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I'd like to question the future of Rose Online & its current game development strategy


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#101 ChampPower

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Posted 02 October 2014 - 05:50 PM

exactly, thats the whole point.
In all the good games I know, it takes months on top of months (if not years) of grinding to get the best gear.


You did not take months on top of months of grinding to get the best gear. In fact, I boasted about how much IM you used to refine in other post. You cannot compete with other players in normal ground thus requesting the the unfair advantage wile other players only ask for a fair ground.

As for Leo, let's assume your refine test is correct because I still think you are very luck to success with a little more than 700 tries. Based on your test, to refine one time to (15), you have consumed all lisents U that market has. I am not sure how many people, in game, has 7 stacks of Lisent U in their inventory. By the same logic, a full set of armor would need 28 stacks of lisents . Another 21 stacks are need for weapon, back, and shield. The total is 51 stacks of Lisent U. Do you think we have that many Lisent U in both inventories and shops? And that is only for 1 set of EQ, per char, per account. If we look at the multiple set of EQs, multiple characters, multiple accounts, and multiple players, I do not see how we can live without without IM. The only exception to that is we have to accept less refined EQs, and we have to let the IM users drive over our non-IM users' heads. If that is the case, is the current system that you are talking about is the "Paid for convenient" system or the "Paid to win" system?
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#102 LexLoyalty

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Posted 02 October 2014 - 06:06 PM

You did not take months on top of months of grinding to get the best gear. In fact, I boasted about how much IM you used to refine in other post. You cannot compete with other players in normal ground thus requesting the the unfair advantage wile other players only ask for a fair ground.

As for Leo, let's assume your refine test is correct because I still think you are very luck to success with a little more than 700 tries. Based on your test, to refine one time to (15), you have consumed all lisents U that market has. I am not sure how many people, in game, has 7 stacks of Lisent U in their inventory. By the same logic, a full set of armor would need 28 stacks of lisents . Another 21 stacks are need for weapon, back, and shield. The total is 51 stacks of Lisent U. Do you think we have that many Lisent U in both inventories and shops? And that is only for 1 set of EQ, per char, per account. If we look at the multiple set of EQs, multiple characters, multiple accounts, and multiple players, I do not see how we can live without without IM. The only exception to that is we have to accept less refined EQs, and we have to let the IM users drive over our non-IM users' heads. If that is the case, is the current system that you are talking about is the "Paid for convenient" system or the "Paid to win" system?

 

once more , i grinded my glorious precious and chiva. Not denying of buying im pts for buffsets back then.


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#103 GooglyEyes

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Posted 02 October 2014 - 06:25 PM

I think we should leave the refine rates like this. Because now +15 equipment will become rarer and if you want to get yours to +15 you will have to farm lisents in order to do so. Before the update there were always the same groups doing the turak quest to get lisents, Now everyone who wants to save a bit of money will do the quest and farm their own lisents. More people doing the quests means more people actually playing the game instead of standing around junon and just talking.
This is promoting gameplay and a sense of accomplishment if you happen to reach the +15.


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#104 SlowBob

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Posted 02 October 2014 - 06:32 PM

I think we should leave the refine rates like this. Because now +15 equipment will become rarer and if you want to get yours to +15 you will have to farm lisents in order to do so. Before the update there were always the same groups doing the turak quest to get lisents, Now everyone who wants to save a bit of money will do the quest and farm their own lisents. More people doing the quests means more people actually playing the game instead of standing around junon and just talking.
This is promoting gameplay and a sense of accomplishment if you happen to reach the +15.

 

This is how it would work out if there wouldn't be the IM runes, this however isn't the case.

+15 equip won't become rare, people will simply buy more IM runes, that's pretty much the whole difference.


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#105 Phish

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Posted 02 October 2014 - 06:36 PM

Maybe instead of just straight up increasing the refine success, the Item mall to ingame refine can be brought closer together while still having the same total success.

 

  1. Increase the base success of refines by 5%.
  2. Increase the success of catalysts by 5% (for 10).
  3. Decrease success of Venurune by 5%.

 

Right now:

 

Going to refine 11 you have 10% base.

With Pink Powder: 20%

With Purple Powder: 25%

With Lisent Hg: 30%

With Lisent U: 35%

With Lisent U and 2 Venurunes: 55%

With Lisent U 2 Venurunes and 1 Nepturune: 60%

 

 

With the Proposed Change:

 

 

Going to refine 11 you have 15% base.

With Pink Powder: 30%

With Purple Powder: 35%

With Lisent Hg: 40%

With Lisent U: 45%

With Lisent U and 2 Venurunes: 55%

With Lisent U 2 Venurunes and 1 Nepturune: 60%

 

 

 

Same rate with full item mall, only now there is a more reasonable chance without using it, but not so high that you won't even need to use.

 

 

 

 

 


Edited by Phish, 02 October 2014 - 06:37 PM.

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#106 GooglyEyes

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Posted 02 October 2014 - 06:41 PM

This is how it would work out if there wouldn't be the IM runes, this however isn't the case.

+15 equip won't become rare, people will simply buy more IM runes, that's pretty much the whole difference.

In a different thread LexLoyalty said that it took him 1k Item Mall points to refine one item to +15. This is quite expensive given that there are 7 slots where items can be upgraded. So 7k item mall points just for 1 gear set. I dont think people here will spend all their money just on those runes. After a while those things will become rarer and rarer as well.


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#107 SlowBob

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Posted 02 October 2014 - 06:45 PM

In a different thread LexLoyalty said that it took him 1k Item Mall points to refine one item to +15. This is quite expensive given that there are 7 slots where items can be upgraded. So 7k item mall points just for 1 gear set. I dont think people here will spend all their money just on those runes. After a while those things will become rarer and rarer as well.

 

1k is rare, it depends on how you refine normaly you can use a way less. Anyways, people would even use twice as much IM points if they don't have to farm 7k lisents per item.

 

@Phish:

Why would you adapt all chatas if you could just lower the chance of a hand full of IM runes?


Edited by SlowBob, 02 October 2014 - 06:58 PM.

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#108 Phish

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Posted 02 October 2014 - 07:24 PM

I'm not sure what you mean.

 


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#109 LexLoyalty

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Posted 02 October 2014 - 08:10 PM

I think we should leave the refine rates like this. Because now +15 equipment will become rarer and if you want to get yours to +15 you will have to farm lisents in order to do so. Before the update there were always the same groups doing the turak quest to get lisents, Now everyone who wants to save a bit of money will do the quest and farm their own lisents. More people doing the quests means more people actually playing the game instead of standing around junon and just talking.
This is promoting gameplay and a sense of accomplishment if you happen to reach the +15.

 

exactly, also I suggested that maybe once a month , the refine rates will be boosted for 1 hour or 30 mins (or less) long.

 

Also make events such as : if the server reaches X number of crystal defenders matches played within a month, the players will benefit from better refining rate for a longer period of time. ( 1 hour instead of 30 mins, 60 success rate instead of 55% , etc). This will motivate players to participate in game arena aswell.


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#110 IAfjiBa

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Posted 02 October 2014 - 10:01 PM

I complete agree. 15+ on armor/weapons should be a challange. It should take time and it should be a bit hard to get 15, becuse its the higest refine you can ever do in Rose. 

 

exactly, also I suggested that maybe once a month , the refine rates will be boosted for 1 hour or 30 mins (or less) long.

 

Also make events such as : if the server reaches X number of crystal defenders matches played within a month, the players will benefit from better refining rate for a longer period of time. ( 1 hour instead of 30 mins, 60 success rate instead of 55% , etc). This will motivate players to participate in game arena aswell.

 

 

I love your idea Lex! :) Maybe a passives for crafter that increase your refine with 5% also? 

 

Maybe make it so if (This is just a exemple) 200 Crystal Defenders gets played all pvp armor/weapons gets a 5% boost in refine. 

But if (This is just a exemple) 200 Cave of Ulverick gets played all pvm armor/weapons gets a 5% boost in refine.?

 

The amount of games for dungeons or pvp games can be changed. I just took a exemple. :)


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#111 ChampPower

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Posted 02 October 2014 - 11:07 PM

I complete agree. 15+ on armor/weapons should be a challange. It should take time and it should be a bit hard to get 15, becuse its the higest refine you can ever do in Rose.



I love your idea Lex! :) Maybe a passives for crafter that increase your refine with 5% also?

Maybe make it so if (This is just a exemple) 200 Crystal Defenders gets played all pvp armor/weapons gets a 5% boost in refine.
But if (This is just a exemple) 200 Cave of Ulverick gets played all pvm armor/weapons gets a 5% boost in refine.?

The amount of games for dungeons or pvp games can be changed. I just took a exemple. :)

This idea will not work. How do you suggest players join war without gear? Do you think non-IM users would join war so the IM users would walk over them? The same can be said with dungeon. You guy talk about hard work, but all I am seeing is you, the IM users, take the easy way out. Do you want challenge? Do you want to test your skill? Do you want to keep the refine rate? fine. Please make the new EQs, and remove all IM refined materials, such as Plutorune, Venurune, and and Nepterune. Let's see how you would play without them.

Hard word and effort by using IM? Who are you try to kid? IM and effort do not mix with each other. period.

So either change back to the prior refine system or remove all IM from game. I am fine with both of them.

Edited by ChampPower, 02 October 2014 - 11:08 PM.

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#112 IAfjiBa

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Posted 02 October 2014 - 11:29 PM

This idea will not work. How do you suggest players join war without gear? Do you think non-IM users would join war so the IM users would walk over them? The same can be said with dungeon. You guy talk about hard work, but all I am seeing is you, the IM users, take the easy way out. Do you want challenge? Do you want to test your skill? Do you want to keep the refine rate? fine. Please make the new EQs, and remove all IM refined materials, such as Plutorune, Venurune, and and Nepterune. Let's see how you would play without them.

Hard word and effort by using IM? Who are you try to kid? IM and effort do not mix with each other. period.

So either change back to the prior refine system or remove all IM from game. I am fine with both of them.

 

Well everyone join cd at the begining with start gears.

 

Where do you get that'' I want Item mall users to run over un item mall users.''? I never said that and I don't want that. I want Item Mall to save time. Not to make players OP over other players.

 

I know it's hard. It's a challange. On my champ alt I have only the valor bonus to get more points. Otherwise he has crap gears. He was wrong jewlery I think for a champ. I die very fast inside dungeons. I know it's hard, so don't tell me that I don't know its hard, I know it's hard.

 

I hate to refine. I suck at it, but I still like this uppdate, that its harder to get to refine 15. Becuse I agree that 15 is the higest '' level '' and then it should be hard to get to that '' level'' on your armor/weapon. There is some IM items that need to be fixed so Item mall users dosen't get a advantage over players that dosen't buy Item mall. But Leonis knows that and he is working to fix it and I like that!


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#113 GooglyEyes

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Posted 02 October 2014 - 11:58 PM

This idea will not work. How do you suggest players join war without gear? Do you think non-IM users would join war so the IM users would walk over them? The same can be said with dungeon. You guy talk about hard work, but all I am seeing is you, the IM users, take the easy way out. Do you want challenge? Do you want to test your skill? Do you want to keep the refine rate? fine. Please make the new EQs, and remove all IM refined materials, such as Plutorune, Venurune, and and Nepterune. Let's see how you would play without them.

Hard word and effort by using IM? Who are you try to kid? IM and effort do not mix with each other. period.

So either change back to the prior refine system or remove all IM from game. I am fine with both of them.

Just a question. How are the Dev's going to get paid if all the IM is removed from the game? Are you gonna pay their checks? If not then dont make stupid comments like that.
You are asking how people can join wars without max refined gears? Press alt+g and join the queue for whichever pvp mode you want. My first cd matches i had legendary gears +5. Yes i got destroyed. Did it stop me from playing? Nope.
Every noob starts with bad gear and with time you get better and better gears. Same goes for dungeons.


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#114 CottonCandies

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Posted 03 October 2014 - 12:03 AM

Just a question. How are the Dev's going to get paid if all the IM is removed from the game? Are you gonna pay their checks? If not then dont make stupid comments like that.
You are asking how people can join wars without max refined gears? Press alt+g and join the queue for whichever pvp mode you want. My first cd matches i had legendary gears +5. Yes i got destroyed. Did it stop me from playing? Nope.
Every noob starts with bad gear and with time you get better and better gears. Same goes for dungeons.

somehow, I agree with this :D


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#115 WH0MP

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Posted 03 October 2014 - 12:31 AM

Even though I am constantly bashing the changes and additions to IM, i definitely agree it is a good thing. It's fun to purchase this stuff and I already spent more on this game than many other games in the few months I've played - I just really HATE being forced to buy IM to do something players could do without IM in the past.


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#116 ChampPower

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Posted 03 October 2014 - 02:20 AM

Just a question. How are the Dev's going to get paid if all the IM is removed from the game? Are you gonna pay their checks? If not then dont make stupid comments like that.
You are asking how people can join wars without max refined gears? Press alt+g and join the queue for whichever pvp mode you want. My first cd matches i had legendary gears +5. Yes i got destroyed. Did it stop me from playing? Nope.
Every noob starts with bad gear and with time you get better and better gears. Same goes for dungeons.

If you are worrying about it so much, you can donate your money to pay for their salaries. As for me, I do not care because I do not agree with anything they do, so let's worry about it after IM was taken out of the game. Some game subscription would be fine if the game is good enough. It is also a lot better than playing with the cheat function, called "Item Mall".
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#117 Gojio

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Posted 03 October 2014 - 03:33 AM

Just a question. How are the Dev's going to get paid if all the IM is removed from the game? Are you gonna pay their checks? If not then dont make stupid comments like that.
You are asking how people can join wars without max refined gears? Press alt+g and join the queue for whichever pvp mode you want. My first cd matches i had legendary gears +5. Yes i got destroyed. Did it stop me from playing? Nope.
Every noob starts with bad gear and with time you get better and better gears. Same goes for dungeons.

 

Go back to p2p.


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#118 GooglyEyes

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Posted 03 October 2014 - 03:52 AM

If you are worrying about it so much, you can donate your money to pay for their salaries. As for me, I do not care because I do not agree with anything they do, so let's worry about it after IM was taken out of the game. Some game subscription would be fine if the game is good enough. It is also a lot better than playing with the cheat function, called "Item Mall".

Why do you play this game if you dont agree with anything they do then ? Maybe you should quit and stop trolling people on here ?


Edited by GooglyEyes, 03 October 2014 - 03:54 AM.

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#119 Peteer

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Posted 03 October 2014 - 04:10 AM

I just created a 15, Blade of Saint Kruez. Yes, it took a lot of money, materials and time. But I made one, with no Item Mall influence at all. 714 refines. Only took 11 to get to 5. The rest of the 703 attempts, were done with LIsent U.

 

Yes, that means it took 7030 Lisent U + Talisman & Zulie, to get there. But obtaining that is what goes in to the effort you are saving by using the Item Mall. That is the convenience you are purchasing.

 

7030 lisent U * 2,000,000z (ive seen lisent U for 3,000,000) = 14,060,000,000 * 6 (*7 if shield included=98,420,000,000z) (Glove Boot Chest Head Weapon & Backshield)=84,360,000,000z Just for refining 1 battle set!!

 

I would like to challenge u to get this amount of zulie, within 1 or 2 years, starting from the bottom. no im.


Edited by Peteer, 03 October 2014 - 04:13 AM.

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#120 LexLoyalty

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Posted 03 October 2014 - 04:58 AM

This idea will not work. How do you suggest players join war without gear? Do you think non-IM users would join war so the IM users would walk over them? The same can be said with dungeon. You guy talk about hard work, but all I am seeing is you, the IM users, take the easy way out. Do you want challenge? Do you want to test your skill? Do you want to keep the refine rate? fine. Please make the new EQs, and remove all IM refined materials, such as Plutorune, Venurune, and and Nepterune. Let's see how you would play without them.

Hard word and effort by using IM? Who are you try to kid? IM and effort do not mix with each other. period.

So either change back to the prior refine system or remove all IM from game. I am fine with both of them.

 

you live in your own bubble , not feeling like wasting any energy arguing with close minded people.

Many many successful games work by this scheme and mister decided it wont work.. lol okayyy.

Also you putting ultimatums. Theres much greater solutions than the two in your ultimatum. What you going to do ? bombard rose players ?

What do you know about hard work lol anyway. I bet I work harder than you maybe except in rose because I'm not in the position to play allot so obviously i'm gonna purchase IM. 

 

Also, you don't need to have necessarily the best gear in the game today to be able to compete in rose. Boosters and Aruas create the biggest inbalance between the poor and the rich. I witnessed 2 players on aruas and boosters wipe 7-8 others that were buffed. If you are so righteous and fight for the weak,poor and new players why don't you say anything about aruas or boosters or help new players instead of arguing, complaining and being overall negative. 


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#121 lolmetimbers89

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Posted 03 October 2014 - 06:00 AM

Your example is perfectly ridiculous and proves how hard it is, no one would and will ever try refining ever again given your results lol. And let's say it, after you just gave away (15)s like cookies you can't just come up with the "heh but it's the best gear" excuse. If you want to introduce harder refining rates, that's fine, but do it with new gear, don't screw with the same gear and discriminate between those who refined it last week and those who are trying to refine it this week.

 

This just sums up the refine changes completely. Devs you dun goofed hard on this one. 


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#122 LexLoyalty

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Posted 03 October 2014 - 06:20 AM

This just sums up the refine changes completely. Devs you dun goofed hard on this one. 

 

If new gear will be introduced , it would be nice if there would be a retool option of the old gear to the new gear. ( lets say the retool option will require 30% less points to achieve the new gear, you get the idea). By doing so, players who farmed their sets will not feel like they completely wasted their time.


Edited by LexLoyalty, 03 October 2014 - 06:23 AM.

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#123 SlowBob

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Posted 03 October 2014 - 07:01 AM

Right now:
 
Going to refine 11 you have 10% base.
With Pink Powder: 20%
With Purple Powder: 25%
With Lisent Hg: 30%
With Lisent U: 35%
With Lisent U and 2 Venurunes: 55%
With Lisent U 2 Venurunes and 1 Nepturune: 60%
 
 
With the Proposed Change:
 
 
Going to refine 11 you have 15% base.
With Pink Powder: 30%
With Purple Powder: 35%
With Lisent Hg: 40%
With Lisent U: 45%
With Lisent U and 2 Venurunes: 55%
With Lisent U 2 Venurunes and 1 Nepturune: 60%


Why not that way?

Going to refine 11 you have 10% base.
With Pink Powder: 20%
With Purple Powder: 25%
With Lisent Hg: 30%
With Lisent U: 35%
With Lisent U and 2 Venurunes: 50%
With Lisent U 2 Venurunes and 1 Nepturune: 55%
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#124 Feuer

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Posted 03 October 2014 - 07:03 AM

If new gear will be introduced , it would be nice if there would be a retool option of the old gear to the new gear. ( lets say the retool option will require 30% less points to achieve the new gear, you get the idea). By doing so, players who farmed their sets will not feel like they completely wasted their time.

 

What? o.O can you explain this a bit more.. I don't think I'm reading it the same way you're intending it. 


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#125 LexLoyalty

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Posted 03 October 2014 - 07:08 AM

What? o.O can you explain this a bit more.. I don't think I'm reading it the same way you're intending it. 

 

Okay , lets say you already have a glorious set (15) or non refined. Now, you gonna give up your old glorious set for a 30% discount of the new gear. So if the price of the new released gear will be 10k honnor for you it will cost 7k.

So basically you are going to retool your old gear to the new gear.


Edited by LexLoyalty, 03 October 2014 - 07:11 AM.

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