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Pure Support Invokers?


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#1 PervySageMarty

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Posted 22 July 2016 - 02:03 AM

Is there such a thing? I am looking at Dragon Saga and wondering if I should start it, but am not really that interested in fighting myself on front lines in games, therefore I want to know if there are such things as pure support Invokers.

 

Would I get shunned by people for not being able to hold my own? Are pure supports looked down upon? Are pure supports even possible as a setup? (that is mostly invested into the party support trees, with regards to other skills that will help it along the way)

 

Most importantly, would I get completely shut off by people for not investing into the awakening tree? All guides here make it sound like its the most mandatory thing to do and anything outside of it means you are utter garbage.

 

 


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#2 Precrush

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Posted 22 July 2016 - 06:41 AM

You can totally make a support invoker. All you really need on the offensive side is double shot/diffusion cannon for the x-spam and wraith of heaven. There's so many support skills though that you'll have to choose if you want to be a pvp or a pve support invoker really, that's the only thing. Do you want all the buffs, heals and revive or all of the debuffs, that's the choice.

 

Both of the aweikening skills, wraith of heaven and lightning magnet, are really good in pvp and you should really 5/5 at least the magnet for that. Wraith of heaven's is good for pvp as it stuns and lands a few hits, but it's also like the only really good clear skill invokers have for mission maps (need to use skills to earn rank). So if you want to pve I'd for sure 5/5 that.

 

There's no shutting off due to skill builds in this game really, and you can always change those. You won't really get much special treatment either for being a good support, since the game is mostly easy on the pve side and in pvp it rarely matters.  In terms of gear support in this game would mean you build as tanky as possible, which is a very good tactic for pvp.

 

In pve clerics are like the chillest class ever, and in pvp you get to be really annoying. So if that's what you're after then it's the right place.


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#3 PervySageMarty

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Posted 22 July 2016 - 08:42 AM

Thankyou for the wonderful answer, it has been bugging me for days without end about them. I will have to post later in the forums as i progress.


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#4 Agitodesu

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Posted 22 July 2016 - 10:52 AM

A full support invoker will practically have the same build as a pure pvp invoker. The skill tree is really simple.

 

Whether for pve or pvp purposes only a few skills will be altered. But as almost everyone can agree on the fundamental skills yields the best results.

 

Unless you have insane reflex and animalistic instinct like ero, you could potentially not get awakenings and purely ruin peoples lives with barbarian, But he still uses it since it's op.

 

Post 60 that is, since awakenings are 60+.


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#5 Precrush

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Posted 22 July 2016 - 11:16 AM

Forgot to say that you can really put points on pretty much anything in the invoker skill trees and it'll be fine. Only really useless skills are Arch Senctuary, fortress from the magician tree (except for empo) and probably detection. Other's have at least some use, so feel free to try stuff out.


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#6 PervySageMarty

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Posted 22 July 2016 - 02:55 PM

About Arc Sant: Really? it looks so ridiculous in effects even with that 300 second cooldown, is it just simply small AoE or just that people dont just stand still all the time?

 

Is it really fundamental to get crippling skills such as Barbarian? Feels like a big waste of points though.

 

What are the actual healing skills that are good? They all technically sound very good in my eyes but I have never watched any video's of peoples runs on Invokers so I have no idea how the mechanics of partying work in a retrospect.

 

 


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#7 Agitodesu

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Posted 22 July 2016 - 06:05 PM

Just wondering are you playing support in pve or pvp.

 

For supporting in bsq/ew, you need skills so that you can enhance a combo or lock so that your team mates can kill the other players.

For pvp 1v1, you need skills to catch your opponent so that you can hit them continuously.

 

In bsq you can not heal other players. Only yourself, no matter what skill you use. So if you plan on getting nothing that supports team play then might as well sit there and afk and be a meat shield.

In pvp, no one likes healing at all. So people won't pvp healers.

In EW everything goes and players are trying to win. It would be a shame that you wouldn't use good skills in order to lead you friends to victory.

 

Pve:

Barbarian isn't needed (helpful in f7)

Witches curse isn't needed (helpful in f7)

Quagmire/mud isn't needed (helpful in f7)

 

Basically all you need is Diffusion/Double shot

Any healing skills you want+Revive

Magnet/Heavens wraith are totally optional, it's good for missions if you plan on trying to get SSS rank

Chain lighting (mission map to get SSS)

Blessing/Striking 5/5 and that's about it.

 

 

I just don't know if you are playing pve or pvp as a support. Hence I can see your bias against some skills that are fundamental in pvp. If you are playing pve I can expand on it more, if it's for pvp, I'll try to explain why skills are good and in situations.

 

 

 


Edited by Agitodesu, 22 July 2016 - 06:08 PM.

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#8 PervySageMarty

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Posted 22 July 2016 - 06:16 PM

I would like to take the PvE, since I will be playing abit more casually. Please do explain some of the more basics and advanced workings of the skills necessary in that aspect. Thankyou!


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#9 Agitodesu

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Posted 22 July 2016 - 07:16 PM

I'll start from the basics and mean no disrespect as I do not know how much you know based on reading or if you've tried out the game already.

 

There are 4 common places to fight monsters.

 

1st place: mission maps. Also known as f1/f2/f5.

 

This is the one you will be most familiar with when you start playing the game. It is called mission maps. There can be 1,2,or 3 maps of monsters that you have to exterminate before moving on to the boss room, which would be the 4th room(if you took 3 maps) F1 will always match your level unless you are above the level range of the respective mission map.

 

F2 is basically F1, but it will be 2 levels above you at all times, unless you out level the range of the mission map.

 

F5 is main quest scenarios where you need to do a quest to unlock it. It will always have 2 maps and then a boss map after.

 

2nd Place: F6

F6 is unlocked when finishing F5 with the hero quests that lead up to it. This mode has a crystal in the middle that you must protect. Monsters spawn either from the left or right side and you have to fend them off by killing them. 10 Rounds with a certain amount of "waves" every round.

 

3rd Place: F7

This is a tower defense game, you kill some monsters to get points, then build towers that will kill the monsters because every round they become much stronger and you won't be able to just kill it normally anymore. Unlocked only at 40 when you do the quests for it.

 

4th Place: Dungeons

Every mmorpg needs a dungeon. This is exactly what it sounds like. Kill monsters get to the boss room. Slay the boss and get a chance to get good equipment.

 

 

Now you can all do these by yourself as a invoker. You can do all of these with any class in fact(except the end game dungeon but that is far away from where we are starting at). If you want to party that's your choice and support the players killing the monsters. This class is capable of dealing more damage than 70% of the other classes we have, so if you ever feel like not sitting back afk and healing whenever, you can kill those monsters faster than the ones you are with :D

 

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If you have more specific questions on skills or something else, I'll answer them. The points distributed is totally random, it isn't meant for anyone to follow.

 

People will most likely shut you off if you do not take the awakening, but your friends will either try to convince you to take them because they are useful or just ignore that and just accept you for what you do and choose.

 


Edited by Agitodesu, 22 July 2016 - 07:25 PM.

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#10 PervySageMarty

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Posted 22 July 2016 - 07:33 PM

This is exactly the kind of guide I need! This is very thoroughly broken down, thankyou really!

 

Is it not recommended to get the heals up to higher levels like 10? Particularly the useful ones that is?

 

Question on cat head and the staff mastery: They increase matk but you do not invest into it, is there a difference between the matk you get from those skills to the kind needed for heals or something else I am missing?

 

I see that you are helping me get as little offense as possible, thankyou kindly for the tremendous help!

 

 


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#11 Agitodesu

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Posted 22 July 2016 - 07:47 PM

This is exactly the kind of guide I need! This is very thoroughly broken down, thankyou really!
 
Is it not recommended to get the heals up to higher levels like 10? Particularly the useful ones that is?
 
Question on cat head and the staff mastery: They increase matk but you do not invest into it, is there a difference between the matk you get from those skills to the kind needed for heals or something else I am missing?
 
I see that you are helping me get as little offense as possible, thankyou kindly for the tremendous help!

 

It's extremely helpful if you try to get slow heal to level 10. At rank 10 it heals 7.5% of anyone's hp every 3 seconds lasts 30 seconds, So very efficient mana wise.

 

I'd like to note it's only possible to get this skill up to 5/5. To get this any higher you will need monster cards, which are farmed at a particular range. To be exact it would be spectral dragoon around level 30ish. You will need 32 cards and combine them on and on till you get a legendary grade card which will increase the cap to 10 instead of 5. This requires a lot of time, effort, luck, and money.

 

Alternatively you could potential buy/get a card you can put on your rings at a much higher level and get it to a higher rank without spending sp. There are also Item mall accessories that can increase "slow heal" in particular by up to 1,2, or 3. (normal,rare,hero) The ring may be expensive but is worth it if you plan to be pve or pvp all the way through.

 

I don't think the other skills are worth getting above 5 except for barbarian which is strictly for pvp purposes. It increases the chance to freeze the enemy, which is why pvpers all want there hands on this. Do not worry you will not need this at all.

 

The cat head increases intelligence and Matk by a minuscule amount. This is for players who want to maximize damage to clear dungeons and mission maps.

 

Staff mastery if I recall is bugged and raises base value, which is practically nothing. If it does work as intended, it''ll just boost your damage by an ok amount.  But to alleviate your worries, Most of your heals are % based. The one's that are based on Matk are strong on it's own. I can assure you will never have a problem healing someone to full health even if you don't use the % heals, unles your healing some op people with 150k hp, then again they wouldn't take that much damage in the first place since they're strong. Mainly damage is for damage more than it is used for healing. You won't be running around naked being 1 shot, nor will anyone else. You heals even with a good or bad weapon will do it's job.


Edited by Agitodesu, 22 July 2016 - 07:55 PM.

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#12 PervySageMarty

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Posted 22 July 2016 - 08:10 PM

I understand now. Thankyou so very much for all the help that you have given me.

 

Just as a last moment then if healing is not too tough the job as you have said, would it be possible you give me another skill build that will allow me to party support(and heal well enough to hold out) but to also drill through on my own if I did solo?

 

I was mostly worried that healing is a tough job, similar to RO in that if you arent fully invested into the healing and support side it will lead to alot of issues during later content.

 

Thankyou kindly once again Agito for all the advice and help, hope to see you in game soon then!


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#13 Agitodesu

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Posted 22 July 2016 - 08:19 PM

http://irowiki.org/~...001015131050503

 

I purposely left out Barbarian and Witches curse since I will assume you will not touch pvp.

 

Every class can do anything. you just save people's hp potions here lol.

 

Healers in this game is not even close to the caliber of something like RO, FF14, Tera, Etc if you know any of those where it requires healing of some sort. But, hey in those games, you can't solo 4 player dungeons on your own as a healer. You can here easily.

 

Most invokers have issue with F1 because of there mission rank of Fs instead of S, SS, or SSS. You get rewards after beating the boss in mission maps. you get up to 3 equipment and a gold pouch. This is generally how you start making gold. By doing f1, get an SSS, sell the gear->get gold. Use gold to buy/enchant/etc. If you get Fs all day, then your won't make any gold and will tread slowly and painfully.


Edited by Agitodesu, 22 July 2016 - 08:22 PM.

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#14 PervySageMarty

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Posted 22 July 2016 - 08:30 PM

Duelly noted. Thanks for all the help until now. I will have to give it a go and see how i fair.


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#15 Precrush

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Posted 22 July 2016 - 09:12 PM

Agitodesu the novel writer :P Good stuff though, I agree with everything but I'd like to comment the shutting off part. Only skill I've ever seen people get shut off for really is not having time reverse on goon.

With aweikenings, in pve it doesn't matter if you have them or not, and in pvp it's all about gear. Maybe in the very very late game pvp you'd get shut off since they are basically what the class is good for there. And from f1 farm parties you might get shut off as an invoker anyway, but even more without wraith of heaven. But not taking wraith of heaven basically means you don't plan on doing f1 farming.

So in very specific situations I can see it happening, but I wouldn't worry about it.
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#16 PervySageMarty

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Posted 25 July 2016 - 06:50 PM

Enjoying it so far! Lvl 28 already.
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#17 Rainnowx

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Posted 27 July 2016 - 10:53 PM

Enjoying it so far! Lvl 28 already.

 

With the Event going on, there shouldn't be any problem to get Lv.60 before the end of its 4th week.

(Within normal conditions, I might be able to do that; but not now heh...)


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#18 zeekyoo

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Posted 08 September 2016 - 02:13 AM

i hope there's a ultimate guide for invoker  :p_laugh:


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#19 Agitodesu

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Posted 08 September 2016 - 08:30 AM

Man it's mikes guide has some good stuff though
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