Full Battle Priest Guide ver: 1.2.1! Now with (correct) DPS Calcs~! - Acolyte - WarpPortal Community Forums

Jump to content


Photo

Full Battle Priest Guide ver: 1.2.1! Now with (correct) DPS Calcs~!


  • Please log in to reply
40 replies to this topic

#1 ExeltusPendragon

ExeltusPendragon

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 387 posts
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2
  • Server:Odin

Posted 13 April 2013 - 06:10 AM

This thread is for all those people out there who don't particularly care for healing and wish to be the best dang DPS Priests ever! I fully understand going into this thread that most people think a Priest should heal, and that DPS Priests aren't as good as pure DPS classes. While the latter is true it doesn't mean we still can't min/max the heck out of out game!

I'm a long time WoW Shadow Priest player here looking to do some theorycrafting! From what I've seen and played skill-wise both the Shadow Priest and DPS Priest are set up very similarly, which means that DPS priests have a crazy amount of potential. The following guide-like thing is based on my experiences in seaRO2, and everything is subject to change in iRO2.

Pros & Cons of DPS and Hybrid
Spoiler


Skill & Stat Builds
Spoiler


Priest Skills Breakdown
Spoiler


Skill build
Spoiler



PVE
Spoiler



PVP
Spoiler



Battle Priest DPS calc
Spoiler


Guide Version History
Spoiler

Edited by ExeltusPendragon, 25 May 2013 - 02:57 AM.

  • 1

#2 Setsuna06

Setsuna06

    I made it Off Topic

  • Members
  • 15 posts
  • LocationNicaragua( Centroamérica)
  • Playing:Nothing

Posted 13 April 2013 - 06:30 PM

ty for the guide, usually a support priest, nothing lasts against monsters of the same level
  • 0

#3 ExeltusPendragon

ExeltusPendragon

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 387 posts
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2
  • Server:Odin

Posted 15 April 2013 - 01:01 PM

Currently working on some PVP stuff, though I don't have any experience in RO2 PVP. Adding it to the main post!

ty for the guide, usually a support priest, nothing lasts against monsters of the same level


Happy you liked it :3
  • 0

#4 synesthetic

synesthetic

    Awarded #1 Troll

  • Members
  • 557 posts
  • Playing:Nothing

Posted 15 April 2013 - 04:26 PM

Also I was wondering if anyone knows how useful, if at all, Recovery is in PVP? It could be another free skill point if it's useless!

I don't PVP, but I haven't heard anyone give any props to either Recovery or Sorc's Soul Cleanse for PVP.
I can't think of any reason why they would help either.

Status debuffs from players include DoTs (poison, bleed, burn), slow, immobility, freeze, and stun/knockdown.
Despite what the skill description says, Recovery doesn't cure all negative status effects. It's known to cure immobility, freeze, and morph. DoTs hurt, but even if you could cure them, all of the classes that have DoTs would just reapply them shortly after. Immobility can be an issue against some classes, but they're generally pretty short, I think. Ranger's Ankle Snare isn't even a problem because you'd have to somehow be blind and walk right onto their trap. And obviously, if you're stunned/down, you wouldn't be able to try curing yourself, even if the spell could cure it.
At best, maybe you could get yourself out of Frost Diver's or Nova's freeze so you can take less damage from lightning. But if you're up against a Sorc, it probably doesn't matter anyway against their Varetyr Spear.

I don't think anyone's done an extensive test on what Recovery and Soul Cleanse can remove, and publicized their results. In English, at least. So maybe there's more to the skill that we don't know yet?
  • 0

#5 Rumm

Rumm

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 167 posts

Posted 15 April 2013 - 06:29 PM

Thanks for the guide, I've been considering DPS priest because they're similar to DPS sorc (that is, dps with a dash of support). Sooo I've been wondering about GenRay. I've heard it has a long animation, so that casting + animation = 6 seconds. Is this true wouldn't that make holy light spam yield the same or higher dps? If so it seems for pvm or pvp I'd be better off dropping it for something else (some levels of High heal maybe :>?). Granted...for a PvP build it would be less bursty to use holy lights...but man having HH could really help out (assuming I kept arch angel).

*random note; this game really needs 2 skill tree's that we can toggle between like what other mmo's have.
  • 1

#6 ExeltusPendragon

ExeltusPendragon

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 387 posts
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2
  • Server:Odin

Posted 16 April 2013 - 03:23 PM

I don't think anyone's done an extensive test on what Recovery and Soul Cleanse can remove, and publicized their results. In English, at least. So maybe there's more to the skill that we don't know yet?

That's generally what I've heard, no one talks about it. I know it's limited as is, so realistically it'll be pretty useless in PVP. I'll have to do some testing once release hits. If it IS useless I'd probably use the extra skill point to bump Asumptio to 4 points for 32% reduction.

Thanks for the guide, I've been considering DPS priest because they're similar to DPS sorc (that is, dps with a dash of support). Sooo I've been wondering about GenRay. I've heard it has a long animation, so that casting + animation = 6 seconds. Is this true wouldn't that make holy light spam yield the same or higher dps? If so it seems for pvm or pvp I'd be better off dropping it for something else (some levels of High heal maybe :>?). Granted...for a PvP build it would be less bursty to use holy lights...but man having HH could really help out (assuming I kept arch angel).

*random note; this game really needs 2 skill tree's that we can toggle between like what other mmo's have.


Yeah, GenRay from casting to end of animation works out to around 6 seconds. Thats 6 seconds where you pretty much can't move or do anything. If you're going the hybrid support route 6 seconds is a LONG time to not be able to heal. Even if you used Aspertio thats 1 second GCD for Asp, then 4 seconds of casting animation. Still risky.

GenRay, imo, is best used for a quick burst, Something to finish off an almost dead opponent in PVP. There's two big parts to PVP, burst damage and survivability. While ArchAngel IS great, I think the points are better spent on support/survivability, which the pure DPS build lacks. Of course you wont be really healing a party with this stuff, but having HH, Colu and Asumptio as options is far more valuable than 25% throughput increase imo.
  • 0

#7 Rumm

Rumm

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 167 posts

Posted 16 April 2013 - 06:07 PM

Awesome. What about this pvp build then? http://ro2base.com/b...1.1.3/0.0.0.0.0
The goal would mainly be if I get the jump on someone, stun them with aspersio judex, dot them up, and restun them 2 more times with judex to finish with holy light or GenRay (if i drop Assum for GenRay). If someone gets the jump on me, I could still do aspersio judex to stun them, then asperio high heal, then dots and judex again.

Actually...looking at Judex...an instant ranged (this is ranged right?) aoe stun for 3 aspersio charges? Isn't that pretty great for woe/pvp?

Edited by Rumm, 16 April 2013 - 06:26 PM.

  • 0

#8 feed3r

feed3r

    I made it Off Topic

  • Members
  • 24 posts

Posted 16 April 2013 - 09:25 PM

Have played both pure DPS and Hybrid priest and I would like to offer some clarifications on certain items on this thread :-

1. You can move during the animation of Genesis Ray (the part where you are up on the air), so you are only immobile for the casting time.

2. Holy Light lvl 5 x3 will deal more damage than level 5 Genesis Ray most of the time, but you'll have to deal with the 1s casting time 3 times and the fact that your target may move out of skill range by that time (PVP). This is also one of the core benefits of using Aspersio+Genesis Ray instead of Holy Light in PVP Colosseum.

3. The strongest DOT is actually Credo for 2 reasons - it lasts 30 seconds and it has a 25m range (vs 20 seconds + 20m range for others), range is once again a crucial point in PVP.

4. Recovery is quite a bad skill namely because its an area target skill and if there's more than one person in the area there's a chance that the person that doesn't need recovery will get it, even maxing it doesn't allow you to recover a full raid group (typically 6-8 people standing together).

5. Judex is ranged, instant and very powerful when used as a stun for up to 3 targets in an area - but you pay the cost of using aspersio.

Pros & Cons of DPS and Hybrid

Full DPS
+ Extremely easy to level
+ Packs a punch in PVP Colosseum (easy to farm PVP eq)
+ Good for farming stuff
- Pretty much unwanted in Raids, because
- Skills do not scale well with Critical (only Holy Light and Genesis does)
- Priest EQ have virtually no AGI = low Critical
- Late Game (COA onwards), the difference in dps is very apparent as rangers and casters can go above 40% crit rate while you're stuck at 20% range.

Hybrid
+ Decent Leveling Speed
+ Can still do well in PVP but requires a lot more skill especially with timing last hits
+ Can fit a unique role of being flexible to switch between damage and support in raids
- Mostly unwanted in RHM (upon hitting 50, you can only farm blue eq in party of 5 and people usually need a FS for that)
- Takes a lot of good judgement on which skills to use at any time, mainly the dilemma to use aspersio for damage or healing.
- Generally still suffers the same dps scale problem though you're still useful in providing buffs, heals, assumptio and help with some damage - just don't claim to be a pure dps :)

One big advantage for both is you can/should farm your epic equipment from PVP Colosseum, thus FS priests would feel less apprehensive with having to compete with another priest for raid gears. However you have to accept that in the much higher levels your DPS will be nowhere compared to the other DPS classes which scales well with crit.
  • 0

#9 Fold

Fold

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 283 posts
  • LocationPallet Town
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2
  • Server:Odin

Posted 17 April 2013 - 01:25 PM

- Late Game (COA onwards), the difference in dps is very apparent as rangers and casters can go above 40% crit rate while you're stuck at 20% range.



I feel like you're overestimating the value of crit for DPS priests.

It's a dot-based class, and dots do not crit in this game. However, you can pump out enormous amounts of single-target damage from dots alone. Assuming full bapho N gear with int runes and weapon, a player could have around 2000+ magic power fully buffed.

Add Archangel to that: 2500 Magic power during Archangel for 30 seconds with a 90 second cooldown. Assuming you're fighting a boss with a 7 minute enrage timer (Common in hardmodes), you can maintain 2500 MP for 2 minutes out of the 7, not even counting the buffed dots after Archangel fades.

Average Oratio during Archangel: 300 every 2 seconds (2500 * .12)

Average Credo during Archangel: 350 every 2 seconds (2500 * .14)

Average Adoramus during Archangel: 375 every 2 seconds (2500 * .15)

Average DoT damage every 2 seconds: 1025, or 512.5 DPS.

That isn't bad at all considering:
1. That is just from dots alone.
2. It is in bapho N and pve N gear.
3. You are capable of throwing 3 dots up on any target.

Adding Genesis Ray and Holy Light would add much more single-target DPS on to that:
Aspersio + Holy Light is 39% MP with a 1 sec cast time, however we factor in Aspersio which doubles the damage to 78%: (2000 * .78) = 1560 average HL crits. With AA: (2500 *.78) = 1950 crits. Factor in some lag and animation delay and it is about ~2 seconds per holy light. This equals 780 DPS HL DPS and 975 AA-buffed HL DPS.

TLDR: It CAN compete with some of the best DPS classes in this game, and there is some mathematical evidence (hopefully not erroneous!) to prove it.

Forgive me if my math is wrong, napkin math is pretty challenging yo.

Edited by Fold, 17 April 2013 - 02:04 PM.

  • 1

#10 feed3r

feed3r

    I made it Off Topic

  • Members
  • 24 posts

Posted 17 April 2013 - 03:59 PM

Understand your calculations though Bapho N gear is nowhere near late game yet :)

Lets work with the damage percentages as the game is pretty straightforward in that. Max Credo, Oratio and Adoramus gives you 615% MATK damage over 30 seconds (assuming you recast oratio and adoramus somewhere in between)

A sorceress with late game gear would have much higher MATK than a priest with similar gear, eg full PVP gear sorc will have about 3k MATK while full PVP priest 2.5k unbuffed. Once again for simplicity, lets calculate in Archangel and they both have the same MATK all the time.

In a 30 second window, lets throw in 9 critical holy lights and 2 Genesis Rays (very generous considered the casting times) with the DOT - 702% + 278% + 615% = 1595% MATK

A sorceress that does cast nothing but Cold Bolt can throw about 60 of them in 30 seconds (0.5 base casting time - less if you include Haste bonus from EQ and Wind Seal) - at 38% MATK each = 2280% MATK in 30 seconds, and this is just raw cold bolt not including
Crits (40%+ chance of double damage)
Varetyr Spear (up to 320% if it Crits)
Instant cast JT (up to 256% if it crits)
Aqua (30 seconds of additional cold bolts and it can crit as well)

So a very hardworking DPS priest can barely keep up with a sorc that just presses 1 button repeatedly, but is completely blown away when other skills are thrown into the mix. Basically at this point crits play a major role in boosting damage and even if the priest has 100% crit, the only damage that goes up is its Genesis Ray which is a once per 15-20s boost.

This is not to say priest DPS is bad, its very decent just nowhere near great. In a typical 3mil HP boss battle, you'll can usually find Rangers, Wizards and DPS Sorcs hitting 500-600k threat while hybrid priests at about 200-300k depending on their damage skill usage, still decent to kill the boss before enrage. But the priest is pure DPS and has no supporting value, then comparing apples to apples the priest is the less preferred choice.
  • 1

#11 synesthetic

synesthetic

    Awarded #1 Troll

  • Members
  • 557 posts
  • Playing:Nothing

Posted 17 April 2013 - 04:59 PM

Understand your calculations though Bapho N gear is nowhere near late game yet :)

Lets work with the damage percentages as the game is pretty straightforward in that. Max Credo, Oratio and Adoramus gives you 615% MATK damage over 30 seconds (assuming you recast oratio and adoramus somewhere in between)

A sorceress with late game gear would have much higher MATK than a priest with similar gear, eg full PVP gear sorc will have about 3k MATK while full PVP priest 2.5k unbuffed. Once again for simplicity, lets calculate in Archangel and they both have the same MATK all the time.

In a 30 second window, lets throw in 9 critical holy lights and 2 Genesis Rays (very generous considered the casting times) with the DOT - 702% + 278% + 615% = 1595% MATK

A sorceress that does cast nothing but Cold Bolt can throw about 60 of them in 30 seconds (0.5 base casting time - less if you include Haste bonus from EQ and Wind Seal) - at 38% MATK each = 2280% MATK in 30 seconds, and this is just raw cold bolt not including
Crits (40%+ chance of double damage)
Varetyr Spear (up to 320% if it Crits)
Instant cast JT (up to 256% if it crits)
Aqua (30 seconds of additional cold bolts and it can crit as well)

So a very hardworking DPS priest can barely keep up with a sorc that just presses 1 button repeatedly, but is completely blown away when other skills are thrown into the mix. Basically at this point crits play a major role in boosting damage and even if the priest has 100% crit, the only damage that goes up is its Genesis Ray which is a once per 15-20s boost.

This is not to say priest DPS is bad, its very decent just nowhere near great. In a typical 3mil HP boss battle, you'll can usually find Rangers, Wizards and DPS Sorcs hitting 500-600k threat while hybrid priests at about 200-300k depending on their damage skill usage, still decent to kill the boss before enrage. But the priest is pure DPS and has no supporting value, then comparing apples to apples the priest is the less preferred choice.

I like the analysis, but just to put times into a little clearer perspective (although it doesn't change the end result)..

Due to casting animation/delay, Cold Bolt is closer to 1-sec. It's more realistic to say you could fit 40 casts into 30 seconds. And Lv.5 CB has 37% matk. So over 30 seconds, you'd have more like 1480% matk from spamming CB alone, without crits.
Including the 40% crit rate, then you'd have an average of 2072% matk.

Similarly, priest is more likely to get only 6 crit HLs in. Out of 30 seconds, 3 would be spent refreshing the 2 20-sec DoTs, 12 on Ray, and 2 on Asp. That leaves 13 seconds for HLs, which is only enough time left to fit in about 6, all of which would then be crit with the 2 Asps.
And forgot how much crit a priest can get by endgame. 20%? 30%? I'll just roll with 25%. The average damage from Ray would then be roughly 347%.
So 468% contribution from HL, + 347% + 615% dropping the hypothetical total to 1430%.
  • 0

#12 Fold

Fold

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 283 posts
  • LocationPallet Town
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2
  • Server:Odin

Posted 17 April 2013 - 08:05 PM

Bapho is still considered endgame, it is just a different tier than CoA/AoD. I just used Bapho N because I think 2k MP is a reasonable amount of matk for a priest with that level of gear. I am not too sure about the matk of a full CoA or AoD priest. If it was around 3000, they would yield an even greater benefit from AA, reaching around 3750 matk in a 30 second timeframe. compared to 2500 with 2000 matk.

I agree with sorcs being better than priests, but there's a few points I'd like to address that confuse me:

I don't understand how a sorc has more matk than a priest. They do not have a passive which boosts their matk, so if they were given the same gear and cards, they would most likely have the same matk.

Even though percentages are accurate, it does not factor the actual matk of the player. For instance:

A priest and sorc both have 2k matk in Bapho N gear. The sorc has 30% crit. however when the priest pops AA, he reaches 2500 matk.
I'll use the examples that syn gave, except the sorc will probably put out 1924% matk on average with 30% crit.
Sorc: 1924% matk would yield 1282.6 DPS over the course of 30 seconds with 2000 matk.
Priest: 1430% matk would yield 1191.6 DPS over the course of 30 seconds with 2500 matk.

Even though this is in a 30 second timeframe where AA is active, the DPS is not too far behind the sorc's. Keep in mind dots can extend the 30 second AA window if you reapply before AA fades. You can realistically keep an AA-empowered Credo up for an entire minute, while keeping an AA-empowered Adoramus and Oratio up for 50 seconds.

So yeah, sorcs definately are better than priests outside of AA, but I don't think it's by a mile. I still believe a priest could outperform a sorc if it's a multi target fight.

Edited by Fold, 17 April 2013 - 08:27 PM.

  • 0

#13 feed3r

feed3r

    I made it Off Topic

  • Members
  • 24 posts

Posted 17 April 2013 - 09:45 PM

Thanks for the realistic corrections :)

The MATK difference is due to the equipment bonuses for different classes, for example a sorc AOD weapon starts at about 850 MATK while a priest one starts at 700, where the difference will be further amplified after refinement. I think the actual % difference is a small matter since the crux of the issue is the scalability with critical.

The comparison is just comparing a sorc that mindlessly spams cold bolt (not exactly the best rotation), while in reality the boost damage comes from the crit spears and JTs that gets double damage and instant cast buffs as a result from spamming cold bolt.

The calculation would probably favor priest in multi target fights, but so far very few bosses come in 2 or more numbers so maybe in the future this will become a better plus point for priests.
  • 0

#14 Fold

Fold

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 283 posts
  • LocationPallet Town
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2
  • Server:Odin

Posted 17 April 2013 - 11:26 PM

Yeah, the only fight i've seen that actually favors multidotting is vadon twins. It also kinda sucks how priests get the short end of the stick in terms of matk when they don't even get alot of agi on their weapon in the first place

Honestly I wish dots would crit in this game, it would be a pretty nice DPS boost for priests. With 20% crit alone it would bump 615% matk dots to 738% on average
  • 0

#15 ExeltusPendragon

ExeltusPendragon

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 387 posts
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2
  • Server:Odin

Posted 18 April 2013 - 03:00 AM

Awesome armchair math And info guys! I'll be working on updating the guide this weekend (both content and formatting, since I know she's a little rough) and will be using what info given here that I can.

Yeah, the only fight i've seen that actually favors multidotting is vadon twins. It also kinda sucks how priests get the short end of the stick in terms of matk when they don't even get alot of agi on their weapon in the first place

Honestly I wish dots would crit in this game, it would be a pretty nice DPS boost for priests. With 20% crit alone it would bump 615% matk dots to 738% on average


It's kinda funny. The current status of DPS Priests reminds me a LOT of how Shadow Priests were in Vanilla WoW. They had little going for them: they did mediocre damage, the only raid buff they provided was marginal party healing, they literally could not heal in Shadow Form, and all of their raid/pvp gear was healer focused (though this issue plagued ALL classes that were hybrids).

By the second expansion their damage remained the same but this was offset by having gained more raid utility (their group healing that was done by causing damage had increased and they provided a CRITICAL mana restoration buff) and having gear sets that were catered to damage dealing.

By the third expansion they became top contenders in DPS meters due to DoTs gaining the ability to crit AND benefit from haste(reduced overall duration AND time between ticks), as well as other nifty raid buffs (raidwide spell crit % aura, a personal 90% dam reduction shield wall for 5 seconds, an execute). Our group healing was also increased on ourselves, allowing for a smart Priest to be able to literally stand in fire/void zones during a raid and negate the damage done.

I stopped playing after that point, and know they've been changed since, but its been more buffs again.

I think what gets me is this game, and the general populaces mentality towards full DPS Priests (hell, most think when you say DPS Priest you mean Hybrid). It just boggles me not just that this game is suffering from the same prejudiced player views that WoW had towards hybrid healers 8-9 years ago, but also that the game itself is reinforcing it with having a full DPS Priest being OK raid damage and no utility, but godly at PVP. It is what it is, and I plan on sticking with it and (futilely) advocating for change. Admittedly, I always found it rewarding the level of skill needed to play a Shadow Priest well, even if it's depressing that another class can literally press one button and beat us (this happened in WoW too actually lol. God damned Arcane Mages).

So TL;DR, to improve DPS Priests as a whole and make us a viable (not competitive, I'm not fool enough to think we deserve to be on par with pure DPS classes yet) raid choice they need any/all of the following:
- A damage only form like Sacrement that increases our damage done at the cost of healing power
- DoT ticks be able to crit
- DoTs able to scale with haste
- Some sort of unique raid buff/utility to give raid leaders more incentive to bring us other than "I guess it's another res (who has to compete with our healers for loot, does less damage than our other hybrid, can't heal...)"


Also, how long do Adds typically stay alive in a raid? In WoW I always found Add spaws always added a nice spike to my damage meters due to being able to return fire on the boss once the add(s) were dotted up (our single target DPS isn't great enough to warrent it and is better focussed on the boss, unless its a 'we wipe if he's not killed asap' add), even if they were nuked down relatively quickly.
  • 0

#16 Fold

Fold

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 283 posts
  • LocationPallet Town
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2
  • Server:Odin

Posted 18 April 2013 - 11:59 AM

Small adds generally have around 15k health in a raid environment, larger ones around 100k+. Unfortunately like wow, there is alot of burst damage in this game and a focused add with 15k health probably won't live to get the full benefit of 3 dots running on it.

Another thing that is completely different from wow: people are either unaware of (or don't care) about multidotting scenarios in this game. There is no damage meter, there is only a threat meter on your current target. The threat-to-damage ratio is exactly 1:1, so basically the number you see on the threat meter is the amount of damage people are dishing out on the boss, except tanks and healers of course. People are usually unaware of multidotting on adds and are more focused on single-target DPS. This is why I feel like priests are at a disadvantage in this game. There is a misconception about how they perform little damage, when in reality they are probably dishing out the most due to multidotting. Not every fight is multidot friendly of course, but there are plenty of fights I can name off the top of my head that multidotting plays a valuable role.

I play a warlock in WoW, so I know these feels D:
  • 0

#17 ExeltusPendragon

ExeltusPendragon

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 387 posts
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2
  • Server:Odin

Posted 19 April 2013 - 01:25 AM

I play a warlock in WoW, so I know these feels D:


My brother ;A; !

In the case of lower HP adds it was always best, and probably still is here, to just roll your strongest DoT and then focus fire the boss. You get the most bang for your buck that way. I haven't raided much here, so the best I can come up with are WoW examples (From Wrath you have Saurfang with his quick to nuke bloodbeasts for the above situation, versus Deathwhisper where you need to multidot all the adds on your side and focus them down first, versus Jaraxxus or the Worm Twins in the Colliseum who are honest to goodness multiDoT fights.). Sure we're not as good on singletarget/Patchwerk fights, but Spriests/AffliLocks never were.

A lot of it comes from awareness and knowing when and how to multiDoT. It doesn't help that in game systems work against us. I magine how much easier it'd be to prove our worth if we had access to a straight up full on damage meter (not that those are the best judge of a DPS's true worth, but it's still a useful tool) and some halfway decent DoT timer bars. Ah well, I can at least take solace in knowing that IN THEORY a good raid/guild leader should know how valuable we can be.

Above anything I still wish we had SOME kind of unique raid buff that could help justify our role in a group, but at the end of the day I know that I'd rather not group with people who don't want me and are ignorant about why. I understand fully that there's legit reasons for it (competition for healer gear tokens, 'mediocre' dps, no utility), but I could do without the end of the world negative attitude I've gotten from a few of the uneducated masses.
  • 0

#18 piratedan

piratedan

    I am New.

  • Members
  • 3 posts

Posted 19 April 2013 - 11:02 AM

All negative and contradictory criticism aside, thank you for breaking down some mechanics. Very helpful. After reading all the back and forth, I am still making a Full DPS priest. My reasoning behind this? I simply like playing the odd characters. The "underdogs" if you must. It's my style. FS priests are a dime a dozen, and I personally find them boring (not to mention difficult to solo with)
Your guide is a great base for me to work off of. I appreciate the time and effort you put in my friend.

*bookmarks post*
Cheers,
Dan the pirate

PS. as of the latest patch Spriests in wow are 3~4th (debatable when you factor in playing your character well + good gear choices) highest dps.
  • 0

#19 ExeltusPendragon

ExeltusPendragon

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 387 posts
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2
  • Server:Odin

Posted 22 April 2013 - 11:27 AM

Happy to be of service Dan! And thanks for letting us know that Spriests are still kicking all types od butt! Gives me hope that one day DPS Priests here will be just as wanted hehe

As for everyone else, I've updated the guide a bit. The formatting is better and added some more info. Still need to do more for PVP but all in good time!
  • 0

#20 Ilyuusha

Ilyuusha

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 143 posts
  • Playing:Nothing

Posted 29 April 2013 - 02:34 AM

Nice guide you made there, kudos to you. After reading everything im kinda pumped up for making a DPS Monk since people usually expect me to be a Tank...and i like to break things. I lurked abit around in SEA forums and here and there and it seems people dont really see DPS Monks viable in comparison to other DPS Classes. You kinda inspired my inner Asura to roll DPS. But i really dont know sh!t yet about the RO2 PvP so all i do is hanging around the Skillsim and Theorycraftin. But well, keep up the good work, maybe it will inspire other people to think out of the box and try more unconventional builds.

Edited by Ilyuusha, 29 April 2013 - 02:34 AM.

  • 0

#21 ExeltusPendragon

ExeltusPendragon

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 387 posts
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2
  • Server:Odin

Posted 03 May 2013 - 01:59 AM

So now that the game is up and running and there's a suggestion forum I think it's time we put together a collaborative effort to try and get Battle Priests brought more in line with other classes in terms of balance. The bottom line is that while we can be totally viable on specific fights our single target DPS is enough to make others question our roles in a raid.

Previous potential points for change brought up:

So TL;DR, to improve DPS Priests as a whole and make us a viable (not competitive, I'm not fool enough to think we deserve to be on par with pure DPS classes yet) raid choice they need any/all of the following:
- A damage only form like Sacrement that increases our damage done at the cost of healing power
- DoT ticks be able to crit
- DoTs able to scale with haste
- Some sort of unique raid buff/utility to give raid leaders more incentive to bring us other than "I guess it's another res (who has to compete with our healers for loot, does less damage than our other hybrid, can't heal...)"


If possibly I think we should try and theorycraft these scenarios as best/accurately as we can to give the most evidence for our case. We'd want to show how much DPS we can do standard on a theoretical tank and spank single target/test dummy (both in and out of execute phase) as well as take into account multi-target fights. Then we should be easily able to run sims of those above potential changes, both alone and in conjunction with each other.

The tricky thing will be to keep balance in mind, as anything we could get could just as easily benefit a hybrid. We don't want to become overpowered, just brought on the same level as other DPS classes.

I'm going to see if I can find a theorycrafting thread on the seaRO2 forums I remember that had a great breakdown and a spreadsheet.

Edit: Found it!

Thread (I warn you now, though informative the debate DOES get heated): http://forums.playpa...14#entry2562914

DPS Priest and Sorc Comparison Spreadsheet: http://www.mediafire...opwdp3pv8ago1wq

If I'm not mistaken numbers will need to be tweaked/changed, but it's a start.

Edited by ExeltusPendragon, 03 May 2013 - 02:13 AM.

  • 0

#22 ExeltusPendragon

ExeltusPendragon

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 387 posts
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2
  • Server:Odin

Posted 09 May 2013 - 02:40 AM

The guide has been updated with DPS calculation outlines since the ~ let me know if you spot anything off. Ill be doing more math and concrete examples later today.

Edited by ExeltusPendragon, 09 May 2013 - 04:15 AM.

  • 0

#23 Jargous

Jargous

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 319 posts

Posted 09 May 2013 - 03:58 AM

DPS priests are heavily underestimated. A good example is if you look at the bapho down thread of how high it can go.
  • 0

#24 Serapheen

Serapheen

    I made it Off Topic

  • Members
  • 30 posts

Posted 10 May 2013 - 01:39 AM

Was thinking of tweaking your Full DPS build a slight bit. http://ro2base.com/b...1.1.3/0.0.0.0.0

I dropped the third point of Lex Divina because I most likely will only see that being useful while soling, but in a single target/raid setting, I will probably not get the killing blow, or if I do, it will probably be from DoTs, so it would be useless. I also removed a point of Gloria, a slight dps loss, but I think the two points gained to toss into HH will be worth it when it comes to survivability (because dead dps does no dps!).

I played Shadow from early Vanilla up through the end of Cata, so I know I can handle the stigma that comes with playing a class most people just don't understand (I think I specced holy twice for Mag attempts in TBC, but never again) and have always loved the dot style. I'm actually really excited to play my little ME priest (ok, so it's not the be all of skills it was in RO1, but I still think of her as an ME priest).

I hadn't even bothered looking at the DPS tree for priest, because my main was always planned to be FS (spent far too long as FS priest in RO1 to not give it a whirl - so far it's boring as hell unless I'm in a dungeon with idiots), but saw what you said about it being similar in feel to shadow and started jumping for joy :rice: Might just have to drop my sorc for a bit to give the lil ME baby some love!
  • 0

#25 ExeltusPendragon

ExeltusPendragon

    Amateur Blogger

  • Members
  • 387 posts
  • Playing:Ragnarok Online 2
  • Server:Odin

Posted 10 May 2013 - 02:07 AM

Was thinking of tweaking your Full DPS build a slight bit. http://ro2base.com/b...1.1.3/0.0.0.0.0

I dropped the third point of Lex Divina because I most likely will only see that being useful while soling, but in a single target/raid setting, I will probably not get the killing blow, or if I do, it will probably be from DoTs, so it would be useless. I also removed a point of Gloria, a slight dps loss, but I think the two points gained to toss into HH will be worth it when it comes to survivability (because dead dps does no dps!).


In terms of raiding, the third point isn't there for the Holy Water but for the extra 10% Damage in the execute phase (which ends up being around 20% since Lex auto-crits during execute). It's essentially our SW:D minus the self-damage~

I definitly can't argue with your reasoning though, as I'm currently building my girl PVP Assumptio spec. While I'm losing a PvE DPS boost by not taking AA, I gain more universal utility in PvE and PVP. It's really hard to pass up the 'I win' extra life button of Colucleo when we're already hard enough to kill in PVP, not to mention a personal sheild wall. Both of those are incredibly useful in PVE as well. I still pray for Dual Specs though!

I'm happy you found this useful, and am happy to see another SPriest join the fold!
  • 0




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users