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#1 Zoltor

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Posted 28 September 2013 - 10:52 PM

I worked it out, so I actually could learn every Rogue, and trans skill I wanted(you know how tight it is sigh, being forced to learn skills you don't want, in order to get the very good skills), Now here's where it gets tricky, the skill calc doesn't really explain how certain skills for the Shadow Chaser work, like how exactly does Shadow spell work, it can auto cast spells learned through intimidate, and reproduce, cool, but what is it triggered off of, attacking or what?

 

How effective are the debuff skills(doesn't list a percentage or anything sigh)

 

Is Invisibility worth getting?


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#2 stygionyx

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Posted 28 September 2013 - 11:28 PM

Shadow spell is triggered through normal attacks.

 

Which debuff skills are you referring to? SC has many debuff skills. Regardless, click this document for complete details on SC's skills post balance patch.


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#3 Zoltor

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Posted 28 September 2013 - 11:41 PM

Shadow spell is triggered through normal attacks.

 

Which debuff skills are you referring to? SC has many debuff skills. Regardless, click this document for complete details on SC's skills post balance patch.

 

 

Great, that's frigging awesome.

 

I'm talking about the Masquerade skills, and ok I'll check that out, thanks.

 

PS. Just to double check, intimidate is limited to first, and 2nd jobs, while Reproduce works on trans skills right(if I recall, that's the difference between the two) ?


Edited by Zoltor, 28 September 2013 - 11:49 PM.

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#4 stygionyx

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Posted 29 September 2013 - 04:07 AM

Intimidation for copying 2nd class skills

Reproduce for copying 3rd class skills

Both Intimidation and Reproduce cannot copy trans skills AFAIK


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#5 Zoltor

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Posted 29 September 2013 - 06:03 AM

Intimidation for copying 2nd class skills

Reproduce for copying 3rd class skills

Both Intimidation and Reproduce cannot copy trans skills AFAIK

 

Hm ok, It's 3rd job, not trans then(thought it was trans, not 3rd job oh well), I guess I can work with that :)


Edited by Zoltor, 29 September 2013 - 06:04 AM.

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#6 Tofu

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Posted 29 September 2013 - 10:42 AM

There are 3 Masquerades worth getting:

Masquerade Ignorance
Masquerade Weakness
Masquerade Gloomy


Ignorance removes the use of skills. Good to use on basically anything, except those rangers and gxs you KNOW only ctrl click.
Weakness removes weapon + shield, and goes through FCP. Great against Rangers, GXs, Royal guards, performers, and anything else that require a weapon or shield to use their skills. Also for making "unkillable" people drop like flies.
Gloomy removes someone's mount, including the kafra shop Halter Lead. But it's main use is for making RKs almost 100% useless when successful.


All the masquerades use the same formula for success. And basically, the more dex you have, and the more stuff the other person is carrying, the better your chances as success are. You're more likely to masquerade someone at 89% weight than someone at 30% weight.

As you can see in that document, each Masquerade has a 1 second delay and 2 second cooldown, but that delay/cooldown is only triggered on success, unlike how Full Divest's delay is activated even upon failure. This means you can continuously spam your masquerades without delay until it succeeds.

With instant cast, the masquerades become exponentially better. Now, they don't even trigger an animation unless it succeeds, which means you can spam them even faster because you don't have to deal with that annoying animation delay. I tested the difference between 99% cast reduction and 100% reduction, and 100% reduction was ~30% faster.


What exactly do you want to do with your Chaser? A pure pvp/woe disabler will have no use for shadow spell or invisibility. But if you're gonna be using Shadow Spell in WoE, invisibility would be an interesting option (I've seen only one chaser do this, and it was surprisingly painful).

Invisibility does not make you immune to damage. But you cannot be targeted by single target attacks. Things like Dragon Breath and Storm Gust will still hit you. Sight/Ruwatch won't uninvis you. Also, your invisibility is not detected by maya purple. While you're invisible though, you can't do anything but normal attack, which is why it's really only helpful for a shadow spell chaser.
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#7 Zoltor

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Posted 29 September 2013 - 11:46 AM

There are 3 Masquerades worth getting:

Masquerade Ignorance
Masquerade Weakness
Masquerade Gloomy


Ignorance removes the use of skills. Good to use on basically anything, except those rangers and gxs you KNOW only ctrl click.
Weakness removes weapon + shield, and goes through FCP. Great against Rangers, GXs, Royal guards, performers, and anything else that require a weapon or shield to use their skills. Also for making "unkillable" people drop like flies.
Gloomy removes someone's mount, including the kafra shop Halter Lead. But it's main use is for making RKs almost 100% useless when successful.


All the masquerades use the same formula for success. And basically, the more dex you have, and the more stuff the other person is carrying, the better your chances as success are. You're more likely to masquerade someone at 89% weight than someone at 30% weight.

As you can see in that document, each Masquerade has a 1 second delay and 2 second cooldown, but that delay/cooldown is only triggered on success, unlike how Full Divest's delay is activated even upon failure. This means you can continuously spam your masquerades without delay until it succeeds.

With instant cast, the masquerades become exponentially better. Now, they don't even trigger an animation unless it succeeds, which means you can spam them even faster because you don't have to deal with that annoying animation delay. I tested the difference between 99% cast reduction and 100% reduction, and 100% reduction was ~30% faster.


What exactly do you want to do with your Chaser? A pure pvp/woe disabler will have no use for shadow spell or invisibility. But if you're gonna be using Shadow Spell in WoE, invisibility would be an interesting option (I've seen only one chaser do this, and it was surprisingly painful).

Invisibility does not make you immune to damage. But you cannot be targeted by single target attacks. Things like Dragon Breath and Storm Gust will still hit you. Sight/Ruwatch won't uninvis you. Also, your invisibility is not detected by maya purple. While you're invisible though, you can't do anything but normal attack, which is why it's really only helpful for a shadow spell chaser.

 

Huh how about Masqurade Enervation, it not only lowers attack, but disables items(which lets face it, a Knight based char, who can't spam whites, is a sitting duck against a Rogue)?

 

Cool, having a delay after failures would suck/be annoying as hell.

 

Awesome, but I'm probally not going for instant cast, I need just enough dex to beable to have a high, if not 100% hit on almost everything, any extra stat points are needed elseware.

 

PvM/MvP(My rogue is indeed capeable of such, I have done so many times already as a reg non trans Rogue at that, I just need to readjust my build, to compensate for the massive flee buffs renewal gave mobs), and some ( "aggressive" playstyle of the char)   WoE..

 

Lol precast is no threat to me anyway. well there's that(lol sounds fun as hell t00) or it sounds like it would be helpful when trying to shatter Emps :) Wow sweet, even Maya Purple can't detect such, lol I wonder how many people rage quit over their insanely expensive head gear becoming almost useless.

 

With that said, Invisible seems to be the least needed skill out of all the useful skills, so it looks like a skill that screams, get if you have enough skill points. Sadly it seems you're forced to get Masquerade Luck, the most useless skill SCs have sigh, and max Deadly Infection(It's like getting Intimidate with a non trans Rogue, It's a very tight fit, so much so, It's almost impractical altogether, nevermind the BS that preserve wasn't made a non-trans skill, but that's a different matter).

 

Thanks.


Edited by Zoltor, 29 September 2013 - 11:48 AM.

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#8 Tofu

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Posted 29 September 2013 - 03:22 PM

Huh how about Masqurade Enervation, it not only lowers attack, but disables items(which lets face it, a Knight based char, who can't spam whites, is a sitting duck against a Rogue)?


Enervation doesn't disable the ability to lose items. It only reduces atk and removes spirit spheres.
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#9 GuardianTK

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Posted 29 September 2013 - 03:45 PM

Only a bad guild leaves their Emperium completely unattended. If they do see someone's attacking it while in Invisibility, it means someone's going to come over to AoE it. At the rate skills are being casted over precasts, it's actually very hard to get through a good precast without using items to keep yourself alive. Don't forget that Invisibility disables the use of items, as hinted by Tofu already. You are also not allowed to toggle it on and off until all of your SP drains or if you die.

 

You can still get affected by status effects, especially immobilization effects while in Invisibility.


Edited by GuardianTK, 29 September 2013 - 03:46 PM.

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#10 Zoltor

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Posted 29 September 2013 - 03:53 PM

Enervation doesn't disable the ability to lose items. It only reduces atk and removes spirit spheres.

 

Oh wtf, then yea that sucks. Well looks like I might beable to squeeze invisible in after all then.

 

 

On a slightly different note, am I right in suspecting Rogue's Treasure is now the best Accessory for a Rogue/SC type char?

 

It will be raising Flee, ATK, and Hit(crit too, but who cares about that) 10 points.

 

Also if you equip 2x Rogues Treasures, dot they stack?


Edited by Zoltor, 29 September 2013 - 03:54 PM.

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#11 stygionyx

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Posted 29 September 2013 - 04:02 PM

They stack, but what are you expecting from those rogue treasures? SC in WoE mostly focus to de-buff others, you don't need atk or hit since your skill largely depends on dex.

RWC pendant is an excellent accessories when enchanted right. 2x spell3 and +6 dex at its wonder.


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#12 GuardianTK

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Posted 29 September 2013 - 04:35 PM

RWC Accessories are the closest things you'll get to a Brisingamen for instant-cast. +3 Dex and carded with Zerom, each one would provide a whopping +6 Dex! Brisingamen brings you closer to instant-cast because each of those also gives you Int. You need a combination of Int and Dex to reach instant-cast without relying on Magic Strings. If you want reductions, go for Glorings Rings or Dark Rosaries with Kafra Blossom cards. If you want to increase your success rates with Masquerade and Divest, you'll most certainly want the enchanted RWC Rings. A Chaser's job in WoE is not killing, but rather disabling.

 

 

Also, please do not get Invisibility unless you can max it. It's a skill you either max or don't get at all.


Edited by GuardianTK, 29 September 2013 - 04:37 PM.

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#13 Zoltor

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Posted 29 September 2013 - 04:37 PM

They stack, but what are you expecting from those rogue treasures? SC in WoE mostly focus to de-buff others, you don't need atk or hit since your skill largely depends on dex.

RWC pendant is an excellent accessories when enchanted right. 2x spell3 and +6 dex at its wonder.

 

Awesome thanks.

 

I'm expecting +20 Hit, +20 Flee, and +20 ATK, that's what I'm expecting :)  I'm not like other Rogue users though, I actually know how to use my char as a killer, instead of your typical annoying/support role Rogue.

 

I was asking about Rogue's Treasure mainly for PvM/MvP though(I may or may not use it in WoE, I'll have to look through the list of newer Accessories, to see if there is anything that would specifically be better in PvP/WoE), since they are the reason I need all this blasted DEX/Hit now to beginwith. Anything that raises both hit, and Flee at the same time is pretty damn godly for any thief type char these days, not to mention the extra attack is a nice bonus as well.

 

Huh without the set, and enchants, all that gives is 1% MATK, nevermind the fact It's supposedly Account Bound evidently(and I'm pretty sure you can't get them anymore, wasn't it a reward/bonus for paticipation for RWC in 2012), then aren't the enchantments pretty random?


Edited by Zoltor, 29 September 2013 - 04:38 PM.

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#14 GuardianTK

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Posted 29 September 2013 - 04:42 PM

http://ragial.com/it...al/HbXm5a42iBLv

 

The RWC Boxes come with both the ring and pendant. The ring is more for the attack with their enchants. The pendant is for magic users.

 

The RWC Enchant Reset Tickets are also available through the KP Shop.


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#15 Zoltor

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Posted 29 September 2013 - 04:46 PM

http://ragial.com/it...al/HbXm5a42iBLv

 

The RWC Boxes come with both the ring and pendant. The ring is more for the attack with their enchants. The pendant is for magic users.

 

The RWC Enchant Reset Tickets are also available through the KP Shop.

 

Ah ok, thanks, It's one of those types of things huh.


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#16 Tofu

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Posted 29 September 2013 - 09:40 PM

With all the new gear available now, you can get instant cast without stats and without relying on magic strings, without MVP cards.
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#17 Zoltor

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Posted 29 September 2013 - 10:16 PM

With all the new gear available now, you can get instant cast without stats and without relying on magic strings, without MVP cards.

 

 

I'm not going for instant cast, but yea I'm sure it is possible, there are so many equipment these days, that reduces casting time, and such.


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