36 replies to this topic

[magiccircle]

+12 Miraculous Turkey Hat (300HP, 12%HP/SP)
Miraculous Black Frame Glasses. (300HP, +1Int)
Umbala Spirit (+1% HP)
+9 Vit +3 Glorious Suit (+20% HP, 7% Demihuman Resisntance)
+12 EA5, EA5 Combat Knife +12 /EA5, EA5, Kingbird (Archer Skeleton) Ice Pick / +12 EA5, EA5 Grimtooth/ +10 Glorious Gladius and a Triple Kingbird (Archer Skeleton) Main Gauche of Infinity (Drake) in the offhand.
+9 Glorious Manteau (+5% HP, 5% Demihuman Resistance)
+9 Glorious Shoes (+10% HP, 4% Demihuman Resistance)
Carefree (Kafra Blossom) Chambered RWC2012 Ring (HP+600, Vit+3)
Megingard (+70STR, +7Mdef)

(Yes I invested all of this into my Kagerou. Ninja WAS my favorite class.)
120VIT
120STR

+10STR Foods
+10Vit Foods
+20 STR Foods
+20 VIT Foods
Increase HP Potion (Large)

Total HP 36330. (/Wrist)

No matter what combination I use. And I cant break 40k damage with Killing Strike against people with WoE Sets in PVP. This is not even WoE. (Freaking depressing.) Nothing works with this stupid class. Empty Shadow lies. Skill never makes people fail there skills. Shadow Tampering lies, it says its 11x11 when its really 3x3 and it doesn't even un-stealth chasers. Shadow Warrior's dumb, it goes away if they the person you cast it on switches weapons and has a really long cooldown for no reason. Cross Slash is pointless the Cross Wound status last about 3 seconds and the cooldown for the skill is 5 . Swirling petals is awful, it promotes all this "Bonus" damage and it doesn't even deliver. Glorious Shuriken and Valorous Humma Shuriken's double damage effects ARE STILL BROKEN. (Seriously its been like this since day 1 of renewal and still not fixed ~_~). Exploding Kunai, 16th Night and Rapid Throw are the only, ONLY good skills. Cast Ninja Spell lies. The description says you can get Deep Sleep status with the wind charm and Congeal status (whatever this is) from the water charm and it never does. Right and Left hand masteries are absolutely pointless. Using skills like cicada skin shed (the best skill ninjas have) is counter productive to auto attacking as it knocks you back every time a monster hits you.
Last but not least Exploding Dragon, Snow Flake Draft, and First Wind are absolutely awful. For the supposed High Tier spells. the modifiers they get from the charms don't even come close to the entry level magic skills you get. leaving you stuck single targeting monsters forever. Not to mention Daggers have the absolute worst magic attack ever. A warlock with +7 Kronos gets more magic than you can ever hope to dream about. Don't even get me started on PvP and woe with magic skills anyone with a Red Pom Band will probably take 0 damage from you.

Please ODA or somebody with some weight send this class back to KRO and yell at them for being retarded. Id rather have a 150 regular Ninja. I'd have more HP anyway. waste of freaking manuals I swear...

[Joshiji]

Really? I think the "lower tier" magic skills are the best (flaming petals, freezing spear, etc.) those are spammable and I was getting 40k with flaming petals on sakray with only 2 +10 mikatsuki (not even enchanted or carded) and a +10 tam. And that's SPAMMABLE not even a full second of delay. Freezing spear is even more spammable though less damage. And frost draft is a pretty good combo with freeze + 1st tier wind spell (I think it's wind blade). Also cast ninja spell could be useful in a precast. The class isn't OP or anything but can fight a 3rd job equally depending on the class and your build. Remember these are technically second job.

[GuardianTK]

Did you test to see if Soul Cutter is removing Soul Links from Chasers linked with Preserve up?

[matrixEXO]

+12 Miraculous Turkey Hat (300HP, 12%HP/SP)
Miraculous Black Frame Glasses. (300HP, +1Int)
Umbala Spirit (+1% HP)
+9 Vit +3 Glorious Suit (+20% HP, 7% Demihuman Resisntance)
+12 EA5, EA5 Combat Knife +12 /EA5, EA5, Kingbird (Archer Skeleton) Ice Pick / +12 EA5, EA5 Grimtooth/ +10 Glorious Gladius and a Triple Kingbird (Archer Skeleton) Main Gauche of Infinity (Drake) in the offhand.
+9 Glorious Manteau (+5% HP, 5% Demihuman Resistance)
+9 Glorious Shoes (+10% HP, 4% Demihuman Resistance)
Carefree (Kafra Blossom) Chambered RWC2012 Ring (HP+600, Vit+3)
Megingard (+70STR, +7Mdef)

(Yes I invested all of this into my Kagerou. Ninja WAS my favorite class.)
120VIT
120STR

+10STR Foods
+10Vit Foods
+20 STR Foods
+20 VIT Foods
Increase HP Potion (Large)

Total HP 36330. (/Wrist)

No matter what combination I use. And I cant break 40k damage with Killing Strike against people with WoE Sets in PVP. This is not even WoE. (Freaking depressing.) Nothing works with this stupid class. Empty Shadow lies. Skill never makes people fail there skills. Shadow Tampering lies, it says its 11x11 when its really 3x3 and it doesn't even un-stealth chasers. Shadow Warrior's dumb, it goes away if they the person you cast it on switches weapons and has a really long cooldown for no reason. Cross Slash is pointless the Cross Wound status last about 3 seconds and the cooldown for the skill is 5 . Swirling petals is awful, it promotes all this "Bonus" damage and it doesn't even deliver. Glorious Shuriken and Valorous Humma Shuriken's double damage effects ARE STILL BROKEN. (Seriously its been like this since day 1 of renewal and still not fixed ~_~). Exploding Kunai, 16th Night and Rapid Throw are the only, ONLY good skills. Cast Ninja Spell lies. The description says you can get Deep Sleep status with the wind charm and Congeal status (whatever this is) from the water charm and it never does. Right and Left hand masteries are absolutely pointless. Using skills like cicada skin shed (the best skill ninjas have) is counter productive to auto attacking as it knocks you back every time a monster hits you.
Last but not least Exploding Dragon, Snow Flake Draft, and First Wind are absolutely awful. For the supposed High Tier spells. the modifiers they get from the charms don't even come close to the entry level magic skills you get. leaving you stuck single targeting monsters forever. Not to mention Daggers have the absolute worst magic attack ever. A warlock with +7 Kronos gets more magic than you can ever hope to dream about. Don't even get me started on PvP and woe with magic skills anyone with a Red Pom Band will probably take 0 damage from you.

Please ODA or somebody with some weight send this class back to KRO and yell at them for being retarded. Id rather have a 150 regular Ninja. I'd have more HP anyway. waste of freaking manuals I swear...

Can't say about anything other than Cross Slash. It's designed to be a tag-team skill with 2 K/O mix. Thus the 3s duration and 5s cooldown. If you want to cast it within the 3s duration solo, I would believe that you need some items and cards to reduce cooldowns (not sure if any exists).

Edited by matrixEXO, 20 February 2013 - 12:21 PM.

[DrAzzy]

The DPS possible on insta/near insta ninja spamming the flaming petals is pretty impressive. You can spam it at your aspd, I think.

[TheSquishy]

Magiccircle, i think you need to reevaluate the way you built your character.

OP equips does not help you if you have built your character in an impractical way.

First of all Killing Strike has never been retooled for renewal mechanics. It was designed to KO trans characters, not 3rd class characters with 30-50k HP.

Next, you made the mistake of picking skills on what you thought they did...not on what they actually do.
This is why testing is vital before you commit to a build. You can drop people with your first tier ninja spells rather easily if you got full charms. For all the things you complain about, I've seen other people that with some ingenuity have gotten the result they wanted.

But understand, K/O are not a "mash these buttons to win" class.
You really got to think about what you are doing in a different way.

[gicko]

Yeah i also thought that K/O class will be so OP when they came out in kRO, but they do wonders on pvm/some mvp and can also kill 3rd job in a harder way. For me its better to be Throwing or magic type than KS type cuz i hate relying only in 1 skill. About the skill description, uhh yeah your right buddy they are so inaccurate.

[NerfChasers]

As if their magic skills will do great DPS vs people with good reductions...Only thing that will kill is Rapid Throw.

[gicko]

Yeah magic is too easy to counter than throwing cuz of the elemental charm floating around you but it can do great for non-shadow/holy monster/mvp or simply glass cannon classes.

[PedroProplayer]

Was the +10 Glorious Gladius the best damage weapon for Killing Stroke?

[magiccircle]

Magiccircle, i think you need to reevaluate the way you built your character.

OP equips does not help you if you have built your character in an impractical way.

First of all Killing Strike has never been retooled for renewal mechanics. It was designed to KO trans characters, not 3rd class characters with 30-50k HP.

Next, you made the mistake of picking skills on what you thought they did...not on what they actually do.
This is why testing is vital before you commit to a build. You can drop people with your first tier ninja spells rather easily if you got full charms. For all the things you complain about, I've seen other people that with some ingenuity have gotten the result they wanted.

But understand, K/O are not a "mash these buttons to win" class.
You really got to think about what you are doing in a different way.

First off. What about my build is impractical. the build is designed completely to maximize killing strike. Every class in the entire game does this. (See any class posted on irowiki.org.)

Killing strike was totally retooled for renewal mechanics. The change from Str*40 (pre renewal) to Atk*40, the additional damage from maintaining mirror image were all changes that came FROM RENEWAL. Before all the WoE sets and UBer reduction gears were released KS did a respectable amount of damage.
The ability for Kagerou to equip 2 weapons added to KS's usability even further by freeing your main hand of % Boosting weapons. Giving you the ability to modify the attack with your main hand more freely.

Secondly I think your underestimating the power of reduction currently available with magic. KB cards, Valk shields, Red Pom bands WoE sets, and the Sheer magic defense obtainable today totally neuters your magical output to almost laughable levels.1st daggers are not staves. Even if you can equip 2 of them. There not designed for magical damage. No dagger setup will ever compare with a Staff of destruction or Kronos in terms of magical output. 2nd the charm system is impractical. The benefit of playing a magic class is the ability to change elements freely at the cost of a cast time (current gears have threw this out the door though.) With fire charms only your fire tier spells get a boost, and you have to summon completely different charms on the fly just to boost the other ones. 3rd a first tier spell is a first tier spell. You could make a card that adds 500% more damage to Cold/Fire Bolt and it still would not surpass the potential of the higher tier magic spells that other magic classes have.

Testing? Do you really think I just made these gears with no knowledge of what

And I dont have ingenunity? Did you completely ignore the fact no that every single piece of gear equipped modifies the damage of killing stroke? Is maximizing my gears not enough to warrant the result I want? Is dedicating my complete stat build not enough to warrant the desired effect? This game only works on 3 parts man.
.
1. Formula.
2. Stat Augmentation.
3. Gear Augmentation.
.
Maximizing these 3 should warrant you the desired results with any skill you use. And it works that way with EVERY other class.

Lastly you say Kagerou/Oboro is not a mash button to win class. Yet you promote spamming 1st tier magic skills to beat people. ~_~

Edited by magiccircle, 20 February 2013 - 05:23 PM.

[magiccircle]

Was the +10 Glorious Gladius the best damage weapon for Killing Stroke?

Not even. The best was CK. Which is understandable as Killing Stroke does not ignore defense. All those massive +% to demihuman effects don't even work with Killing Stroke.

[magiccircle]

The DPS possible on insta/near insta ninja spamming the flaming petals is pretty impressive. You can spam it at your aspd, I think.

In PvM man. In PvM. Any averagely geared player wont take much from spamming flame pedals. Everybody at least owns a fire armor (or should as Dragon Breath is the most damaging thing you'll experience in WoE) Valk shields, Glorious Rings or KB accessories. Yea you can spam flame pedals on someone, but if it only does 1 damage whats the point. (Is what im trying to say)

[Kadelia]

+12 Miraculous Turkey Hat (300HP, 12%HP/SP)
Miraculous Black Frame Glasses. (300HP, +1Int)
Umbala Spirit (+1% HP)
+9 Vit +3 Glorious Suit (+20% HP, 7% Demihuman Resisntance)
+12 EA5, EA5 Combat Knife +12 /EA5, EA5, Kingbird (Archer Skeleton) Ice Pick / +12 EA5, EA5 Grimtooth/ +10 Glorious Gladius and a Triple Kingbird (Archer Skeleton) Main Gauche of Infinity (Drake) in the offhand.
+9 Glorious Manteau (+5% HP, 5% Demihuman Resistance)
+9 Glorious Shoes (+10% HP, 4% Demihuman Resistance)
Carefree (Kafra Blossom) Chambered RWC2012 Ring (HP+600, Vit+3)
Megingard (+70STR, +7Mdef)

(Yes I invested all of this into my Kagerou. Ninja WAS my favorite class.)
120VIT
120STR

+10STR Foods
+10Vit Foods
+20 STR Foods
+20 VIT Foods
Increase HP Potion (Large)

Total HP 36330. (/Wrist)

No matter what combination I use. And I cant break 40k damage with Killing Strike against people with WoE Sets in PVP. This is not even WoE. (Freaking depressing.)

I am pretty sure I told you this before you finished investing and you flipped me the middle finger.

Here are the magic words: I told you so.

Edited by Jaye, 20 February 2013 - 07:34 PM.

[PedroProplayer]

Not even. The best was CK. Which is understandable as Killing Stroke does not ignore defense. All those massive +% to demihuman effects don't even work with Killing Stroke.

That doesn't make sense. +% to demihumans should work for Killing Stroke.

My starting idea for Kagerou was that using a +10 Glorious Gladius on the main Hand, with either a CK or an AS Ice Pick[1] on the off hand would give optimal damage. I'd use CK for low def targets, and pick for high def targets9I could test which was better using a Kunai befor using the Stroke).

If what you're saying is true it might be possible to make Kagerous into the ultimate PvP class. They can't 1 hit KO people, but using a combination of attacks and ending with a Final Stroke might be possible.

Also, to make sure I got it right: the best damage you got was using the CK on the Main hand? I think it would do a better job on the off hand since all of its effect are applied to the right hand side. Well, obviously you did this because you wanted to keep the Drake on since the -25% nerf on medium sized is the biggest problem.

If you tried to use a +12 grimtooth with 8EA on the main, with a CK on the off hand and using Weapon Perfect to get Drake effect, how would ti go?

Edited by PedroProplayer, 20 February 2013 - 07:52 PM.

[ilovemilk]

Sometimes I wonder how much money people spend to achieve their goals? (this is just me pondering)... Anyway you have to keep this in mind that most people in PVP wear +9 GR/DR WOE set. Don't expect to one shot people even though you have superb gears. The people you are fighting may have invested just as much as you have into their gears. PVP is for scrubs anyway. Burning money/zenies/supplies just to make a statement is dumb.

[magiccircle]

^ Well against GR users I use the elemental charms/Frost driver hat to forcefully change the element. Since they can most likely freeze and stone curse. It's not like I didn't plan against the weaknesses of Killing Strike nor did I not estimate the weight of other more well geared players. For some people (myself included) PvM is not important, quests and leveling and even MvPing in some cases were never the things that drew me into the game. It in fact was RO PvP/WoE so to us it's not really burning money/zeny/supplies because that's what we play the game for in the first place.

[Viri]

PvP is the best part of RO O_o. Wasting supplies on pvm/mvping is dumb imo lol

[Kadelia]

PvP is the best part of RO O_o. Wasting supplies on pvm/mvping is dumb imo lol

PVP is a crummy 1 hit fest and WoE is crappy too it revolves around 3 skills; stasis, dragon's breath, and suicidal destruction.

[magiccircle]

That doesn't make sense. +% to demihumans should work for Killing Stroke.

My starting idea for Kagerou was that using a +10 Glorious Gladius on the main Hand, with either a CK or an AS Ice Pick[1] on the off hand would give optimal damage. I'd use CK for low def targets, and pick for high def targets9I could test which was better using a Kunai befor using the Stroke).

If what you're saying is true it might be possible to make Kagerous into the ultimate PvP class. They can't 1 hit KO people, but using a combination of attacks and ending with a Final Stroke might be possible.

Also, to make sure I got it right: the best damage you got was using the CK on the Main hand? I think it would do a better job on the off hand since all of its effect are applied to the right hand side. Well, obviously you did this because you wanted to keep the Drake on since the -25% nerf on medium sized is the biggest problem.

If you tried to use a +12 grimtooth with 8EA on the main, with a CK on the off hand and using Weapon Perfect to get Drake effect, how would ti go?

For some reason, Wanky effects like Ice Pick are not working in the offhand.

[magiccircle]

PVP is a crummy 1 hit fest and WoE is crappy too it revolves around 3 skills; stasis, dragon's breath, and suicidal destruction.

yea thats why im complaining about kagerou, Killing strike should be in that list.

[Kadelia]

For some reason, Wanky effects like Ice Pick are not working in the offhand.

Have you tested a 80 atk effectless dagger (such as an npc Cowardice Blade) in the main hand (no offhand weapon) and then tried again with just the icepick as main hand to verify that icepick works at all with killing stroke as opposed to blaming it on left hand mechanics?

[waka]

Here 's hoping there will be ninja Mora gear that buff's skills .. heck, maybe the ninja gear enchanter could get an updated likst for EA 1-3, Spell 1-3, or FS 1-3

[Kadelia]

Here 's hoping there will be ninja Mora gear that buff's skills .. heck, maybe the ninja gear enchanter could get an updated likst for EA 1-3, Spell 1-3, or FS 1-3

Nobody except ninja fanboys hope for that. Its an expanded class that is easier to make than the core classes and makes WoE harder to balance with more classes. It is a lower tier of uselefulness, where it belongs.

[Viri]

It's about 4 hours different, the easier to make argument is kinda moot now that 1-99 high/trans takes about 4 hours lol