312 replies to this topic

[RyuMax02]

It's a test build so until it's finalized all details are subject to change. 

 

I like the word that its still under testing...so there a 1/10000000000 chances they will listen to our comment and suggestions..

[Emilizzard]

I like the word that its still under testing...so there a 1/10000000000 chances they will listen to our comment and suggestions..

 

Well, "in testing" really just means that the testers go in and test the changes to make sure it's not worse and hopefully what they were looking for. If it doesn't pass testing, it gets sent back along with more feedback. It's a cycle until everybody is happy with the result, or they at least don't absolutely hate it. It's really just a constant cycle, which is all labeled as "in testing"

 

This is how testing works in general, and it's what we've been working to do with the new content 

[Shinyusuke]

What about the testing of the old content? Or better say the fixing? If it causes a decrease in population being an old content doesn't means necessarily that is right the way it is

[RyuMax02]

there a hint that the new map will be implement around 26th January..based on Maridah's blog..

 

[Rhein14]

It should be an open map, not a dungeon, so be prepared to compete for monster spawns like with DWF.

 

Say no to open Map.. When grinding it annoys me the "SPOT"  especially in CONDOR, MUCA, DWL, DWU... No chance to grind if they took all the channels and all the SPOTs.. Implement Dungeon..

[KuroiKoneko]

field map as dungeon? lolwut

better and easier to make more spots and\or add more channels or merge with freyja to get old 14-20 channels

[pdracoz]

so i guess  they sweeping the class balance and broken formula under the rug ? sigh

[Greven79]

field map as dungeon? lolwut

better and easier to make more spots and\or add more channels or merge with freyja to get old 14-20 channels

 

Even if you double the number of channels, it might not be enough. You would then have a maximum of 70 players (14x5) for a single given spot. And as you can see with all the existing maps, you usually have only 1~2 adequate spots. Such a 'open map' system is therefore limited to 140 players at best (or 90 players with 9 channels).

 

So I don't see any problems, if it would be a ceiling-less dungeon instead (just check Sandarman Fortress). I think Osiris is still the grinding spot that players like most.

Edited by Greven79, 14 January 2015 - 03:35 AM.

[Emilizzard]

What about the testing of the old content? Or better say the fixing? If it causes a decrease in population being an old content doesn't means necessarily that is right the way it is

That's been worked on too. When I (and some of the other VCRs) find an issue in the live server, we make a video to show what is happening, upload it, then post it on our bug list and message Njoror to let him know we added something. These get forwarded. How long it takes to fix is up to the team at Gravity, but some of the small fixes, like moving or removing objects that can't be reached, get fixed fairly quickly. When we see the fix list in patch notes, we will often log on immediately after maintenance to check if the problems were actually fixed, and sometimes find new problems in the meantime, which also get reported.

Fixing an existing large issue (Out of Range anyone?) is a bit harder, because it is difficult to make a video showing exactly what is happening, and therefore difficult for Gravity to investigate and fix things on their end. If you can make a video of this, by all means please do.

For other problems, like the large MP requirements for ML21+, that would probably be considered an easy fix; however, this requires the agreement of a lot of people on the development team. Getting approval for such changes is the hard part in this type of issue, and we're definitely requesting the requirements be lowered.

That being said, was there a specific issue you were thinking of that I didn't mention?

[Shinyusuke]

In the report section of this forum there is already a video of the out of range bug that i made long time ago... no replies were given at that post.
There are some easy to fix bugs (really old ones) like devirucky picture book in bapho not dropping that does't allow to conplete karas. And if you remember long time ago MorningRose for an event requested the 4th kara page complete without knowing to just asking something impossible.
The drop event for gears in dayr desert NEVER ended that make the loot a pain and produce a broken amount of zenny?
As i said old content doesn't necessary means fixed content i know you vep do a lot but these bugs are around since before the vep program and are ALL well documented bugs

Edited by Shinyusuke, 13 January 2015 - 02:35 AM.

[Greven79]

What about the testing of the old content? Or better say the fixing? If it causes a decrease in population being an old content doesn't means necessarily that is right the way it is

 
That's been worked on too. [...] How long it takes to fix is up to the team at Gravity, but some of the small fixes, like moving or removing objects that can't be reached, get fixed fairly quickly. [...]

Fixing an existing large issue (Out of Range anyone?) is a bit harder, because it is difficult to make a video showing exactly what is happening, and therefore difficult for Gravity to investigate and fix things on their end. If you can make a video of this, by all means please do.

That being said, was there a specific issue you were thinking of that I didn't mention?

 
There are many issues:

• Combat bug
• False language keys (Sorcerer / SM)
• Facing directions on entering a new map
• Incorrect player location after using butterfly wings / long kafra flight
• Falling damage bug (who would bother if there would be no damage at all?)
• Not being able to use long kafra flight while mounted or transformed (which works fine using other methods)
• Improper respawn times of certain mobs (prevents skinning, etc)
• Missing / misleading quest description/hints (f.e. prophet of doom union quest)
• Unsuitable leveling progress for cooks
• Identical items still being unstackable
• Enhancement elixirs polluting your bag
• Inconvenient use of pet DNA - especially for Binding Protein
• Kick-outs due to a false 'speed hack' detections from HackShield
• Divine Protections being usable below ML1 (although completely useless)
• Master Level quest inconvenience due to high differences towards other lvl50 opponents
• Divided Plains adjustment of illumination not using a proper z-axis limitation
• ...

And this doesn't really include real balancing issues or more questionable inconveniences: F.e. OP gear reward after job change, improper success chances for dismantling items or to obtain certain recipes. Polinium as a quest reward which intriques 'new players' to use an unsafe item (can break your weapon). And the inbalanced 1sec pet DoT trigger for both the 'electrostatic' and 'Ignite' debuff exist since the introduction of pets.

 

Another issue are the shades summoned by Ratmaster. They deal 50% of your current HPs as damage, but the calculation isn't 'safe', which can lead to a killed player, if two shades attack almost simultaneously.  And I could go on for quite a while...

 

But as always, it's about the question about how issues get prioritized.

 

Sure, removing a single gold ingot might not have taken up much time, but even then, it would have been much more useful to remove the osiris mummy closest to the entrance.... that one is much more annoying.

 

For other problems, like the large MP requirements for ML21+, that would probably be considered an easy fix; however, this requires the agreement of a lot of people on the development team. Getting approval for such changes is the hard part in this type of issue, and we're definitely requesting the requirements be lowered.

 

How many developers are there and how many of them are needed to make such a decision?

[RyuMax02]

leave it to Greven to stated all the problem in the game

I always learn a lot from all his comment even though i don't care because ran far from the original topics

[Saturn33]

Has everyone notice that they already changed the seed rune description?  
 
Blueseed Rune for example:
http://ro2.doskoi.or.../22261100#basic
Able to equip on Blue/Gold seed rune hole of 50 level above equipment.
 
The same applied to red and green seed rune. And with the upcoming Eddga gear with 1 gold rune hole, meaning that we can only choose one rune among blue, red, and green for the gold rune slot?
 
 
Besides that, seed rune that has been "opened", BlueSeed Rune[10 to 50] for example:
http://ro2.doskoi.or.../22261101#basic
When equip to equipment, it increase 14 of STR, AGI, INT, WIS, VIT.
... ...
... ...
... ...
http://ro2.doskoi.or.../22261141#basic
When equip to equipment, it increase 71 of STR, AGI, INT, WIS, VIT.
 
The same applied to red seed rune. Meaning that it give a fix number of stats instead of % of stats after the patch?
Not sure what is the formula to relate them:
[10] ≡ 14
... ...
... ...
... ...
[50] ≡ 71
 
 
Next, is the seed rune "open rate", Blueseed Rune for example:
http://ro2.doskoi.or...22261100#random
[10] = 28%
... ...
[36] = 0.01%
[37] = 0%
... ...
[50] = 0%
 
The same applied to red seed rune as well. Meaning that people no longer can obtain [37 to 50] after the patch?
 
 
There are also many weird rune showing up, many of them. No idea they are abandoned old content or the upcoming content?
Ansuz Rune
... ...
Wunjo Rune

[Shinyusuke]

IF over 36 rune is really impossible the old ones HAVE TO be deleted or downscaled

[MingMei]

i think change the integer value not to show beyond .00

it been that way for some time now 

[KuroiKoneko]

sigh, they gonna break game economy

without degrading runes numbers prices for 30+ BS and RS runes gonna be about 500k-10m

btw same with runes like power, wind and armor

[Shinyusuke]

Patch notes out on steam there is no payon patch and not even a exp event or a drop in exp requirement you know what will happen....

[Matsuyuki]

There's the lunar event thing.

[Emilizzard]

@Greven:

Spoiler

Oh yay a list. Awesome. Going through them in groups because otherwise I have too many quote blocks.

 

• Combat bug
• Falling damage bug (who would bother if there would be no damage at all?)
• Kick-outs due to a false 'speed hack' detections from HackShield
• Master Level quest inconvenience due to high differences towards other lvl50 opponents

 

These four have either been brought up ad nauseam or are extremely hard to capture on video. There's also an issue with being kicked out of game with no popup at all - it just closes.

 

For the falling damage, are you suggesting that it would be better if we didn't have falling damage?

 

 

• False language keys (Sorcerer / SM)
• Inconvenient use of pet DNA - especially for Binding Protein

 

Not really sure what these are referring to.

 

 

• Facing directions on entering a new map
• Incorrect player location after using butterfly wings / long kafra flight
• Improper respawn times of certain mobs (prevents skinning, etc)
• Missing / misleading quest description/hints (f.e. prophet of doom union quest)

 

I've noticed all of these... in exactly one location each:

• Facing directions: between East/West Mt. Mjolnir
• Incorrect player location: after using long distance to East Mt. Mjolnir, you currently are put on the hill with aggro Fabres, but should be in the town, probably near the Kafras.
• Improper respawn times: recently noticed this with the Flower Deer on Divided Plain
• Quests: One of the quests with the Miho doesn't update the description once it's completed, and becomes confusing. I'll look into the Prophet of Doom quest though.

If you or anybody else knows specific spots without searching, that would be great. And also save me lots of time and bwings.

 

 

• Not being able to use long kafra flight while mounted or transformed (which works fine using other methods)
• Unsuitable leveling progress for cooks
• Identical items still being unstackable
• Enhancement elixirs polluting your bag
• Divine Protections being usable below ML1 (although completely useless)
• Divided Plains adjustment of illumination not using a proper z-axis limitation

• Mounts/Transformation: I doubt this will be considered a bug, but it would be a good improvement suggestion. I know it can be really irritating.
• Chef: This is probably mostly due to Chefs not getting materials to process like cloth, leather, ore, or herbs. It definitely needs to be fixed. However, the crafting system is something we've been talking about lately, so hopefully something good will come from that.
• Unstackable items: This is due to different item IDs behind the scenes. I already did suggest that it gets fixed to show a different description or something so that it actually looks like it can't be stacked.

• Enhancement Elixers: I'm not entirely sure how this is a problem, but that's probably because I use them as soon as I can (to get rid of them). However, I have seen a screenshot of somebody's storage, where they have 2 slots taken just from WIS elixirs. Perhaps make them destroy-able, similarly to what was done with Polinium recently?

• Divine Protection: I never even thought to try that, since I knew it's not going to do anything, but I can definitely report it.

• Divided Plains: This is a good point, but I'm not entirely sure where it's supposed to end. I'm guessing the darkening shouldn't happen on the surface, and only while in the Scar of Despair?

 

Ok, I think I got all the bullet points, now on to the other things:

 

And this doesn't really include real balancing issues or more questionable inconveniences: F.e. OP gear reward after job change, improper success chances for dismantling items or to obtain certain recipes. Polinium as a quest reward which intriques 'new players' to use an unsafe item (can break your weapon). And the inbalanced 1sec pet DoT trigger for both the 'electrostatic' and 'Ignite' debuff exist since the introduction of pets.

 

OP gear reward after job change: at this point in the game's life, I'm not so sure this is really a problem. Most people play alone at this point, and never get to do the dungeons, so nice gear isn't horrible. It's also similar enough to the Izlude dungeon drops/quest rewards that it's not really noticeable, except of course that characters are trying to do Wolves' Cave at level 30, which is a different issue entirely that I've gone over many times.

Improper success chances for dismantling items: Yes. Again, unfortunately it's something that's not really used at this point, but I would like to see it fixed. If nothing else, another way of obtaining Radiant Crystals would be nice....

Obtain certain recipes: I'm assuming this is, more specifically, about the Chef recipes? I'd like to see them a bit more common to get used more, but I'd also like to see Chef get a complete overhaul to make it more useful in general. I'll bring it up again anyway, though it has been mentioned recently.

Polinium as a quest reward: Absolutely. The only people I know who don't hate this stuff with a burning passion are the ones who stockpile it and use it to rank in refining. We actually had made a thread of ideas of what to do about it, since it's so useless.

Imbalanced 1 sec pet DoT: Honestly, never really thought about it that much, since pets are different from skills... but I agree that pets shouldn't really outdo our skills.

 

 

Another issue are the shades summoned by Ratmaster. They deal 50% of your current HPs as damage, but the calculation isn't 'safe', which can lead to a killed player, if two shades attack almost simultaneously.  And I could go on for quite a while...

 

Probably not going to be high priority, considering the amount of (dis)use it sees. Unfortunately, catching a video of this one is going to be difficult, but I can certainly try.

 

 

But as always, it's about the question about how issues get prioritized.

 

I'd like to know that as well, unfortunately. I know the VCR-specific bug list has a priority order, but that may or may not be the same as how the developers see things.

 

 

Sure, removing a single gold ingot might not have taken up much time, but even then, it would have been much more useful to remove the osiris mummy closest to the entrance.... that one is much more annoying.

 

I somehow always manage to forget about that one.

 

 

How many developers are there and how many of them are needed to make such a decision?

 

I've no idea how many developers there are. How many of them are needed to make decisions is more of a business decision or company organization thing. I've no insight into this, sorry.

 

Concerning runes:

Spoiler

Yes, they're awful and confusing right now. It's one of the things we're looking at, as we just got a new version to test, with a bunch of new stuff, and I completely expect it to be awful.

 

@Shinyusuke:

Spoiler

Patch notes out on steam there is no payon patch and not even a exp event or a drop in exp requirement you know what will happen....

 

No, there is no Payon update yet. That's because it's not ready yet. Most of the new content (map, monsters, levels) isn't really all that interesting. One of the things we've been doing while it's getting delayed is writing up quest content and such to go along with it, to try and give it a bit more life. I don't think anybody really wants just another map with some monsters.

 

I remember when Dark Whisper was released, I had heard that it wasn't really ready yet... and what did we get? A bunch of time at the beginning of new content where the whole (ML) game was basically unplayable because of the issue with using AoE skills... and players were the ones who found the source of the problem.

 

No exp event or drop in exp requirements... We just had an exp event this past week. We just discussed the things that are not good with the ML system, the things we'd like to see change, and the things that can be done to change it for the better. The exp requirements was one of the things that everybody brought up. We also all brought up the (groundbreaking?) idea of having something to do other than grind.

 

Also, we discussed and designed some events to rotate through constantly, such as EXP week and Happy Hour week; the others we came up with aren't ready yet, so I'd guess this is one of the weeks where an unfinished event takes place. There's actually a bunch of new stuff that's coming up... am I going to spill all of the secrets? No. Why? Because I want everybody to be able to experience it for themselves when it comes out, and be excited when it's officially announced, instead of hearing about it too early and getting tired of waiting. For example, I know everybody is tired of waiting for the long-overdue Jawaii update.

 

And yes, we know what will (probably) happen. That's why we're trying to make it better.

 

I hope that answers some of the questions, and I hope everybody enjoys the Lunar Event. It's a little silly.

Edited by Emilizzard, 22 January 2015 - 10:03 AM.

[MingMei]

my guildmate says he got bs45 3 weeks ago

the open rate displayed in http://ro2.doskoi.org/ have been like that since december

[Oyufam]

No reason for a new content when only a few players will be ML30 and still in game to play whit it

and be prepared for a 3x exp needed from ml31 to ml40

i agree on this XD everyone wants to be superior  so why not wait little bit 

[Shinyusuke]

I have a big question IF the new runes share the same holes and the holes are not enough to put red, blue and green why would we use the new equit instead of a full runed cazar? OR if also the runeslots on the old gears will be changed what will happen at our runes on them?

[Glukos]

Higher than %36 runes will be NOT impossible after payon uptade.(i hope) this is just mathematic. For example; We can say 1,343 is 1,34 or 1,346 is 1,35. So answer is; getting higher than %36 runes rate lower than 0.005. So it says %0. For example %37 Rune rate might be %0,004. I hope i could explained. I should say this is also ; this is my suggest only.

Edited by Glukos, 22 January 2015 - 03:40 AM.

[Warrantless]

Does Anyone knows what runes can we place inside eddga gears Purple seed and gold slot, does anyone from VCR knows about these?, if u do please give us info.

[MingMei]

I have a big question IF the new runes share the same holes and the holes are not enough to put red, blue and green why would we use the new equit instead of a full runed cazar? OR if also the runeslots on the old gears will be changed what will happen at our runes on them?

 

the buzz back then that purp slot is for CLS /Regular rune 

odd though you could get tons of PVP def/att if you could put 2 CLS per part XD 

100% pvp damage reduction since this scenario is unlikely 

the possible scenario would be enforcing limits 

-either a cap on pvp def/att rate 

-1 CLS per gear

-1 CLS type per gear 

 

once payon is live i forsee 

knight/Warrior dominating PVP outside of collo

 

if CLS is available for the 35 gears people would get tougher

monks/sins/priest(iirc CLS reduced damage) damage wouldnt be enough to kill people quickly