13 replies to this topic

[Stophy]

Hello Community and Popcorn,

 

I really like farming the expert modes. But I prefer to farm in groups. Now the thing is if you farm expert modes for example Paris.

 

If I go solo I need like 1 hour to do. In a group of 2 I need 1:10 Minutes... ~ depending But in a group of 3 or 4 we need a lot more time and that is not very attractive for expert dungeons.

 

The times are just an example to show the dimensions.

 

Expert Dungeons are made for having another way to get exp but also to farm new interesting items and in my opinion it should be also able to farm in a group of 3-4 with nearly the same time or because of entering in a group it should be at least faster as if you go solo.

 

 

I thought of making it a bit easier for groups of at least 2-4. Why should people get punished if they group up? It should be a little bit faster as if you go solo.

What are your opinions about it? I would really like to make this possible to farm expert modes (like paris) in a group with 3 or more without loosing that much time.

 

 

[nighty007]

I dont agree with you.

I like to level and it actually makes alot of fun to me (expert, ofc not f7) and the fact that you can level solo and you dont have to play in a group makes it so fun for me. You dont have to wait hours for it like F7 and you dont need to trust in others. Im playing everything solo.

Honestly i only do expert for the EXP so maybe i would think different about this if i would focus on the items, then it would be probably more fun to do expert in a group.

Edited by nighty007, 23 January 2018 - 04:06 PM.

[Vossel]

I dont really have those problems as long as i farm with classes who have a similar difficulty than me, like other Warriors or thiefs.

For 1 paris Expert run i need ~40-45 Minutes solo, when i farm with another Overlord / Dragooner who isnt even as geared as i am doesnt increase the time by a lot, maybe if we are unlucky in coordination we need maximum of 50 minutes for 1 run. If you join as 4 people, the amount of Monster is doubled, even without expert this szenario is increasing the time you need.

I think expert is fine as it is now, some classes just cant farm efficient with some other classes example Warrior x Summoner, but that is okay.

[Stophy]

I like to level and it actually makes alot of fun to me (expert, ofc not f7) and the fact that you can level solo and you dont have to play in a group makes it so fun for me. You dont have to wait hours for it like F7 and you dont need to trust in others. Im playing everything solo.

Honestly i only do expert for the EXP so maybe i would think different about this if i would focus on the items, then it would be probably more fun to do expert in a group.

 

Thats actually a nice thing but I like to farm paris for example and sometimes i do in a group of 2 (not more because it takes somehow way longer) and it should take maybe not less time but nearly the same  with a group of 3 if everyone uses the normal weap. And if someone dc's for example at stage 40 you have to do 10 stages with very tanky mobs and bosses without adjusting to the new average group level. 

 

As idea a little improvement would be that if you change the stage at paris (after someone dc's or leave) the mobs could get a the new average group level.

 

Actually the thing is expert is nearly useless to farm in a group. When i ask people to go expert in a group, they say "no, its not worth in a group" and if i ask for paris they add "if i or u dc, its worth even less".

 

 

If you join as 4 people, the amount of Monster is doubled, even without expert this szenario is increasing the time you need.

I think expert is fine as it is now, some classes just cant farm efficient with some other classes example Warrior x Summoner, but that is okay.

 

That's a clear thing and only appears for Drakos and Bone (correct me if im wrong). But with a group of 3 its still more "difficult"/needs more time.

 

And your second thing is true. I wouldnt farm expert with classes like summoner or Invoker but for all other classes it should be able to reach nearly same times sothat they can easy farm together.

Edited by Stophy, 24 January 2018 - 06:57 AM.

[XiongmaoLin]

The problem I have with expert mode is that a party of two players doubles the monsters' and bosses' health points, as compared to a solo run (do not forget to quote numbers when you have a problem. Numbers are your friends). Which implies that if two characters do not 'combo' well, as in Mage & Warrior, Invoker & Assassin, etc. there is absolutely no point in creating a party to begin with.

 

Only benefits I see are: party members can buff each other, so everyone will have a little more power; they will benefit from party passive buffs related to classes participating in the run; they will earn friend points if they are registered on one another's list. That... is about all I can think of.

Moreover, party members have to share loot such as silver coins, event material and mini-boss drops (think Verdurous Forest).

 

 

Reducing the difficulty increase by 25% (id est two-player dungeon monsters having only 175% of regular health for example) would make this feature more attractive to parties. Well, at least creating a party to expert-murder Mutisha would make sense.

Edited by XiongmaoLin, 25 January 2018 - 03:33 PM.

[Popcorn]

We have no plans to change anything to this mode. The mode is implemented as we wanted it to be implemented.

[XiongmaoLin]

Thus : why make it this unappealing to parties ?

[Kristof3195]

Thus : why make it this unappealing to parties ?

I love expert mode realy but ^ this 

What we need is like a Mythic / Legend mode for parties to get the real item drops and not just for exping I guess would probably be appealing to endgame 

[XiongmaoLin]

I see no need for yet another dungeon mode. A slight decrease in difficulty as players are added to the party would be enough.

[Stophy]

 

Reducing the difficulty increase by 25% (id est two-player dungeon monsters having only 175% of regular health for example) would make this feature more attractive to parties. Well, at least creating a party to expert-murder Mutisha would make sense.

 

 

Something like this would be very nice 

[XiongmaoLin]

I found yesterday another thing that makes parties have a small edge in running expert mode dungeons: mini-bosses' groggy bar seems to be worth the same amount of hits whatever the number of players in the party. Which has small value for Warlocks in dungeons in which mini-bosses have a very annoying 75% damage cut while enraged, since hitting with X attacks becomes a reasonable option seeing how these are almost impossible to kill while angry anyway. Filling the gauge still takes ages though...

 

I still see no reason to make expert mode this absurd to party up for: about all dungeons are easier as a team, which makes a lot of sense to me and promotes actual social bonding (in a very digital and shallow way usually, but still) rather than playing alone. Dragon Saga is called a massive multiplayer online game, is it not?

 

Any chance for an explanation, somehow, some day, somewhere?

(Hold my hand and I'll take you there... ~)

[Popcorn]

It won't change no matter how much you will state your opinion on this. The way the expert mode dungeons are desgined to not give abusers the chance to play the easy way like 1x playing, 3x AFK. I guess there are still people who are able to do it but it's not the usual 5 minute thing. And we are not going to discuss this further with you on our end.

 

[XiongmaoLin]

I find it almost funny that asking for what we players are entitled to, that is a simple reason as to why this or that exists or not in the game we play and possibly invest money into, makes you plainly stonewall the subject.

 

At last the difficult question has been answered; however many objections I find to such reason, there seems to be no point in discussing Expert mode any longer. I'll be taking my leave.

[Stophy]

It won't change no matter how much you will state your opinion on this. The way the expert mode dungeons are desgined to not give abusers the chance to play the easy way like 1x playing, 3x AFK. I guess there are still people who are able to do it but it's not the usual 5 minute thing. And we are not going to discuss this further with you on our end.

 

 

Hm thats funny because we experienced a bit and if we go as a group of 2 both with normal weapons we need of course a bit longer as solo .

 

But as a group of 3 we need muuuuch more time and monsters have much more hp.

 

So we decided that one person goes afk (of course semi-afk, has to be carefully at the boss stages and has to chat with us xD) with level 1 weapon and that works. Its nearly like 2 people going expert, it just needs a little bit more time. The difference to the group of 2 is not very big.

 

So in the end thats not abuse because we need at least more time (as solo) to reach the same aim. But its a possible way to start in a group for nearly the same results and time.

Because of this I made this topic. I would like to start with the same group with the help of all 3 using their main weapons.

 

But I can surely understand you opinion about this.