29 replies to this topic

[Njoror]

Hello.

 

This topic will be used to collect Priest class suggestions.

 

Please use the form below when submitting balance issues.

 

Remember, the more detail, image, or video that can be provided, the quicker these issues can be addressed.

 

Character Name:

Suggestion Type: (Example: Skill, Stats, Animation, etc)

Suggestion Description:

Video/Image Link (if applicable):

[Electrophoric]

A new aoe that allows for selection of casting area to counter other player's hide skill would be nice. IMHO there should a time frame for hide because as of this moment they could stay in hide forever and it can be really unfair esp. in WOE for other players without such ability.

Edited by Electrophoric, 08 April 2014 - 11:42 PM.

[Sestuplo]

Let's kick a bit of life into this thread

Character Name: Doppio

Suggestion Type: Sacrament

Suggestion Description: I have a few suggestions to give drawbacks to Sacrament

-Retain the original drawback (10% less damage)

-Increase the original drawback (to say, 50% less damage)

-No damage decrease, but players would only be able to use Aspersio with support skills, and wouldn't be able to use them without it on (ie, Priest casts Aspersio, he doesn't have Sacrament on, so they cannot High Heal HoT themself. Priest casts Aspersio, has Sacrament on, can use HH's HoT, but can't use Judex to stun while having Sacrament up.)

[Greven79]

Suggestion Type: Sacrament
Suggestion Description: I have a few suggestions to give drawbacks to Sacrament
-Retain the original drawback (10% less damage)
-Increase the original drawback (to say, 50% less damage)
-No damage decrease, but players would only be able to use Aspersio with support skills, and wouldn't be able to use them without it on (ie, Priest casts Aspersio, he doesn't have Sacrament on, so they cannot High Heal HoT themself. Priest casts Aspersio, has Sacrament on, can use HH's HoT, but can't use Judex to stun while having Sacrament up.)

 

To me, that sounds more like a 'hidden' fix for other issues than a real suggestion to make the skill useful.

Therefore, my version would be:

 

Suggestion: Sacrament

• +50% MATK for Healing skills
• minus 20~25% for damaging skills
• No other special bonus.
• Healing skills should at least be nerfed to compensate for the additional MATK boost.

 

Suggestion: Credo / Adoramus

• one becomes a passive skill similar to Sacrament. Might need to rename it as well.
• +50% MATK for damaging skills
• minus 20~25% for healing
• Only one boost skill (this one or Sacrament) might be active at the same time.
• All the remaining damage skills should be nerfed to compensate for the MATK boost.

 

Comment: With two competitive auras / credos, the priest can specialize on a specific role. That's similar to the concept of a Sorcerer, Warrior, BM or Knight. (The +100% bonus for the Sorcerer feels a bit too harsh, whereas the +10% ATK increase for the Warrior is too lame. 50% feels just fine, especially with the additional drawback)

 

Reducing the number of DoTs down to two shouldn't hurt at all, because they would then profit from the increased MATK of the Aura / Credo. That concept is comparable to the Curse Reinforce of the Crecentia.

 

All in all, it's not so restrictive like your suggestion. You would still be able to activate any skill, however focusing on healing skills means a loss of 50% in DPS and vice versa (-25% MATK & not choosing the 50% increase instead = 50% decrease in total).

Edited by Greven79, 06 August 2014 - 10:27 AM.

[SolM77186]

I'm completly disagree your post "Greven, i'm not fan of Doppio changes, but at least he knows his class, my question is simple, are you really playing priest as PVP or only as PVE.. and at least don't be anonym, cause make complains whole time without show you up. it's like a bit sad.

 

(No Offenses here) but it's kinda annoying.

[Greven79]

I'm completly disagree your post "Greven, i'm not fan of Doppio changes, but at least he knows his class, my question is simple, are you really playing priest as PVP or only as PVE.. and at least don't be anonym, cause make complains whole time without show you up. it's like a bit sad.

 
Lol. Nice try!
 
If PM's aren't enough to get my IGN, you try this method... a bit infantile, huh? So, let's make it easy, be childish as well and quote from one of the PMs:
 

cause you're considering only priest way and not compared to each others class, priest need nerf but every class need nerf same time else this game will be more ghost town than now.

 
A few facts:

• There were more players in this game when all the classes were significantly weaker
• There were more full support priests in this game when the priests heals were weaker percentage-wise.
• There were many Priests winning Colo although the DoTs were proportional weaker (and they were primary targets)

So your statement about the future of the game is as shallow as saying: "On the same day next year, it'll be snowing!"
_____________________________

 

Just to give you a few facts on the Priest:

• I could farm Mukas just by running in circles casting one Credo per second by 'tabbing' through them. An occasional Renovatio or HH was enough to recover any damage. Regarded over some time, that's almost 1 kill per second. Try that with a Knight or Rogue.
   
• During DW, my Warrior's Brandish Storm dealt like 10 times 250~300 damage (without a crit.). Against the same mobs, the Priest's Oratio DoT alone dealt 3k+ damage. Both with a similar refined weapon w/o runes. Well, the Warrior has BT, but what's about a monk, wizard & co?
   
• And as I've stated earlier, a single HH is enough to fully heal myself (INT build, w/o aspersio and w/o a crit).
  The same could be true with a Sanctuary every 2sec (870% vs 896% heal)

So even if you play a Priest all by yourself, you can clearly see the inbalance. In a parallel thread, I analysed that the heals are much better post-AoV and I stated that the higher the defense rate, the higher the damage has to be to negate the defense and the more inbalanced DoTs and Heals will get.

 

What's your share? Have you brought up any facts?

_____________________________

 

But I am not a typical PvP guy, that's right. I am not a 16 year old boy. If I win because I can stun my opponent and wait 'till he dies, I don't feel any better. If I lose because my opponent stunned me and used one shotted, I am not depressed either.

 

I wouldn't mind to allow pots during duels and I definitely don't run around on the WoE map, killing other players randomly just to jerk off. And the 'intented' WoE isn't any better with the collusive fights. So just tell me, what makes PvP so 'special' for you?

 

And of course, I could try to lever the current system out by going full VIT, hoping that I can't be one-shotted any more. Then I could make full use the free full heal from HH or Coloseo to become seemingly invincible, but that doesn't make 1vs1 any better. Oh wait... my bad, they don't recover 100%, right?
_____________________________
 
The funniest thing about your comment is: "cause you're considering only priest way"
 
Yes, yes. Of all the fanboys on this forum, I am the worst.

 

Must be the reason why I am posting on almost every class thread and it must be the reason why I was bring up facts that could be easily criticized if they were wrong. So let's see the truth about my opinion so far:

 

Warrior:

Spoiler

Goal: Make the Warrior a good tank class, but make him a good DPS class as long as he is 'enraged'.

• Replace BT (with a crit. chance boost f.e.) or make it independant of INT (a fix 50% crit. damage bonus)
• Half the CD for Parrying and Endure
• Remove rage points from Battle Leap and keep the targeting
• Add a debuff to Provoke
• Give the Warrior a bonus on ATK / movement speed based on the rage points

Knight:

Spoiler

Goal: Make the Kinght a very good tank class and improve the role as a paladin (support / healer)

• Replace BT or make it independant of INT
• Reduce CD for Aura Shield and SF
• Replace Aura Heal with Survival
• Remove the slow and the additional targets from Shield Boomerang, add a stun effect instead
• Replace stun on Shield Bash with a 'confuse' or slow.
• Add a debuff to Provoke

Beastmaster:

Spoiler

Goal: A beast with massive HPs, constantly regenerating wounds who calls pet-companions to fight with him

• Nerf Cruel Bite heal
• Nerf Fury Strike beast points
• boost Rage Smash
• Replace survival and add a passive party buff instead
• add Falcon Assault
• remove Frenzy

Assassin:

Spoiler

Goal: Lower normal damage, highest damage on a single strike. Slow, but deadly (and invisible).

• Nerf or remove heals
• make Hide usuable during combat
• replace Shadow Armor speed & ATK bonus with an effective defensive bonus
• boost crit damage (but don't add armor penetration)
• nerf Shadow Explosion CD (to 20sec)
• remove 'Mark of Shadow'
• add a stackable debuff (preferrable dodge) to Cross Impact

Ranger:

Spoiler

Goal: Make the Ranger a mobile and constantly firing plattform with occasional power-shots

• No additional heals
• remove Impact Arrow CD, but slow as well (to make it the primary attack skill usable on the run)
• add a CD to Double Strafing, adds 'Concentration' instead of consuming them (see Bowling Bash)
• Charge Arrow: Consumes 'Concentration', add a cc-effect (slow, stun, etc.)
• alter Fear Breeze and Main Ranger (would take too long to explain)
• remove Falcon Assault

Sorcerer:

Spoiler

Goal: Make the Sorcerer the most versatile class that boosts his skills for high bursts of damage, defense or speed

• Seperate elements into Ice, Fire, Blitz, Water, Earth and Wind
  • Give every element a unique Emblem
  • Remove some top-tier skills to make room for unique skills of every element
  • add / combine Seal Explosion, Aspersio and Memorize to create top-tier effects out of regular skills

Wizard:

Spoiler

Goal: Supperior in all the elements (ice, fire, blitz). The Wizard should have the highest AoE and a very high single-target dps

• No additional heals (even remove the existing ones)
• alter Fireball into an Thunderstorm-like AoE
• transform Thunderstorm into a single-target strike
• add DoTs to Ice skills
• add slow / freeze to Ice skills
• add debuff to Fire skills and let it remove freeze resistence
• add stun/confuse to Lightning skills
• vastly improve Flame Explosion, Firestarter, Inferno
• Make Meteor Swarm a zone effect similar to LoD

Soulmaker:

Spoiler

Goal: Should be the best support class (buffs) and a powerful healer

• No stackable cure
• improve Immunity
• vastly improve Cure Pearls to generate an HoT
• the links should have a shorter duration (like 30sec buffs), but should create a decent, active effect

Crecentia:

Spoiler

Goal: Should have the best debuffs and the powerful DoTs (so the opposite to a Soulmaker)

• fix the INT/STR bonus
• nerf the pet inbalance to let the Crecentia shine for his skills
• balance the DoTs
• replace Earth Worm with a more curse-like effect

Monk:

Spoiler

Goal: Should be king of dodge and parry. His attacks should hit multiple enemies or cripple a single one.

• no additional heals
• reduce CD of G-Fist to 40sec
• add a stackable debuff to Crippling strike
• at least seperate HP (into Iron Skin) and defense bonus (50% per level on Steel body)
• Throw Spirit Sphere should require 'spirit' points to create a powerful kamehameha effect

 

and for the sake of the remaining class.

 

Rogue:

Spoiler

Goal: Should be a really fast, acrobatic and versatile class. Best to hunt down Sorcerers or Ranger

(no suggestions made so far)

_____________________________

 

So about Sestuplo's suggestions: They aren't that bad, but IMO a bit too restrictive and don't fix the issues at their bottom. A typical priest can still stun you, place some DoTs on you and then switch to Sacrament to be able to use heal, just in case.

 

That's why I used his idea and shifted it a bit. Instead of a pure restriction, I would make both the DoTs and the HH less effective as long as the opposite focus/aspect is chosen. That worked quite well for Sorcerers, switching Seals/Emblems.

 

But of course, I would fix the Judex stun seperately.

Edited by Greven79, 06 August 2014 - 10:44 AM.

[SolM77186]

why you tell me "nice try" ? dude...it's ok you're allright. don't change anything.

"if the pm aren't enough etc.." it's not my fault if you don't assum it. but i have my idea about your identity, i remember a same arrogant guy like you then.

 

Don't change your mind, stay like that it's perfect at all. (it's too much easy to criticize while to be anonym.) maybe you got your reasons and i think  i understand why but don't tell me i got a kid attitud. i just show the truth. i explain:

 

1: i saw you said lot of things about stun etc..., but if in game you're using etc... how can       we know  how you're playing and if you're saying truth cause as i said , it's easy to say       with anonym profil.

 

2: Second reason, i'm not against criticize something but at least you need to assum that        players could criticize you too.

 

 

3: At least if you don't respect yourself, respect each others. it will be fine.

 

 

By the way to say" you pm me to get my IGN, now you're doing this" it's not a kid attitud ? no of course..then at least if you want to say i got a kid attitud, don't do it too .

 

By the way if i know one of yours character and if sometime i'm talking to you without knowing it's you. Then do me a favor, don't reply my mess, no offense here, nothing personnal.  I just dislike this kind of mind, then let's stay in peace together.

 

Have fun, Cordially. (you don't have/need to reply). BUT IF YOU WANT TO REPLY, i think in game never you'll pm me to say "i'm greven" then if you want to reply, let's talk by PM on forum (Conv closed).

 

IGN:Solemia

Edited by SolM77186, 05 August 2014 - 05:54 AM.

[Exvee]

If people even developers can't see how ridiculous Meditation and Aspersio (and DoT?) are I'm not gonna continue this. It's useless to made long words, we just defend our opinions that's all...

 

I don't see other issues with Sacrament or others,they can stay fine left untouched.

Edited by Exvee, 05 August 2014 - 04:24 PM.

[SolM77186]

Please Greven don't criticize again and again.. (i'm not talking with or about you then don't do it)

 

Then to answer you. making complains is showing up how you're, it's ok dev undersood priest got something op and they understoff too that EVERY class got OP things... but make complains whole time... it's just annoying for us, isn't our faults is priest could chain stun. but in duel exemple opponent say" pfff don't stun you'll see" then ok i stop stun and after OHHH! surprise, the opponent is finding a new thing, now it's our dot, and after it's our heal, what else after ? 

 

Then if you don't want to see how priest could use stun (some priest are using, and me too sometime vs monk) then don't duel them. and if you're a priest, then try to make some challenges like "now i don't stun" or "now i don't dot this sin" etc... you see ? 

 

And excuse me if you think i'm rude, i'm not i'm just too lazy to hear whole time "priest something" etc...

Edited by SolM77186, 05 August 2014 - 04:30 PM.

[Greven79]

By the way to say" you pm me to get my IGN, now you're doing this" it's not a kid attitud ? no of course..then at least if you want to say i got a kid attitud, don't do it too .

 

To quote myself:

 

"If PM's aren't enough to get my IGN, you try this method... a bit infantile, huh? So, let's make it easy, be childish as well and quote from one of the PMs:"

[SolM77186]

It's ok i'm a kid Greven... you're allright i already told you. but make me a favor,

 

DON'T TALK TO ME OR ABOUT ME WITHOUT GIVING YOUR IGN. i don't like to talk to anyone when he is criticize while to be anonym. then please do it or don't talk to or about me.

Edited by SolM77186, 06 August 2014 - 02:45 AM.

[Greven79]

It's ok i'm a kid Greven... you're allright i already told you. but make me a favor,

 

DON'T TALK TO ME OR ABOUT ME WITHOUT GIVING YOUR IGN. i don't like to talk to anyone when he is criticize while to be anonym. then please do it or don't talk to or about me.

 

I don't talk with you anymore, but with zJuliusx, Exvee or the 60 priests that 'agreed' with your VCR report. And even if you write in bigger letters or with a blinking effect... like I told you in my first PM reply already:

 

 

Sorry, but I don't share my IGNs. I don't want people to add me to their friendlist in my absence. There were too many 'dramas', stalkers, etc. among friends for me to know it better. As soon as Gravity adds a security option that can prevent that, I might consider to share the IGNs of my chars.

 

But just ask GottaLongSword why he isn't FallenWarrior anymore or why he became Fallen in the first place Or how does it come that there are 'kill lists'. Guess what, even you Solemia are listed in one of the top ranks. Maybe your attitude hasn't resulted in all too many friends either.

Edited by Greven79, 06 August 2014 - 04:30 AM.

[SolM77186]

Before to be "Fallenwarrior" it was GLS... tenhe is back as GLS and every players know it was GLS when he was fallenwarrior and "my rank" has not to do about "kid attitud" or not...but as i told you i give with you like lot of players.

 

then now please stop it. stop to talk about that, don't bring it back.

Edited by SolM77186, 06 August 2014 - 05:18 AM.

[Greven79]

Before to be "Fallenwarrior" it was GLS... tenhe is back as GLS and every players know it was GLS when he was fallenwarrior

 

See, you couldn't even read a single sentence I made carefully enough:  "But just ask GottaLongSword why he isn't FallenWarrior anymore or why he became Fallen in the first place."  I know he was GottaLongSword and I even raided with him back then.

 

And I know you got on the kill list for randomly killing lower-level character on the WoE map (outside the WoE times) to prove how superior your Priest is. And I know how you reacted when you duelled yourself with other players, insulting them even if you stun-DoT-ed them to death. So what?

 

It funny that you call me arrogant... I can handle that. Just prove me how good your manners really are!

 

 

Edited by Greven79, 06 August 2014 - 07:28 AM.

[SolM77186]

Dude to prove how i'm superior ? you see ? you're telling something about me but i can't tell something about you cause you're anonym then you criticize me but i can't ? it's not a little bit easy ? 

 

Anyway, i don't want to prove something, lot of people want to duel me and yesterday exemple i lost some duels and i said gg, that's all i agree that long time ago i was sometime QQing. but now it's gone. I don't want to prove i'm superior i think you're just mad to something... maybe i killed you while you were wearing a OP set ? Arf i don't know dude.

 

but as people told me in game about you in forum...you're just "a coward" excuse me to be rude but..criticize while be anonym aha.. so sad dude,so sad. now if you want to trashtalking me let's go

 

And about WOE, if i see one guy from an enemy guild yeah that's true i might kill him like if they see me alone they will kill me. Then yeah think you didn't do WOE cause  you said bull-_- then.

 

By the way as i see you know me and you're staying without showing your IGN ? Ahahaha but omg dude ? respect yourself XD respect yourself. you're so annoying XD

 

*Who are you dude ? who are you to trashtalk anyone whithout showing your identity ? you realize how it's so bad ? * at least if you want to Trashtalk....assum that.

 

 

now i gonna tell to some moderators to close this post or find a solution cause your "trashtalk" it's ok i'm done.

Edited by SolM77186, 06 August 2014 - 09:38 AM.

[AhinaReyoh]

What's with your obsession about knowing somebody's ingame names? It's not even relevant to the discussion.

 

You can't accuse Greven of giving undue critique to Priests either. If you check around the other boards you'll see he's commented on various classes.

[SolM77186]

I asked lot of players and trust me. they told me that he said something about priest, he doesn't play priest, and about to be anonym, he trashtalk, he disagree all VCR posts, only his ideas are good. lot of player are pissed off, lot of don't answer him cause he is so annoying to disagree whole time.

 

i'm ok if he want trashtalk me but at least "not behind a computer, i mean without showing him"

Edited by SolM77186, 06 August 2014 - 10:39 AM.

[jhay1825]

What i noticed about is skills that are connected to int or have anything to do with int are broken.
Like for example: BT for Knights and Warriors, Wiz and Sorcs Fireball DOTs, Cres DOTs, SM HOTs and Priest Heals and DOTs.

Now i know this is a Priest sub forum but a major rework on int related skills is probably the best way to fix most of the unbalanced stuff thats been dragging the game to ruins. All ive mentioned there is what i see are broken. Now if they were to just adjust how int works on these skills pretty sure we wont need to rework every classes skills that are unbalanced.

Edited by jhay1825, 07 August 2014 - 06:57 AM.

[kimsera]

It's because DOTS go through armor, and that most magic-based DoTs have ridiculous percentages. In contrast, Physical DoT's like Poison Weapon, Head Crush etc. are . (They use to be good though. Thanks korea.)

[SolM77186]

That's why thanks to did read my VCR post. i decreased the % and i said "won't ignore defense anymore"

[Greven79]

What i noticed about is skills that are connected to int or have anything to do with int are broken.
Like for example: BT for Knights and Warriors, Wiz and Sorcs Fireball DOTs, Cres DOTs, SM HOTs and Priest Heals and DOTs.

Now i know this is a Priest sub forum but a major rework on int related skills is probably the best way to fix most of the unbalanced stuff thats been dragging the game to ruins. All ive mentioned there is what i see are broken. Now if they were to just adjust how int works on these skills pretty sure we wont need to rework every classes skills that are unbalanced.

 

Your conclusion is wrong. Although most problematic skills are based on INT, it doesn't mean that the stat itself is the problem.

• If BT would be based on WIS, it wouldn't be any better.
• All DoTs ignore armor. STR-based DoTs with a total of 574% (Oratio+Credo+Adoramus) would create the same inbalance.
• HoTs are scaled according to the DoTs. If the DoTs are overpowered, the HoTs are as well. No matter of the associated attribute.

 

For the HoTs and Heals: The source of all evil is the abnormal high defense rates (up to 90%). And this is caused by the defense formula and/or the defense values!

 

In general, the higher the defense rate, the higher the inbalance. Skills that are affected by defense (most attacks) get weaker and weaker towards skills that ignore defense (DoTs, HoTs, Heals). You could now make the DoTs affected by defense (like Solemia suggested), but that would leave the Heals and HoTs unaffected.

 

Let's assume a physical skill effect (PSE) of 2500:

 

75% defense rate (PSE 2500):

Holy Light (548%) = 3425 damage

Heal (433%) = 10825 damage recovered

Oratio (200%) =  5000 damage over time

Renovatio (220%) =  5500 heal over time

 

Result:

Oratio deals ~50% more damage than a Holy Light and a Heal recovers more than 3 times as much damage.

 

Now let's assume the 20% defense rate and an adjusted PSE that I've already suggested:

FYI: Both the defense rate and the PSE are scaled down by a factor of ~3.2.

 

20% defense rate & PSE 780:

Holy Light (548%) = 3420 damage => same as with 75% defense rate

Heal (433%) = 3377 damage recovered => as effective as a Holy Light

Oratio (200%) =  1560 damage over time => ~45.5% as effective as a Holy Light

Renovatio (220%) =  1716 heal over time

 

 

You see, this change would easily restore balance again. A Heal isn't better than a Holy Light and even all three DoTs combined (574%) can't create an unfair result (although unaffected by armor). With the chosen PSE, a non-crit. Genesis Ray would deal approx. 12k damage and an Aspersio-boosted Highness Heal would recovers 10.5k instantly plus 7k over the next 10sec... more than enough to negate the damage caused by a Genesis Ray (or other finishing skills).

 

In fact, this is only true balancing method that I can think of that avoids class-specific changes: Simply reduce the defense rate significantly and adjust the initial PSE accordingly (like I did => 780).

Edited by Greven79, 18 August 2014 - 06:12 AM.

[bheb03]

NERF THE PRIESTS!! TOO OP!!

[Sestuplo]

NERF THE PRIESTS!! TOO OP!!

 

Thank you for this constructive criticism.

 

Skill: Recovery

Suggestion: Right now this skill has only one very specific use, and it's due to the limited debuffs that can be removed. My suggestion is to increase the types of debuffs one can remove via levelling the skill (ie, level 1 can remove slow, level 2 can remove snare and freeze as well, up to level 5 where it can remove everything but DoTs)

Edited by Sestuplo, 05 September 2014 - 12:46 PM.

[3069121108025959500]

should nerf heal across the board

[Greven79]

Skill: Recovery

Suggestion: Right now this skill has only one very specific use, and it's due to the limited debuffs that can be removed. My suggestion is to increase the types of debuffs one can remove via levelling the skill (ie, level 1 can remove slow, level 2 can remove snare and freeze as well, up to level 5 where it can remove everything but DoTs)

 

Why would you exclude DoTs?