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Lets talk about Axe

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#1 henrycao


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Posted 20 April 2018 - 06:21 PM



"Axes are the preferred weapon of choice for executioners. Armed in training for high damage and critical power, they are to be feared when facing a Champion alone and unsupported. Axes have the highest natural damage output when trained right and can be a fearsome weapon tree to invest in to." Quoted from the main page.


??? Axes have the highest natural damage output you say?!?! "When trained right!?"?!?! After years, people still have not trained it right.. why?


"Armed in training for high damage and critical power, they are to be feared when facing a Champion alone and unsupported." Run up to a single unsupported katar raider, hop *MISS* hop *MISS* hop *MISS* hop *MISS* hop *MISS*

Or build accuracy, hop miss, hop hit, hop hit, hop miss, hop miss, hop miss. Low damage.


Run up to a single unsupported sword champ... Magic damage 11k, Magic damage 11k


Basically everything an Axe was meant to do, a sword can do better. Axe's took too hard of a nerf, the class has been dead for so long. How can anyone train it right? All based on probability and chance, to be able to 3 shot other players or be killed seconds later.. It's like trying to refine an item 33% success chance and hoping to get it a success 3x's in a row...


Swords have a higher damage output than Axe.

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#2 henrycao


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Posted 30 April 2018 - 04:38 PM

So if I were to hypothetically make an Axe build with 33.3% hit chance with 50% critical chance above the raiders critical defense. We can use a punnet square to make an analysis of what will happen.


Axe build with 1850 accuracy vs a raider with 7400 dodge before debuffs. Estimated dodge down of an Axe champ being 25%. 7400 x 0.75 = 5,550.

1850/5,550 = 0.33333333333.... Therefore is 33.3% hit rate.


1/3 = 33.3%

1 Hit

2 Miss


Let the Hit be represented by H. Let the Miss be represented by M. Let the Critical be represented by C. Let the Neutral non critical be represented by N.



















Edit: The table I had used disappeared after the post so I can't show you the punnet square I had made.


The tallied up results:

1 (Hit + Critical)

1 (Hit + Neutral)

2 (Miss + Critcal)

2 (Miss + Neutral)


On average only 1 in 6 attacks will my Critical actually work on a raider. Excuse me but what??? I have a 50% critical rating above the opponent raiders Critical Defense but because I can't hit anything, the immense amount of critical I have only mounts up to around 16%???(1/6) Meanwhile I have passives such as Invigoration with a 40% chance on critical attack to regenerate 1 hp per 1 character level.

So Invigoration passive has a 6% chance to work. That's hilarious!

Then lets start estimating the probability of a 6% chance for the Invigoration passive to proc.

100% - 6% = 94% failure rate.

94% in decimal value becomes 0.94

Let N represent the number of times tried at 6%. Let 0.5 represent the 50% even odds we take to succeed.

0.94N  0.5

once we have determined N to be 12, to find out the amount of attacks needed, we can calculate by multiplying 12 by 6. Resulting at 72 attacks hit or miss to be at even odds of 1 proc.


To sum this all up, results show that critical and passives that proc off critical is useless against a raider if you do not have a high enough hit rate.

So ideally, you want to have 2,775 accuracy against this 7,400 dodge raider while still having 50% critical above your opponents Critical Defense, along with having a 25% dodge down and not loosing much AP while your at it. -.-


Dear Genesis, here is some math. It's ultimately up to you if you want to give axes back some of its power or not, but as of now the game has none because this class just doesn't work in the current meta.

Edited by henrycao, 30 April 2018 - 04:47 PM.

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#3 Feuer


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Posted 30 April 2018 - 04:45 PM

I hate to burst your bubble Henry, especially given I sympathize with you but .... do you honestly expect them to do anything? I mean, I've brought up the very same numbers you have, it persuaded no one. Look, I admire your persistence as a dedicated Champion player, even if you ultimately caved in a made a Raider just to not be embarrassed as much, but c'mon man. It's been nearly 4 year? Just let it go. Raiders are their pet class, FS are the only healers, and Mages are the anti everything else class. 


I'm sorry man, really, but Champions are done, especially Axe. Just enjoy your Sword in 1v1's, and accept that Spears will only ever be useful for being an annoying spinning top and leveling AoE slave. 

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#4 voxdei


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Posted 16 May 2018 - 03:41 PM

RIP champs

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#5 MarkVincent


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Posted 16 June 2018 - 10:02 PM

axe champ was awesome when there was no epic weapons and no chivs, prec, lumi, glor armors!! :-(

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