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Class Specific Headgear Foundry - Lyrica Hat[1]


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#1 Campitor

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 12:38 PM

The Lyrica Hat. The effects are not on the items yet however they can all be bought from a merchant right outside the prontera smithy for zeny. 

Currently on Sakray it is as follows:

 

 
Lyrica Hat[1]
Increase Severe Rain Storm Damage 15%
If upgraded to +7 or higher
   Reduce Fixed Cast Time based upon Voice Lessons Skill Level
If upgraded to +9 or higher
   Increase SP regeneration 25%

 

This is discussing the preview 2 and preview 3 headgears that we recently implemented as rewards from the Fourth of July quest. As mentioned in the notes, the headgear effects were significantly different than how they were proposed and many players are concerned about balance issues introduced by the new gears as received from kRO.

 

The original intent of the headgears was to give a boost to less common builds but some effects are not possible in the game without extensive development time. Some effects were tried but would not work, so the kRO team developed alterate effects. In several cases these are very different from the originally proposed effects so I am opening this thread for suggestions on modifications that can be tried to bring these closer to the spirit of the project. 

 

I will be posting the feedback from kRO on the reasoning why certain effects would not work or were requested to be changed. Please understand that some effects are not possible in the game. We are looking for alternative suggestions in those cases.

 

Lyrica Hat[1]

 

Current Effect: 

 
Increase Severe Rainstorm damage by 15%
If upgraded to +7 or higher,, Reduces fixed casting time of all skills by 4% for each level of Voice Lessons learned.
If upgraded to +9 or higher, reduces the SP cost of Severe Rainstorm by 10.
 
Original Proposed effect: 

 

Headgear Upper / Minstrel only / Lv.100 / Slot1 / Weight20 / DEF15 / Possible to refine / Not possible to destroy

 

Reduces fixed casting time of all skills by 5% for each level of Voice Lessons learned.

If upgraded to +7 or higher, increases Severe Rainstorm damage by 25%.

If upgraded to +9 or higher, reduces the SP cost of Severe Rainstorm by 50%. 

 
The comment by the devs is that it would not be possible to have a equip modify the sp consumption of individual skills by a percentarge

 

 

 
----This list is still being expanded, I think working on 3-4 of these at a time would be a reasonable task.----
 
Guidelines for the thread (follow these or Get Dunked!
-Be respectful of other posters
-Be open to constructive criticism of your suggestions
-the point of these is to buff builds that are not common, NOT to solve all real or perceived balance issues with a class vs every other class. 
-These were designed for PVM, if deemed necessary we may restrict these from PVP and WoE areas.
-I don't want to see X class is OP! Learn how to play X! X needs to be nerfed! Kind of posts here. That isn't what the project is for. 
 
The mission statement of the project: 

 


Each headgear targets or attempts to target a niche build that is not of the mainstream (if possible, not all will come out like this).
...

I would like to re-iterate the point of these are for PvM and not for PvP or WoE so don't even try to suggest otherwise as it will be ignored.


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#2 Ramen

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 01:05 PM

Is it just me or did the hat barely get changed?  I'm curious why it is you're so anxious to ignore what amounts to expert analysis on what the performer class needs to have buffed.  Jaye has stated several times that Severe Rainstorm doesn't need to get buffed, and although I'm not a Bard/Dancer class player, even I realize this simple fact.  As has been stated many times over now, these hats are supposed to help buff non-standard or alternate builds for PVM leveling.  Severe Rainstorm is the main build, so buffing that skill would be comlpetely against the entire purpose of these hats.

 

As has already been stated Wanderer and Maestro have other skills that could be really fun to level with as an alternate build, if only they could get a little bit of a boost.  Those skills being Reverberation, Metallic Sound, and Great Echo.  I've not heard anything stating that those skills can't be buffed, and even if they can't, there are a number of ways to indirectly buff them, so why not?


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#3 Campitor

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 01:10 PM

Is it just me or did the hat barely get changed?  I'm curious why it is you're so anxious to ignore what amounts to expert analysis on what the performer class needs to have buffed.  Jaye has stated several times that Severe Rainstorm doesn't need to get buffed, and although I'm not a Bard/Dancer class player, even I realize this simple fact.  As has been stated many times over now, these hats are supposed to help buff non-standard or alternate builds for PVM leveling.  Severe Rainstorm is the main build, so buffing that skill would be comlpetely against the entire purpose of these hats.

 

As has already been stated Wanderer and Maestro have other skills that could be really fun to level with as an alternate build, if only they could get a little bit of a boost.  Those skills being Reverberation, Metallic Sound, and Great Echo.  I've not heard anything stating that those skills can't be buffed, and even if they can't, there are a number of ways to indirectly buff them, so why not?

To be honest I am right now getting Oda to separate out the threads because so much as been lost in the mass posting for another classes hats. I will do my best to read through that thread later.


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#4 Viri

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 01:15 PM

Why not have it reduce fixed cast time by .02 seconds per level of voice lessons.

% reductions of fixed cast time don't stack and anything adding up to less than 50% is pretty garbage.

 

Also adding damage to reverberation/related skills would be a lot more fun than severe rainstorm.


Edited by Viri, 25 July 2014 - 01:16 PM.

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#5 Kadelia

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 01:32 PM

Why not have it reduce fixed cast time by .02 seconds per level of voice lessons.
% reductions of fixed cast time don't stack and anything adding up to less than 50% is pretty garbage.

Also adding damage to reverberation/related skills would be a lot more fun than severe rainstorm.


Whats the point of fixed cast reduction? With temp dex boots (4-5m zeny), all fixed cast time is removed from all performer skills. Just need 120 dex (easy to do on pvm performer)
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#6 Viri

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 01:34 PM

I guess, but if they insist on having fixed cast time reduction in there at least make it something not 100% useless like % reduction. In that case you could just make it .05 sec per level so instant is achievable without the shoes? idk.


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#7 Kadelia

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 01:39 PM

I shuppose you could but I still don't see the point. the only skill performer has where the fixed time even matters is severe rainstorm (rest are like 2 chorus/song skills with 0.5 sec that dont matter, since they are fast and your not mobbed/busy when casting), and you're going to want dex boots for that. And were not trying to use the hat Specifically for sr, right?
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#8 Viri

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 01:42 PM

May as well have the hat enable level 10 arrow storm, add +200% arrow storm damage and call it a day.


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#9 Kadelia

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 01:59 PM

Heh.

I'd be happier seeing it boost reverberation, metallic sound, and auto attack builds, like I've proposed around a dozen times :P
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#10 thatfool

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 02:04 PM

May as well have the hat enable level 10 arrow storm, add +200% arrow storm damage and call it a day.

make this happen, im coming back to ro if it does. or keep the original damage, but allow whips to cast arrow storm.


Edited by thatfool, 25 July 2014 - 02:41 PM.

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#11 Hissis

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 02:29 PM

MY Suggestion for Lyrica

 

Increase Reverberation Damage by 100%

 

if +7 or higher,Increase severe rainstorm damage by 30%

 

if +9 or higher,reduces the sp cost for all skills by -50 (idk if is possible to get -50SP for all skills,whatever,-50SP cost of Severe rainstorm is great)
 

 


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#12 Kadelia

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 05:17 PM

What I proposed in the other thread:

 

 

Lyrica Hat [1] & Nightsparrow Cap [1]

Physical and magical damage +5%.
Reduces the cost of [Severe Rainstorm] and [Reverberation] by 30.

If refined +7 or higher, For every base 30 AGI, ATK +5%
If refined +7 or higher, For every base 30 INT, MATK +5%

For every 3 refine, ATK and MATK + 20.

If refined +9 or higher, increases the damage of [Reverberation] by 50% and [Metallic Sound] by 100%.

Uncommon builds

* Auto attack with berserk guitar or swing dance - NEEDS the ATK/MATK boosts to do decent damage with autocasted CD in Mouth, and per-hit swings.

* Reverberation spammer: Such a build can sit in magic strings and spam reverb; needs high AGI and lots of ATK+MATK. A Maestro supporting party with soul link is self-stringed and can reverb monsters while performing!

* Metallic Sound: Maestro NEEEDS more MATK. 100 MATK and +% damage will make Metallic 1-shot mid-high TI monsters! This is quite fair! You can metallic while performing songs/dances! Very helpful for protecting priestsand such from stray monsters plus self-protection.

* Pure SR PVM build: A pure SR PVM performer has lots of AGI/DEX, so they will meet the ATK buff requirements!

 


Edited by Jaye, 25 July 2014 - 05:17 PM.

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#13 spikexp

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 06:30 PM

auto attack pls

i'm so gonna play maestro once it's viable to level via auto attack

Edited by spikexp, 25 July 2014 - 06:33 PM.

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#14 AlmrOfAtlas

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 06:53 PM

Anything previously mentioned so long as the current test effects aren't made permanent and added to the main.
 

So I noticed that the Lyrica Hat is being somewhat ignored due to the community's insistence on keeping Autumn Hairband front-and-center.

 

While this isn't a bad thing, it seems a lot of valid suggestions (specifically those from Jaye and Hyperballad) are being ignored, and Round 1 consists of 3 hat revisions, being Monk, Performer and Archer, not just that damnable Arrow Storm hat :v

 

First off, Severe Rainstorm absolutely does not need a damage buff. With the new temp boots and a few other things in the kRO pipeline, SR damage is going to get obscene, and we don't want that. It's also the Performer's primary leveling skill, and these hats are supposed to promote uncommon builds. While a fixed reduction in SP cost is an excellent idea, a damage buff is not.

 

Second, both fixed and variable redux on the hat are unnecessary. Fixed cast on Performers is already negligible and not worth an effect, and Variable may already be eliminated by equipping 2 Sound Amplifiers (-50% per Amp; stacks to -100% with 2), which are extremely common and surprisingly cheap due to overfarming.

 

Both of these things have been stated by multiple community members several times over the course of the thread, but no CM attention has been given to them. Again, this isn't the "Autumn Hairband" thread, and there are other things that need acknowledgement.

 

The most well-known alternate leveling builds are Reverberation, Metallic Sound and Arrow Vulcan. As mentioned here, Great Echo is also semi-viable with at least one other Performer along for the ride. All of these skills have one thing in common though: they're excessively weak in comparison to the leveling skills of most other classes as to be considered useless, which accounts for 99.99% of soloing Performers using SR, or just sitting in TI and getting their asses leeched from 100 to 150. This is compounded with Metallic Sound and Great Echo having restrictively long cooldowns along with MASSIVE SP drain, preventing immediate reuse and further advocating a Performer's reliance on SR, yet another skill with hilariously overblown SP drain.

 

The only way to get around the drain on all these is by spending a small fortune on blues/strawbs or by using a Healing Hat such as Rideword or Vanargand, which therefore means you'll be taking Lyrica off, doing less damage and regenerating less in general. Therefore, a reduction in SP cost on the most intensive skills wouldn't be out of place on Lyrica.

 

Damage output also needs to be sorely addressed. Reverberation at Lv5 uses ATK 800% + MATK 600% for damage. While this seems fine on paper, Performers don't exactly get high ATK gear options and MATK is almost unheard of. Thus, Reverb damage is always underwhelming. Part of the damage can also miss (and will often do so on end-game mobs) x_x

 

Metallic Sound uses MATK * 600% + 60% MATK per level of Voice Lessons. Once again, it's not like Performers get much in the way of specialised gear for these skills (the best Performer MATK gear is only marginally better than a typical 1H Staff, of which usually have low MATK values as a tradeoff for shields, for the Mage tree) so this skill is not only underwhelming in the damage department, it has a stupidly long reuse delay (3 goddamn seconds) that will likely get you killed if relying solely on that skill.

 

Arrow Vulcan is actually rather good, but the animation delay can and will get your butt tenderised by a high-aspd mob, and it's a single target skill which, as we all know, is fundamentally useless in 3rd class leveling unless you're a bot and don't care if you take 6 months to hit 150.

 

 

I could go on but honestly, a number of people have already described all this in greater detail. Go read those posts >:v

 

tl;dr current effects for Lyrica need to be completely overhauled.

 

Buff SR and you've officially failed in the whole point of this project.
 
I'm starting to think that kRO aren't the only problem. You don't play the game. We do. Open your ears.

Edited by AlmrOfAtlas, 25 July 2014 - 06:54 PM.

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#15 Kadelia

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Posted 25 July 2014 - 06:54 PM

auto attack pls

i'm so gonna play maestro once it's viable to level via auto attack

 

I'm the only one that's proposed something that will buff that build :p_hi:


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#16 Hyperballad

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Posted 26 July 2014 - 09:27 AM

Auto-attack maestro  :p_laugh:

 

" +1 ASPD every 4 refine levels "


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#17 spikexp

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Posted 27 July 2014 - 01:48 AM

rather than aspd, i think it'll be better to have a nice atk/matk buffs plus crit buffs

aspd can easily achieved via berserk guitar, or maybe you thought that auto attack build should NOT only revolve around berserk guitar?

i've yet to hit maestro (least i played was a 7x minstrel) so here's a noob thought
Spoiler


might be abusable or too weak?
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#18 Hyperballad

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Posted 27 July 2014 - 02:14 AM

Yeah I meant something more universal. Those who want to use the guitar can already equip themselves with autocast stuff,

and honestly the weapon gives -200 dex and no matk so the result would be quite unimpressive.

 

I think the problem with Improvised Song is that it's a skill that casts others skills, so I think you'd have to stop attacking

and click to activate the cast, i.e. Safety Wall, Storm Gust, ..


Edited by Hyperballad, 27 July 2014 - 02:16 AM.

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#19 spikexp

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Posted 27 July 2014 - 02:22 AM

i guess you're right... almost forgot that it has to be targeted.

how bout something like pseudo-improvised song and autocasts Cold Bolt, Frost Diver, Fire Bolt, Fireball, Firewall, Lightning Bolt, Thunder Storm, Napalm Beat, Soul Strike, Safety Wall, Jupitel Thunder, Lord of Vermillion, Meteor Storm, Fire Pillar, Water Ball, and Storm Gust /heh xD
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#20 Kadelia

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Posted 27 July 2014 - 08:25 AM

I'd love to see performers autocast reverberation while attacking :P


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#21 spikexp

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Posted 27 July 2014 - 02:28 PM

iirc songs affect the caster, so maybe autocasts non-ensemble 2nd class songs at learned level? people will start getting impressive riff... and since it doesnt affect bow, instruments are the way to go~

does reverb works like a trap? funny to see some kind of trap is autocasted then xD

and it's a 3rd class skill... i can't recall any gear that autocasts 3rd class skil x.x
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#22 Kadelia

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Posted 27 July 2014 - 04:11 PM

iirc songs affect the caster,

 

Bard songs? Or the chorus/song skills from 3rd?

 

The bard songs only work on caster when soul linked.

 

3rd job skills are party buffs, so it includes the caster.

 

 

does reverb works like a trap? funny to see some kind of trap is autocasted then xD

 

I would compare it to... hell plant?


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#23 Hyperballad

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 12:42 PM

Something like this should help pretty much every kind of 'alternative' build:

 

Chance to autocast Lv1 Reverberation when attacking.
When equipped with a bow: ASPD+2, Ranged damage +5%
When equipped with an instrument: MATK+40, skill SP usage -10%
When refined to +7 or more: ATK +35, MATK +35, CRIT +5
When refined to +9 or more: Reverberation, Metallic Sound and Great Echo damage +30%

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#24 meditation

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 12:53 PM

 

Something like this should help pretty much every kind of 'alternative' build:

 

Chance to autocast Lv1 Reverberation when attacking.
When equipped with a bow: ASPD+2, Ranged damage +5%
When equipped with an instrument: MATK+40, skill SP usage -10%
When refined to +7 or more: ATK +35, MATK +35, CRIT +5
When refined to +9 or more: Reverberation, Metallic Sound and Great Echo damage +30%

 

 

I really like this one. :ok:


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#25 Kadelia

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 02:36 PM

 

Something like this should help pretty much every kind of 'alternative' build:

 

Chance to autocast Lv1 Reverberation when attacking.
When equipped with a bow: ASPD+2, Ranged damage +5%
When equipped with an instrument: MATK+40, skill SP usage -10%
When refined to +7 or more: ATK +35, MATK +35, CRIT +5
When refined to +9 or more: Reverberation, Metallic Sound and Great Echo damage +30%

 

 

If you wear 2 amps, you have 400% metallic, so this would be 430%, which isn't going to really help much.

 

I'd like to see it autocast at least lvl 3 reverb, so that it does damage more on par with a warg or something.

 

Those are my main feedbacks.


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