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Upgrading info and system


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#26 LethalJokeChar

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 12:32 AM

I guess you do not know of the existance of status def eh?


What does that have to do with anything when I used YOUR formula which included status defense, and it was the thing that was off? More specifically, it became increasingly off. Meaning, the flat deduction of damage from your status defense was not working properly. If your formula worked correctly, it would at least be off by the same amount for each armor defense value.

Edited by LethalJokeChar, 02 December 2010 - 12:35 AM.

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#27 LordVader

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 12:49 AM

Recently I upgraded some spears and overupgraded them. However all upgrades even past 4/5 gave the same atk. According to the wiki overupgrades are supposed to give additional atk than the safe upgrades? Is this true or false? Future implementation perhaps? Or just one of those things that's there but doesn't show on the status window?
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#28 Clogon

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 03:26 AM

NVM I don't care anymore.

Edited by Clogon, 02 December 2010 - 04:10 AM.

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#29 brokenguy

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 07:48 AM

You all forgot how changing the update chances will affect the market greatly... It'll kill all +7 - +10 gear...
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#30 Sarune

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 08:06 AM

Are the we getting a new upgrading system soon? Is that why Enriched ori/elu is much cheaper?

You all forgot how changing the update chances will affect the market greatly... It'll kill all +7 - +10 gear...


Well to be fair renewal already has killed a lot of items and cards and made a lot of gear useless, but we got through it, and we can go through this too.
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#31 Pravin

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Posted 09 December 2010 - 02:14 PM

NVM I don't care anymore.


CLOGON, I know you were going to mention the bows, please dont give up. We seriously dont have much hope if you give up, lol.
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#32 Puppet

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Posted 09 December 2010 - 03:09 PM

Recently I upgraded some spears and overupgraded them. However all upgrades even past 4/5 gave the same atk. According to the wiki overupgrades are supposed to give additional atk than the safe upgrades? Is this true or false? Future implementation perhaps? Or just one of those things that's there but doesn't show on the status window?


I noticed this too the bonus from overspreading past safe limits on weapons seem to of disappeared. The bonus from over upgrading Armor on there other hand works tho and those bonus upgrades past safe point on armors show in the window

Edited by Puppet, 09 December 2010 - 03:12 PM.

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#33 TheSquishy

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 09:42 PM

@Jayrad and others who don't know

Many of the gear that get bonus effects x upgrade level are restricted in some way or other.

For instance, a Valk Mant does not give perfect dodge/reflected damage bonuses after being upgraded past +10.
Well it's not suppose to anyway. Can anyone test this? OH wait...+10 impossible at current refine rates.
Le sigh....
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#34 Trixdee

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Posted 21 January 2011 - 12:17 PM

I think now that they are trying to clean up the HD mess I think one suggestion is the safe rate should be raised. The rates themselves should be evaluated and changes made that can be both fair and reasonable and doesn't break the fact that the whole market flow depends on it being a chance based system.

Would be nice to be a medium between breaking that aspect of the economy that people depend on but then doesn't make getting the refine that you want hopelessly impossible. I mean who enjoys trying to upgrade that gear you spent a week farming whatever for and then to have a stupid NPC say duuurhhh syz I broked it.


Most gear does not need to be refined extremely high, 9 at the most. For example Firelock soldier shoe and Kathryn Keyron helm. Sure 9 was extreme when 10 was the cap but now that 20 is the cap things really need adjustment.


I don't think the HD disaster would have happened if we had FAIR rates in the first place.

Will there ever be that line between broken and FAIR?

Edited by Trixdee, 23 January 2011 - 05:29 PM.

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#35 jniedert

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Posted 21 January 2011 - 08:20 PM

Where do i find sam status for stat reset in valk ?

Edited by jniedert, 21 January 2011 - 08:21 PM.

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#36 Dukeares

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Posted 21 January 2011 - 10:39 PM

+1 For Trixdee

Maybe in the future in the next episode, the safety upgrade can be changes to +8 or more. It would be a welcome for more people to try to upgrade to +18~20.

With the current HD ores changes.I must say it will be even harder to archive +15 or more but is not impossile to archive

PS:

Personaly to me a +20 gear should be the pinacle of an Achivement for an Ro Player and should not be spoon fed and shoud be be more harder to get just like the asprika or other god item. Seriously i would rather have in the future "Hd ores only works up to 15 or 17.
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#37 Dukeares

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 09:57 PM

Just something to add here for future reference (Was too important to just let die some other thread..)

The long & short of the above math is the more DEF you already have, the less of an effect that adding more DEF has. While if you have 0 DEF +20ing an item may be almost 10% reduction, once you equip a bunch of other things, that +20 gear only ends up being like 4% more reduction than a +7 gear. Its quite pointless given how radically impossible +20 upgrades are. It'd take you years and like 100,000,000,000,000z to get a set of five +20 gears for that extra 20% reduction, at which point you're still reducing damage less than you did pre-renewal.


Which pretty much means the system needs to be redone completely in a nutshell. I still think in the end if you made +20s easy at this time, it wouldn't be a good idea.



The GM team can't improve the upgrading system b/c if people were to get +1x gear it gets to be quite stupid, or Quite Stupid.

The former, because any + on armor is lolgarbage. Getting upgraded armor is only a status symbol, it "looks pretty". The real effects of +s on armor are laughably small compared to the armor's own DEF values. You pay (hundreds of) millions (billions) to get an extra 1% or 2% reduction, which is bypassed by most weapons you will encounter. Why bother improving an upgrade system when the upgrades themselves are ineffective.

The latter, because + on weapons is **g godlike. KvM weapons especially. Once you start hitting +9 or better on a level 3 or 4 weapon, you are doing damage better than you would have with dual megs in pre-renewal. If +10 to +20 gear becomes available the people who have it are going to dominate in all aspects of the game.

Edit: Apparently the GM team believes that higher+ armor gives better def. Of course, instead of offering up facts and data, they want you to believe that it does and spend money to find out whether or not it is true.


Heim's Reply

Â?no gear = 0 def = 1281 damage 0% reduction
+0 gear = 142def = 941 damage 26.6% reduction
+4 gear = 162def = 907 damage 29.2% reduction
+7 gear = 192def = 860 damage 32.8% reduction
+10 gear = 232def = 805 damage 37.1% reduction
+15 gear = 322def = 703 damage 45.1% reduction
+20 gear = 442def = 601 damage 53.0% reduction

Spiky Band
Opera Masque
Saints Robe
Buckler
Heavenly Maiden Robe
Shoes
2x Safety Ring

Yes quite different from this same gear at +7 giving the ~ 40%, but damage and speed of attack is also lowered somewhat.

From +0 to +10 your extra defense was only about 10.5%, whereas the +10 to +20 is 15.9%

That should end up higher in the future. Admittedly the whole PVP defense calculation leaves much to be desired, and such has already been reported as a bug.



Renewal...Fail... :D
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#38 Dukeares

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Posted 20 July 2011 - 02:24 AM

is it Posible to archive+ 14 to +20 without the usage of REAL CASH / Cast Item in the FUTURE???
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#39 Lucentos

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Posted 21 July 2011 - 10:36 AM

is it Posible to archive+ 14 to +20 without the usage of REAL CASH / Cast Item in the FUTURE???

I`m guessing that even with cash items it is nearly impossible to do.
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