained other rewards such as Zenny/Items/Points to redeem for better gear. This is based on 1-1.5hrs of playing, I got from 6 base to 12 base only x_x.

I agree. It was the same way on cRO renewal...basically people who had just started were doing a few of them and I had to instruct them away from them because the exp they gave was way too inefficient for the time they put into it. They need to at -least- give you a full level, especially since it's so early on.

Some initial thoughts:

The translation is bad in so many places that actually compiling each example was overwhelming. Trying to decipher Engrish to try out new quests is kind of frustrating. Hopefully the majority of new content can be thoroughly proofread before it hits the main servers.

The new GUI has good and bad points... Custom hotkeys, more information, etc is nice, but compared to the old interface, it's really just messy looking. You need to open menus and select items rather than using some of the old keyboard shortcuts we've adapted to, which I would imagine (unless I'm the only crazy one) is somewhat frustrating, even if it only takes another second or two. I'm finding myself constantly toggling between the battlemode and chat mode... It would be great to make chat/battlemode 'stick' with some option... Is there one? I imagine that it would be less of an issue for new players who aren't used to the old windows.

The levelling is slow at the lower levels... You're somewhat forced to fight level-appropriate monsters, but it also seems much friendlier to a new player starting off alone. I realize that most testers are used to power-levelling a new character to level 50 in an hour, but it's not really slow compared to starting off one's first character way back when. The new training grounds are much more helpful to someone with empty pockets. The training grounds NPC quests that I did try evened out the job/base levels much more than killing things alone. I like being able to sample 1st class skills a bit. The amount of supplies was a great relief compared to the usual. The Eden group quests... some of them give quite a nice amount of experience, but a few potions, a little zeny, or some other supplies would be nice for the less-rewarding ones. The new levelling curve is probably much less overwhelming for everyone though, even with a slower start. I am honestly looking forward to not getting nerdrage if I die at 98 without insurance. XD I also have a few friends who are willing to play again simply for this reason.

Still being a noob, I have yet to really encounter the reduced drop rate issue, but it is definitely something I am concerned about. I honestly don't see the benefit of this at all, especially for iRO. The only new players joining in huge waves every day are... well, yeah.

I know we're supposed to 'explore' and all, but I am hoping that we'll get a nice, official page when renewal launches to go over the larger changes and hopefully help us all adapt more.

The Quests are nice but they don't give enough reward for the trouble of doing them (mainly eden quests); because of the cooldown they seriously need to give alot more EXP (I completed 2 and STILL didn't level at base 11) and Zenny as well (to buy new pots/new gear); otherwise you can just grind out the monsters and you level so much more quicker. Even then it feels like a grind fest = Not fun.

Me personally, I hate grinding thus why I enjoy quests because it feels like I'm working towards something. However, even questing feels like a grind fest since you only gain EXP from it. It would be much more appealing if you gained other rewards such as Zenny/Items/Points to redeem for better gear. This is based on 1-1.5hrs of playing, I got from 6 base to 12 base only x_x.

In addition, there's absolutely no quest progression once you leave Training Grounds. Newbies aren't going to realize that they need to grind their way to level 11 just to start doing quests in the game. Having non-progressive quests in the training ground and then dropping players into the job change place of their choice only to have no direction after job change is a very disoriented way to get started in the game. At the very least, have job change NPCs direct players to the class training quests after changing them. (i.e. "oh, [NPC name] will show you how to get started with your new occupation. S/he should be over by [location].")

I do not like leveling system anymore, while it like Requiem it is not to the same extreme.

Dont like the Eden quest cool down, there way to long.

Battlemode while it is improved upon ENTER still triggers battlemode to turn on and off, IT just don't do when us the tele skill. DISABLE ENTER from tiggering bm going on and off, and make so only SPACEBAR does this.

I agree with this because the current tone of every renewal announcement addresses renewal as a sort of common knowledge with the assumption that the entire RO population knows about this/expected this. While that may be true, some non avid RO players may go on the renewal server without knowing their entire stat system, equipment, formulas, monsters, skills and everything they ever knew is changed, and then wonder why a valk shield now has 80 def. I understand there are a lot of issues that need more immediate attention than a fancy notice, but a general summary of what renewal encompasses on top of the "renewal is here" would be nice for anyone who actually relies on official information to get by.

I'll second this. My greatest misgiving about Renewal was that they changed a LOT of formulas that didn't need changing. All the game really needed was:

1) A monster balancing to adjust their experience to match their difficulty, their difficulty to match their level, and a little reshuffling of the spawns. Many monsters were perfectly fine. What we got was a complete revamp of the leveling system, where players can attack higher level monsters (esp. with good gears and in party), but are penalized for doing so, and a complete shuffle of monster spawns. Level didn't need to be a deterministic trait, just a guide as to difficulty and EXP.
2) An additional incentive for high-level players to kill lower-level monsters. Perhaps something like increased drop rates by comparing levels. There is still no incentive for higher level characters to farm lower level monsters, in fact, there is even less incentive.
3) A skill balancing to address a few problems in PvP, and a couple of issues concerning PvM. We have an entirely new imbalanced 3rd class, and some of the same pre-existing broken skills remain broken.

So basically, with the exception of high level grinding, many of the previous problems still exist, and we get to deal with an entirely new set of game mechanics to boot. It *looks* like RO, but it *feels* like I'm playing an entirely new game with the same problems as RO.

BTW,
A ) I like the new allocatable hot keys.
B ) Some of the Battle Messages are informative, while some are annoying. I wish settings held over restart.
C) I wish the Status Menu was separate from the Equipment Menu. It is annoying, always popping up when I open the Equipment Menu. I want ALT-A back.
D ) I dislike the new Information window layout, but like the decimal display of level percentage. The window takes up too much room vertically, and the Main Menu gets in the way. Again, I would like to see them separated. ALT-V for information, ALT-O for Main Menu.
E ) Window resizing doesn't seem to work.

I do not like leveling system anymore, while it like Requiem it is not to the same extreme.

Dont like the Eden quest cool down, there way to long.

Battlemode while it is improved upon ENTER still triggers battlemode to turn on and off, IT just don't do when us the tele skill. DISABLE ENTER from tiggering bm going on and off, and make so only SPACEBAR does this.

Spacebar was never a part of the new battlemode and with enter it's a lot easier. If you see your chat bar after you talk to an npc, just hit enter again and you won't think about it again.

Spacebar was never a part of the new battlemode and with enter it's a lot easier. If you see your chat bar after you talk to an npc, just hit enter again and you won't think about it again.

The problem is even the way BM was is somewhat problematic. Spacebar is a better option because it isn't used for anything. Enter, however, is highly useful for quickly interacting with NPCs. It's also typically the reason why one can get in deep trouble when visiting the inn, going in a portal to WoE, and suddenly none of your BM keys are working. OOPS, looks like we forgot pressing enter messes with it.

Spacebar BM chat would be an improvement.

Edited by LethalJokeChar, 10 September 2010 - 03:20 PM.

The problem is even the way BM was is somewhat problematic. Spacebar is a better option because it isn't used for anything. Enter, however, is highly useful for quickly interacting with NPCs. It's also typically the reason why one can get in deep trouble when visiting the inn, going in a portal to WoE, and suddenly none of your BM keys are working. OOPS, looks like we forgot pressing enter messes with it.

Spacebar BM chat would be an improvement.

This

Even with this BM change people are gona still wind up dieing random cause of this enter, CHange it to spacebar only, right now it might be better then prerenewal but it still gona cause problems with ENTER still trigger it to go on and off. If I wana talk i rather hit SPACEBAR and this means there no chance of some one dieing cause of battlemode cause they accidentally hit enter and forgot to hit it again,

LIke he said SPACEBAR is far less used and better choice for turning it on and off.

Edited by Puppet, 10 September 2010 - 03:32 PM.

That actually raises a major question - do we actually have any say in how our renewal is going to work beyond very minor adjustments, or are we stuck with what kRO hands us?

I second this. kRO dev team struck out. Actually, they have been striking out. The same people who screwed up RO are "fixing" it! Can iRO split from kRO and partner with the jRO dev team? I think the best course of action would be to split from kRO, and perform the numerous, minor tweaks that their poorly conceived and tested new content (since 10.1) required. Then, iRO could begin addressing the handful of minor issues which have plagued RO since the beginning.


Not to be racist or anything, but I have noticed some strong stereotypes in Asian (non-Japanese) programmers:

Koreans: Always looking ahead to the next great feature, rarely addressing existing bugs (leave them for tomorrow, tomorrow), and rarely performing regression tests (analyze how new code affects old code). Doesn't this sound familiar?

Chinese: No imagination. They copy. When what they copied doesn't work with what they had, they copy some more. Eventually, you end up with a code that has lots of features that don't inter-operate.

Indians: Umm... well... How can a computer science graduate not know the basics of the command line? Why must phone conversations proceed like, "c a t *space* m y p r o g a m *dot* c *pipe*. That's the vertical bar. *pipe* g r e p *space* s t r n c p y *enter*. What did you get? No. Only one pipe, not two."

In addition, there's absolutely no quest progression once you leave Training Grounds. Newbies aren't going to realize that they need to grind their way to level 11 just to start doing quests in the game. Having non-progressive quests in the training ground and then dropping players into the job change place of their choice only to have no direction after job change is a very disoriented way to get started in the game. At the very least, have job change NPCs direct players to the class training quests after changing them. (i.e. "oh, [NPC name] will show you how to get started with your new occupation. S/he should be over by [location].")

Agreed. I was warped to pyramids for thief jobchange, but if i didnt already know where i was going I would have walked through the portal near me, gotten killed by a familiar (this happened after i changed) and then been stuck.

If its warping to the job change area it should warp directly to the NPC's who change you.

Also consider where the Eden NPC is on prontera at least. Most new players will be distracted by all the vendors (and maybe bot spammers) and not actually see the Eden NPC thus missing out on the entire experience.

Eden really needs quests from 1-10, because some players are going to choose "go directly to world" option.

Agreed. I was warped to pyramids for thief jobchange, but if i didnt already know where i was going I would have walked through the portal near me, gotten killed by a familiar (this happened after i changed) and then been stuck.

If its warping to the job change area it should warp directly to the NPC's who change you.

Also consider where the Eden NPC is on prontera at least. Most new players will be distracted by all the vendors (and maybe bot spammers) and not actually see the Eden NPC thus missing out on the entire experience.

Eden really needs quests from 1-10, because some players are going to choose "go directly to world" option.

We seriously need a sense of progression. For a decent introduction to the game, a newbie should do all the training grounds quests, then get warped to the job change NPC of their choice, then get directed to the job class training quest NPC, and then get directed to the Eden Group NPC. This, of course, is largely dependent on having Eden Group agents in ALL the class change towns (Izlude, Payon, Morroc, Geffen, Alberta, Prontera) and not just Prontera.

As for the Familiars in the thief job pyramid, either make the darn things passive or take them out of the first floor entirely. Those things are very hindering for Thief newbies.

Also consider where the Eden NPC is on prontera at least. Most new players will be distracted by all the vendors (and maybe bot spammers) and not actually see the Eden NPC thus missing out on the entire experience.

Eden really needs quests from 1-10, because some players are going to choose "go directly to world" option.

Hmm yeah, I didn't know the NPC was there because I don't usually wander around off to the side when I enter Prontera. Maybe it would've been easier to find the Eden Group NPC if they were near each of the kafra NPCs?

In addition, there's absolutely no quest progression once you leave Training Grounds. Newbies aren't going to realize that they need to grind their way to level 11 just to start doing quests in the game. Having non-progressive quests in the training ground and then dropping players into the job change place of their choice only to have no direction after job change is a very disoriented way to get started in the game. At the very least, have job change NPCs direct players to the class training quests after changing them. (i.e. "oh, [NPC name] will show you how to get started with your new occupation. S/he should be over by [location].")

It would've been nice to know that you needed to be at least lvl 11 to do the quests before they ask you if you'd like to be teleported to the Eden Group :/

As for the Familiars in the thief job pyramid, either make the darn things passive or take them out of the first floor entirely. Those things are very hindering for Thief newbies.

I guess they like annoying people with bats...

Edited by inuko23, 10 September 2010 - 09:24 PM.

The GMs need to fix partying...seriously. Stop punishing us for working together. Give some kind of bonus for every member in a party.

after a couple hours im concerned about 1 thing. Why developers never learn what is fun? You already know what makes people fun. You increase spawn rates and people go nuts. now you make quests in the oposite way. you fill a map with Ragglers like LOTS of ragglers and then make a quest to kill "crabs". pardon my french... what the f-- with this? so you think the idea of fun is runnind around in a HUGE map that has only 5 o 6 crabs while trying to avoid 60 ragglers... come on ... you may as well made "kill 100 ragglers" and people would have fun actually. and the list goes on an on in every level.

If you mean Helpful Henry, he just likes sending you to retarded maps.

I think every map he's sent me to so far has been like the worst possible one to hunt that particular monster on.

If you mean Helpful Henry, he just likes sending you to retarded maps.

I think every map he's sent me to so far has been like the worst possible one to hunt that particular monster on.

yeah, he gave me a quest to hunt 10 Pecopeco eggs then sent me to the map filled with drops. I might as well teleport to Morroc and walk to the right area for the eggs myself :|...

Edited by inuko23, 11 September 2010 - 02:00 PM.

Helpful Henry sent me to go kill drainliars on the peno map. I think he might just hate us a little. XD At least he's only for testing. Chiming in on him is really only an issue if we want to level fast-ish to test more high-levelled things... which we do.

Some of the Eden quests have weird locations for their quests (though they don't force you there). It would probably be nice to not direct low-level characters to a map full of hunter flies.

Also, I'm noticing that with my usual amounts of dex, I'm missing a LOT of the time. I think a lot of people are experiencing this. I suppose it's probably an intended change, but it is a little disorienting to see that "miss" pop up so often.

I'm kind of bummed out that monsters aren't special anymore. I beat a Stapo to death with an axe and it didn't do any less damage than anything else. Same deal with Horong.
It seems like the special characteristics of the monsters has all been sucked away.

Yeah, all monsters are pretty much the same as any other monster their level. But on that note, you can level on pretty much anything you want, which I think was the intent.

I'm still kind of bummed that all our pre-renewal weapons become pretty worthless, but at least I managed to sell off most of mine.

Renewal just screw over monk/champ builds

Even with 99 dex TSS and Occult are painfull slow now

Zen is insanely slow now on top of that it is interrupted

Fist forget about geting fist off even with 99 dex in woe, unless you combo build

Renewal completely destroyed 99% of all builds used right now. I was looking forward to sura and few other classed. I think at this point RO will be dead to me when renewal hits mains

Edited by Puppet, 11 September 2010 - 08:24 PM.

all I have to add so far is that I am not liking how hard it is to get base lvls compared to job lvls

Edited by DJMaxSilver, 11 September 2010 - 09:02 PM.

I've also been looking forward to renewal, but after playing Ygg some, my opinion has changed quite a bit for the negative.

New Players:
I think the new system is very fluid and easy to get new players into the game, something just tells me it's not going to attract any, those looking to get to Trans and then 150 have a LONG road ahead of them.

Level range:
See below for exp.
Drops: This system is horrendous, it's already bad enough that the pre-renewal game has zero income for low level drops outside of OCA and etc, but people who make their money hunting and keeping the necessary items on the market can't anymore?

Leveling:
I enjoy actually having to go around and not stick to one map for 30-40 levels, I'm generally happy if a level takes 30 minutes to an hr (unless it's something like 141-150), though evening out the levels for lower characters is definitely a chore.

1x exp is a HORRIBLE idea (by comparison kRO Renewal Sakray had 10x, not sure what their current mains rate is), let's do the math on a level:
A level 110 needs 12m to hit 111 (by comparison is roughly a trans 83->84 in the current system), a level 120 monster with 140% higher level bonus magnification gives generally 5k exp (most of the good monsters in the current format giving at least 10k-49k, though some classes have to make do with 4k), that'd make renewal 2400 kills for a single level [before manual] when you'll need to get 39 more levels after that. I don't really have an idea of a good mid range for whatever times the server should be given exp events might make it too crazy, but rates, but a level is only fun up til about 200-300 kills per level, afterwards it becomes a full time job. I have a lot of characters and I'll probably quit if the final version takes a full day off day to night to get one single level on 1 character.

tldr; GMs and players need to come together and come up with a good rate, seems like outside of this thread, there has been very little listening to players about how renewal should be tested/run when it's implemented, etc, jRO got to make their own modifications, why can't we?

Transcendant job exp: Can't really tell about 99 since the helper npc was put in, but it seems like Trans that go 50 1st class will probably only be about 63 or so when it hits 99, mostly due to 2nd class J1-30 being a good bit slower now.

Turn-in quests were generally abused, but couldn't we get something along the lines of kill counts that go all the way to early 130-140s somewhat in the same vein as the helper NPC the testing has?

Other:

I'm all for the stat revamp, but I haven't casted anything with noticably long casting time to say that it sucks.

Also as said many times before, a lot of the new text completely redone.

As far as upgrades go, we either need better rates or something better than enriched if there's ever any hope of hitting +11 or above.

CTHO Arclouses need to be removed or set to around level 80.

Edited by Hikari, 11 September 2010 - 11:18 PM.