Patch Notes v498 - (3/25/14) Server Maintenance 2PM (-7 UTC) - Page 3 - Patch Notes Archive - WarpPortal Community Forums

Jump to content


Photo

Patch Notes v498 - (3/25/14) Server Maintenance 2PM (-7 UTC)


  • Please log in to reply
249 replies to this topic

#51 Leonis

Leonis

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Retired
  • 4096 posts
  • Playing:Metal Assault
  • Server:US Server 1

Posted 25 March 2014 - 01:53 PM

I appreciate everyone's viewpoint regarding the changes in balances.

 

If you want to provide further feedback after today's update, you will have the opportunity to as we continue to monitor game play and feedback.

 

I'm not going to get in to arguments or discussions based on just reading the patch notes. On top of that, any changes will need to go through a period of review. None of these changes were made without careful consideration to how it would impact game play and follow our intended design of class roles and play styles of those roles.


  • 0

#52 jerremy

jerremy

    Knight Representative

  • Members
  • 6045 posts
  • LocationYour closet.
  • Playing:ROSE Online
  • Server:Currently unknown

Posted 25 March 2014 - 01:53 PM

You say that as if champpower uses proper sources.

Anyway Phish' (or mine several posts ago) suggestion would have been good enough, drop radius or increase cooldown. Purifying one effect is not enough to be able to do much, should be at least 2 or 3.


  • 0

#53 Nifa

Nifa

    Artisan Representative

  • Members
  • 580 posts
  • Playing:Nothing

Posted 25 March 2014 - 01:59 PM

Sorry, I should have specified Charm build Offensive character***** not fs cleric. Although it could still be considered OP even for full cha clerics since you could get rid of their mute, mdef, def, ms, dodge debuffs all in one go, allowing them to run around and resume supporting their team with little incapacitation.

Well, I am unable to understand how you have little time for spamming puri (of any sort) since I find that the majority of the time in these recent CDs, we do nothing but toss the occasional heal around.
  • 0

#54 MidnightSmurf

MidnightSmurf

    Artisan Representative

  • Members
  • 1424 posts
  • Playing:ROSE Online
  • Server:Arua

Posted 25 March 2014 - 02:00 PM

Purify, take it step by step rather then nerfing it to hell right away. Could have decreased it from 5 to 3 and then decreased the ranged by 5m and made it to 5 sec cooldown rather then 8.  And see how it turned out before making further changes. Maybe it could be decreased to 2 from 3 if it proved to still be too good.

Further more on Clerics subject. In CD we see more often then not how one team don't have a cleric. Clerics have a difficult time healing their members due to the MASSIVE burst, as in duplicating themselves in numbers, of katar raiders who make healing even harder. Now with the MEGA nerf of purify it will surely be even harder. Along with Mutes from Sword champs that are now more common then ever in comparison to other weapon choices. A team without a cleric is a boring CD. A long discussion it has been and a longer one it will become. Good luck.

I do enjoy seing the slight nerf to Hawker aspd.
And most of the other changes were great, good job on those.

 

Edit: Looking forward to see the changes to the point system in CD, sounds promising!


Edited by MidnightSmurf, 25 March 2014 - 02:03 PM.

  • 2

#55 nions

nions

    I made it Off Topic

  • Members
  • 57 posts

Posted 25 March 2014 - 02:00 PM

sir, 

how long did the patch takes.


  • 0

#56 Leonis

Leonis

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Retired
  • 4096 posts
  • Playing:Metal Assault
  • Server:US Server 1

Posted 25 March 2014 - 02:05 PM

sir, 

how long did the patch takes.

The patch itself is now available.

 

The maintenance generally takes a couple hours to process and maintain the database information.

 

I see that we're at the 2 hour mark, based on past periods of maintenance we can expect perhaps another hour at least based on the amount of data that is being processed.


  • 0

#57 Leonis

Leonis

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Retired
  • 4096 posts
  • Playing:Metal Assault
  • Server:US Server 1

Posted 25 March 2014 - 02:10 PM

Purify, take it step by step rather then nerfing it to hell right away. Could have decreased it from 5 to 3 and then decreased the ranged by 5m and made it to 5 sec cooldown rather then 8.  And see how it turned out before making further changes. Maybe it could be decreased to 2 from 3 if it proved to still be too good.

Further more on Clerics subject. In CD we see more often then not how one team don't have a cleric. Clerics have a difficult time healing their members due to the MASSIVE burst, as in duplicating themselves in numbers, of katar raiders who make healing even harder. Now with the MEGA nerf of purify it will surely be even harder. Along with Mutes from Sword champs that are now more common then ever in comparison to other weapon choices. A team without a cleric is a boring CD. A long discussion it has been and a longer one it will become. Good luck.

I do enjoy seing the slight nerf to Hawker aspd.
And most of the other changes were great, good job on those.

 

Edit: Looking forward to see the changes to the point system in CD, sounds promising!

 

I understand what you mean, but going over the point, we went with this as a resolution. The ability to counter a debuff was really high on a per cast basis. Combined with the short cooldown, when faced against a Cleric or someone with a Cleric supporting, keeping a debuff to make any benefit on it was impossible, with the quick interjection of a single cast, all negative effects were gone.

 

The issue of the Wounded effect, purify doesn't attend to, only Cure, while combined with the Healing Touch, or Integrity, can clear a stack (or stacks) of Wounded. But that doesn't stop your ability to heal the target, just reduces. The longer you fight a Raider, the more potential Wounded stacks you will give.

 

Reading how some barely even use the skill, if that's the case, then you will not see such an issue unless you were relying on the fact that it cleared so many debuffs at a time, which was directly one of the points stated behind why it is being reduced in how many it will remove. As explained in the spoiler note, for its designed job, it was entirely overpowered, compared to its opposite, which is the application of debuffs.
 


  • 0

#58 nions

nions

    I made it Off Topic

  • Members
  • 57 posts

Posted 25 March 2014 - 02:16 PM

Thanks Leo :)


  • 0

#59 borgahutt

borgahutt

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Members
  • 1317 posts
  • Playing:ROSE Online

Posted 25 March 2014 - 02:27 PM

all i will do is test it and see what happens but no one would even bother to skill it if it simply gets rid of one debuff, that would be pointless.


  • 1

#60 MidnightSmurf

MidnightSmurf

    Artisan Representative

  • Members
  • 1424 posts
  • Playing:ROSE Online
  • Server:Arua

Posted 25 March 2014 - 02:30 PM

Purify discussion:
I agree it was overpowered but now it will most likely be underpowered. And considering how hard a time Clerics had keeping their group alive before this will certainly not make it easier. Classes has been buffed while the defences are not boosted as much wich has resolved in shorter fights across the board (in CD) in my experience that is. Hopfully you'll buff purify a bit if it proves to be necessary. It's an ongoing process as you said after all wich we all have to accept. We do appreciate the efforts being made. It's not as if you're working toward making us upset after all :D

Throwing Cure on 15ppl sounds challenging to me as it doesn't heal for much either and hence "wasting" some time :) I hope you understand what I mean by "wasting", I can't find the proper word atm. It's an awesome skill just hard to find the time to throw it as often as you might need to due to the fact there's often (slight exageration) 8 raiders in a group these days. People like to be able to hide and run due to the shorter fights and lack of clerics to heal, as said earlier. Now it was made harder yet for the Cleric even if I agree that it was very overpowered I cannot understand why it was nerfed to such an extent. It remains to be seen how it will affect gameplay but it doesn't look promising.
Integrity has a longer cooldown and the party one cost an immense amount of mana. But as I said, the reduction of the aspd is appreciated, didn't go unnoticed. They will still have well above 350% aspd in many if not most cases.


Off-Topic: the ability of spamming food in TG is tragic. It's like an own game of constantly clicking that goulash. Don't bother with cookie crushing :)


  • 0

#61 ChampPower

ChampPower

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Members
  • 2070 posts
  • Playing:Nothing

Posted 25 March 2014 - 02:33 PM

I understand what you mean, but going over the point, we went with this as a resolution. The ability to counter a debuff was really high on a per cast basis. Combined with the short cooldown, when faced against a Cleric or someone with a Cleric supporting, keeping a debuff to make any benefit on it was impossible, with the quick interjection of a single cast, all negative effects were gone.

The issue of the Wounded effect, purify doesn't attend to, only Cure, while combined with the Healing Touch, or Integrity, can clear a stack (or stacks) of Wounded. But that doesn't stop your ability to heal the target, just reduces. The longer you fight a Raider, the more potential Wounded stacks you will give.

Reading how some barely even use the skill, if that's the case, then you will not see such an issue unless you were relying on the fact that it cleared so many debuffs at a time, which was directly one of the points stated behind why it is being reduced in how many it will remove. As explained in the spoiler note, for its designed job, it was entirely overpowered, compared to its opposite, which is the application of debuffs.


I am agreeing with your point of view and why you think it that way. Rarely use does not mean we did not use it at all. You are right when saying that we were depending on the multiple debuffs effect. We did sneak the AoE here and there, when we had the time, to help keeping people alive. However, it did not make the job of keeping everyone alive easier than it was. With the reduce on the ability of the purify, from 5 debuff to 1 debuff, all you did is just increasing the difficulty level of keeping everyone alive (as if it was not difficult enough). In worst case of senerious, we may have to forgo that skill all together because it's usefulness for keeping people alive is minimal.
  • 2

#62 Bendersmom

Bendersmom

    Cleric Representative

  • Members
  • 2000 posts
  • LocationUSA
  • Playing:ROSE Online
  • Server:Leonis

Posted 25 March 2014 - 02:38 PM

I use Purify, the unique one, as much as I can in CD.  I wish more clerics, especially battle clerics, had it and used it.  It is the best skill for helping other clerics and other team members.  Mostly I use it to get rid of mutes and sleeps on people.  Unfortunately now, if I read it right, it will only get rid of one debuff.  That means that if the one you are using it on has say mdef down and mute, it is a 50/50 chance it will get rid of the mute?  To me that is nuts.  What good is it to get rid of sleep on another cleric, yet they will remain muted.  I can see making the unique purify take away maybe 3 debuffs since it is unique and people have paid money or worked hard to get the tome.  Then have the single target one only get rid of 1 debuff. 

 

Why massive changes at one shot?  That is so frustrating.  Why not make it 3 first and see if that makes a difference?  Then if it is not how you wanted it decrease it to 2, etc.  Why all or none.  At only one debuff it is not really worth the time of using it.  I can put the SP somewhere else then.  It is a skill I have always had on a FS cleric and I always use it.  And I spent the money on the unique purify due to the usefulness of being able to do a distance purify.  I do not use it to take away slow or def down on someone unless it is me and only if trying to run, I use it mostly for supporting against mutes and sleeps and stuns.....which I still say there are way too many of.  The stat debuffs go away pretty fast and are not usually disabling like the mutes, stuns and sleeps.


Edited by Bendersmom, 25 March 2014 - 02:42 PM.

  • 2

#63 Leonis

Leonis

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Retired
  • 4096 posts
  • Playing:Metal Assault
  • Server:US Server 1

Posted 25 March 2014 - 02:45 PM

Purify discussion:
I agree it was overpowered but now it will most likely be underpowered. And considering how hard a time Clerics had keeping their group alive before this will certainly not make it easier. Classes has been buffed while the defences are not boosted as much wich has resolved in shorter fights across the board (in CD) in my experience that is. Hopfully you'll buff purify a bit if it proves to be necessary. It's an ongoing process as you said after all wich we all have to accept. We do appreciate the efforts being made. It's not as if you're working toward making us upset after all :D

Throwing Cure on 15ppl sounds challenging to me as it doesn't heal for much either and hence "wasting" some time :) I hope you understand what I mean by "wasting", I can't find the proper word atm. It's an awesome skill just hard to find the time to throw it as often as you might need to due to the fact there's often (slight exageration) 8 raiders in a group these days. People like to be able to hide and run due to the shorter fights and lack of clerics to heal, as said earlier. Now it was made harder yet for the Cleric even if I agree that it was very overpowered I cannot understand why it was nerfed to such an extent. It remains to be seen how it will affect gameplay but it doesn't look promising.
Integrity has a longer cooldown and the party one cost an immense amount of mana. But as I said, the reduction of the aspd is appreciated, didn't go unnoticed. They will still have well above 350% aspd in many if not most cases.

Off-Topic: the ability of spamming food in TG is tragic. It's like an own game of constantly clicking that goulash. Don't bother with cookie crushing :)

No, we certainly are not trying to make anyone upset, however we do need to also keep some fairness to aspects of game play. It's really difficult for us to keep everything in consideration, because there are an infinite amount of setup, combinations and situations. A single factor can alter the end of a result, given enough time. It is entirely possible Purify can be given a further adjustment if felt necessary. The idea that you cast it between activities to remove a debuff, is kind of the point, that interruption is also a breaking point to decide is it worth removing, or should you keep on another course of action. But before, the cooldown was so short along with the effect being so powerful, it was just too easy to interject it without concern otherwise.

 

Cure on 15 people, could be pretty daunting, however that is, again, one of the aspects of consideration. Do you change tactics or continue the course, perhaps just wait for that right moment. Depending on who's applying the wounded stacks, it can be relatively slow or fast. Katar Raiders, with Screw Attack, can give a varying set of Wounded stacks (1~5 per skill use) while the Dual Raider's Circle Break can apply 2 stacks within its range of AoE.

 

Also, there's a benefit to using Cure as a pre-cast to a healing spell, which will make the following healing spells 25% stronger (assuming there were no Wounded stacks to clear) which I would say is a tip, to any support/healing Clerics out there, in case you haven't already found out that combo.

 

As for the 350% attack speed matter, roughly half of that is gear. So don't think it's all just the class, but it certainly did help put a bit more perspective balance within the class build design. :)

 

"Spamming food" is a bit misleading, because if you use a food before it finishes it's timed effect, you actually lose out on the amount of healing you will receive from it. It doesn't stack, it only restarts the timer. The amount it heals when consumed, per second, is set, based on the food itself.

 

 

I am agreeing with your point of view and why you think it that way. Rarely use does not mean we did not use it at all. You are right when saying that we were depending on the multiple debuffs effect. We did sneak the AoE here and there, when we had the time, to help keeping people alive. However, it did not make the job of keeping everyone alive easier than it was. With the reduce on the ability of the purify, from 5 debuff to 1 debuff, all you did is just increasing the difficulty level of keeping everyone alive (as if it was not difficult enough). In worst case of senerious, we may have to forgo that skill all together because it's usefulness for keeping people alive is minimal.

Purify has no healing ability, and debuffs don't kill. They just hinder. The idea that you perceive it as a necessary survival tool is a bit folly. A debuff alters the outcome of a battle, and depending on what buffs or debuffs you have, how many you have and what they affect. The intention is essentially that a debuff will negate a buff, if present. While if there is not one present, it will put the target in a disadvantage. Regardless, the point is, currently, no class is designed to debuff heavily, short of the Dual Raider and even then, they generally only apply one debuff at a time from a basic class design. The skill is still useful, it has just been tamed down, to still be a bit more on par with the rate of how debuffs are applied, but still given the edge overall. When facing multiple targets, a single Cleric will find it difficult to keep up with negating debuffs, if that is their decision of supportive strategy. Otherwise, you may still be able to alternate between the class and unique version, so you can alternate, as needed if that's the case. Prior the update, it didn't matter how many opponents would apply a debuff, a single cast would negate near everything that most would apply. That's the situation that's being looked at. The idea of teamwork overpowering others, when a single skill could negate that effort of teamwork effortlessly. Now, not so much the case.

 

 

I use Purify, the unique one, as much as I can in CD.  I wish more clerics, especially battle clerics, had it and used it.  It is the best skill for helping other clerics and other team members.  Mostly I use it to get rid of mutes and sleeps on people.  Unfortunately now, if I read it right, it will only get rid of one debuff.  That means that if the one you are using it on has say mdef down and mute, it is a 50/50 chance it will get rid of the mute?  To me that is nuts.  What good is it to get rid of sleep on another cleric, yet they will remain muted.  I can see making the unique purify take away maybe 3 debuffs since it is unique and people have paid money or worked hard to get the tome.  Then have the single target one only get rid of 1 debuff. 

 

Why massive changes at one shot?  That is so frustrating.  Why not make it 3 first and see if that makes a difference?  Then if it is not how you wanted it decrease it to 2, etc.  Why all or none.  At only one debuff it is not really worth the time of using it.  I can put the SP somewhere else then.  It is a skill I have always had on a FS cleric and I always use it.  And I spent the money on the unique purify due to the usefulness of being able to do a distance purify.  I do not use it to take away slow or def down on someone unless it is me and only if trying to run, I use it mostly for supporting against mutes and sleeps and stuns.....which I still say there are way too many of.  The stat debuffs go away pretty fast and are not usually disabling like the mutes, stuns and sleeps.

I believe much of what I've given in response above covers many of your points in why it was done and why it wasn't less.


  • 0

#64 jerremy

jerremy

    Knight Representative

  • Members
  • 6045 posts
  • LocationYour closet.
  • Playing:ROSE Online
  • Server:Currently unknown

Posted 25 March 2014 - 02:49 PM

As for the 350% attack speed matter, roughly half of that is gear. So don't think it's all just the class, but it certainly did help put a bit more perspective balance within the class build design. :)

To be more precise, half of that is passives, 30% (something along those lines, usually less, 25-30%) is buffs, and the remaining 20% is gear.


Edited by jerremy, 25 March 2014 - 02:50 PM.

  • 0

#65 iMatt

iMatt

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Members
  • 1539 posts
  • LocationMunich, Bavaria
  • Playing:ROSE Online
  • Server:Leonis

Posted 25 March 2014 - 02:49 PM

 


Purify

Spoiler

  • Level 1 Cooldown has been increased to 13.5 seconds, from 2 seconds.
  • Cooldown reduces by 2.5 seconds per skill level after, ending at 3.5 seconds when mastered (increased by 1.5 second, from previous 2 seconds)
  • The number of dispells has been reduced to 1 effect, for all levels, instead of its increasing value.

(Unique) Purify (AoE)

  • Cooldown has been increased to 8 seconds, from 2 seconds.
  • The number of dispells has been set to 1 effect.

(Unique) Integrity

  • Heal values are updated to match Integrity as intended.

 

So, the idea behind this is forcing clerics to focus more on just spamming heals?

 

Wasn't the correct use of purify on the right target something that seperated good clerics from random newbies?

 

I personally see no point in skilling/using purify anymore (which was SO IMPORTANT for example to rescue another cleric from a mute or someone from a clodsnap attack) if it just removes 1 debuff since every second offensive skill includes a debuff its like gambling....

 

Correct me if I am wrong but isn't the difference between a casual cleric and a good one, that good clerics don't spam heal blindly?

 

Is your intention of these changes that you want to make ROSE a noobparade where people just spam skills/heals etc.?

 

90% of the current clerics (at least on leonis) are already those kind of dumb "I set up my flares and spam heal while i run into 10 enemies that aoe"-kind of players - you want to make it even more casual by removing the last thing that made good clerics unique? 

 

KK GJ KEEP GOING
 


Edited by matthiashornauer, 25 March 2014 - 02:55 PM.

  • 3

#66 Bendersmom

Bendersmom

    Cleric Representative

  • Members
  • 2000 posts
  • LocationUSA
  • Playing:ROSE Online
  • Server:Leonis

Posted 25 March 2014 - 02:55 PM

""ClericEn help I am muted."

 

"Mom I purified you....now your mdef debuff is gone!"

 

"Yeah thanks, no worries, I am dead from the mute"  

 

That is how it is going to go...if anyone even keeps purify now.  

 

So now we have a bit of defense against mutes.  Good thing since the other clerics will not be able to help us with purify. But hey we will give it a shot.  If it doesn't work out we will complain on the forums.  So we get one thing and another big thing taken away again.  I don't get the extremes I guess.


Edited by Bendersmom, 25 March 2014 - 02:56 PM.

  • 6

#67 ChampPower

ChampPower

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Members
  • 2070 posts
  • Playing:Nothing

Posted 25 March 2014 - 03:05 PM

""ClericEn help I am muted."

"Mom I purified you....now your mdef debuff is gone!"

"Yeah thanks, no worries, I am dead from the mute"

That is how it is going to go...if anyone even keeps purify now.

So now we have a bit of defense against mutes. Good thing since the other clerics will not be able to help us with purify. But hey we will give it a shot. If it doesn't work out we will complain on the forums. So we get one thing and another big thing taken away again. I don't get the extremes I guess.


This would be extremely funny if it was not 100% correct

@leonis, if purify change the outcome of battle (as you said), why would it not help us survive? Your argument is flaw here, Leo.
  • 0

#68 iMatt

iMatt

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Members
  • 1539 posts
  • LocationMunich, Bavaria
  • Playing:ROSE Online
  • Server:Leonis

Posted 25 March 2014 - 03:10 PM

This would be extremely funny if it was not 100% correct

@leonis, if purify change the outcome of battle (as you said), why would it not help us survive? Your argument is flaw here, Leo.

 

actually its pretty simple:

 

- NOOBS don't see it when there is something that HAS to be purified

 

- NOOBS don't skill purify 'cause it gives no points

 

->Let's nerf purify so the NOOBS will win!

 

Heil Noobs! Noobs invasion since skillpatch August 2013!


  • 1

#69 justin8er

justin8er

    I am New.

  • Members
  • 1 posts
  • Playing:ROSE Online
  • Server:Leonis

Posted 25 March 2014 - 03:18 PM

Any idea on when we will be able to log on?


  • 0

#70 Leonis

Leonis

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Retired
  • 4096 posts
  • Playing:Metal Assault
  • Server:US Server 1

Posted 25 March 2014 - 03:33 PM

""ClericEn help I am muted."

 

"Mom I purified you....now your mdef debuff is gone!"

 

"Yeah thanks, no worries, I am dead from the mute"  

 

That is how it is going to go...if anyone even keeps purify now.  

 

So now we have a bit of defense against mutes.  Good thing since the other clerics will not be able to help us with purify. But hey we will give it a shot.  If it doesn't work out we will complain on the forums.  So we get one thing and another big thing taken away again.  I don't get the extremes I guess.

 

See how it plays out. We'll be watching too. We expect to hear feedback regarding it. The course of activity behind someone who's paying attention to a debuff to remove, vs just casting it, because "it's time" is one of the factors of attention. It's not impossible to have the skill be changed in the future, for now this is what was done in view of how debuff application to counter was currently viewed.

 

Your example of a situation is pretty well fed towards your dislike of the change. And I could give many questions behind the choices of strategy to pick purify over another supportive action to that person. So, let's try to put it in to a bit more of an objective look and see how it actually affects you, rather than creating situations that cater to a failure of support. :) I think the good Clerics will be able to step up to the change.


  • 0

#71 Leonis

Leonis

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Retired
  • 4096 posts
  • Playing:Metal Assault
  • Server:US Server 1

Posted 25 March 2014 - 03:34 PM

Servers are OPEN!


  • 0

#72 SpawN9999

SpawN9999

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 229 posts
  • Playing:Nothing

Posted 25 March 2014 - 03:38 PM

hey Leo, any chance of you and the GM team queuing up for a game or two on the Leonis server?


  • 0

#73 jerremy

jerremy

    Knight Representative

  • Members
  • 6045 posts
  • LocationYour closet.
  • Playing:ROSE Online
  • Server:Currently unknown

Posted 25 March 2014 - 03:39 PM

Why not both servers?


  • 0

#74 SpawN9999

SpawN9999

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 229 posts
  • Playing:Nothing

Posted 25 March 2014 - 03:44 PM

because his name is leonis

 

 

 

 

 

 

rofl, yeah both servers is ideal


  • 0

#75 Leonis

Leonis

    Too Legit To Quit

  • Retired
  • 4096 posts
  • Playing:Metal Assault
  • Server:US Server 1

Posted 25 March 2014 - 03:47 PM

I could join the queue, but I would be useless. My GM characters on the live servers are just visitors. :heh:  They're only there to help with questions and investigate reports usually. Most actual needs are met on our test server.


  • 0




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users