scouts :3

There are 6 or 7 ranged classes in Rose: Bow Scout, Crossbow Scout, Artisan, Gun Bourgious, Launcher Bourgious, Crossbow Knight, Cleric.

There is no differentiation in skills between bow scouts and crossbow scouts so they are essentially the same class..... for now.

Each class should be different obviously, so what do we have now?

Scout: Well rounded. Good at escaping and catching enemies trying to escape. Slightly more defensive than dealers but slightly less offensive.

Artisan: Best damage output against a single enemy, good at controlling a group of enemies. They are also crafters. Dies easily but slightly better at surviving than Bourgious.

Launcher Bourgious: Highest range of all and best at dealing damage to a group of enemies and farming. Subpar at fighting enemies 1v1. Dies easily.

Gun Bourgious: Generally an inferior combination of Artisan and Launcher Bourg. Their skills are lackluster and their stats other than attack power are less than that of artisans.

Crossbow Knight: Most defensive of all and best at tanking, but also the least offensive. Has some useful skills to cripple/annoy the enemy.

Cleric: Support class. Also defensive but not meant to tank. Very limited offense but can deal fair damage to low magic defense enemies.




If you make Scouts stronger offensively, what becomes of the dealers? If you lower their defensive attributes but increase their offense, they become too similar to them (dealers).


Class balancing isn't about changing 1 class only, it should be about adjusting every class in unison (if needed). I have no idea what they will be doing with this fabled skill change update, other than the fact that we will be getting more skills to choose from.

And personally, I don't feel Scout's are entitled to an aoe skill just because X class has an aoe skill. But Scouts having an aoe has as much merit as Gun Bourg's having one so whatever. The most logical thing I can vision, for those have played Twighlight Princess, is an exploding arrow similar to Link's bomb arrows. Anything more than that doesn't really make sense to me.

There are 6 or 7 ranged classes in Rose: Bow Scout, Crossbow Scout, Artisan, Gun Bourgious, Launcher Bourgious, Crossbow Knight, Cleric.

There is no differentiation in skills between bow scouts and crossbow scouts so they are essentially the same class..... for now.

Each class should be different obviously, so what do we have now?

Scout: Well rounded. Good at escaping and catching enemies trying to escape. Slightly more defensive than dealers but slightly less offensive.

Artisan: Best damage output against a single enemy, good at controlling a group of enemies. They are also crafters. Dies easily but slightly better at surviving than Bourgious.

Launcher Bourgious: Highest range of all and best at dealing damage to a group of enemies and farming. Subpar at fighting enemies 1v1. Dies easily.

Gun Bourgious: Generally an inferior combination of Artisan and Launcher Bourg. Their skills are lackluster and their stats other than attack power are less than that of artisans.

Crossbow Knight: Most defensive of all and best at tanking, but also the least offensive. Has some useful skills to cripple/annoy the enemy.

Cleric: Support class. Also defensive but not meant to tank. Very limited offense but can deal fair damage to low magic defense enemies.




If you make Scouts stronger offensively, what becomes of the dealers? If you lower their defensive attributes but increase their offense, they become too similar to them (dealers).


Class balancing isn't about changing 1 class only, it should be about adjusting every class in unison (if needed). I have no idea what they will be doing with this fabled skill change update, other than the fact that we will be getting more skills to choose from.

And personally, I don't feel Scout's are entitled to an aoe skill just because X class has an aoe skill. But Scouts having an aoe has as much merit as Gun Bourg's having one so whatever. The most logical thing I can vision, for those have played Twighlight Princess, is an exploding arrow similar to Link's bomb arrows. Anything more than that doesn't really make sense to me.

100% agreed.

Edited by FormerlyEternal, 01 July 2012 - 01:46 PM.

And personally, I don't feel Scout's are entitled to an aoe skill just because X class has an aoe skill. But Scouts having an aoe has as much merit as Gun Bourg's having one so whatever. The most logical thing I can vision, for those have played Twighlight Princess, is an exploding arrow similar to Link's bomb arrows. Anything more than that doesn't really make sense to me.

lol twilight princess FTW :3 and yes that could be a good idea ;o but i still think the idea of arrows falling from the sky is cool c:

Quite simply put this debate will not end with a point being made and agreed upon.

Scouts need more variance in skill build. It's too linear and boring.
Some want more passives, others want AoE added, other say that both of those are stupid ideas [based on whatever personal/professional opinions they hold]

The facts remain.

They're Linear, and do not offer any choices in skill selection
They lack acc in a passive form, even passives at all.
They tank about as goood as their Raider brethren of the same stat build

- Duals add STR for AP on weapons, gives added DEF and HP, Xbow scout gets the same benefit + shield % to block, less AP then duals however.
- Katars add DEX for AP on weapons, gives added Dodge rate, Bow scouts will receive the same benefit, minus the attack speed passives.

Fix these verified issues the community has with the class, while maintaining a balance towards other classes, and the problem will be fixed.

Edited by Feuer, 01 July 2012 - 07:26 PM.

scouts dont need more acc passives they barely miss imo.. plus all they do is skill spam anyways with their quick animations

what a lie ._. i dont skill spam >.>

scouts dont need more acc passives they barely miss imo.. plus all they do is skill spam anyways with their quick animations

With the bug that limits how many skills can be chained before the animation gets glitched, this argument doesn't really pan out, no offense

The facts remain]
They're Linear, and do not offer any choices in skill selection
They lack acc in a passive form, even passives at all.
They tank about as goood as their Raider brethren of the same stat build

- Duals add STR for AP on weapons, gives added DEF and HP, Xbow scout gets the same benefit + shield % to block, less AP then duals however.
- Katars add DEX for AP on weapons, gives added Dodge rate, Bow scouts will receive the same benefit, minus the attack speed passives.

Only two of your facts are actually facts, once again I won't state why, but scouts can tank better than raiders. If you state that raiders can tank as well as scouts you are just wrong, period.

Of the two other facts, the fact that they're linear is true, their lack of passives is something that could lend itself to this. Accuracy passive would be ridiculous, good scouts barely miss.

Edited by FormerlyEternal, 02 July 2012 - 12:58 AM.

Only two of your facts are actually facts, once again I won't state why, but scouts can tank better than raiders. If you state that raiders can tank as well as scouts you are just wrong, period.

Of the two other facts, the fact that they're linear is true, their lack of passives is something that could lend itself to this. Accuracy passive would be ridiculous, good scouts barely miss.

Make a dual raider, give it dodge gems, and go full dex/Con/Sen and use dodge gears. ... see how often you get hit lol

Make a dual raider, give it dodge gems, and go full dex/Con/Sen and use dodge gears. ... see how often you get hit lol

Alright, granted, if you make a failraider you can tank. However, you would probably still die faster than the scout, because you can't insta-purify.

Edited by FormerlyEternal, 02 July 2012 - 01:06 AM.

It's a PvM build, works quite well actually since dual wields get attack power passives. and purify pots cure that in a hurry.

everyone who says scout need to get a boost don't know how to play a scout.

Lmfao! Yeah, anyone can play a scout, because there;s only 1 way to build it xD

Every class has their way to build it, also scouts have some points. Launcher bourgs has the same thing, yes they can go for the single target skills, but rlly who does that.
They have an accu passive compared to their weapon accuracy, which is compared to other classes one of the higher accuracy on a weapon. U canot compare the accu passives with eachother without looking at the accuracy given on the weapon.
Maybe the only lack on scouts is what i said before a second stun and some aspeed passive, there is no need for scouts to come with aoe or more accu passives.

Talking about passives and tank ability for scouts.
They sure do tank better then raiders if u ask me, i got similiar builds on both raider and scout only my raider has more dex and less con, but the hp recovery passives make them better tanks then raiders. and i have less dodge and def on my scout as i have on my raider. So stating they tank about the same is nonsence, scouts defenatly tank better. Don't come with the argument if a dual raider goes full dodge... bla bla, Scouts can do the same. That's just nonsence.

Dont forget they are a ranged class and has this range as an advantage, specialy when u put the skills in the right order to cast.

I agree with Darkii, if u asking for such boosts on scouts, u simply dont know how to play it. And so do u when u say they only have one way to build it, doesnt mean anyone can play it. They might lack on skill builds diversity, but atleast its a class u have to work for ur points in ga instead of spamming aoe's.

@ Teus, u dont have skill spam, just learn how to put ur skills in a right order to be more succesfull on playing a scout. Or any class u play.

lol @Graziano

how do you want us to build a scout if there is only1 way to build it?.... and what the points of warring, without your opponents hp going lower than 70%? just spams some goulash and red and there you go 100% again, while that stupid poison takes away just few hp ._. dude if you say scouts are good the way they are then you are wrong .-. the only class they can kill without any problems are mages/bourgs/artis... Champs-takes for ever, raiders- miss miss miss hit miss miss....
ok SF-770/PA-874 accuracy.
champ-40%acc & 40%crit plus all other passives they got.
scout-30%acc.... errr something's wrong here isn't it?

Edited by Teus, 02 July 2012 - 05:11 AM.

Just because they don't have passives or AoE doesn't make them any weaker than other classes. Stop playing them for kills and play them how they're supposed to be played; support. If you put a scout as a killing class, of course it's going to suck.

Try using skills more often, thats the way scouts get the most damage, they are not made to kill melee, specialy not against champs, knights or raiders.
If ur decent enough ur opponant wont get u lower then 70%, and u can slowly kill him. If ur not patient enough thats ur problem not the class.

So it takes some time for a champ, so whut?
Accuracy for sf with passive: 770 + 4x77 (308) = 1078
Accuracy for pa with passive 874 + 3x 87.4 (262.2) = 1136.2
Champs can get alot of passives, but if u take them all ull end up without much skills to cast. So what's ur point?

Raider takes some skills to kill. And with decent accu and dodge down u can hit them, they are a pain, but with some practice, it's posible.

I dont know which gear ur using, maybe thats the problem. u cannot expect that ur char can kill everyone or every class with only chiv/glor or whatever.
Or do u just simply want a char which can outstand all classes without any problems?

I made my suggestion for scouts to improve, which is imo more then enough, for the rest they are fine the way they are.
Instead of saying my thoughts are wrong, prove urself right.

So it takes some time for a champ, so whut?
Accuracy for sf with passive: 770 + 4x77 (308) = 1078
Accuracy for pa with passive 874 + 3x 87.4 (262.2) = 1136.2

uhmm look at that almost same acc as a scout o: i think there's still something wrong c:

and no i do not want a char that can stand up among all characters, im just comparing what scouts lack ;3

uhmm look at that almost same acc as a scout o: i think there's still something wrong c:

and no i do not want a char that can stand up among all characters, im just comparing what scouts lack ;3

Because realistically, aiming a bow and swinging a sword is pretty similar, right?

Stop playing them for kills and play them how they're supposed to be played; support.

Exactly. I've been playing a mage in the past few days now and even though i've been getting low amount of points (GA) i'm still pretty much enjoying it. It already satisfy me that i've helped my team and not just for my personal gain (of points).

EDIT: About what you said teus on raider having both stealth and cloak. Well, stealth has a long cd unlike scouts who can pretty much run away if they want to (Even with mute. It only lasts for like 5 seconds)

Edited by Soda, 02 July 2012 - 07:46 AM.

Scouts in CD games and scouts in TG wars are two totally different things. Since you can't use Goulash in GA, all ranged classes pretty much got their "ranged advantage" back.
But it's true that if you want to get points in CD games, getting kills is pretty much your only option since Scout's DPS is one of the lowest.

@Feuer: "Lmfao! Yeah, anyone can play a scout, because there;s only 1 way to build it xD"
After this statement you should never comment on anything about Scouts.

Because realistically, aiming a bow and swinging a sword is pretty similar, right?

yes c:

@Kwam: I could tell that you would fail so bad at scout, if you think skill spamming will get you anywhere.


@Feur: Anyone could play any class, but that doesn't mean they'll be useful or any good at it, if there was "One" way to build scout, then why do 90% of the scouts suck?

@Svene Us scouts have as much as right as any other class to complain or suggest improvement, just like you or anyone else would for updates on your class. If scouts were to be "Support" because we have a mspd down skill, then how does scout differ from all the other classes with mspd down? That's the only useful skill we have. We have 1 Stun, every other class has 2+.

We have a poison that is weak + easily removed. Scouts aren't even support, nor offensive. They're distractions which is terrible. They can't kill, they can't tank as much of you say ( Just because they have stealth, Which does not remove the target off you you still get hit, Doesn't mean we're tanks). Dodge is easily hit now. IF we're suppose to be a support class, what's there to use for support? Mspd Down? So basically people leveled to 220, bought gears, & spend billions just to slow down the enemy. That's sounds amazing. &

@Form Only reason why people are going scout, is because "RANGE" in general is the best class to play in Game Arena. As Melee characters tend to just run in to a group of people with no escape after. So don't even bring up Game Arena to scout. Cause there were no damn scouts when Game Arena wasn't around. So i don't wanna hear that they're op or that their support. They are not support, they're suppose to be offensive. If you were a player from pre-evo or from back then you would know that scouts were actually USED TO KILL. Not to slow down enemies, and be dummies out there for distraction.

If they have to lower our dodge, let them lower it. a smart scout would know to keep his distance = which means he doesn't get hit as much as everyone would. As long as they get better ability to kill or atleast make damage. I'm not saying a ton of AP, or even a passive. Just something, a skill to use to atleast impact a group or make decent amount of damage. Not something that would finish them off right quick.

Edited by iBryan, 02 July 2012 - 09:29 AM.

@Feuer: "Lmfao! Yeah, anyone can play a scout, because there;s only 1 way to build it xD"
After this statement you should never comment on anything about Scouts.

@Feur: Anyone could play any class, but that doesn't mean they'll be useful or any good at it, if there was "One" way to build scout, then why do 90% of the scouts suck?

Quite simply put this debate will not end with a point being made and agreed upon.

Scouts need more variance in skill build. It's too linear and boring.
Some want more passives, others want AoE added, other say that both of those are stupid ideas [based on whatever personal/professional opinions they hold]

The facts remain.

"They're Linear, and do not offer any choices in skill selection"
They lack acc in a passive form, even passives at all.
They tank about as goood as their Raider brethren of the same stat build

- Duals add STR for AP on weapons, gives added DEF and HP, Xbow scout gets the same benefit + shield % to block, less AP then duals however.
- Katars add DEX for AP on weapons, gives added Dodge rate, Bow scouts will receive the same benefit, minus the attack speed passives.

Fix these verified issues the community has with the class, while maintaining a balance towards other classes, and the problem will be fixed.

1 skill build, ONE, SKILL, BUILD.

WAAAAAAAANNNNN SKEEEEEEELLLLLLLL BIIIIIIILLLLL-DUUUUUUUUUUHHHHHH

I don't speak Spanish